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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / March 2005Going outside - advice please
Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and would like him to do his business outside, but he won't. He goes into the garden (no further as the fences are quite high and he won't/can't jump them) but when he needs the toilet he comes back inside to use his tray. I've tried putting it outside but he just comes in and stands by where the tray normally is and miaows. Any ideas? I'm worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a > litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes > where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! He won't either. Our cats always came back in to do their business too. Just accept and move on. He isn't going to change. I always thought it was funny that the cats would come bang on the back door to come in and use the litter box, and then go back outside again. > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a > litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes > where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! Potty habits really isn't an area to mess with, particularly at his age, as it may end up causing you more grief than it solves. Yes, I know, I have heard the stories about folks successfully training their cats to use the indoor toilet. But your Otis is an old man, let him live out his life in relative peace with the comfort of his own indoor toilet (litter box). :) >> Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a >> litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >Yes, I know, I have heard the stories about folks successfully training >their cats to use the indoor toilet. I've heard some real horror stories about this practice too.. Imagine an aged and infirm cat - the only thing he knows how to do is hop on the toilet, but he's too weak or sick. This can only end with lots of urine and fecal material in unwanted places. There's also the possibility that the aged/infirm cat can make it up on the toilet, but falls in. If he's a bengal, he swims around and meows, if he's not it could be quite ugly. Personally, I'd love it if we could train our cats that way.. hehe. But it comes down to the fact that one of the things you have to deal with when you own indoor cats is the litterbox. Look at it this way, what if you owned a dog? I see these poor shmucks running around with their little baggies - ew - and then go downstairs, clean the litterboxes and thank them. BLink >But your Otis is an old man, let him live out his life in relative peace >with the comfort of his own indoor toilet (litter box). :) > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a > litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes > where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! Think about it this way. Your cat is the equivalent of a 76 year old man. Would you expect your grandfather to make such changes in his daily routine after all the years he's lived? Nope, you can't use the toilet anymore, grandad, you've got to go outside now! Please get a clue, and be thankful your cat is happy and healthy at his age. As another has noted, don't mess with something that ain't broken or you could end up with some *real* problems! dragon > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a > litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes > where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! Why don't you want to just let him use his litter box?? Scoopable litter now makes the upkeep easy, anyway. Cathy > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a litter > tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and would like [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > litter tray in case he just goes where it normally is. Talk about a > creature of habit! Consider this: If he were to do it regularly in your garden you would have to clean it too. Otherwise you would attract flies and bugs. Be thankful he uses the litter pan. MLB > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a > litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes > where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! Your Otis sounds like my Odie. He was about 10 when we moved back to the country. He will literally yowl at the door to get back in, do his bizness, and yowl to go back outside. I have a policy around here that I never mess with a cat who uses the litterbox. I never change litter brand, or style of box, etc. Don't want to mess with what works. It could be worse!! :-) (But then, the one thing that might spark his little brain to what you're wanting him to do, is to put a second litterbox *outdoors for a few weeks, then remove it. Think he might get the idea then? Sherry > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a > litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and > would like him to do his business outside, but he won't. For 3/4 of his live he's used a litter box. Now, in his golden years when learning new behaviors are much more difficult and stressful - major changes can severely stress an older cat - which also weakens his immune system, you want to impose unnecessary stress on an older cat solely for your own convenience. Let the cat live out his golden years in peace without inflicting unnecessary stress on him for no good reason other than your own convenience. Have a little empathy and consideration for the older gentleman for chrissake. If all he knows is the litter box then why mess with that? Some cats are very clean about themselves and their