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Fipronil or Imidocloprid on elderly cat?

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jdc1 - 14 Oct 2005 01:28 GMT
Frontline uses Fipronil, Advantage uses Imidocloprid for control of fleas.

She's got white flecks and losing fur, and seems to be losing some weight. Fleas too.
Outdoor cat.

I'm sure the bites are causing a bit of anemia, some cats have more serious reactions to
flea bites.

Are they both about equally safe?  I've used Frontline on her before with no noticable
side effects, but she's getting older.

I know to stay away from Hartz drops.  She went into convulsions a year or so ago after
using that poison sold over the counter.
No More Retail - 14 Oct 2005 01:32 GMT
I use advantage on my epileptic cat who takes diazepam  he has a habit of
liking his fur off   no side effects in 6 years of using it on any of my
cats except when they smell it after we put it on we get the cold shoulder
for a few hours
No More Retail - 14 Oct 2005 01:33 GMT
we also use it on a Himalayan that is 18 almost 19 years old who weighs
about 4 lbs  and she is fine just hates the smell
"
AnimalBehaviorForensicSciencesResearchLaboratory@HushMail.Com - 16 Oct 2005 01:56 GMT
HOWEDY jec1,

> Frontline uses Fipronil, Advantage uses Imidocloprid
>  for control of fleas.

Aren't they NEURO TOXINS?

> She's got white flecks and losing fur, and seems to
> be losing some weight. Fleas too. Outdoor cat.
>
> I'm sure the bites are causing a bit of anemia,

Kats can DIE from flea anemia.

>  some cats have more serious reactions to flea bites.

Don't get much worse than DEAD.

> Are they both about equally safe?

You mean equally dangerHOWES.

> I've used Frontline on her before with no noticable
> side effects, but she's getting older.
>
> I know to stay away from Hartz drops.  She went into
> convulsions a year or so ago after using that poison
> sold over the counter.

So you'll buy other poison from your vet?

HOWEDY Pearl,

pearl wrote:
> hi all
> any one help

You AIN'T gonna get no heelp from the dog abusin
punk thug cowards we got postin here.

> i have a springer spanial aged 1 year 2 months,male,
> having a right probelm with fleas at the mo .

Yeah? I haven't seen fleas in years and I live in
Central Florida, Flea Crapital of the world.

> before i go any further ,i am a single parent and
> cant afford vet fees

You'd be hard pressed to find a vet who knows HOWE
to protect your HOWES and family from fleas.

> i have treated the dog with , 1 tablets ( 2 different
> sorts) had all 6 of each,one recommended by a vet

SEE?

> dog flea spray 3 different sorts and used all
> dog flea shampoo bathed twice flea and tick drops
> house flea spray twice ,one recomended by a vet

SEE?? SEE???

> flea powder and smoke bombs for fleas
>
> but still my poor dog has fleas .

Yeah. That was PREDICTABLE.

> any one know what i am doing wrong ,

Yeah. You been following the advice of incompetent
self serving blowhards.

> he  doesnt appear to have flea dirt ,but every
> morning i comb him had appox 20 fleas anyone help
> many thanks in advance

Here's EVERY THING YOU GOTTA KNOW:

Subject: Re: blonde fleas?

HOWEDY neenee,

neenee wrote:
> Hi there, we have a very very old dachshund and he's
> been getting these little bugs.  My brother thinks
> they're "blonde fleas", but I've never heard of such
> a thing,

Yeah, fleas can be pretty, golden, dark, and like
dogs, are gregariHOWES social critters.

> and they seem to congregate in one area,

They're havin a party.

> rather than being all over like fleas usually are.

You'll find stray fleas at random, but most often
they congregate to celebrate.

>   And I don't notice them jumping very much.

Why should they jump? They're at home.

> We've been bathing him regularly, and wipe the area
> inbetween with a mild flea treatment, but they keep
> coming back.... and always in the hindquarters.

Your fleas have probably developed an immunity to
the prescription or over the counter treatment.
That's very common with all poisons "What doesn't
kill you makes you stronger," Dr. Hunemann, the
father of homeopathy..

> Anyone have any idea what these bugs are?

Sounds like fleas, but only your veterinarian
can give you a DIAGNOSIS.

> --
>   (`*·.¸(`*·.¸¸.·*´)¸.·*´)
>    «´¨ `Janine ´¨`»
>   (¸.·'´`(¸*·'´'·.*`)`'·. ¸)

> San Clemente, CA, USA
> "O wad some Pow'r the giftie gie us; to see
> oursels as oth'rs see us!"
> ~~ Robert Burns

From: ThePuppyProp...@AniMail.Net
Date: 3 Oct 2005 03:02:20 -0700

Subject: Re: My dog has flees

HOWEDY Prophet,

Prophet wrote:
> What should i do?

1st, You should go to The Amazing Puppy Wizard's Archives
on Google and other fine pubicly archived news group
search engines and type in the correct SPELLIN and
see what The Amazing Puppy Wizard SEZ HE DOES to live
in a flea and other parasite free environment.

2nd, DO NOT believe the professional lying dog abusing
punk thug coward mental cases who SELL training lessons
and promote unethickal veterinary practices like toxic
substances and surgical sexual mutilation which may harm
your dogs and family.

3rd, if you DON'T FIND a definive authentic Amazing
Puppy Wizard's Post then ASK HIM HOWE to accomplish
whatever your needs are.

4th, DECENT PEOPLE DO NOT POST HERE so if you see
someWON giving you contradictory information, KNOW
that they're a miserable lying dog abusing punk thug
coward and DISREGARD them. Better yet, tell them to
get the heel HOWETA The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual Forums.

Here's your own FREE COPY of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's'
100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual:

http://www.tinyurl.com/7bl5u

http://www.irishdogs.ie/Information/Wits_End_Dog_Training.pdf

Please study my manual using a text to speech reader.
There's a free one at http://www.ultrahal.com

If you need any additional free help call me
ANY TIME at 407-425-5092.

Here's The Amazing Puppy Wizard's most recent post
on non toxic flea CON-TROLL methods and treatments:

Subject: Re: Excerpt: Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide
to Natural Health for Dogs & Cats

HOWEDY Jane,

Thank you for the valuable information. Dr.Pitcairn's
works are EXXXCELLENT, to say the least. In addition
to her fleating (Ouch!) tips, I recommend insect growth
regulators (IGR's) and beneficial nematodes.

For daily grooming / inspection I always have a "Q-Tip"
soaked in alcohol to quickly swab them up off the dog
and dunk it back into a small bottle of alocohol to
dispatch them.

Of curse, cleanlieness is next to G-dlieness!

Thank you again,

Yours,
The Amazing Puppy Wizard <{); ~ ) >

Jane Smith wrote:
> The following is an excerpt from the book Dr. Pitcairn's
> Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs & Cats by
> Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD, and Susan Hubble Pitcairn
> Published by Rodale; September 2005;$18.95US/$25.95CAN; 1-
> 57954-973-X Copyright © 2005 Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD,
> and Susan Hubble Pitcairn Safe, Effective Flea Control.

> The best approach to controlling fleas is to start with the
> least toxic and most natural choices, resorting to stronger
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> that, it's important to practice thorough sanitation and
> cleaning.

> Understanding the life cycle of the flea makes it clear
> why cleaning is so important. Adult fleas live about three
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> cracks and crevices of rugs, upholstery, blankets, floors,
> sand, earth, and the like.

> Because these tiny larvae cannot jump or travel very far
> (less than an inch), they feed on the black specks of dried
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> a meal of blood, and then start the whole process all over
> again.

> This cycle takes anywhere from 2 to 20 weeks, depending on
> the temperature of the house or environment. During summer -
> - flea season -- the entire cycle is usually just 2 weeks
> long. That's why fleas increase so rapidly at that time.

> The bad news is that, no matter how many adult fleas you
> manage to kill, numerous future fleas are developing in
> the environment simultaneously.

