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Took in Adandon Kitty, What Have I DONE???

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Charles - 08 Jan 2004 22:46 GMT
I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7 months
old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing several
scratching posts, giving kitty the run of the house.  Did NOT have her
declawed, got her rabies and distemper vaccine, had her spayed.  Now 6 weeks
after her rabies vaccine, there is a lump at her vaccination site.  Further
research suggests that this could very likely be cancerous sarcoma caused by
the vaccine.  The vet NEVER mentioned this side effect.  We had a needle
aspirator (sp) biopsy which was negative, but even the vet said we still
should be concerned.  We are going to watch the lump for changes and may
have a tough choice coming up.  I am very upset about this and can't help
but wonder if I wouldn't have been better off leaving kitty a feral.  I
can't believe that my own actions of having her vaccinated may cause her
such pain.  We have grown so attached to kitty.  The vet tried to reassure
us that it is unlikely that this is cancerous, but I am AMAZED at how many
other cat owners have gone through this same thing. Any one out there have
experience with post vaccination lumps.  I am just praying that one morning
I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Magic Mood Jeep? - 08 Jan 2004 23:00 GMT
I too had a similar problem.  After Weeble's (see my webshots photo albums,
he was abandoned by his Mama at less than a week old) second set of
vaccinations, he developed a lump at the shot site, but it took about a week
to develop!  Vet was concerned, but puzzled as he'd not had such
developments before, but in the past month, after switching vaccine brands,
was having a rash of them.  The first few he biopsied, and they turned out
negative, just an inflammatory reaction to the vaccine.  So we kept a close
eye on him: he got 'felt up' by the vet once a week for 4 weeks, and it
seemed to get smaller, so vet said to only call/bring him in if the lump did
anything besides shrink, and to bring him in for his neuter on the scheduled
time - and by the time his neuter came, lump was almost gone, and two weeks
after that, the lump was completely gone - now I can't even tell exactly
where it was!.

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> I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7 months
> old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing several
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> experience with post vaccination lumps.  I am just praying that one morning
> I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Charles - 08 Jan 2004 23:11 GMT
You must have been SO relieved.  I am hoping for the same outcome.  I am
really concerned that the vaccination was done on Nov 14 and it should have
gone down by now.  That was almost 8 weeks ago.  All I can do now is pray
and hope it goes away.
> I too had a similar problem.  After Weeble's (see my webshots photo albums,
> he was abandoned by his Mama at less than a week old) second set of
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
> morning
> > I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Karen - 09 Jan 2004 01:50 GMT
> You must have been SO relieved.  I am hoping for the same outcome.  I am
> really concerned that the vaccination was done on Nov 14 and it should have
> gone down by now.  That was almost 8 weeks ago.  All I can do now is pray
> and hope it goes away.

My Grant and Sugar both got bumps at their vaccination sites when they first
got them that lasted about 3 months. Vet never mentioned the possibility of
sarcomas and said it was just "a reaction". The lumps *did* go away. I took
them to a new vet who upon hearing they had such a long lasting reaction
wrote it in their charts and they only get purevax shots now and have had NO
swelling since then. Here's hoping that is all it is for you, but be warned
it may take a bit longer to go down. If the biopsy was negative, most likely
is. Get purevax shots next time. More expensive but worth it. You *did* do a
good thing taking kitty in.

Karen
Charles - 09 Jan 2004 14:19 GMT
I am not a statistics major, but when I mentioned this problem to my sister
and friends, I found out that one of my sister's cats had sarcoma and a
friends aunt had the same thing.  So much for the 1 in 3,000 number that
gets this reaction.  I think this goes largely unreported.  Our kitten is
still very active and shows absolutely no signs of being sick.  The biopsy
that was done was the needle aspirator type and I guess this type of biopsy
is not real reliable for catching cancer cells.  At least it gave us
temporary peace of mind.

> > You must have been SO relieved.  I am hoping for the same outcome.  I am
> > really concerned that the vaccination was done on Nov 14 and it should have
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> Karen
Laura R. - 09 Jan 2004 17:43 GMT
>  they only get purevax shots

I cannot recommend this highly enough. Purevax (Merial) vaccines are
adjuvant-free, which means that they do not contain the substances that
are suspected to be responsible for vaccination-site sarcomas. Ask your
vet if s/he uses Purevax. If s/he doesn't, either find another vet or
tell your current one that you won't vaccinate unless and until s/he
makes adjuvant-free vaccinations available.

Laura
Charles - 09 Jan 2004 17:47 GMT
She was given Fort Dodge???
> >  they only get purevax shots
> >
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Laura
Laura R. - 09 Jan 2004 22:53 GMT
> She was given Fort Dodge???

