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Cat Forum / General Topics / March 2005Pedigree v. non -ped
Min has just slinked onto my lap for a snuggle and also would like to bat my onscreen mouse if she can. Does it really matter that she is a pedigree? No, not to me, she is a pusscat, and adorable as they all are. She is snuzzling under my armpit now. And it is just as gorgeous and loving as when my non-pedigree cats - Pushkin and Sid who died aged 14 and 15 - did this type of action. Sweet, snuggly, purr purr on the bed, under your arm pit, under the duvet.... cats! Who would want to live without them? I appeal to unity. We all love pusscats. Lets not fall out amongst ourselves about pedigree, non pedigree etc. Its all really rather pointless - in my humble opinion. Long live pusscats! And all who love them! Whatever shape they are or origin! Purrrrrr, miaow prrrrrhhpp! Samantha > Min has just slinked onto my lap for a snuggle and also would like to bat my > onscreen mouse if she can. > > Does it really matter that she is a pedigree? No, not to me, she is a > pusscat, and adorable as they all are. Of course they all are. Exactly my sentiments. That is why, in this country that euthanizes healthy cats by the millions, with healthy cats waiting for homes in shelters at any given time, I do not understand why *anyone* would buy a pedigreed cat. Sherry - in my >humble opinion. >Samantha Humble is the last word that comes to mind, enough already we know you like non pedigree...... Brad LIFE'S JOURNEY IS NOT TO ARRIVE AT THE GRAVE SAFELY IN A WELL-PRESERVED BODY, BUT RATHER TO SKID IN SIDEWAYS, TOTALLY WORN OUT, SHOUTING... " HOLY @#$%... WHAT A RIDE!" > Min has just slinked onto my lap for a snuggle and also would like to bat > my onscreen mouse if she can. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Samantha I don't care if mine are pedigree or not. I've got 4 cats and they are all 100 % non-pedigree cats.. Just former barn cats who came into our house and now have a live of luxury sleeping on our bed and in my lap. Hmmm, me too, my old blue boy Sid was from a farm near here, wild when I got him. Taming him was great cos I was ill at the time so was in bed, with him mostly! He loved my long hair and used to snuggle in it like his mummy. He had a "hair fetish" all his life after that, but that's what made him feel purry and happy when he was small, frightened and missing his mum. He turned out to be the most gregarious cat I've ever had - I have a shop and he would go in and greet any stranger who came in - and their dogs! He especially loved a little Pekinese that used to come in with his owner! He lived to 15 yrs. And still eat out of dustbins and scrounged all his life despite top food being always available! He is the only cat I've ever owned who managed to prise open the fridge when there was chicken in it! Tenacious these barn cats! Samantha > I don't care if mine are pedigree or not. I've got 4 cats and they are > all 100 % non-pedigree cats.. Just former barn cats who came into our > house and now have a live of luxury sleeping on our bed and in my lap. A very important point here is also about preservation of natural cat breeds. Not designer cats as is implied, but cats that could be extinct if it were not for enthusiasts of that breed keeping the genetic print going - often despite not having any popularity to sell to - they are not in it for the money. Take the Scottish Fold Cat - almost extinct after WW2, now enough of them to reintroduce to the wild as conditions become more able to support them. Another - the Norwegian Forest - unique for its claw design (to help it get DOWN trees!) - helped to survive by breeder enthusiasts. The Manx, and many other natural breeds of cats would be extinct in the wild had it not been for enthusiasts loving, protecting and preserving them. Not all pedigree cats are "man made" if they are they are mostly "woman made". And without exception - all of those "man made" strains come from naturaly occuring types of cats particular to a part of the world they come from - all designed by NATURE to survive in their natural habitat. The Siamese was only intorduced to the western world in the 1880's. We have taken these cats environments away, just like the tiger and the lynx. Like the wolf and the bear. Personally I hate to see wild animals in captivity, but appreciate - with the odds stacked against them (and I have spent months in Gombe, Hells Gate, the Ngorungoru, Masai Mara and Serengeti) what is the option? Let them all die? Or try and preserve the genes, petition and work for change, hope for improvement and revitalisation of the genetic stock in time? Meanwhile these are domesticated cats. Like domesticzated dogs, cattle, sheep etc. they have been bred to be "improved" to suit their job. Be that put meat on your table, catch deer better, have a bigger bite to keep trespassers off your land, or to look more slinky cos you like them that way and they still catch the mice... I completely love cats - and am appalled by the irresponsibility of people who aquire cats without thought, dont have them neutered, let them breed here there and all over, dont get vets help, dont love them, dont feed them, be mean to them - dont care. Dont THINK. But discouraging pedigree breeding is not the answer. If it was stopped tomorrow I still stand by that the problem with unwanted cats would persist. Education is the answer. Lets all love cats in peace and harmony. I do. But I happen to choose to now worship the Havana - they do look more like the Goddess Bast than any other cat I have ever seen. To me - they personify the goddess Bast. Samantha > A very important point here is also about preservation of natural cat > breeds. Not designer cats as is implied, but cats that could be extinct if > it were not