> The good news is that these eggs, larvae, pupa, and the
> flea dirt they feed upon can be sucked up by a vacuum
> cleaner or washed away in the laundry. And because the
> developing fleas are so immobile, they are most
> concentrated wherever your pet sleeps, so you know
> where to focus your efforts.

> Your important ally in the battle against fleas is
> cleanliness, both for your pet and your home, particularly
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> if you act before flea season begins. So start your program
> with these nontoxic steps.

> Steam clean your carpets at the onset of flea season (or
> whenever you begin your flea-control program). Though it
> is somewhat expensive, steam cleaning is effective in
> killing flea eggs.

> Thoroughly vacuum and clean floors and furniture at least
> once a week to pick up flea eggs, larvae, and pupae.

> Concentrate on areas where your pet sleeps and use an
> attachment to reach into crevices and corners and under
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> at least once a week. Dry on maximum heat. Heat will kill all
> stages of flea life, including the eggs.

> Remember that flea eggs are very slippery and easily fall off
> bedding or blankets. So carefully roll bedclothes up to keep
> all the flea eggs contained on the way to the washing machine.

> Bathe the animal with a natural flea-control shampoo. Use a
> nontoxic shampoo as recommended above, such as one containing
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> a regular habit of flea-combing your pet while you watch TV
> or talk on the phone.

> Depending on the degree of infestation and the time of year,
> this might be daily (at the onset of the flea season),
> weekly, or monthly.

> Gently but thoroughly comb as many areas as your pet will
> allow, especially around the head, neck, back, and
> hindquarters. As you trap the little buggers, pull them
> off the comb and plunge them into a container of hot, soapy
> water (or dip the comb and pull the flea off underwater).

> Cover your lap with an old towel to catch extra clumps of
> hair and flea dirt and to wipe the comb off as you work.

> When you're finished, flush the soapy water and fleas down
> the toilet. If your pet goes outdoors, follow these steps
> as well.

> Mow and water your lawn regularly. Short grass allows unlight
> to penetrate and warm the soil, which kills larvae. Watering
> drowns the developing fleas.

> Encourage ants. Perhaps I should say "do not discourage
> ants." They love to eat flea eggs and larvae. This is
> another reason not to use pesticides that kill all the
> insects in your yard.

> "Sterilize" bare-earth sleeping spots. If your pet likes
> to sleep or hang out in a certain bare or sandy area,
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Of course, this is not appropriate to use where you want
> to preserve live grass or plants.

> Apply agricultural lime on grassy or moist areas. This
> helps to dry out the fleas. Rake up any dead leaves and
> grassy debris first.

> Along with the above steps, you might try these methods to
> repel fleas that may try to jump back on your pet, especially
> those harder-to-kill ones hanging out in the backyard.

> Use an herbal flea powder. You'll find them in pet stores and
> natural food stores, or you can make your own. Combine one
> part each of as many of these powdered herbs as you can find:
> eucalyptus, rosemary, fennel, yellow dock, wormwood, and rue.

> Put this mixture in a shaker-top jar, such as a jar for
> parsley flakes. Apply the flea powder sparingly to your
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> contain natural pyrethrins, which are not strong flea-killers
> but do seem to greatly discourage them.

> Use an herbal flea collar. These are impregnated with insect-
> repellent herbal oils. Some are made to be "recharged" with
> the oils and used again.

> Buy them at natural food stores.

> Try a natural skin tonic. The animal herbalist Juliette de
> Bairacli-Levy recommends this lemon skin tonic, which many
> of my clients successfully use on their pets for a general
> skin toner, parasite repellent, and treatment for mange.

> Thinly slice a whole lemon, including the peel. Add it to 1
> pint of near-boiling water and let it steep overnight. The
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> substances such as d-limonene and other healing ingredients
> found in the whole lemon.

> Add ample nutritional or brewer's yeast and garlic to the
> diet. Some studies show yeast supplementation significantly
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> praise the value of garlic as a flea repellent, though so far
> studies do not support this.

> If these methods do not control the fleas sufficiently, take
> the following steps.

> Get your carpets treated with a special anti-flea mineral
> salt. There have been some developments in safe flea control.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> to a year, the products safely kill fleas and their dveloping
> forms over a few week's time.

> Once or twice a year, sprinkle natural, unrefined diatomaceous
> earth along walls, under furniture, and in cracks and crevices
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> insects by attacking the waxy coating that covers their
> external skeletons. The insects then dry out and die.

> I do not recommend using diatomaceous earth frequently or
> directly on your animal -- mostly because of the irritating
> dust that can be breathed in by both of you. It is also
> messy. Be careful about breathing it in. Wear a dust mask
> when applying. It is not toxic, but inhaling even the natural,
> unrefined form of this dust can irritate the nasal passages.

> Important: Do not use the type of diatomaceous earth that is
> sold for swimming pool filters. It has been very finely
ground,
> and the tiny particles can be breathed into the lungs and
> cause chronic inflammation.

> Use a spray or powder containing pyrethrins or natural
> pyrethrum. These are the least toxic of all the insecticides
> used on pets, and they are found in both conventional and
> natural flea-control products.

> For a more lasting effect, use a microencapsulated product,
> which is perhaps labeled "slow release." Repeat the
> applications as you simultaneously use the carpet treatment
> system or diatomaceous earth. This will help kill both adult
> fleas and developing fleas at the same time.

> Reprinted from: Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide to Natural
> Health for Dogs & Cats by Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD,
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> directly from the publisher by calling (800) 848-4735 or
> visit their website at www.rodalestore.com.

> Authors Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD, opened the Animal
> Natural Health Center, a clinic offering only holistic
> animal care, in 1985. Recently retired from practice, he
> teaches post-graduate courses in homeopathic medicine to
> veterinarians.

> Susan Hubble Pitcairn was a major contributor to the first
> two editions of this book. As the third edition goes to press,
> she is splitting her time between artistic pursuits and the
> support of positive social change.

> For more information, please visit www.drpitcairn.com

Commercial dog food is GARBAGE. Save your
hard earned dough and feed your dog sumpthin
you'd eat:

Breakfast At The Puppy Wizard's -
Chez du Chien - Gourmet Recipies

Here's HOWE The Puppy Wizard feeds his dogs:

HOWEDY People,

Unbeknownst to yourselves, this has been a difficult
couple weeks for Your Puppy Wizard. Not to complain,
but he's been necessarily temporarily abandoned by
his Mrs.Puppy Wizard who had to attend to affairs out
of town for nine days.

Left alone, helpless and hapless to cope with domestic
and personal needs, to fend for HISSELF and his pups by
his own devices, his Mrs. Puppy Wizard HOWEver, is
considerate and foresighted enough to prepare His table
before him, in advance, and even calls to remind him to
breath, when necessary.

Your Puppy Wizard requires little from the physical realm,
existing primarily on prahana and nirvana as his staple diet.

HOWEver, HIS puppies unfortunately cannot thrive in the
physical world without the grounding effects of the evils
of wholesome food.

Mrs. Puppy Wizard prepares daily, fresh, well balanced
HOWES cooked meals. When Mrs. Puppy Wizard travels
occasionally, she prepares for the days of lean in advance,
by freezing two weeks worth of puppy chow and posting the
culinary instructions on the Puppy Wizard's coffee can, the
only physical need The Puppy Wizard requires, beyond his
internet connection and of course, his Mrs. Puppy Wizard
and puppies. But those are givens, naturally.

Mrs. Puppy Wizard prepares 2 meals a day. The following
recipe is for about a 100 pound dog:

Breakfast is half pound raw ground turkey, green
Source, and 1gram vitamin C, and a *Iams cookie
*(cause she LIKES to).

