 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
| HomeDiscussion GroupsGeneral TopicsCat AnecdotesHealth and BehaviorRescue CatKB.com Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map |
Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / July 2005Cat food - which have the lowest phosphorus? Paging PhilP
PhilP, are you out there? I know you know a lot about feline nutrition, and really could use your input. In reading and talking about Dmitri's CRF, I'm seeing the controversy over whether or not low protein diet is the way to go. But the one thing is clear...the lowest amount of phosphorus seems to be crucial. Isn't there a listing somewhere of the phosphorus levels in commercial cat foods? If so, does anyone have that link. Otherwise, which are the cat foods out there with the lowest amount of phosphorus. Right now, he's eating the Hill's KD chicken flavor canned, and he does like the dry KD. (Though I don't usually feed them dry food other than having some on hand for emergencies, such as getting snowed in) I'm also wondering if I should get some liquid potassium supplements? His vet said his potassium was okay (only the BUN and creatine numbers were elevated, and I'm working on getting a urine sample to them). But over the last year, twice it seemed his back legs gave out. I attributed that to his ongoing arthritis and overall aging, but now I'm worried it might be a symptom. Both times were when he jumped off the bed. I'm in the process of making him some handicap steps because he really likes curling up on the bed with Jack. TIA, Juls  SignatureTo email (remove annoying hyphens) j-u-l-i at e-c-t-dot-o-r-g > Isn't there a listing somewhere of the phosphorus levels in commercial > cat foods? If so, does anyone have that link. http://webpages.charter.net/katkarma/canfood.htm http://webpages.charter.net/katkarma/dryfood.htm They are linked to from my site too. > I'm also wondering if I should get some liquid potassium supplements? > His vet said his potassium was okay (only the BUN and creatine numbers [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > bed. I'm in the process of making him some handicap steps because he > really likes curling up on the bed with Jack. I wouldn't, no. Not every CRF cat has low potassium. I'd only supplement if potassium is 4 or below. It could well be the arthritis, although there are several possible other causes of weak back legs in CRF cats: http://www.felinecrf.org/symptoms_treatments_index.htm#W HTH Helen Thank you so much Helen. Your site has been an absolute godsend to me!!! > > Isn't there a listing somewhere of the phosphorus levels in commercial > > cat foods? If so, does anyone have that link. [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Helen SignatureTo email (remove annoying hyphens) j-u-l-i at e-c-t-dot-o-r-g > PhilP, are you out there? I know you know a lot about feline nutrition, > and really could use your input. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > like the dry KD. (Though I don't usually feed them dry food other than > having some on hand for emergencies, such as getting snowed in) I think k/d is too low in protein for all but mid to end-stage CRF cats. I wouldn't restrict protein until the BUN reached 60-70 mg/dl. Protein restriction can exacerbate or cause anemia by reducing hemoglobin production. It can also impair immunological responses and reduce the cat's resistance to infection, and also cause muscle wasting. I've seen dramatic turnarounds in our CRF cats after switching them to x/d. Even though x/d has more protein than k/d, their BUN *decreased*! X/d is very similar to k/d except for protein, and the phosphorus is a little higher- but still acceptable. Like k/d, x/d also is not acidified- which is very important for CRF cats. Petguard Turkey & Rice, Rabbit, and Venison are also very low in phosphorus- even lower than k/d according to Petguard's analysis. Wysong Chicken Gourmet is also low in phosphorus and would be my 3rd choice after x/d and Petguard. > I'm also wondering if I should get some liquid potassium supplements? > His vet said his potassium was okay (only the BUN and creatine numbers > were elevated, and I'm working on getting a urine sample to them). But > over the last year, twice it seemed his back legs gave out. I > attributed that to his ongoing arthritis and overall aging, but now I'm > worried it might be a symptom. I *definitely* recommend a potassium supplement. Many CRF cats that have normal serum potassium levels have *decreased* muscle potassium and total body potassium stores. A total body deficit of potassium can develop well *before* the onset of hypokalemia. So: even though your cat has normal serum potassium levels he can still have deficit in his total-body potassium stores. You would want to keep his serum potassium levels in the *upper half* of the normal range to prevent hypokalemia and further renal damage during intracellular redistribution. The usual beginning dose of potassium is about 2-4 mEq/day/cat divided into 2 or 3 doses. In my experience most CRF cats need between 1 and 4 mgEq/day to keep the serum potassium levels in the upper half of the normal range. You can adjust the dose based on serum potassium levels. Remember, CRF cats drink a lot and form more urine rapidly and urinate more frequently. Rapid urine formation *promotes* potassium excretion. Therefore, potassium supplementation is *crucial* for CRF cats. I've read studies and also seen for myself renal function *improve* in CRF cats after potassium supplementation. Both times were when he jumped off the > bed. I'm in the process of making him some handicap steps because he > really likes curling up on the bed with Jack. Rear leg weakness can certainly be caused by low muscle potassium even though serum potassium levels are in the normal range. Remember, less than 5% of the total body stores of potassium are contained in the blood- the rest, about 95-98% is contained in the tissues. So: serum potassium levels is not an accurate assessment of total body potassium stores. Best of luck, Phil Thank you, Phil. This is fantastic info and so helpful. One question: who makes the x/d? Okay, two questions...do you recommend a particular brand of potassium? > > PhilP, are you out there? I know you know a lot about feline nutrition, > > and really could use your input. [quoted text clipped - 69 lines] > > Phil SignatureTo email (remove annoying hyphens) j-u-l-i at e-c-t-dot-o-r-g > Thank you, Phil. This is fantastic info and so helpful. > > One question: who makes the x/d? x/d is a Hill's prescription diet intended for the prevention of calcium oxalate. Hill's g/d is another good alternative to k/d. Okay, two questions...do you recommend > a particular brand of