for enthusiasts of that breed keeping the genetic print going - [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Take the Scottish Fold Cat - almost extinct after WW2, now enough of them to > reintroduce to the wild as conditions become more able to support them. The Scottish Fold wasn't even a breed until the early 1960's. It is nothing more than a genetic anomoly that was propogated into a recognized breed at that time. I do not understand your post. A Scottish Fold is just a domesticated cat with folded ears. Why in the world would we want to "introduce them into the wild"?? And, the real reason that Scottish Folds are difficult to find is that only a percentage of kittens in each litter actually has folded ears. > Not all pedigree cats are "man made" if they are they are mostly "woman > made". And without exception - all of those "man made" strains come from > naturaly occuring types of cats particular to a part of the world they come > from - all designed by NATURE to survive in their natural habitat. The > Siamese was only intorduced to the western world in the 1880's. Very few breeds today remotely resemble the original cats brought to this country. The rest have been created and manipulated by breeders. In fact, the Applehead Siamese, who most closely resembled the original, is now shunned by CFA, in favor of the "New Siamese" -- a man-made Oriental cross that doesn't even resemble the Siamese. Or compare today's pathetic, concave-faced, runny-eyed Persian to a Persian from the turn of the century -- no resemblance. Thanks to breeders "preservation" methods. We don't need new breeds. We have enough cats already. Sherry >> A very important point here is also about preservation of natural cat > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > And, the real reason that Scottish Folds are difficult to find is that > only a percentage of kittens in each litter actually has folded ears. <snip> Cloudberry is probably getting the "Scottish Fold" confused with the "Scottish Wildcat" http://www.scottishwildcats.co.uk/ --? The ONE and ONLY lefthanded-pathetic-paranoid-psychotic-sarcastic-wiseass-ditzy former-blonde in Bloomington! (And proud of it, too)? email me at nalee1964 (at) insightbb (dot) com http://community.webshots.com/user/mgcmdjeep > Cloudberry is probably getting the "Scottish Fold" confused with > the "Scottish Wildcat" http://www.scottishwildcats.co.uk/ This link is has some interesting info, re: domestic cats vs. wildcats. They have a section that talks about the amount of "whiteness" in domestic cats being related to a "friendly" gene. I've always wondered about the relationship between coat colors and temperament, more so now that I have tiger kittens that resemble Bengals in both looks and temperament. Many disagree with it, but I've noticed a difference. Check this out: http://www.scottishwildcats.co.uk/Domestic%20page.htm (BTW, that b/w cat looks amazingly like Shamrock!)  SignatureCheryl | We don't need new breeds. We have enough cats already. | | Sherry I do completely agree with you, but guess what happened, and it's true!! Our Cinderella is pregnant, we wanted it like that, just for once. People are asking me for kittens already because I give them away to be kept indoors too. Most people here only pass on cats if they can go outside, but I've learned from this group. I believe if cats have enough company or even better another cat friend they can be happy indoors, but be sure, I'm in the minority here! Carola I have had a cat in my life since the day I was born, and all but one were adopted from local shelters or our vet. I 'bought' my Siamese, Malley, from a local family who bred their Chocolate point and Lilac point - my cat is not pedigree, but she is an Applehead and is the most unique kitty that has ever graced my life. Our previous Siamese were adopted from shelters. I love the breed, and that is why I brought her home. I agree with Sherry on the awful "preservation" methods by certain breeders. But to each his own - I am not here to bash anyone who likes the "New Siamese", or the Munchkins. Yes, even if such breeding practices were stopped, there would still be shelters filled with kitties who do not have a home. The only thing we can do is take care of our own babies, and maybe even give our time and donations to local shelters to help them out. > Very few breeds today remotely resemble the original cats brought to > this country. The rest have been created and manipulated by breeders. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Sherry > I have had a cat in my life since the day I was born, and all but one were > adopted from local shelters or our vet. I 'bought' my Siamese, Malley, from [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > care of our own babies, and maybe even give our time and donations to local > shelters to help them out. I completely agree with you, re: the Applehead Siamese. They are a delightful breed. Lucky for me, becuase I have never and would never buy from a breeder, they seem to be the most prevalant purebred to show up in shelters. I got mine as a seized kitten mill kitten. I think it's just plain sad what breeders have accomplished playing their little gene-pool game. Someone once posted a photo of a winning Persian from the turn of the century. A truly beautiful cat, but it bore no resemblance to today's Persian. It looked more like a healthy, robust "domestic longhair" shelter cat. I am also not flaming anybody who likes the "new" Siamese, but IMO there is absolutely no excuse to breed them. There's no reason to "preserve" the breed--it's a modern, man-made creation to begin with. And there's no end to it. Check out this website...here's some fool who is "creating" the "Cheetoh" breed. Just an illustration that breeders aren't out there solely to "preserve" the