Dinner is 2 cups cooked rice, a tablespoon of rolled
oats and an ounce of hamburg. When the rice and oats
cool, add half cup pinto or similar beans, ground fine
in the food processor with equal amounts raw collard or
similar greens or your dog's favorite vegetable or cabbage,
a tablespoon or two Olive or Cannola oil, half clove garlic,
mixed with 1/2 pound raw ground turkey, a good vitamin /
mineral supplement (Green Source for People), calcium and
magnesium, 1 gram vitamin C.

Addition of table scraps is encouraged, bear in mind
salt can be dangerous. The Puppy Wizard's diet is
environmentally friendly and will not produce noxious
gasses provided the vegetable and beans are ground
finely and because the Green Source contains digestive
enzmyes.

BONE APETITE!

From: "Dr. Von" <drv...@mindspring.com>
Date: 12 Sep 2005 10:52:19 -0700
Subject: Re: Clicker Training for Dogs Newsgroups?

Jen, your request for a positive only dog training list,
needs the same answer as I give the folk who ask why I
don't have a list for what I do with biofeedback.

The method is so simple, and if you adopt it and relate
to your dog in such a positive manner you won't have any
more problems and there is no need for any more technique.

With Puppies we Ph.D. psychologists have been outflanked
by the entirely practical and effective methods described
in http://www.tinyurl.com/7bl5u.  Free download, nothing
sold, no mailing list, no distribution of your name. Free
support if needed.

With ADHD kids I provide similar information at
www.drbiofeedback.com and there is no need for
a list dealing with problems with kids.  Apply
as directed and have happy healthy doggies or
kiddies.

Not difficult.

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

P.S. jerk and choke, spanking, shocking, scruff shake,
choke, chin chucks, all those negatives, denial of
affection etc. are harmful, dranging, obscenities.

You might want to consider Pavlov's typology to
understand "hard and soft dogs" - essentially he
taught that there are outward and inward responding
organisms in weak and strong nervous systems and if
you grasp this firmly you'll shape your training
methods effectively.

Punishment ALWAYS deranges behavior, and so is
recommended and given only by deranged humans.

Of course, it doesn't matter if we are talking
dogs, cats, people, sheep, even husbands.

Dr. Von

From: Mike (m.bidd...@ns.sympatico.ca)
Subject: Re: Info. on the puppy wizard?
Date: 2004-07-18 14:27:02 PST

> > Oh, and did I mention his methods work, ya nuff said.
> > Mike
> Ok Mike which part worked for you?

It helped clear problems from my dogs in the
field using the can penny distraction technique.

Works like a charm.

My dogs get distracted easy from their jobs ie,
retrieving or training to find lost people, oh did
I mention that I am a Search and Rescue Team
Leader.

Sorry that slipped my mind.

I have read volumes of training books and don't
know where people get that Jerry copied others
work as I have NEVER come across his methods
before. I would like to see proof.

Just like Jerry outlined I eliminated problems one
at at time as they arose. I used to try and train to
the way I wanted them but this is backward, you
train out the problems leaving what you want left over.

Funny part is the second dog who had the same
problems as the other didn't need correcting for
some of his habits after I cleared it from the first
dog.

Seemed he learned through osmosis.

Nice side benefit there.

It nearly came to giving them up to a 3rd party
trainer as they were not performing well. The
VAST majority of working dog trainers are
agressive in their actions with the dogs.

I tried it and it didn't work and guess what I
was at my "Whits End" then someone I new
turned me onto Jerry and the rest is history.

I referred friends and families to Jerry's manual
and all have had great results. Starting puppies
out on the distraction technique is especially
good because they never develop the habit.

I had my sisters dog healing, sitting and down
stay reliably at 8-9 weeks. The first night home
following Jerrys advice we ditched the crate and
put the pup on the floor beside the bed and after
2 whimpers NOT A SOUND OUT OF THAT DOG
FOR 6 HRS! first night, that has never happened
in all my days.

Sorry, the man understands dogs its that simple.

Mike

"Ama...@DCFWatch.com" wrote:

No, the dog learned that I would hold still
the second she began to pull.  She would pull
to go where *she* wanted.

Well if she wanted to stop and go in another
direction.. say to sniff my neighbors yard..

she learned if she wanted to do it I would stop
walking and she could go.. and if there wasn't
enough slack on her lead she would just pull me.

Then when she got done doing *her* thing, she woudl
heel.. smile at me and wait for me to say "let's go"
and finish *my* thing.  I would refuse to move .. i
looked like an idiot.. freezing mid walk for minutes
waiting for *my* dog to heel and give *me* permission
to go again.

I did the treats and the let's go... she got to do her
stuff and get a cookie.. if she even wanted the cookie.

I wound up calling Jerry.. as I have a half red nose
pit and half amstaff.. who is incredibly protective..

we had a new pup on the way.. and i needed help.. i
followed petsmarts trainnign guides.. memorized them...
and they *did* work, don't get me wrong.. but only
when my pet wanted a cookie or felt the cookie was
better than what she wanted.. which was not often.

She quickly learned to ignore my commands if she
could see my hands were empty.  So I called Jerry...
he chatted me for about an hour and a half.. gave me
his link... and even when i had probs intro'ing the
pup he called me withn i5 mins of my email for help
at 10pm on a sunday night.

One.. singular.. uno family pack exercise after
the hot and cold exercise and i could zig zag
down my street.. about face .. whatever.. and
never had tension.

two men were acrossed the street and she walked right
by them... ordinarily she'd snarl and protect us.

And in two days.. my dog.. who bit the puppy if he
even looked like he was going near my husband or kids..
is nursing him every hour.. cleaning him.. rough housing
gently.. and teaching him to go potty outside..

actually watches him to make sure he doesn't go in
the house... and has milk.. which is awesome since
she's 19 months old and has never had a litter.

She also has stopped barking non stop at our neighbor's
dogs and pig.. does not bark at eveyr car that drives by
and has stopped jumping on people.  she's even starting
to ignore our cat who has lived on her dome litter box
and our window sill (literally) for over a year and a half.

She also does her commands on cue..  and doesn't look for a treat.

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D." <drv...@mindspring.com>
Subject: The Amazing Jerry's take on psychobabble
Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 12:13:44 -0400

   You might improve the learning of folk who actually
live with and train dogs to do useful things if you
excluded everyone who uses psychobabble from your lists.

I recommend to all of you who wish to taste the flavor
of sensible animal behaviorists to read THE MISBEHAVIOR
OF ORGANISMS, Breland and Breland.

This married pair of psychologists began the long trail
of highly trained animals who are symbolized by Shamu
eating a mackrel from a girl's hand instead of eating
the much more tasty pretty girl who is exactly the size
of the natural food of killer whales, seals.  Yum!

The essay, by the way, is a chapter in B.F. Skinner's
summing up book, CUMULATIVE RECORD.  They include a
sentence which more or less says, "unless you understand
the personal history of the particular animal, and the
history of this animal's species and group, the developmental
history of the animal, you cannot effectively train the animal.

Pigs root and hen's scratch, if you try to train hens without
scratching or pigs without scratching or pigeons without pecking,
you aren't going to have much success.

A conditional reflex is one which is learned, the original
primitive reflex occurs no matter what the history of the
animal, and is hard wired.  If you train the animal to respond,
say by ringing a bell immediately before turning on a bright
light, then you've taught the animal and made his native reflex
of pupil constriction conditional upon the ringing of a bell.

Thorndyke added some terminology to this kind of training
and insisted that when you train the animal to make gross
motor responses that this learning is "instrumental", the
animal takes action and uses an instrument.

The Russian word translated as "conditional" in all other
contexts was mistranslated by Pavlov's American translator,
Horsley Gannt, as "conditioned" and so American psychology
went haring after phantasmagora.

The major theorists for the development of the language of
operant conditioning are Edward Thorndike, John Watson, and
B. F. Skinner. Their approach to behaviorism played a major
role in the development of American psychology.

They proposed that learning is the result of the application
of consequences; that is, learners begin to connect certain
responses with certain stimuli. This connection causes the
probability of the response to change (i.e., learning occurs.)

