Cat Forum / General Topics / July 2008
Cats and kittens
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batty - 19 Jun 2008 23:19 GMT Hello, am at my wits end so please any advice would be most welcome.
I have 2 adult cats - who occasionally spit and hiss at each other but for the most part tolerate each other well. Recently - 2 weeks ago I was given 2, 8 week old kittens. I did the usual things - different rooms, food, mixed up bedding etc - the usual kind of things. At first lots of hissing and spitting but gradually things improved - but now, my 14 month old cat Lilli has started 'bullying' the kittens. I usually get the kittens out to play when the adults aren't around,but, when they turn up I always make a great fuss of them so as not to let them feel left out.
I know that it is only 2 weeks, but if this is the sign of things to come then I might have to let the kittens go to another home - and it is breaking my heart to even think about doing it.
Please help my kittens!!!
Thanks :-)
William Graham - 20 Jun 2008 07:12 GMT > Hello, am at my wits end so please any advice would be most welcome. > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Thanks :-) I have 5 cats....They all had problems when they were first introduced to the others. I simply yelled at both of them, and clapped my hands together and scared them out of the room elsewhere whenever they showed signs of fighting. - Pretty soon, they realized that I didn't like it, and it wasn't worth it, so they learned to get along. Now, they seldom hiss at one another, and sometimes they even play together. Your kittens will grow up fast.....In a few weeks they will be large enough to take care of themselves. In the meantime, let them all know that you won't put up with them fighting with one another.......
batty - 20 Jun 2008 09:05 GMT Thank you for replying - I have raised my voice several times and then felt guilty - like being a new mum again!!! I will try and be rather more forceful on the one hand and then with the other praise when good things are done :-) CHeers
>> Hello, am at my wits end so please any advice would be most welcome. >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >themselves. In the meantime, let them all know that you won't put up with >them fighting with one another....... Riannon - 20 Jun 2008 20:25 GMT >I have 2 adult cats - who occasionally spit and hiss at each other but for >the most part tolerate each other well. Recently - 2 weeks ago I was given 2, >8 week old kittens. I did the usual things - different rooms, food, mixed up I have 3 - the latest was a kitten when he came here 10 yrs ago and the other two were 6 yrs at the time. They hated the new kitten and would hiss and avoid him or give him a smack or two. Now they have all learned to tolerate each other but it took quite awhile. They may never be "friends" and sleep cuddled up together; being able to tolerate each other is about the most you may get but there's nothing wrong with that. You need much more time than 2 weeks; eventually Lilli will calm down and realize the kittens are there to stay. If it's any consolation, my guys have been living together for almost 10 yrs and they still hiss once in awhile. I wouldn't start yelling at them - can cause stress for the adults and they are already under enough stress with the new additions; just clap your hands if they start to fight or you could try "growling"; it actually works - mama cat growls at her kittens when she's mad at them so they associate you growling with that.
Riannon
PS Don't forget you will need 3 or 4 litter boxes for 4 cats
batty - 20 Jun 2008 20:37 GMT Thanks Rainnon, all suggestions are most welcome! I realised that I'd need more than a couple of weeks, but just concerned that the little ones would be hurt, but what I did today again was to fuss the older cats, play with them more than the kittens and hissed once at them when they were rather rough - but I will try the growling.
They did tolerate the kittens being fed in the same room though and that is another small land mark - however long it lasts!
My older cats don't use litter trays, but I did let them into the utility room to have a look around and absorb the various smells.
So hopefully a peace will eventually ensue. Will try the growling - certainly wouldn't punish them for doing it - after all as you said the kittens are the 'intruders'.
Thanks again
Batty
>>I have 2 adult cats - who occasionally spit and hiss at each other but for >>the most part tolerate each other well. Recently - 2 weeks ago I was given 2, [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >PS Don't forget you will need 3 or 4 litter boxes for 4 cats Tracy101 - 21 Jun 2008 07:29 GMT Why do people do this? Cats are like people. Some personality types simply don't like other personality types. If you're going to get more than one cat, you might be better off getting one of the same breed (or you might call it race) as the first one for a better chance of acceptance.
It's a good idea to try the new cat out for a couple of weeks first as well, to see if they will get along. Remember, the first cat thinks the house belongs to him/her. Other cats are intruders.
Note also that two female cats tend to get along with each other overall better than a male and female (because even fixed males will bother females to no end sexually) and better than two males (because males are both possessive and want domination).
Also, older cats feel threatened by kittens, (including their own) after a few weeks. They are fearful that you will show preference to the kittens (which usually is the case) and shortly get rid of them. It's also irritating to their nerves to have the young little pranksters jumping around all the time. You probably won't like that either when you are old. Older cats also tend to prefer homes that are more quiet and where they can do their own thing in peace. They want basically what exactly what most older people want.
