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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / June 2005Looks like Fatass has Chornic Renal Failure
Background, 16 year cat, was my mom's until she passed away last year - has been drinking a lot and eating litter. We went to the vet today - she is dehydrated and the blood test revelaved elevated kidney values and a high calcium level. She also has a heart murmur. (which I did not know about.) Anyway, they gave her an IV of NaCL for the dehydration, and I will do this fluid therapy at home going forward. It involves administering an IV with an 18g needle. It takes less than 10 minutes for the fluids to go in. I also picked up some Science diet k/d and IVD modified dry and canned. I guess as long as she eats, she is doing ok, but when she stops eating, there won't be much that can be done. I am also going to pick up some nutri-gel or vita-gel to supplement her nurtition. The whole deal, food, blood work, exam, and the fluid IV ran me a cool $257.25... She eats a bit, plays, purrs, and generally is her usual self - I can't beleive she only has months to live. Here is Fatty chillin' on the window sill with her cool look: http://www.freepixhosting.com/uploadedfiles/Picture%20306.jpg Any input from the experienced is appreciated. Bluesman > Here is Fatty chillin' on the window sill with her cool look: > > http://www.freepixhosting.com/uploadedfiles/Picture%20306.jpg > > Any input from the experienced is appreciated. Sounds like a plan Bluesman! ha, that cat don't look fat I gotta get some of mine posted, you wanna see rolly polly I have some more info from the blood test - maybe someone can comment: BUN 129, crea 7.4, ca14.8, phos 11.2 Can someone help me out with these? Bluesman > I have some more info from the blood test - maybe someone can comment: > > BUN 129, crea 7.4, ca14.8, phos 11.2 > > Can someone help me out with these? The BUN/Cr should come down some with rehydration. When a cat is dehydrated, urea diffuses back across the renal tubules and raises the BUN- so the numbers may not be a true indication of actual kidney damage. Fluid therapy should also promote diuresis which will help eliminate renal toxins and excessive electrolytes and also lower the BUN and Ca/P. Because the BUN is so high, you might want to speak to your vet about diuretics- these will stimulate urinary output and the excretion of uremic toxins and should lower the BUN a lot a quicker. I think you should also speak to your vet about a phosphate binder asap. When the calcium x phosphorus product is over 70 the cat is at risk of soft tissue calcification- which promotes renal damage. Phosphate binders can't reduce serum phosphorus alone-- so you must also feed your cat a low phosphorus diet. A low protein renal diet (k/d or g/d) will also help lower the BUN. If your cat won't eat a renal diet, choose a low-phosphorus diet --- *low phosphorus takes precedence over low protein*. Some good low-phosphorus non-prescription diets are Wysong, PetGuard and Innova Lite (in that order). Just remember treat the *cat* not the numbers. The BUN and creatinine aren't as important as the degree of improvement after the cat is rehydrated and in diuresis. Don't forget to speak to your vet about a diuretic and phosphate binder ASAP. Best of luck, Phil > A low protein renal diet (k/d or g/d) will also help lower the BUN. If your > cat won't eat a renal diet, choose a low-phosphorus diet --- *low phosphorus > takes precedence over low protein*. Some good low-phosphorus > non-prescription diets are Wysong, PetGuard and Innova Lite (in that order). Phil, My look at Wysong shows the lowest phos food at 0.6% with foods up to 1.4%, Innova Lite canned is 0.636%. That's a considerable increase ~30%, from Feline k/d which ranges from 0.34 (can) to 0.49% (dry). I found no data on PetGuard on their website so have no clue. Released at ACVIM this week was the early findings of a Grade 1 clinical trial in naturally ocurring feline renal failure. The results are very clear. Even at the earliest stages of renal failure detection, feeding a renal diet with low phos levels, high Omega 3 levels, low sodium levels etc. made a significant differernce in life span, delayed onset of uremic crisis, and to the severity of uremic crisis. > > A low protein renal diet (k/d or g/d) will also help lower the BUN. If your > > cat won't eat a renal diet, choose a low-phosphorus diet --- *low phosphorus [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > to 1.4%, Innova Lite canned is 0.636%. That's a considerable increase > ~30%, from Feline k/d which ranges from 0.34 (can) to 0.49% (dry). Yes, I know, Steve. I recommended these diets as an alternative *only* if the cat won't eat Hill's k/d-g/d, Waltham Low Phosphorus, Purina NF, Abbott Clinicare RF and Iams Multistage Renal prescription renal diets. It doesn't matter how perfectly formulated a renal diet is if the cat won't eat it. Wysong Chicken Gourmet, Liver Gourmet and Seafood Gourmet contain 0.60% phosphorus DMB. Wysong Chicken Au Jus- at 0.20% DMB(which needs to be supplemented). I > found no data on PetGuard on their website so have no clue. PetGuard Turkey & Rice P = 0.23% DMB, Rabbit P = 0.21% DMB, Venison P = 0.20 DMB contain about lowest phosphorus of *non prescription* diets, and even less phosphorus than k/d and g/d. Phil > It doesn't matter how perfectly formulated a renal diet is if the cat won't > eat it. I agree with that, however it is critical and it does make a significant difference, enough that pet owners shouldn't simply give it the old thirty second try and go off with a non renal food too easily. > PetGuard Turkey & Rice P = 0.23% DMB, Rabbit P = 0.21% DMB, Venison P = 0.20 > DMB contain about lowest phosphorus of *non prescription* diets, and even > less phosphorus than k/d and g/d. I suspect those are As Fed - even if Pet Guard tells you they are DMB's. My experience with PetGuard over the years is that the people on the phone don't know the difference. I'd want to see some lab analysis before I would buy those values. > Phil > Background, 16 year cat, was my mom's until she passed away last year > - has been drinking a lot and eating litter. [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Bluesman How long she lasts depends on how advanced her renal failure is. DH & I had a cat that had mid-range, but it was advancing. She lasted 8 months on "fluid therapy" & special food (Prescription Diet K/D, plus whatever else she would eat, cheap canned stuff, just to get *something* in her). Some weeks were good - some were bad. She peed frequently, a lot of times not in the litterbox (one time on the bed & pillow right next to my face!). There were a couple of months where she *seemed* to be getting better - but actually she was just *acting* better. When I get up for by 3am potty-run, I would toss a fake mouse for her to play with. She would fetch it and bring it back to me, with a loud MEOW (she was normally a quiet cat) to proclaim her catch. I would pat her on the head and praise her, toss it again on my way back to bed. One time she did that, and I didn't re-toss the mouse. I stepped past her in the doorway, and my bare foot brused the mouse. It was *WARM*!