Thorndike labeled this type of learning instrumental. Using
consequences, he taught kittens to manipulate a latch (e.g.,
an instrument). Skinner renamed instrumental as "operant"
because in this learning, one is "operating" on, and is
influenced by, the environment. Where classical conditioning
illustrates S-->R learning, operant conditioning is often
viewed as R-->S learning since it is the consequence that
follows the response that influences whether the response
is likely or unlikely to occur again.

It is through operant conditioning that
voluntary responses are learned.

One should note that Russian Psychology did very well
without the operant language, and only pettifogging
university professors ought to worry about what kind
of label we attach to the learning.  Pfui!

Even Skinner understood this!

And please note if you saw the original movie, THE
MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE, you saw a Chinese psychologist
who was based on Andrew Salter, CONDITIONED REFLEX
THERAPY.

Alas, Salter didn't have a Ph.D., but he basically rescued
us from the long Freudian nightmare and returned psychotherapy
to a scientific basis.  Alas, the 2nd movie didn't even cite
Salter as a source.  "...all the highest nervous activity, as
it manifests itself in the conditional reflex, consists of a
continual change of these three fundamental processes --
excitation, inhibition and disinhibition."  Ivan P. Pavlov

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

What's important is, "does Shamu reliably eat
the fish and not the pretty girl?"

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D." <drv...@mindspring.com
To: <d...@arcane-computing.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 5:38 PM
Subject: Doggy advice

Scott, Jerry Howe forwarded me the letter below.
I'm glad that you referred negatively to Jerry's
habit of CAPITALIZING and HOWEING everything.

I personally hate this habit of his. I think it is his
way of diluting his authority - IME he is a very modest
fellow. However, contrary to your sneer, he is very
competent at living with dogs.

I thought I'd list a series of actions which I found
on the list, folk asking advice on what to do about
dogs doing this and that, for example:

whining,
humping, hunching,
pacing,
self mutilation - paw licking, side sucking,
spinning,
prolonged barking, barking at shadows,
overstimulated barking,
fighting, bullying other dogs,
compulsive digging,
compulsive scratching,
compulsive chewing,
frantic behavior,
chasing light, chasing shadow,
stealing food,
digging in garbage can,
loosing house (toilet) training.
inappropriate fearfulness
aggression.

The thing that is fascinating to me, as an ethologist who
graduated from college 50 years ago and has spent all of
the intervening time working with animals (including the
human animal), is that you never see any of these behaviors
in wild dingoes, jackals, coyotes or wolves, you don't even
see these behaviors in hyenas (who aren't dog related).

You see these behaviors in human managed animals, especially
animals who live with neurotic hysterical humans.

As Sam Corson (Pavlov's last student) demonstrated for
nearly 50 years at Ohio University (Oxford, O.) there
is no treatment more useful for dogs than tender loving
care.

George von Hilsheimer, Ph. D., F. R. S. H., Diplomate,
Academy of Behavioral Medicine

       "Linda" <llindaleedan...@msn.com wrote in message
       news:

       I have been trying for the last 18 months to help my
       dog who became fear aggressive at 18 month of age.
       I do not know what started the problem but he came
       aggressive first with dogs and then began lunging and
       snapping at people. Until this time he loved everyone
       and could play with any dog. He was well socialized
       ad I took him with me everywhere.

       At 13 months he passed the Canine Good Citizens
       Test except he could let me leave him. I had used
       clicker training to teach him manners and tricks but
       it was not working on his aggression problem.

       I took him to vets who suggested a low protein diet,
       trainers who charged $800 to only make him worse.
       They tried to use a prong collar and he froze, urinated
       and tried to climb on my head to help him. they then
       suggested a shock collar I knew this approach was not
       working as he was becoming more aggressive.

       I took him to an animal behaviorist with Ph. D. 400 miles
       away who told me to "KEEP HIM SAFE" and read a book
       on the fearful canine. I tried another trainer who tried to
       use a nylon chock collar but it only made him worse.

       I read hundreds of books,"CULTURE CLASH", "DOG
       ARE FROM NEPTUNE", "THE OTHER END OF THE
       LEASH", ETC looking for help. We finally went to Purdue
       University Small Animal Behavior Clinic and they said he
       had fear aggression, punishment would not work, use the
       gentle leader and when out walking and he got stressed
       have the people stop until he could get in control using
       treats, and work on clicker training.

       At that point I knew more about clicker training and using
       the gentle leader than they did! Nothing was working--he
       would not come when I called him and would run away when
       I tried to catch him. I was afraid to walk him even in the
       neighborhood as we had become that "mean dog and women who
       hasn't trained her dog"

       I went to four trainers in both Michigan and Florida who
       were trainer/specialists in aggression and the last two
       were so afraid of him they could not approach him. No one
       said I should give up on him and kill him but they would
       say "You have to realize he is dangerous and you are
       responsible for him."

       *(You got LUCKY, Linda... They coulda got Sunshine
       DEAD on us. Damned near did... too.)

       As last resort I tried the internet again--I had had on
       going discussions with trainers from Triple Crown and Dr
       Meister with out any help-and I found the ad to Doggy Do
       Right and messaged Jerry to ask if this might help my dog.
       He said solving the aggression problem was EZ but I could
       not believe him even when I downloaded the manual.

       The name of the method was right I was at my Wits End.
       I had been working for 18 months!

       Using the can sound three time he came, and still comes
       from anywhere with the command-"comegoodboy" Next
       I tried the can when walking him--when he saw a dog three
       blocks away he went off-lunging and snapping-I used the
       can sound and he looked at me like uhn?

       I used it three more times and we got to the other dog-
       -the looked at me wagging his tail--the other person
       looked at me like why are shaking that can but just walked
       on by.

       When ever I try to explain about the sound people look at
       me like "you must be out of your mind"

       The results can make a believer!!!

       Three weeks since beginning the Wits End Training
       Manual program I walked him without the gentle leader
       in a busy shopping area with many dogs.

       He just seemed to not notice any one.

       When people talked to him or ask his name he would
       look at then and wag his tail and let then pet him.

       I still can not believe the change in him--we can now
       enjoy life out in public.

       If I had not found the Wits End method I know there
       was no hope for him and he would have hurt someone
       Through all this he never growled at me, guarded his
       toys or food or showed any sign of aggression with me.

       My goal is to get the message out to all dog lovers that
       dogs can be trained fast, easily and problems solved with
       out force, pain, food or anything but sound and praise!!!!

       I know most people would have given up on him a long time
       ago but he was and is my life. Solving the problem was EZ
       but only with the right approach-sound and praise.

       I know because I tried everything else and nothing worked!!!

       ================================

       From: Linda Daniel
       To: Jerry Howe
       Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 1:06 AM
       Subject: Re: - Re: dog aggression

       Thanks for writing--I would be happy to do almost anything
       to get your approach out to dog owners as I know it would
       save so many lives.  I know at times I was so frustrated I
       thought of giving up on Sunshine but of course I never would
       have but many people would have.  The world just does not
       know you can train a dog in just a few sessions and actually
       solve problems.

       We will be here until late April and we really have no plans-
       -just to enjoy the warmth and sun of Florida, so any time
       you could meet us would be great.  I drive so I would be
       happy to come to you anytime anywhere!

       We went to Celebration today and two little poodles got
       right into his face and he just sat there--I GOT a little
       scared but he handled it just fine.--a couple of times people
       would ask his name and want to pet him and he just went
       to them tail wagging and rolled over for them rub his tummy.

       He really just is not concerned about people passing, even
       those on rollerblades!  I have always used a gentle leader
       in public but he spent most of time rubbing his face on the
       grass--today I used his collar and he was so much happier!!

       Only problem is he will stop to smell and I can not get
       stopped soon enough to keep the leash loose.  He never
       pulled ahead of me but when he gets into smelling I have
       a hard time getting him going--at times  I think he could
       smell a blade of grass for 10 minutes.