As a person who once owned 6 cats, I can tell you that that's far too many. No home should have more than two at very most. Owners should also be prepared to keep and love those cats for 20 years or so, because it's really hard for an older cat to adjust when it's simply shoved into a new home again. This can be terrifying and very upsetting for them. ____________________________________________
> Hello, am at my wits end so please any advice would be most welcome. > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Thanks :-) batty - 21 Jun 2008 10:41 GMT Hello Tracy, why do people do what? I realise that all animals are different and that is why I asked for help to bring my cats together as best I could. I know some of the 'tricks' but just thought that there might be methods that I hadn't thought about and have been most grateful to receive - after all nobody knows everything.
All my cats are 'moggies'
My older cats are 13/14 months and the other adult is possibly 3/4 - both from a shelter. The kittens were either to be taken in by myself or put to sleep. Hardly an option when there was nothing wrong with them.
I full expect all my pets to live to a great age - and have recently lost a cat that lived to be 19. Have never taken on animals lightly - they deserve a good quality of life and if I couldn't, then I wouldn't.
I have plenty of room for four cats, they are all she cats, 2 have been spayed and the kittens will be when they are old enough. The two older cats (from choice) spend a lot of time outside. Where they were rescued from in the first place.
No cat is going to get on well with another after just a couple of weeks - it does take time and I certainly don't expect miracles - just any information to ease the transition for everyone concerned.
Thanks for your comments.
Batty
>Why do people do this? Cats are like people. Some personality types >simply don't like other personality types. If you're going to get more than [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] >> >> Thanks :-) Matthew - 21 Jun 2008 11:02 GMT > Why do people do this? Cats are like people. Some personality types > simply don't like other personality types. If you're going to get more > than one cat, you might be better off getting one of the same breed (or > you might call it race) as the first one for a better chance of > acceptance. NO true yes there are cats that are one cat household personalities but they would have shown signs before this
> It's a good idea to try the new cat out for a couple of weeks first as > well, to see if they will get along. Remember, the first cat thinks the [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > home again. This can be terrifying and very upsetting for them. > ____________________________________________ Please you have no right or even professional backing to say that no more than two. Just because that is your way doesn't even mean it is close to being right. I have been proudly owned by 11 in one house before and would gladly have twenty if I could afford them. So you can blow that right out your a.s since this is your first post here but you did get the rest partly right except for the two part. there are people on here that will blow that out of the water very quickly. You were trying do something right but before you talk do a little research first
I am proudly owned by 5 right now it was 6 but lost one to the pet food recall
As for the other poster it takes time you must gradually introduce them to one another here is some information for a real source http://www.maxshouse.com/introducing_cats.htm
batty - 21 Jun 2008 11:38 GMT HI Matthew - I started the original thread. I'd looked on the internet, but thoughts seemed to vary but am open to all suggestions so thank you for the site that you've highlighed. Funny thing is that I've just fed one of the adults and Mia (kitten) decided to venture into the kitchen - I waited for there to be a hissing and a spitting - but there was nothing! Amazing - so I know that this is only a small step but it is a step. I usually feed them in different rooms, gradually moving the bowls closer together, but this was totally unexpected - and a delight. However, there is no way that I'd leave them together!!!
I will admit that I'd love more cats, but 4 is enough for me - I couldn't afford anymore, although I have got them insured. Again, some people might think this is a waste of money, but had my daughter not had her cat insured then she'd have had a £2700 - yes that's correct - medical bill! Unfortunately the little chap died. So sad.
:-) >> Why do people do this? Cats are like people. Some personality types [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] >one another here is some information for a real source >http://www.maxshouse.com/introducing_cats.htm batty - 21 Jun 2008 11:47 GMT Hi Matthew - have just had a quick look at the site - brilliant. Wish that I'd seen it before then I wouldn't have been so worried that what I was doing was incorrect. Maybe just instinct made me do most of what has been written in the article - in maybe a slightly different way, but is comforting to know that all behaviours are 'normal'
HAve just read the article on declawing - how barbaric - can't believe that people would do that unless for medical reasons. Be like us having our toes and fingers cut off!
Have a good day and thanks :-)
>> Why do people do this? Cats are like people. Some personality types >> simply don't like other personality types. If you're going to get more [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] >one another here is some information for a real source >http://www.maxshouse.com/introducing_cats.htm tension_on_the_wire - 26 Jun 2008 04:09 GMT > Hello, am at my wits end so please any advice would be most welcome. > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Thanks :-) You've gotten lots of suggestions which are all potentially valid. I just wanted to add one thing. Sometimes, cats need to work out their own politics, and our interference is not always welcome. As long as you are there in the background to defuse any potentially dangerous situation for the little ones, you might want to sit back and watch them work out their own pecking order. They have rules and communications we do not always understand and if we stay out of the way, they can sometimes settle themselves much more quickly. I have seen this work several times. Other times, we need to mediate, but if nothing else works, you might want to step back and see if they can work it out. As I said, always staying close enough for a quick rescue of a kitten just in case it gets nasty.