They apparently use a proprietary adjuvant:

http://wgnradio.com/shows/pet/fivvaccine.htm

However, I wouldn't worry overmuch just yet. See the other link I
posted.

Laura
Linda E - 10 Jan 2004 16:50 GMT
We recently had a scare after one of our cats developed a vaccination site
lump almost 3 years (!) after her last vacc at that particular site.  Vet
was very concerned and really thought the outcome was going to be bad.  When
the vet "went in" for a biopsy, a round ball of fat popped out.... got it
analyzed and that's what it turned out to be - fat!  We dodged the bullet
that time......

Linda
Betsy - 09 Jan 2004 02:56 GMT
Could you please find out from the vet what brand caused that reaction?  I'd
be grateful.

> I too had a similar problem.  After Weeble's (see my webshots photo albums,
> he was abandoned by his Mama at less than a week old) second set of
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
> morning
> > I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Magic Mood Jeep? - 09 Jan 2004 14:09 GMT
I know that they now went back to the other vaccine, Purevax, that they had
stopped using because it was temporarily unavailable, but I don't know what
they were using in it's place.

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> Could you please find out from the vet what brand caused that reaction?  I'd
> be grateful.
[quoted text clipped - 51 lines]
> > morning
> > > I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Charles - 12 Jan 2004 16:35 GMT
It was a Fort Dodge vaccine.  The kitty still has the lump on her and it has
not shrunk, but is hasn't gotten any bigger either.  It feels as if it is
harder than it was before, but at least it is not growing.  Kitty sure
doesn't act sick and is as playful as ever.
I guess I wait another 2 weeks and then we go to the vet to have it removed
and analyzed.  I wonder if I should give it more time.  From reading some of
the posts, it sounds like it could take a few months for a vaccine reaction
to go away.  I would hate to put kitty through surgery if it is not
necessary.  Then again, if it is Sarcoma, it would be best to remove the
lump as soon as possible and pray they remove it all.

> Could you please find out from the vet what brand caused that reaction?  I'd
> be grateful.
[quoted text clipped - 51 lines]
> > morning
> > > I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Karen Chuplis - 13 Jan 2004 01:03 GMT
> It was a Fort Dodge vaccine.  The kitty still has the lump on her and it has
> not shrunk, but is hasn't gotten any bigger either.  It feels as if it is
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> necessary.  Then again, if it is Sarcoma, it would be best to remove the
> lump as soon as possible and pray they remove it all.

A biopsy will not be very invasive and will provide you with peace of mind.

Karen
Rona Yuthasastrakosol - 08 Jan 2004 23:27 GMT
<snip>
>I am just praying that one morning
> I will wake up and the lump will be gone.

FWIW, I also found a lump on my cat a few weeks after she had been
vaccinated.  I took her back to the vet and he said it wasn't an unusual
occurrence, but that I should watch it just in case.  It took a few more
weeks, but the lump did disappear and has not reappeared since (I still
check for lumps every so often, just in case).  And as a human, I get
vaccine-related lumps, too :-)!  (I bruise and scar easily.)

From what I read, 1 in 5000 cats are affected--seems like a lot but as a
percentage, it's .0002%.  And, from
http://littlezoo.com/data/vet/Commonly%20Treated%20Malignancies%20of%20the%20Cat.htm
"VAS may develop from 3 months to 3 years after vaccination" so 6 weeks is a
bit early for the sarcoma to have developed (if you believe the site
quoted).  I think you were wise to bring her in to the vet, and you should
keep your eye on the lump, but you don't need to worry for now.  She has a
very good chance of *not* getting a vaccine-related sarcoma.

Good luck, and let us know how she's doing!

rona
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Hans Schr?der - 09 Jan 2004 00:28 GMT
> From what I read, 1 in 5000 cats are affected--seems like a lot but as a
> percentage, it's .0002%.

More like .02%, I guess... If we start with the fact that 1 in 50 is 2%,
then 1 in 500 is 0.2% and...?

Hans
Rona Yuthasastrakosol - 09 Jan 2004 00:56 GMT
> More like .02%, I guess... If we start with the fact that 1 in 50 is 2%,
> then 1 in 500 is 0.2% and...?
>
> Hans

Oops!  I meant to adjust the decimal point but forgot!  But staying on
topic, .02% is still a relatively low risk...

Thanks for the correction!

rona

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Laura R. - 09 Jan 2004 17:47 GMT
> From what I read, 1 in 5000 cats are affected

http://www.avma.org/vafstf/treatcoutomacy.asp

Laura
Linda E - 10 Jan 2004 16:54 GMT
> <snip>
> >I am just praying that one morning
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> check for lumps every so often, just in case).  And as a human, I get
> vaccine-related lumps, too :-)!  (I bruise and scar easily.)