       I can never thank you enough for giving Sunshine back!!!!!

       I wrote to Purdue and told them about him being able to
       walk in a crowd with out the /gentle leader and not having
       a problem with other people and dogs.

       I told them their advice did not work. Their advice was
       to use the gentle leader at all times and when he was
       around people or dogs to have him sit and reward with
       treats--one really good suggestions was to have people
       coming toward us stop when he got stressed or aroused
       and not move until we backed away-

       - can you just see me yelling at people to stop on the street
       until I get his attention with treats.

       They also suggested the possibility of using drugs-prozac-
       but thought he was too dangerous as the drug would make
       him less fearful and then he might attack or become more
       sure of himself and become dominate aggressive. Just had
       to share their great advice with you but I am sure you have
       heard it all--even I am becoming an expert on bad advice.

       ----------------------------------

HOWEDY Pearl,

pearl wrote:
> hi all
> any one help

You AIN'T gonna get no heelp from the dog abusin
punk thug cowards we got postin here.

> i have a springer spanial aged 1 year 2 months,male,
> having a right probelm with fleas at the mo .

Yeah? I haven't seen fleas in years and I live in
Central Florida, Flea Crapital of the world.

> before i go any further ,i am a single parent and
> cant afford vet fees

You'd be hard pressed to find a vet who knows HOWE
to protect your HOWES and family from fleas.

> i have treated the dog with , 1 tablets ( 2 different
> sorts) had all 6 of each,one recommended by a vet

SEE?

> dog flea spray 3 different sorts and used all
> dog flea shampoo bathed twice flea and tick drops
> house flea spray twice ,one recomended by a vet

SEE?? SEE???

> flea powder and smoke bombs for fleas
>
> but still my poor dog has fleas .

Yeah. That was PREDICTABLE.

> any one know what i am doing wrong ,

Yeah. You been following the advice of incompetent
self serving blowhards.

> he  doesnt appear to have flea dirt ,but every
> morning i comb him had appox 20 fleas anyone help
> many thanks in advance

Here's EVERY THING YOU GOTTA KNOW:

Subject: Re: blonde fleas?

HOWEDY neenee,

neenee wrote:
> Hi there, we have a very very old dachshund and he's
> been getting these little bugs.  My brother thinks
> they're "blonde fleas", but I've never heard of such
> a thing,

Yeah, fleas can be pretty, golden, dark, and like
dogs, are gregariHOWES social critters.

> and they seem to congregate in one area,

They're havin a party.

> rather than being all over like fleas usually are.

You'll find stray fleas at random, but most often
they congregate to celebrate.

>   And I don't notice them jumping very much.

Why should they jump? They're at home.

> We've been bathing him regularly, and wipe the area
> inbetween with a mild flea treatment, but they keep
> coming back.... and always in the hindquarters.

Your fleas have probably developed an immunity to
the prescription or over the counter treatment.
That's very common with all poisons "What doesn't
kill you makes you stronger," Dr. Hunemann, the
father of homeopathy..

> Anyone have any idea what these bugs are?

Sounds like fleas, but only your veterinarian
can give you a DIAGNOSIS.

> --
>   (`*·.¸(`*·.¸¸.·*´)¸.·*´)
>    «´¨ `Janine ´¨`»
>   (¸.·'´`(¸*·'´'·.*`)`'·. ¸)

> San Clemente, CA, USA
> "O wad some Pow'r the giftie gie us; to see
> oursels as oth'rs see us!"
> ~~ Robert Burns

From: ThePuppyProp...@AniMail.Net
Date: 3 Oct 2005 03:02:20 -0700

Subject: Re: My dog has flees

HOWEDY Prophet,

Prophet wrote:
> What should i do?

1st, You should go to The Amazing Puppy Wizard's Archives
on Google and other fine pubicly archived news group
search engines and type in the correct SPELLIN and
see what The Amazing Puppy Wizard SEZ HE DOES to live
in a flea and other parasite free environment.

2nd, DO NOT believe the professional lying dog abusing
punk thug coward mental cases who SELL training lessons
and promote unethickal veterinary practices like toxic
substances and surgical sexual mutilation which may harm
your dogs and family.

3rd, if you DON'T FIND a definive authentic Amazing
Puppy Wizard's Post then ASK HIM HOWE to accomplish
whatever your needs are.

4th, DECENT PEOPLE DO NOT POST HERE so if you see
someWON giving you contradictory information, KNOW
that they're a miserable lying dog abusing punk thug
coward and DISREGARD them. Better yet, tell them to
get the heel HOWETA The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual Forums.

Here's your own FREE COPY of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's'
100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW
Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual:

http://www.tinyurl.com/7bl5u

http://www.irishdogs.ie/Information/Wits_End_Dog_Training.pdf

Please study my manual using a text to speech reader.
There's a free one at http://www.ultrahal.com

If you need any additional free help call me
ANY TIME at 407-425-5092.

Here's The Amazing Puppy Wizard's most recent post
on non toxic flea CON-TROLL methods and treatments:

Subject: Re: Excerpt: Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide
to Natural Health for Dogs & Cats

HOWEDY Jane,

Thank you for the valuable information. Dr.Pitcairn's
works are EXXXCELLENT, to say the least. In addition
to her fleating (Ouch!) tips, I recommend insect growth
regulators (IGR's) and beneficial nematodes.

For daily grooming / inspection I always have a "Q-Tip"
soaked in alcohol to quickly swab them up off the dog
and dunk it back into a small bottle of alocohol to
dispatch them.

Of curse, cleanlieness is next to G-dlieness!

Thank you again,

Yours,
The Amazing Puppy Wizard <{); ~ ) >

Jane Smith wrote:
> The following is an excerpt from the book Dr. Pitcairn's
> Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs & Cats by
> Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD, and Susan Hubble Pitcairn
> Published by Rodale; September 2005;$18.95US/$25.95CAN; 1-
> 57954-973-X Copyright © 2005 Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD,
> and Susan Hubble Pitcairn Safe, Effective Flea Control.

> The best approach to controlling fleas is to start with the
> least toxic and most natural choices, resorting to stronger
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> that, it's important to practice thorough sanitation and
> cleaning.

> Understanding the life cycle of the flea makes it clear
> why cleaning is so important. Adult fleas live about three
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> cracks and crevices of rugs, upholstery, blankets, floors,
> sand, earth, and the like.

> Because these tiny larvae cannot jump or travel very far
> (less than an inch), they feed on the black specks of dried
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> a meal of blood, and then start the whole process all over
> again.

> This cycle takes anywhere from 2 to 20 weeks, depending on
> the temperature of the house or environment. During summer -
> - flea season -- the entire cycle is usually just 2 weeks
> long. That's why fleas increase so rapidly at that time.

> The bad news is that, no matter how many adult fleas you
> manage to kill, numerous future fleas are developing in
> the environment simultaneously.

> The good news is that these eggs, larvae, pupa, and the
> flea dirt they feed upon can be sucked up by a vacuum
> cleaner or washed away in the laundry. And because the
> developing fleas are so immobile, they are most
> concentrated wherever your pet sleeps, so you know
> where to focus your efforts.

> Your important ally in the battle against fleas is
> cleanliness, both for your pet and your home, particularly
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> if you act before flea season begins. So start your program
> with these nontoxic steps.

> Steam clean your carpets at the onset of flea season (or
> whenever you begin your flea-control program). Though it
> is somewhat expensive, steam cleaning is effective in
> killing flea eggs.

> Thoroughly vacuum and clean floors and furniture at least
> once a week to pick up flea eggs, larvae, and pupae.

> Concentrate on areas where your pet sleeps and use an
> attachment to reach into crevices and corners and under
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> at least once a week. Dry on maximum heat. Heat will kill all
> stages of flea life, including the eggs.

