Cat Forum / General Topics / May 2008
Antifreeze Kills
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John - 24 Apr 2008 17:12 GMT After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need to inform as many people as possible. We stared by handing out pamphlets door to door in the area we lived to warn others about the dangers and symptoms of antifreeze poisoning. We have also notified the press and with help from the Animal Concern Advice Line (ACAL) and the Scottish Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (SSPCA) the word has been spread even further.
Please visit http://www.antifreezekills.co.uk/ and sign our petition to the Gordon Brown. We need over 200 signatures to get a response.
Thank you John
William Graham - 24 Apr 2008 21:01 GMT > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a beautiful > ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need to inform as many [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Thank you > John You have done all you could......Thank you.
Here, there are many localities that have banned Ethylene Glycol, and there have been developed good alternatives to that substance in anti-freeze. They can also produce E.G. based anti freezes that have additives that make it highly unpalatable to both animals and people. Keep up the good work.......
Cat Guy - 26 Apr 2008 15:52 GMT > > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a > > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need > > to inform as many people as possible. Was this poisoning intentional?
Was antifreeze left out on purpose by a neighbor - specifically to kill you cat, or other cats, or other animals?
> Here, there are many localities that have banned Ethylene Glycol, There is no reason to ban a product that performs very well as a coolant for vehicles.
I think the occurrance rate of coolant leaking from cars (and pooling such that it can be licked by animals) is practically zero.
It's never happened in my neighborhood.
deannie - 26 Apr 2008 17:17 GMT > > > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a > > > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > It's never happened in my neighborhood. did you know that for humans the antidote for anti-freeze poisoning in alcohol? either orally or I.V good to know
William Graham - 26 Apr 2008 22:10 GMT >> > > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a >> > > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > did you know that for humans the antidote for anti-freeze poisoning in > alcohol? either orally or I.V good to know Yes. This is because the enzymes in the liver will convert the ethylene glycol into a poisonous substance, but these are the same enzymes that are used to convert alcohol, and you can overload them with alcohol, so there won't be enough left over to convert the ethylene glycol into something more poisonous, so it will pass through harmlessly.......I think (IIRC) the name of this enzyme is, "Hydrogenese", but it was a long time ago that I read about it, so perhaps I am wrong on this......
deannie - 30 Apr 2008 07:46 GMT > >> > > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a > >> > > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > of this enzyme is, "Hydrogenese", but it was a long time ago that I read > about it, so perhaps I am wrong on this...... Thanks for explaining that. Very interesting Are you a bit of an alchemist?
William Graham - 30 Apr 2008 17:10 GMT >> >> > > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a >> >> > > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > Thanks for explaining that. Very interesting Are you a bit of an > alchemist? No, but I had a job where I was baby-sitting a machine in the middle of the night at a large university.....They received a science journal, which I would read religiously......It contained mostly biological papers written by PhD candidates and the like. Even though I was a "hard sciences" guy (math and the like) I gradually learned lots of stuff by reading this journal....Of course, since I didn't do this for a living, I forgot most of it. Just as I forgot everything I learned about dairy farming by listening to two dairy farmers arguing with each other while I was in the Navy.....:^)
deannie - 07 May 2008 22:28 GMT > >> "deannie" <nadine...@gmail.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > it. Just as I forgot everything I learned about dairy farming by listening > to two dairy farmers arguing with each other while I was in the Navy.....:^) Sounds like your life has been interesting.
William Graham - 07 May 2008 22:44 GMT >> >> "deannie" <nadine...@gmail.com> wrote in message >> [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] > > Sounds like your life has been interesting. Yeah.....I've been pretty lucky.....I got a good grammar school education back in the 40's in NYC, and then I spent 4 years in the Navy in between two wars. (Korea and Vietnam) then after 8 miserable years crawling around fixing IBM machines, I got a job I really liked at a high energy physics lab at Stanford University. There is nothing better than working at a job you like.....Don't ever stay with one you don't like.....The money is never worth it. Somewhere along the way, I got a BS degree in mathematics, which was good for impressing people, but not really worth much for anything else. If you like playing games, math is the easiest, and most fun way to go in college. It's like a four year course in playing chess, and it gets your foot in the door almost anywhere you want to work.
Kathy - 08 May 2008 20:03 GMT > Yeah.....I've been pretty lucky.....I got a good grammar school education > back in the 40's in NYC, and then I spent 4 years in the Navy in between [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > fun way to go in college. It's like a four year course in playing chess, > and it gets your foot in the door almost anywhere you want to work. Wiliam, you have been lucky - my dear huby has a bachelors and a masters in Mathematics. After 20 + years in computer science, he's now a math teacher who's being driven out of his mind by high school math students... Yeah, good work.... Sigh....