I have used this method for 24 years and it has not failed yet. The other thing I do is give each and every cat total coddling whenever I get one in a room by himself, without the others to see or get jealous, so that they are each still secure in my affections. It has even worked with my current pair, one of which was 13 years old when the other was acquired as a new kitten and severe jealousy ensued. At first, it was the kitten in jeopardy, and then when he grew into a 16 pound man'o'war, it became the fragile old lady cat who was vulnerable. But now they have a nice parallel existence and even vacate my lap for the other when the rival comes in the room. All civil and courteous now but what a war zone it was in the first months!
Good luck
--tension
batty - 26 Jun 2008 12:28 GMT Hi Tension, thank you very much for taking the time to reply.
Now that the kittens are a little older - well 10.5 weeks I am trying to stand back and just intervening when absolutely necessary - as you say - they have to learn the pecking order.
I keep them apart at night time - I keep my adult cats in at night - but they have the run of the house and until I am sure that there isn't going to be any 'violence' then that's the way that it will stay.
There is slightly more tolerance appearing but I will still be there until relative peace is the norm!!!
Was funny the other day in that an adult cat was 'attacking' a kitten and when I raised my voice slightly - she stopped trying to bite and started cleaning - as thought to say 'what's the fuss mum'!! Took that as a good sign, but not good enough yet!
Despite all the 'trouble' that ensues, I wouldn't have it any other way as they are such a joy to have. Four cats is enough - that is until someone comes alone with a...Lucy, this cat needs an new home......
Thanks again.
>> Hello, am at my wits end so please any advice would be most welcome. >> [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > >--tension batty - 19 Jul 2008 12:37 GMT Hi T - thanks for your comments. Maybe I am fortunate in that my 4 cats have settled and are happy and adjusted. They all have individual time and play time together with me. Non of them are spoiled. The adult cats seem to enjoy the kittens and indeed spend hours grooming them which I understand is important to them all.
As for people having no more than two cats so that they can have 100% attention - that is mathematically impossible. They could only have 50%...
>Hi Tension, thank you very much for taking the time to reply. > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] >> >>--tension Tracy101 - 19 Jul 2008 12:25 GMT I once ran into that situation and when the kittens grew up, the reverse was true -- they got even and it was the mother who was constantly running. Animals are so much like humans it's unbelievable.
Mothers often get upset with their kittens just as mothers do with their kids, especially when they reach the teen years. Then it can be unbearable for both of them.
People should never own more than a couple of cats at most. Cats love nothing more in the world than to be on the receiving end of 100% of their owner's TOTAL ATTENTION. So many people think they get lonely like people. A VERY FEW may, but the great majority don't like competition of any sort. They want to be the ONLY spoiled brat.
Usually when people have more than one cat, there will indeed be domination problems, fighting, jealousy, and so on, just like when they have more than one child. Generally the animal who is the most dominant is happiest, while those who are ruled by the dominant one are less happy and feel used and abused -- same as with humans..
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On Jun 19, 3:19 pm, "batty" <u44344@uwe> wrote:
> Hello, am at my wits end so please any advice would be most welcome. > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Thanks :-) You've gotten lots of suggestions which are all potentially valid. I just wanted to add one thing. Sometimes, cats need to work out their own politics, and our interference is not always welcome. As long as you are there in the background to defuse any potentially dangerous situation for the little ones, you might want to sit back and watch them work out their own pecking order. They have rules and communications we do not always understand and if we stay out of the way, they can sometimes settle themselves much more quickly. I have seen this work several times. Other times, we need to mediate, but if nothing else works, you might want to step back and see if they can work it out. As I said, always staying close enough for a quick rescue of a kitten just in case it gets nasty.
I have used this method for 24 years and it has not failed yet. The other thing I do is give each and every cat total coddling whenever I get one in a room by himself, without the others to see or get jealous, so that they are each still secure in my affections. It has even worked with my current pair, one of which was 13 years old when the other was acquired as a new kitten and severe jealousy ensued. At first, it was the kitten in jeopardy, and then when he grew into a 16 pound man'o'war, it became the fragile old lady cat who was vulnerable. But now they have a nice parallel existence and even vacate my lap for the other when the rival comes in the room. All civil and courteous now but what a war zone it was in the first months!
Good luck
--tension
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