> Remember that flea eggs are very slippery and easily fall off
> bedding or blankets. So carefully roll bedclothes up to keep
> all the flea eggs contained on the way to the washing machine.

> Bathe the animal with a natural flea-control shampoo. Use a
> nontoxic shampoo as recommended above, such as one containing
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> a regular habit of flea-combing your pet while you watch TV
> or talk on the phone.

> Depending on the degree of infestation and the time of year,
> this might be daily (at the onset of the flea season),
> weekly, or monthly.

> Gently but thoroughly comb as many areas as your pet will
> allow, especially around the head, neck, back, and
> hindquarters. As you trap the little buggers, pull them
> off the comb and plunge them into a container of hot, soapy
> water (or dip the comb and pull the flea off underwater).

> Cover your lap with an old towel to catch extra clumps of
> hair and flea dirt and to wipe the comb off as you work.

> When you're finished, flush the soapy water and fleas down
> the toilet. If your pet goes outdoors, follow these steps
> as well.

> Mow and water your lawn regularly. Short grass allows unlight
> to penetrate and warm the soil, which kills larvae. Watering
> drowns the developing fleas.

> Encourage ants. Perhaps I should say "do not discourage
> ants." They love to eat flea eggs and larvae. This is
> another reason not to use pesticides that kill all the
> insects in your yard.

> "Sterilize" bare-earth sleeping spots. If your pet likes
> to sleep or hang out in a certain bare or sandy area,
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Of course, this is not appropriate to use where you want
> to preserve live grass or plants.

> Apply agricultural lime on grassy or moist areas. This
> helps to dry out the fleas. Rake up any dead leaves and
> grassy debris first.

> Along with the above steps, you might try these methods to
> repel fleas that may try to jump back on your pet, especially
> those harder-to-kill ones hanging out in the backyard.

> Use an herbal flea powder. You'll find them in pet stores and
> natural food stores, or you can make your own. Combine one
> part each of as many of these powdered herbs as you can find:
> eucalyptus, rosemary, fennel, yellow dock, wormwood, and rue.

> Put this mixture in a shaker-top jar, such as a jar for
> parsley flakes. Apply the flea powder sparingly to your
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> contain natural pyrethrins, which are not strong flea-killers
> but do seem to greatly discourage them.

> Use an herbal flea collar. These are impregnated with insect-
> repellent herbal oils. Some are made to be "recharged" with
> the oils and used again.

> Buy them at natural food stores.

> Try a natural skin tonic. The animal herbalist Juliette de
> Bairacli-Levy recommends this lemon skin tonic, which many
> of my clients successfully use on their pets for a general
> skin toner, parasite repellent, and treatment for mange.

> Thinly slice a whole lemon, including the peel. Add it to 1
> pint of near-boiling water and let it steep overnight. The
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> substances such as d-limonene and other healing ingredients
> found in the whole lemon.

> Add ample nutritional or brewer's yeast and garlic to the
> diet. Some studies show yeast supplementation significantly
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> praise the value of garlic as a flea repellent, though so far
> studies do not support this.

> If these methods do not control the fleas sufficiently, take
> the following steps.

> Get your carpets treated with a special anti-flea mineral
> salt. There have been some developments in safe flea control.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> to a year, the products safely kill fleas and their dveloping
> forms over a few week's time.

> Once or twice a year, sprinkle natural, unrefined diatomaceous
> earth along walls, under furniture, and in cracks and crevices
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> insects by attacking the waxy coating that covers their
> external skeletons. The insects then dry out and die.

> I do not recommend using diatomaceous earth frequently or
> directly on your animal -- mostly because of the irritating
> dust that can be breathed in by both of you. It is also
> messy. Be careful about breathing it in. Wear a dust mask
> when applying. It is not toxic, but inhaling even the natural,
> unrefined form of this dust can irritate the nasal passages.

> Important: Do not use the type of diatomaceous earth that is
> sold for swimming pool filters. It has been very finely
ground,
> and the tiny particles can be breathed into the lungs and
> cause chronic inflammation.

> Use a spray or powder containing pyrethrins or natural
> pyrethrum. These are the least toxic of all the insecticides
> used on pets, and they are found in both conventional and
> natural flea-control products.

> For a more lasting effect, use a microencapsulated product,
> which is perhaps labeled "slow release." Repeat the
> applications as you simultaneously use the carpet treatment
> system or diatomaceous earth. This will help kill both adult
> fleas and developing fleas at the same time.

> Reprinted from: Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide to Natural
> Health for Dogs & Cats by Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD,
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> directly from the publisher by calling (800) 848-4735 or
> visit their website at www.rodalestore.com.

> Authors Richard H. Pitcairn, DVM, PhD, opened the Animal
> Natural Health Center, a clinic offering only holistic
> animal care, in 1985. Recently retired from practice, he
> teaches post-graduate courses in homeopathic medicine to
> veterinarians.

> Susan Hubble Pitcairn was a major contributor to the first
> two editions of this book. As the third edition goes to press,
> she is splitting her time between artistic pursuits and the
> support of positive social change.

> For more information, please visit www.drpitcairn.com

Commercial dog food is GARBAGE. Save your
hard earned dough and feed your dog sumpthin
you'd eat:

Breakfast At The Puppy Wizard's -
Chez du Chien - Gourmet Recipies

Here's HOWE The Puppy Wizard feeds his dogs:

HOWEDY People,

Unbeknownst to yourselves, this has been a difficult
couple weeks for Your Puppy Wizard. Not to complain,
but he's been necessarily temporarily abandoned by
his Mrs.Puppy Wizard who had to attend to affairs out
of town for nine days.

Left alone, helpless and hapless to cope with domestic
and personal needs, to fend for HISSELF and his pups by
his own devices, his Mrs. Puppy Wizard HOWEver, is
considerate and foresighted enough to prepare His table
before him, in advance, and even calls to remind him to
breath, when necessary.

Your Puppy Wizard requires little from the physical realm,
existing primarily on prahana and nirvana as his staple diet.

HOWEver, HIS puppies unfortunately cannot thrive in the
physical world without the grounding effects of the evils
of wholesome food.

Mrs. Puppy Wizard prepares daily, fresh, well balanced
HOWES cooked meals. When Mrs. Puppy Wizard travels
occasionally, she prepares for the days of lean in advance,
by freezing two weeks worth of puppy chow and posting the
culinary instructions on the Puppy Wizard's coffee can, the
only physical need The Puppy Wizard requires, beyond his
internet connection and of course, his Mrs. Puppy Wizard
and puppies. But those are givens, naturally.

Mrs. Puppy Wizard prepares 2 meals a day. The following
recipe is for about a 100 pound dog:

Breakfast is half pound raw ground turkey, green
Source, and 1gram vitamin C, and a *Iams cookie
*(cause she LIKES to).

Dinner is 2 cups cooked rice, a tablespoon of rolled
oats and an ounce of hamburg. When the rice and oats
cool, add half cup pinto or similar beans, ground fine
in the food processor with equal amounts raw collard or
similar greens or your dog's favorite vegetable or cabbage,
a tablespoon or two Olive or Cannola oil, half clove garlic,
mixed with 1/2 pound raw ground turkey, a good vitamin /
mineral supplement (Green Source for People), calcium and
magnesium, 1 gram vitamin C.

Addition of table scraps is encouraged, bear in mind
salt can be dangerous. The Puppy Wizard's diet is
environmentally friendly and will not produce noxious
gasses provided the vegetable and beans are ground
finely and because the Green Source contains digestive
enzmyes.

BONE APETITE!

From: "Dr. Von" <drv...@mindspring.com>
Date: 12 Sep 2005 10:52:19 -0700
Subject: Re: Clicker Training for Dogs Newsgroups?

Jen, your request for a positive only dog training list,
needs the same answer as I give the folk who ask why I
don't have a list for what I do with biofeedback.

The method is so simple, and if you adopt it and relate
to your dog in such a positive manner you won't have any
more problems and there is no need for any more technique.