My vet always tells me there's a chance of a "lump" or "swelling" at the
vaccine site... I don't think she's referring to a sarcoma though at that
point, but a "reaction."  (or so I assume)
Linda
Gail - 09 Jan 2004 00:01 GMT
YOu did the best thing for her. I think the lump will be OK. The fact that
the needle aspiration came back negative is a good thing.
Gail
> I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7 months
> old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing several
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> experience with post vaccination lumps.  I am just praying that one morning
> I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
~*Connie*~ - 09 Jan 2004 00:19 GMT
I had a foster kitten that reacted to the vaccine too.  After a few weeks it
went away.. cancer can develop with vaccines, but its usually not that fast.
> I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7 months
> old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing several
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> experience with post vaccination lumps.  I am just praying that one morning
> I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Dennis Carr - 09 Jan 2004 02:16 GMT
> I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7 months
> old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing several
> scratching posts, giving kitty the run of the house.  Did NOT have her
> declawed, got her rabies and distemper vaccine, had her spayed.  Now 6
> weeks after her rabies vaccine, there is a lump at her vaccination site.

And you took her to the vet.  Good call, and with this, you did the Right
thing.

>  Further
> research suggests that this could very likely be cancerous sarcoma
> caused by the vaccine.  The vet NEVER mentioned this side effect.

Here's a question - where is the research that says this is a
*significant* risk?  Odds are that your vet not only felt that this was of
no risk, but that because a rabies shot may be so routine

First and foremost, I'll go on record as saying I hope this gets better.
Second, keep in mind that I'm not anywhere near a doctor of any sort.

Now then, something I learned is that most sub-independent research (IE,
"this is what happened to me") is something to be taken with a grain  -
nay, about a truckload - of salt.   It is always the people who have
something bad happen to them who yell the loudest, and when something goes
right, the only time you'll hear of it is if it's authoritative research
beyond what the news gives you.  (Besides, the news gives you
pseudoscientific results of initial findings - such as that having a beer
would melt your liver, and next year beer would strengthen your heart, or
something equally ridiculous.)

With that said, keep in mind that, as it is in humans, there is a risk
when you do something - ANYTHING - invasive to a feline, from full blown
open heart surgery to something as simple as a vaccination injection,
however minute the risk is.  There are steps to prevent really nasty
things from happening, but every now and again something does happen, and
there are almost always ways to treat this.

In any case, heed your vet's word before you heed what's online - they are
the one who has the training to know where there are problems.

We had a needle
> aspirator (sp) biopsy which was negative, but even the vet said we still
> should be concerned.  We are going to watch the lump for changes and may
> have a tough choice coming up.

If the biopsy came back negative, like others have said, there's probably
no worry.

> I am very upset about this and can't help but wonder if I wouldn't have
> been better off leaving kitty a feral.

Well, kitty has grown fond of you, yesno? =^^=

The storm will ride out.  Prayers and purrs for you and kitty, I'm sure
this isn't painless.

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------------------------------------+-------------------------------

Cathy Friedmann - 09 Jan 2004 02:37 GMT
Considering the needle aspiration biopsy was negative, I wouldn't be
overly-worried.  I personally know of one cat who died of a vaccine (FeLV -
cat was indoor/outdoor, so needed the vaccine) site-induced cancerous tumor
on her shoulder a few years ago, when the cat was 7.  It was inoperable,
because of the location.  Now a rear leg is used for FeLV vax, *if* the cat
needs it, so that an amputation can be performed in the unlikely event of a
carcinoma forming as a result of the shot.

So, I agree to keep a watch on it, but to try to relax in the meantime.
Adopting her was, IMO, a wiser thing to do than to leave her to her own
devices outside.  One can't ever second-guess such a situation - the "what
ifs" - the adverse things that *may* happen, Vs. what is -likely- to be the
overall better situation.  And you chose the likely-to-be-better deals:
adopting her & getting her rabies shot taken care of.  Which it may very
well still turn out to be.

Cathy

--
"Staccato signals of constant information..."
("The Boy in the Bubble")  Paul Simon
> I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7 months
> old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing several
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> experience with post vaccination lumps.  I am just praying that one morning
> I will wake up and the lump will be gone.
Victor Martinez - 09 Jan 2004 03:32 GMT
I too hope the bump is just some kind of allergic reaction to the shot.
In the future, you might want to discuss with your vet the vaccination
guidelines recommended by the AAFP:
http://www.aafponline.org/about_guidlines.htm
Since we keep our cats indoors only, many vaccines are not necessary.
Others don't need to be given every year, only every 3 years. Talk to
your vet about this.