old breeds. Sherry >>I have had a cat in my life since the day I was born, and all but one > [quoted text clipped - 59 lines] > > Sherry Sherry, Did you forget to post the link to the aforementioned website? > > I completely agree with you, re: the Applehead Siamese. They are a > > delightful breed. Lucky for me, becuase I have never and would never [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > > Sherry, Did you forget to post the link to the aforementioned website? D'oh! Sorry, Jacquie, here it is: (warning: contains obnoxious background music that continues after you close) http://www.royalflushcheetohs.com/ Sherry >http://www.royalflushcheetohs.com/ I think I'm going to be sick. Orchid See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid >>http://www.royalflushcheetohs.com/ > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage > Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid I don't understand Orchid. Why are you going to be sick? I didn't see anything wrong with the pictures or the kittens. Could you explain it to me please? Thanks. >>>http://www.royalflushcheetohs.com/ >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >anything wrong with the pictures or the kittens. Could you explain it to >me please? Thanks. Gladly. This person is simply crossbreeding Ocicats and Bengals and selling the resulting moggy kittens for a thousand dollars. 'Cheetohs' aren't recognised by either of the registries claimed on the site (at least not that I could discern from the UFO page and I *know* they aren't even attempting PNB status in TICA). No mention of testing for HCM or luxating patellas. The Bengals being used are extrordinarily poor examples of their breed as well. Orchid See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid >>>>http://www.royalflushcheetohs.com/ >>> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage > Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid Thanks for the information Orchid. To be honest, I didn't know that the breed was not a recognized one. I took one look at the kittens and fell in love with them. It is too bad that someone feels that they have to try to fool unsuspecting buyers like that. What is more of a crime is that the kittens are the ones who will have to eventually be dealt with. What I mean is, in order to maintain a particular standard, the cats will be constantly re-bred in hopes that they will produce "perfect" kittens. The kittens that are not "perfect" are the ones that are going to suffer in some way. That's what bothers me about people who breed "pedigree" cats. It's not that they breed these cats, it's that they keep trying to breed the "perfect" cat. I have heard from different breeders at different cat shows tell eachother that out of 3 to 5 litters of kittens, only 1 kitten might be show quality or breeding quality. What happens to all of the other little souls of those 3 to 5 litters? It's not right that they should be "rejected" just because they don't "measure up" to someone elses standards. Sorry about the rant. Like I said before, that is what really bugs me about breeders. >What is more of a crime is >that the kittens are the ones who will have to eventually be dealt with. >What I mean is, in order to maintain a particular standard, the cats >will be constantly re-bred in hopes that they will produce "perfect" >kittens. The kittens that are not "perfect" are the ones that are going >to suffer in some way. How do you mean suffer? >That's what bothers me about people who breed >"pedigree" cats. It's not that they breed these cats, it's that they [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >quality. What happens to all of the other little souls of those 3 to 5 >litters? *grin* They are neutered or spayed and become beloved pets. It takes a discerning eye to tell the difference between a pet quality kitten and a show/breeding quality kitten. The ones who wouldn't make it in the show ring are placed in pet homes. Not to mention that the show/breeding quality cats are generally neutered and placed in pet homes (or kept as pets by the breeder) by the time they're five -- breeding cats have very short 'careers'. >It's not right that they should be "rejected" just because they >don't "measure up" to someone elses standards. I can't really agree when 'rejected' in this case means being placed in a home to be the prince/ss of the house. :D Orchid See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid >>What is more of a crime is >>that the kittens are the ones who will have to eventually be dealt with. [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage > Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid They must be the lucky ones then. I have seen where kittens are just left to fend for themselves, or are killed so that the breeders can devote more time to making sure that the "perfect" one is given the utmost attention and care. I know that there has to be reputable breeders out there, but I also know personally, that there are breeders out there that are only in it for a quick buck. Please, all you breeders out there, I am not "slamming" you all for breeding your cats, so please don't take what I am saying about breeders as if I am refering to all breeders. I am refering to the ones I know. They all know who they are, and I hope and pray that seeing what they do here, will shame them enough to think twice about breeding their cats again. > No mention of testing for HCM or luxating patellas. Interesting. Is it Bengals that are prone to this? My Tahi (moggy) is off to the vet in another 5mins for his second course of drugs in an attempt to conservatively treat his luxating patellas. The net searches I've done suggest Abys are prone to this, and Tahi has an Aby body shape. |
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