With Puppies we Ph.D. psychologists have been outflanked
by the entirely practical and effective methods described
in http://www.tinyurl.com/7bl5u.  Free download, nothing
sold, no mailing list, no distribution of your name. Free
support if needed.

With ADHD kids I provide similar information at
www.drbiofeedback.com and there is no need for
a list dealing with problems with kids.  Apply
as directed and have happy healthy doggies or
kiddies.

Not difficult.

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

P.S. jerk and choke, spanking, shocking, scruff shake,
choke, chin chucks, all those negatives, denial of
affection etc. are harmful, dranging, obscenities.

You might want to consider Pavlov's typology to
understand "hard and soft dogs" - essentially he
taught that there are outward and inward responding
organisms in weak and strong nervous systems and if
you grasp this firmly you'll shape your training
methods effectively.

Punishment ALWAYS deranges behavior, and so is
recommended and given only by deranged humans.

Of course, it doesn't matter if we are talking
dogs, cats, people, sheep, even husbands.

Dr. Von

From: Mike (m.bidd...@ns.sympatico.ca)
Subject: Re: Info. on the puppy wizard?
Date: 2004-07-18 14:27:02 PST

> > Oh, and did I mention his methods work, ya nuff said.
> > Mike
> Ok Mike which part worked for you?

It helped clear problems from my dogs in the
field using the can penny distraction technique.

Works like a charm.

My dogs get distracted easy from their jobs ie,
retrieving or training to find lost people, oh did
I mention that I am a Search and Rescue Team
Leader.

Sorry that slipped my mind.

I have read volumes of training books and don't
know where people get that Jerry copied others
work as I have NEVER come across his methods
before. I would like to see proof.

Just like Jerry outlined I eliminated problems one
at at time as they arose. I used to try and train to
the way I wanted them but this is backward, you
train out the problems leaving what you want left over.

Funny part is the second dog who had the same
problems as the other didn't need correcting for
some of his habits after I cleared it from the first
dog.

Seemed he learned through osmosis.

Nice side benefit there.

It nearly came to giving them up to a 3rd party
trainer as they were not performing well. The
VAST majority of working dog trainers are
agressive in their actions with the dogs.

I tried it and it didn't work and guess what I
was at my "Whits End" then someone I new
turned me onto Jerry and the rest is history.

I referred friends and families to Jerry's manual
and all have had great results. Starting puppies
out on the distraction technique is especially
good because they never develop the habit.

I had my sisters dog healing, sitting and down
stay reliably at 8-9 weeks. The first night home
following Jerrys advice we ditched the crate and
put the pup on the floor beside the bed and after
2 whimpers NOT A SOUND OUT OF THAT DOG
FOR 6 HRS! first night, that has never happened
in all my days.

Sorry, the man understands dogs its that simple.

Mike

"Ama...@DCFWatch.com" wrote:

No, the dog learned that I would hold still
the second she began to pull.  She would pull
to go where *she* wanted.

Well if she wanted to stop and go in another
direction.. say to sniff my neighbors yard..

she learned if she wanted to do it I would stop
walking and she could go.. and if there wasn't
enough slack on her lead she would just pull me.

Then when she got done doing *her* thing, she woudl
heel.. smile at me and wait for me to say "let's go"
and finish *my* thing.  I would refuse to move .. i
looked like an idiot.. freezing mid walk for minutes
waiting for *my* dog to heel and give *me* permission
to go again.

I did the treats and the let's go... she got to do her
stuff and get a cookie.. if she even wanted the cookie.

I wound up calling Jerry.. as I have a half red nose
pit and half amstaff.. who is incredibly protective..

we had a new pup on the way.. and i needed help.. i
followed petsmarts trainnign guides.. memorized them...
and they *did* work, don't get me wrong.. but only
when my pet wanted a cookie or felt the cookie was
better than what she wanted.. which was not often.

She quickly learned to ignore my commands if she
could see my hands were empty.  So I called Jerry...
he chatted me for about an hour and a half.. gave me
his link... and even when i had probs intro'ing the
pup he called me withn i5 mins of my email for help
at 10pm on a sunday night.

One.. singular.. uno family pack exercise after
the hot and cold exercise and i could zig zag
down my street.. about face .. whatever.. and
never had tension.

two men were acrossed the street and she walked right
by them... ordinarily she'd snarl and protect us.

And in two days.. my dog.. who bit the puppy if he
even looked like he was going near my husband or kids..
is nursing him every hour.. cleaning him.. rough housing
gently.. and teaching him to go potty outside..

actually watches him to make sure he doesn't go in
the house... and has milk.. which is awesome since
she's 19 months old and has never had a litter.

She also has stopped barking non stop at our neighbor's
dogs and pig.. does not bark at eveyr car that drives by
and has stopped jumping on people.  she's even starting
to ignore our cat who has lived on her dome litter box
and our window sill (literally) for over a year and a half.

She also does her commands on cue..  and doesn't look for a treat.

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D." <drv...@mindspring.com>
Subject: The Amazing Jerry's take on psychobabble
Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 12:13:44 -0400

   You might improve the learning of folk who actually
live with and train dogs to do useful things if you
excluded everyone who uses psychobabble from your lists.

I recommend to all of you who wish to taste the flavor
of sensible animal behaviorists to read THE MISBEHAVIOR
OF ORGANISMS, Breland and Breland.

This married pair of psychologists began the long trail
of highly trained animals who are symbolized by Shamu
eating a mackrel from a girl's hand instead of eating
the much more tasty pretty girl who is exactly the size
of the natural food of killer whales, seals.  Yum!

The essay, by the way, is a chapter in B.F. Skinner's
summing up book, CUMULATIVE RECORD.  They include a
sentence which more or less says, "unless you understand
the personal history of the particular animal, and the
history of this animal's species and group, the developmental
history of the animal, you cannot effectively train the animal.

Pigs root and hen's scratch, if you try to train hens without
scratching or pigs without scratching or pigeons without pecking,
you aren't going to have much success.

A conditional reflex is one which is learned, the original
primitive reflex occurs no matter what the history of the
animal, and is hard wired.  If you train the animal to respond,
say by ringing a bell immediately before turning on a bright
light, then you've taught the animal and made his native reflex
of pupil constriction conditional upon the ringing of a bell.

Thorndyke added some terminology to this kind of training
and insisted that when you train the animal to make gross
motor responses that this learning is "instrumental", the
animal takes action and uses an instrument.

The Russian word translated as "conditional" in all other
contexts was mistranslated by Pavlov's American translator,
Horsley Gannt, as "conditioned" and so American psychology
went haring after phantasmagora.

The major theorists for the development of the language of
operant conditioning are Edward Thorndike, John Watson, and
B. F. Skinner. Their approach to behaviorism played a major
role in the development of American psychology.

They proposed that learning is the result of the application
of consequences; that is, learners begin to connect certain
responses with certain stimuli. This connection causes the
probability of the response to change (i.e., learning occurs.)

Thorndike labeled this type of learning instrumental. Using
consequences, he taught kittens to manipulate a latch (e.g.,
an instrument). Skinner renamed instrumental as "operant"
because in this learning, one is "operating" on, and is
influenced by, the environment. Where classical conditioning
illustrates S-->R learning, operant conditioning is often
viewed as R-->S learning since it is the consequence that
follows the response that influences whether the response
is likely or unlikely to occur again.

It is through operant conditioning that
voluntary responses are learned.

One should note that Russian Psychology did very well
without the operant language, and only pettifogging
university professors ought to worry about what kind
of label we attach to the learning.  Pfui!

Even Skinner understood this!

And please note if you saw the original movie, THE
MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE, you saw a Chinese psychologist
who was based on Andrew Salter, CONDITIONED REFLEX
THERAPY.