William Graham - 08 May 2008 22:05 GMT >> Yeah.....I've been pretty lucky.....I got a good grammar school education >> back in the 40's in NYC, and then I spent 4 years in the Navy in between [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > teacher who's being driven out of his mind by high school math students... > Yeah, good work.... Sigh.... I feel for him.....Perhaps he should try getting a job at a University, or local Junior college.....The students he will find there are a bit more mature, and easier to teach. But this reminds me of a story....
When I was in High School back East, I had a Geometry Teacher (Geometry I) who was a drunk. She missed every Monday morning, and the rest of the week, she just stared at the rear wall of the room and never said anything. After a couple of days, one third of the class left, and never returned. The rest of us divided ourselves into study groups, and assigned ourselves homework from the book. In class, each group would put one of the homework problems on the board, and discuss it. Then, we would go on to the next section of the book and repeat the process. With only people who were actually interested in learning the subject, the class went amazingly well, and we all learned a lot about geometry. We all scored very high on the regence examination at the end of the semester. And don't forget....We essentially had no teacher at all! So when your husband complains that disruptive students make it hard for him to teach, I can really identify with that.....With no disruptive students, he wouldn't even have to come to class. - They would learn without him even being there!
deannie - 09 May 2008 23:02 GMT > >> Yeah.....I've been pretty lucky.....I got a good grammar school education > >> back in the 40's in NYC, and then I spent 4 years in the Navy in between [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > that.....With no disruptive students, he wouldn't even have to come to > class. - They would learn without him even being there! Does anyone have a cat? I miss my cat. He was my best friend. A cat is what makes a home. Any cat stories out there? Warms the heart.
Ivor Jones - 09 May 2008 23:25 GMT [snip]
: Does anyone have a cat? I miss my cat. He was my best friend. A cat : is what makes a home. Any cat stories out there? Warms the heart. Yep, let's get back on topic ;-)
Here's a good place for cat stories:
www.flippyscatpage.com
Here's a page about my cat Missy
www.g6urp.co.uk/missy
Ivor
Ivor Jones - 09 May 2008 23:26 GMT In news:68k1agF2tcgulU1@mid.individual.net, Ivor Jones <ivor@thisaddressis.invalid> typed, for some strange, unexplained reason:
[snip]
: Here's a page about my cat Missy : : www.g6urp.co.uk/missy Oops I forgot I edited the site the other day, try
www.g6urp.co.uk/cats/missy :-)
Ivor
deannie - 10 May 2008 03:59 GMT > Innews:fb1209b5-ab61-4582-b597-f11898f6a505@q27g2000prf.googlegroups.com, > deannie <nadine...@gmail.com> typed, for some strange, unexplained reason: [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Ivor Thanks for that. I had a cat called Missy too. She was black and white. A real fussy, prissy cat.
Kathy - 10 May 2008 00:48 GMT >>> Yeah.....I've been pretty lucky.....I got a good grammar school >>> education [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > even have to come to class. - They would learn without him even being > there! Thanks - I don't think that'll make him feel any better - his department head sounds a lot like your teacher....
replyonusenet@emailprivate.com - 26 Apr 2008 18:04 GMT >I think the occurrance rate of coolant leaking from cars (and pooling >such that it can be licked by animals) is practically zero. Let me guess: you've never had a car that leaked anti freeeze?
Over the years i've had a number of cars leak anti freeze. My current car is the first one that didn't leak.
Oh and anti freeze is needed here since it gets below freezing from October through April. And it can stay below freezing for months at a time.
Cat Guy - 27 Apr 2008 02:33 GMT
> > I think the occurrance rate of coolant leaking from cars (and > > pooling such that it can be licked by animals) is practically > > zero. > > Let me guess: you've never had a car that leaked anti freeeze? Any car that leaks an appreciable amount of antifreeze will soon be a car sitting at the side of the road with the hood up while the owner has his/her cell phone to their head calling for a tow truck.
My daily driver is a '00 Chrysler 300m. I bought it new. It's 8+ years old. I've NEVER EVEN CHANGED THE ANTIFREEZE IN IT. IT's still got it's original coolant. I've never added any water or needed to top it up.
It's not rocket science to design a car that doesn't leak coolant.
> Over the years i've had a number of cars leak anti freeze. Well you're a luser then. And irresponsible.
> My current car is the first one that didn't leak. I've owned, restored and rebuilt several cars from the 1960's and early 1970's. A coolant leak is VERY easy to detect when it starts, and VERY easy to fix, and a leak is not something you can easily put up with for long without fixing it.
replyonusenet@emailprivate.com - 27 Apr 2008 03:56 GMT >> > I think the occurrance rate of coolant leaking from cars (and >> > pooling such that it can be licked by animals) is practically [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >It's not rocket science to design a car that doesn't leak coolant. Let me put it this way: I've owned alot of cars over the years. A lot of cars. Every one of them with one exception leaked anti freee.