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stocksRus - 10 Jan 2004 21:30 GMT
> I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7
> months old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> just praying that one morning I will wake up and the lump will be
> gone.

Just went throught the same thing...1 in 10,000 cats are affected by the
vaccine. I wouldnt worry too much now. I freaked out and my vet assured me
he was OK and within 8 weeks it, the lump was gone
Charles - 12 Jan 2004 16:38 GMT
My big concern is that there was no immediate reaction.  The lump first
appeared about 6 weeks after the vaccination.  It has now been 2 months and
it still has not gone away.  The vet said that usually a reaction will occur
in the first week or two.

> > I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7
> > months old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> vaccine. I wouldnt worry too much now. I freaked out and my vet assured me
> he was OK and within 8 weeks it, the lump was gone
JP Hobbs - 20 Jan 2004 11:25 GMT
Purrs to your kitten to lose the lump, and I hope it is not cancerous
please dont regret taking it in if you hadn't she might well be dead
by now anyway with no-one to help her *or him* if she died in pain
like being run over or another animal killing her, be thankful she has
you to care about her, hugs  Jean P.

> > I took in an abandoned kitty approx 4 months ago.  She is now 6-7
> > months old.  I was what I thought to be a wonderful owner, purchasing
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> vaccine. I wouldnt worry too much now. I freaked out and my vet assured me
> he was OK and within 8 weeks it, the lump was gone
Charles - 20 Jan 2004 19:22 GMT
Thanks for the reply.  The lump has not gone down but is NOT getting any
bigger after 3 weeks.  My vet wants to remove the lump next week if it
hasn't gone down.  But the vet also thinks it is unlikely a cancerous
sarcoma.  If the vet really feels it is not cancerous, I wonder why she
wants to remove the lump so quickly.  I would hate to put my kitten through
this if it is not cancerous and the lump will eventually subside.  I did get
another vet's opinion and they seemed to think that since it is not growing
in size, that I should wait a few more weeks and monitor the size.  It is
not totally unusual for a vaccine reaction to last a couple of months before
disappearing.  The big drawback here is that if it is cancerous, that is 3
more weeks of allowing this to invade my kitten's body.  I am at a loss as
far as what I should do.  The kitten appears to be less active lately but
otherwise in good health.  I just think she is growing up and is becoming
more mature ;)
> Purrs to your kitten to lose the lump, and I hope it is not cancerous
> please dont regret taking it in if you hadn't she might well be dead
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
> > vaccine. I wouldnt worry too much now. I freaked out and my vet assured me
> > he was OK and within 8 weeks it, the lump was gone
Laura R. - 21 Jan 2004 00:48 GMT
circa Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:22:34 -0600, in rec.pets.cats.health+behav,
Charles (charles@mn.rr.comnotright) said,

> Thanks for the reply.  The lump has not gone down but is NOT getting any
> bigger after 3 weeks.  My vet wants to remove the lump next week if it
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> more weeks of allowing this to invade my kitten's body.  I am at a loss as
> far as what I should do.  
How about a compromise- can the veterinarian perform a needle
aspiration of the lump and biopsy that?

Laura
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Charles - 21 Jan 2004 21:40 GMT
> circa Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:22:34 -0600, in rec.pets.cats.health+behav,
> Charles (charles@mn.rr.comnotright) said,
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> Laura

We did have a needle aspiration and it was negative.  The vet said this was
good, but not conclusive as she has done needle aspirations before with
negative readings, only to find out the worst later.
Karen - 21 Jan 2004 22:17 GMT
> > circa Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:22:34 -0600, in rec.pets.cats.health+behav,
> > Charles (charles@mn.rr.comnotright) said,
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
> good, but not conclusive as she has done needle aspirations before with
> negative readings, only to find out the worst later.

OK, I understand being cautious, but I would consider this quite good taking
into account age and the nearness of the event to the shot. Most sarcomas
that I've read up show up much later (like 1 to 3 years). So, I would,
myself, feel quite confident in watching it and making sure it doesn't grow.
If it hasn't gone away in 3 months (I picked that because that is how long
my cats took to go away), then I'd think of doing further diagnostics.

Karen
Laura R. - 22 Jan 2004 02:07 GMT
circa Wed, 21 Jan 2004 21:40:14 GMT, in rec.pets.cats.health+behav,
Charles (charles@mn.rr.comnotright) said,

> > circa Tue, 20 Jan 2004 13:22:34 -0600, in rec.pets.cats.health+behav,
> > Charles (charles@mn.rr.comnotright) said,
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
> good, but not conclusive as she has done needle aspirations before with
> negative readings, only to find out the worst later.

With the needle aspiration being negative, I think I'd give the lump
a little more time to subside, personally.

Laura
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