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I looked down, and sure enough, our CRF kitty had caught (and cleanly killed) a REAL MOUSE! About that time, DH came by on *his* way to the bathroom, and I showed him! He was shocked. We *really* priased her, and flushed it down the stool. There are several Feline CRF "support groups" out there, here's one link (I'm sure you can find more by typing in Feline CRF for a google search): http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Feline-CRF-Support/  SignatureThe ONE and ONLY lefthanded-pathetic-paranoid-psychotic-sarcastic-wiseass-ditzy former-blonde in Bloomington! (And proud of it, too)© email me at nalee1964 (at) insightbb (dot) com http://community.webshots.com/user/mgcmdjeep > Background, 16 year cat, was my mom's until she passed away last year - > has been drinking a lot and eating litter. [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Bluesman What a grand dame! Hopefully she will respond to the fluid therapy. You never know how long they have with this. It could be more than months since you are doing the fluid therapy at home and if she likes the food. When she starts not wanting it, get whatever she *does* want to eat. At that point it is more important that she eats than what she eats. But hopefully, she will like the food. You should check out this website: felinecrf.com. Also, you should join the yahoo group feline crf support (groups.yahoo.com). There are lots of people there dealing with the same thing you are. Lots of real good advice. My cat lived with crf for over 5 years. Good luck. Sue > Background, 16 year cat, was my mom's until she passed away last year - > has been drinking a lot and eating litter. [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Bluesman I've read that eating litter is a sign of anemia. > Background, 16 year cat, was my mom's until she passed away last year - > has been drinking a lot and eating litter. [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Bluesman > Background, 16 year cat, was my mom's until she passed away last year - > has been drinking a lot and eating litter. [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > Any input from the experienced is appreciated. Fatass is beautiful and she does not look sick. I remember how you took care of her while she kept your Mom company in her last years. I'm so sorry she's sick. I've never had a cat that has this, so I can't help with advice. My heart goes out to you--you were a good son and I know Fatass is in very kind and capable hands. Please give her a little scratch for me. > She eats a bit, plays, purrs, and generally is her usual self - I can't > beleive she only has months to live. > > Here is Fatty chillin' on the window sill with her cool look: She's cute! My late cat lived for over 2 years with CRF (that's not even what he died from) and I've heard of many others who lived longer. Some do really well with the sub-q fluids and go on and on. She may surprise you. I'll second what Sue said. Check out this website, it's got excellent, easy-to-understand and very helpful info on making your cat's life better. www.felinecrf.org Best of luck to you both and keep us posted. Candace > Background, 16 year cat, was my mom's until she passed away last year - > has been drinking a lot and eating litter. Eating litter is often a sign of anemia, which is often a symtpom/side effect of CRF. If needed - determined by a PCV test (quickly done in-house at the vet's) when the PCV falls below a certain number (18 - 20%, IIRC??), it's possible that Procrit/epogen injections may work well. My late cat Debbie had CRF, became anemic (she was eating litter) & responded well to Procrit. The injections are very easy to give at home - much easier than sub-Q fluids, since the needle is tiny in comparison; slip right in. > We went to the vet today - she is dehydrated and the blood test > revelaved elevated kidney values and a high calcium level. She also [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > IV with an 18g needle. It takes less than 10 minutes for the fluids to > go in. This is a good plan - to do the fluids at home. Less stress for the cat, therefore less stress on you, plus less expensive. > I also picked up some Science diet k/d and IVD modified dry and canned. > I guess as long as she eats, she is doing ok, but when she stops > eating, there won't be much that can be done. I am also going to pick > up some nutri-gel or vita-gel to supplement her nurtition. If she'll eat the k/d, good. I not, there are some other apppropriate renal failure foods out there. If she doens't like any of them, feed her whatever she'll eat. If she needs it, you can ask the vet about Periactin/cyproheptadine - it often works well as an appetite stimulant for cats, although it's an antihistamine for humans. > The whole deal, food, blood work, exam, and the fluid IV ran me a cool > $257.25... > > She eats a bit, plays, purrs, and generally is her usual self - I can't > beleive she only has months to live. It may be months, or it may be years... > Here is Fatty chillin' on the window sill with her cool look: > > http://www.freepixhosting.com/uploadedfiles/Picture%20306.jpg She's looking good, to me, for a cat in CRF - coat doens't look seriously "staring", re: dehydration, for ex. > Any input from the experienced is appreciated. Some others already provided the CRF website - it's really very, very good. The person who wrote it had 2 CRF cats, & learned a *lot* about the disease, its treatments, etc. Good luck! Cathy > Bluesman |
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