>> My current car is the first one that didn't leak. > >I've owned, restored and rebuilt several cars from the 1960's and >early 1970's. A coolant leak is VERY easy to detect when it starts, >and VERY easy to fix, and a leak is not something you can easily put >up with for long without fixing it. Well our local mechanics could never get it fixed.
William Graham - 27 Apr 2008 06:28 GMT >>> > I think the occurrance rate of coolant leaking from cars (and >>> > pooling such that it can be licked by animals) is practically [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >>up with for long without fixing it. > Well our local mechanics could never get it fixed. Once you find exactly where the leak is, and mark that spot with paint, you can drain out the coolant and fix the leak with solder.
Stan Brown - 27 Apr 2008 12:02 GMT Sat, 26 Apr 2008 22:56:23 -0400 from <replyonusenet@emailprivate.com>:
> Let me put it this way: > I've owned alot of cars over the years. A lot of cars. Every one > of them with one exception leaked anti freee. Then every one of them without exception was poorly maintained, or else you put in too much antifreeze (which is a form of poor maintenance).
 Signature Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA http://OakRoadSystems.com Shikata ga nai...
Ivor Jones - 27 Apr 2008 16:37 GMT In news:4lq714t4o1lep8us5p6mtonkjuq9nsci27@4ax.com, replyonusenet@emailprivate.com <replyonusenet@emailprivate.com> typed, for some strange, unexplained reason:
[snip]
: Let me put it this way: : I've owned alot of cars over the years. A lot of cars. Every one : of them with one exception leaked anti freee. My 6-yr old Ford Fiesta, bought from new, has never leaked anything, water, oil, whatever. It has, though, been regularly serviced according to the manufacturer's instructions. Maybe those that leak all over the place haven't been..?
Ivor
Matthew - 26 Apr 2008 18:07 GMT >> > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a >> > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > There is no reason to ban a product that performs very well as a > coolant for vehicles. Yes there is the product also damages the environment and is also dangerous to animal 2 very good reasons to get rid of it
> I think the occurrance rate of coolant leaking from cars (and pooling > such that it can be licked by animals) is practically zero. > > It's never happened in my neighborhood. That you know of. I am in the USA not sure where you are in the world but it happens all the time due to stupidity, accidental.
Antifreeze is a sweet smell sweet taste to cats and dogs who will drink it if it there
Upscale - 26 Apr 2008 19:47 GMT "Cat Guy" <Cat@Guy.com> wrote in message
> > > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a > > > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need > > > to inform as many people as possible. > > I think the occurrance rate of coolant leaking from cars (and pooling > such that it can be licked by animals) is practically zero. Next time while you're "thinking", try a little investigation before posting. Antifreeze poisoning happens thousands of times, all year around in all environments. Statistics estimate some 10,000 accidental poisonings a year. Even a small amount can be fatal for cats and dogs. Children aren't immune to accidental poisoning either. Do a Google search for "antifreeze poisoning".
http://www.petshealth.com/dr_library/antifreeze.html
William Graham - 26 Apr 2008 22:05 GMT >> > After losing our best friend and dearest companion Barrie, a >> > beautiful ginger cat to antifreeze poisoning we felt the need [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > It's never happened in my neighborhood. It happens in areas where there are a lot of people working on their cars, and other people's cars.......And almost everyone keeps cats and/or dogs, so the animals can be poisoned easily......Especially the dogs, because they like sweet tasting things, and are far less careful about what they eat than are the cats. Also small children can be poisoned by ethylene glycol. I think banning it is not a bad thing, as long as special exceptions to the law can be obtained. In most cases, the anti-freeze substitutes will work fine.
Cat Guy - 27 Apr 2008 02:40 GMT > > It's never happened in my neighborhood. > > It happens in areas where there are a lot of people working on > their cars, and other people's cars... Ok, - I guess I don't see it because I don't live on skid row.
I would bet that pets living in or around a blighted area where sloppy people work on their own cars have more to worry about than antifreeze poisoning. In a perfect world, those pets would all be spayed / neutered, have all their vaccinations, and then we'd worry about whether or not there was any antifreeze laying around...
Kathy - 27 Apr 2008 03:34 GMT >> > It's never happened in my neighborhood. >> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > neutered, have all their vaccinations, and then we'd worry about > whether or not there was any antifreeze laying around... Sorry to tell you this, but my brother, who restores and creates cars for people and himself, once had a small amount of antifreeze leak onto the garage floor. Thier beagle managed to find it and died of anti-freeze poisoning. It's not something that only happens on skid row. It also happens when you can't see under the car and the dog or cat can. A few drops is enough...
William Graham - 27 Apr 2008 06:26 GMT >>> > It's never happened in my neighborhood. >>> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > happens when you can't see under the car and the dog or cat can. A few > drops is enough... Yes, and from watching, "Court" TV, I can tell you that sometimes housewives use it to poison their husbands.....:^)
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