potassium? I use Tumil-K powder mixed in the food. 1/4 teaspoon contains 2 mEq potassium gluconate. Don't start potassium therapy without consulting your vet. Serum potassium levels must be monitored to avoid hyperkalemia. If your cat is urinating normally or more than normal he probably won't develop hyperkalemia- I've never seen hyperkalemia in a CRF cat that was polyuric. Nevertheless, his serum potassium levels should be monitored to make sure they stay in the upper half of the normal range. If your cat is receiving SC fluids, the doses will have to be adjusted- probably upwards. Best of luck. Phil > > > PhilP, are you out there? I know you know a lot about feline nutrition, > > > and really could use your input. [quoted text clipped - 69 lines] > > > > Phil > Thank you, Phil. This is fantastic info and so helpful. > > One question: who makes the x/d? Okay, two questions...do you recommend > a particular brand of potassium? What is his current potassium level exactly? Helen > > Thank you, Phil. This is fantastic info and so helpful. > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Helen I don't know. I did specifically ask about it, because I'd remembered something about potassium. She just said it was in the normal range. I have to get a urine sample and take it back, so I'm going to ask for a copy of his results. And I won't start him on anything until I discuss with his vet. He's starting to revolt on the KD already, so I'm going to have to find alternatives. SignatureTo email (remove annoying hyphens) j-u-l-i at e-c-t-dot-o-r-g > > > Thank you, Phil. This is fantastic info and so helpful. > > > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > He's starting to revolt on the KD already, so I'm going to have to find > alternatives. I used to recommend Innova Lite canned because it was very low in phosphorus, however, in June of this year Innova reformulated their diets. Innova Lite canned now contains a whopping 390 mg of phosphorus per 100 kcals- 1.61% phos on a dry matter basis- .37% phos. as fed. *Much* too much phosphorus for a renal cat- or *any* cat for that matter. Don't laugh- after the Purina takeover of Friskies and Fancy Feast the quality of their diets and phosphorus levels of some diets have dramatically improved. Phil Ouch, that's a disappointment about Innova. I have to correct something I said previously. I said Petco carried Pet Guard. Wrong. I went there today to get some, and it's Pet GOLD they carry. So I'm going to have to do an online order to get more food. On the Hill's XD, is that likely to taste any better than the KD? He's really tired of it already. (He refuses the reg flavor, but will eat the chicken and the dry, though I'm trying not to feed too much dry) And do I just ask my vet for it? I don't want to sound like I'm second guessing her. I really do like her a lot. > > > > Thank you, Phil. This is fantastic info and so helpful. > > > > [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Phil SignatureTo email (remove annoying hyphens) j-u-l-i at e-c-t-dot-o-r-g > Ouch, that's a disappointment about Innova. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > On the Hill's XD, is that likely to taste any better than the KD? Yes. x/d contains more protein and a little more phosphorus- both improve palatability. Feeding x/d now will help him adapt to k/d much easier later in life. He's > really tired of it already. (He refuses the reg flavor, but will eat > the chicken and the dry, though I'm trying not to feed too much dry) > And do I just ask my vet for it? I don't want to sound like I'm second > guessing her. I really do like her a lot. Just tell your vet you have a friend that recommended x/d because he had very good results with the food in his renal cats and tyhat you'd like to try it. x/d is also a Hills prescription diet. Petsmart (at least in my area) now sells prescription diets, but you'll still need a script- which you can obtain from the veterinary concession right in the store. Just bring a copy of the blood test results or they might try to talk you into more bloodwork before writing the script. Or just ask your vet to write a script and fill it at Petsmart. Phil > > > > > Thank you, Phil. This is fantastic info and so helpful. > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > > > Phil > Petguard Turkey & Rice, Rabbit, and Venison are also very low in phosphorus- > even lower than k/d according to Petguard's analysis. Wysong Chicken > Gourmet is also low in phosphorus and would be my 3rd choice after x/d and > Petguard. To the OP, if you have a Whole Foods Market in your area, they carry the Petguard brand. Lauren See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe : To the OP, if you have a Whole Foods Market in your area, they carry : the Petguard brand. How are Whole Foods' prices compared to Petsmart etc? Any expereince with Trader Joe's house brand cat food? Thanks. > : To the OP, if you have a Whole Foods Market in your area, they carry > : the Petguard brand. > > How are Whole Foods' prices compared to Petsmart etc? Any expereince > with Trader Joe's house brand cat food? Thanks. I'd imagine that you'd probably pay more for the Petguard at Whole Foods than another food at Petsmart. As far as I know, Petsmart does not carry Petguard. But the way I see I'd rather pay more for the food, then to have vet bills from a food that might cause problems. I've never used Trader Joe's housebrand but maybe someone who knows about it will post. LAUREN See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe Petco carries PetGuard, though I don't know if they carry those particular flavors. I'll be checking it out. But I know they carry the brand, because I've bought it before and the boys really like it. (But that was sardines and various fish, which is their thing - it's going to take some prodding to get them to like poultry and game) I've used Pet Food Direct a lot as well (they carry Wellness, which is the only place I can get it), and have had very good experiences with them. They also frequently send out 25 percent off coupons, and that really cuts the prices. > > : To the OP, if you have a Whole Foods Market in your area, they carry > > : the Petguard brand. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe SignatureTo email (remove annoying hyphens) j-u-l-i at e-c-t-dot-o-r-g My Petco does not carry Petguard foods. I order mine from waggintails.com or petfooddirect.com Sue > Petco carries PetGuard, though I don't know if they carry those > particular flavors. I'll be checking it out. But I know they carry the [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >> >> See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2008 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.