Alas, Salter didn't have a Ph.D., but he basically rescued
us from the long Freudian nightmare and returned psychotherapy
to a scientific basis.  Alas, the 2nd movie didn't even cite
Salter as a source.  "...all the highest nervous activity, as
it manifests itself in the conditional reflex, consists of a
continual change of these three fundamental processes --
excitation, inhibition and disinhibition."  Ivan P. Pavlov

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.S.H.

What's important is, "does Shamu reliably eat
the fish and not the pretty girl?"

George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D., F.R.

From: "George von Hilsheimer, Ph.D." <drv...@mindspring.com
To: <d...@arcane-computing.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 5:38 PM
Subject: Doggy advice

Scott, Jerry Howe forwarded me the letter below.
I'm glad that you referred negatively to Jerry's
habit of CAPITALIZING and HOWEING everything.

I personally hate this habit of his. I think it is his
way of diluting his authority - IME he is a very modest
fellow. However, contrary to your sneer, he is very
competent at living with dogs.

I thought I'd list a series of actions which I found
on the list, folk asking advice on what to do about
dogs doing this and that, for example:

whining,
humping, hunching,
pacing,
self mutilation - paw licking, side sucking,
spinning,
prolonged barking, barking at shadows,
overstimulated barking,
fighting, bullying other dogs,
compulsive digging,
compulsive scratching,
compulsive chewing,
frantic behavior,
chasing light, chasing shadow,
stealing food,
digging in garbage can,
loosing house (toilet) training.
inappropriate fearfulness
aggression.

The thing that is fascinating to me, as an ethologist who
graduated from college 50 years ago and has spent all of
the intervening time working with animals (including the
human animal), is that you never see any of these behaviors
in wild dingoes, jackals, coyotes or wolves, you don't even
see these behaviors in hyenas (who aren't dog related).

You see these behaviors in human managed animals, especially
animals who live with neurotic hysterical humans.

As Sam Corson (Pavlov's last student) demonstrated for
nearly 50 years at Ohio University (Oxford, O.) there
is no treatment more useful for dogs than tender loving
care.

George von Hilsheimer, Ph. D., F. R. S. H., Diplomate,
Academy of Behavioral Medicine

       "Linda" <llindaleedan...@msn.com wrote in message
       news:

       I have been trying for the last 18 months to help my
       dog who became fear aggressive at 18 month of age.
       I do not know what started the problem but he came
       aggressive first with dogs and then began lunging and
       snapping at people. Until this time he loved everyone
       and could play with any dog. He was well socialized
       ad I took him with me everywhere.

       At 13 months he passed the Canine Good Citizens
       Test except he could let me leave him. I had used
       clicker training to teach him manners and tricks but
       it was not working on his aggression problem.

       I took him to vets who suggested a low protein diet,
       trainers who charged $800 to only make him worse.
       They tried to use a prong collar and he froze, urinated
       and tried to climb on my head to help him. they then
       suggested a shock collar I knew this approach was not
       working as he was becoming more aggressive.

       I took him to an animal behaviorist with Ph. D. 400 miles
       away who told me to "KEEP HIM SAFE" and read a book
       on the fearful canine. I tried another trainer who tried to
       use a nylon chock collar but it only made him worse.

       I read hundreds of books,"CULTURE CLASH", "DOG
       ARE FROM NEPTUNE", "THE OTHER END OF THE
       LEASH", ETC looking for help. We finally went to Purdue
       University Small Animal Behavior Clinic and they said he
       had fear aggression, punishment would not work, use the
       gentle leader and when out walking and he got stressed
       have the people stop until he could get in control using
       treats, and work on clicker training.

       At that point I knew more about clicker training and using
       the gentle leader than they did! Nothing was working--he
       would not come when I called him and would run away when
       I tried to catch him. I was afraid to walk him even in the
       neighborhood as we had become that "mean dog and women who
       hasn't trained her dog"

       I went to four trainers in both Michigan and Florida who
       were trainer/specialists in aggression and the last two
       were so afraid of him they could not approach him. No one
       said I should give up on him and kill him but they would
       say "You have to realize he is dangerous and you are
       responsible for him."

       *(You got LUCKY, Linda... They coulda got Sunshine
       DEAD on us. Damned near did... too.)

       As last resort I tried the internet again--I had had on
       going discussions with trainers from Triple Crown and Dr
       Meister with out any help-and I found the ad to Doggy Do
       Right and messaged Jerry to ask if this might help my dog.
       He said solving the aggression problem was EZ but I could
       not believe him even when I downloaded the manual.

       The name of the method was right I was at my Wits End.
       I had been working for 18 months!

       Using the can sound three time he came, and still comes
       from anywhere with the command-"comegoodboy" Next
       I tried the can when walking him--when he saw a dog three
       blocks away he went off-lunging and snapping-I used the
       can sound and he looked at me like uhn?

       I used it three more times and we got to the other dog-
       -the looked at me wagging his tail--the other person
       looked at me like why are shaking that can but just walked
       on by.

       When ever I try to explain about the sound people look at
       me like "you must be out of your mind"

       The results can make a believer!!!

       Three weeks since beginning the Wits End Training
       Manual program I walked him without the gentle leader
       in a busy shopping area with many dogs.

       He just seemed to not notice any one.

       When people talked to him or ask his name he would
       look at then and wag his tail and let then pet him.

       I still can not believe the change in him--we can now
       enjoy life out in public.

       If I had not found the Wits End method I know there
       was no hope for him and he would have hurt someone
       Through all this he never growled at me, guarded his
       toys or food or showed any sign of aggression with me.

       My goal is to get the message out to all dog lovers that
       dogs can be trained fast, easily and problems solved with
       out force, pain, food or anything but sound and praise!!!!

       I know most people would have given up on him a long time
       ago but he was and is my life. Solving the problem was EZ
       but only with the right approach-sound and praise.

       I know because I tried everything else and nothing worked!!!

       ================================

       From: Linda Daniel
       To: Jerry Howe
       Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 1:06 AM
       Subject: Re: - Re: dog aggression

       Thanks for writing--I would be happy to do almost anything
       to get your approach out to dog owners as I know it would
       save so many lives.  I know at times I was so frustrated I
       thought of giving up on Sunshine but of course I never would
       have but many people would have.  The world just does not
       know you can train a dog in just a few sessions and actually
       solve problems.

       We will be here until late April and we really have no plans-
       -just to enjoy the warmth and sun of Florida, so any time
       you could meet us would be great.  I drive so I would be
       happy to come to you anytime anywhere!

       We went to Celebration today and two little poodles got
       right into his face and he just sat there--I GOT a little
       scared but he handled it just fine.--a couple of times people
       would ask his name and want to pet him and he just went
       to them tail wagging and rolled over for them rub his tummy.

       He really just is not concerned about people passing, even
       those on rollerblades!  I have always used a gentle leader
       in public but he spent most of time rubbing his face on the
       grass--today I used his collar and he was so much happier!!

       Only problem is he will stop to smell and I can not get
       stopped soon enough to keep the leash loose.  He never
       pulled ahead of me but when he gets into smelling I have
       a hard time getting him going--at times  I think he could
       smell a blade of grass for 10 minutes.

       I can never thank you enough for giving Sunshine back!!!!!

       I wrote to Purdue and told them about him being able to
       walk in a crowd with out the /gentle leader and not having
       a problem with other people and dogs.

       I told them their advice did not work. Their advice was
       to use the gentle leader at all times and when he was
       around people or dogs to have him sit and reward with
       treats--one really good suggestions was to have people
       coming toward us stop when he got stressed or aroused
       and not move until we backed away-

       - can you just see me yelling at people to stop on the street
       until I get his attention with treats.

       They also suggested the possibility of using drugs-prozac-
       but thought he was too dangerous as the drug would make
       him less fearful and then he might attack or become more
       sure of himself and become dominate aggressive. Just had
       to share their great advice with you but I am sure you have
       heard it all--even I am becoming an expert on bad advice.

       ----------------------------------
 
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