potty practices as well so going outside would be out of the question in their opinion. Why not make him as happy as possible and keep the litter up like he has always known? Maybe you should start going in the garden too... think of all those cleaning products for the toilet you could save on ;)  Signature.oO rach Oo. > Otis lived in a flat for the first 12 years of his life, and used a > litter tray. He's now 15. I now have a house with a small garden and [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes > where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! > If all he knows is the litter box then why mess with that? Some cats are > very clean about themselves and their potty practices as well so going [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > worried about doing away with the litter tray in case he just goes > > where it normally is. Talk about a creature of habit! I guess you're all right, I hadn't really thought about it that way. I just sort of hoped that when we moved to a place with a garden I would be able to put the litter box outside, it's in the dining room at the moment as there really isn't anywhere else to put it, apart from the kitchen, and that's a no no. It's a bit embarassing if people come over for dinner and he decides to "go". I'm used to it, but I know some people find it offensive, but there really isn't anywhere else to put it. > > If all he knows is the litter box then why mess with that? Some cats are > > very clean about themselves and their potty practices as well so going [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > but I know some people find it offensive, but there really isn't > anywhere else to put it. Can you sort of disguise/hide it with a folding screen (that matches the rest of the DR), maybe? Cathy >> ".oO rach Oo." <reachin@anewrefutationoftimeandspace.com> wrote in message > news:<OPx1e.25$w63.13982@news20.bellglobal.com>... [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > Cathy I have one in the bathroom and one in the bedroom (which has oddly gone unused since Grant died although they all used it - albeit lightly - before??) Anywho, I got a big office mat from the office supply store (the clear kind you put under your chair in front of the desk) and put it in a corner of the room to protect the carpet. It is quite big and has a lot of space for kicked out litter. Then I put a small folding screen around it. It makes it highly unnoticeable to the casual glance. > > ".oO rach Oo." <reachin@anewrefutationoftimeandspace.com> wrote in message > news:<OPx1e.25$w63.13982@news20.bellglobal.com>... [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > Cathy That's a good idea, but you can still hear him digging around, he likes to fling it all over the place - I'll say nothing about the smell! He has an obsession at the moment about following me into the bathroom, if I shut the door he makes a fuss but I don't really like him sitting in front of me, maybe I should get a screen for my loo too..also he once fell in a hot bath that I'd left to cool down so I try not to let him in there in case it happens again. > > > ".oO rach Oo." <reachin@anewrefutationoftimeandspace.com> wrote in message > > news:<OPx1e.25$w63.13982@news20.bellglobal.com>... [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > too..also he once fell in a hot bath that I'd left to cool down so I > try not to let him in there in case it happens again. That puts paid to the other idea I had - keeping the box in the bathroom. But it'd mean leaving the door open, of course, at least a little. Personally, I don't like having a litter box in the bathroom, because I don't like to step out all nice & clean from the shower or tub, only to feel scattered cat litter grit under my clean bare feet! Although a short-ish screen around the box (given there's enough room) would help to solve the scatter problem, I guess. I don't in the least mind that cats coming into the bathroom while I'm in there, though. Cathy > > "Cathy Friedmann" <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message > news:<3aoe7qF6cdfqvU1@individual.net>... [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] > > Cathy I'm not too keen on him sitting in front of me when I'm using the loo - he stares at me and miaows! I don't mind him being in the bathroom with me when I'm in there, it's just since the time he fell in the bath trying to catch bubbles when I'd gone out for a minute and he scalded himself. The bathroom is on the ground floor next to the kitchen so if I use it in the middle of the night, he normally makes a fuss as he thinks it's meal time (mind you he always thinks it's meal time). The bathroom is tiny too so there really wouldn't be any room for the litter box, the dining room is my only option apart from the kitchen and I don't think that would be good, even though it's changed daily. I suppose I could put in my lodgers bedroom - ha ha :) It's a bit embarassing if > people come over for dinner and he decides to "go". I'm used to it, > but I know some people find it offensive, but there really isn't > anywhere else to put it. Where did you put the litterbox when you lived in an apartment? Wherever you put it, just make sure its in quiet, low-traffic area where you can *visually* monitor your cat's litterbox behavior for abnormalities. This is extremely important for male cats because they're much more susceptible to urinary tract obstructions which can cause severe damage to the urethra and bladder and can become fatal if not treated quickly. > It's a bit embarassing if > > people come over for dinner and he decides to "go". I'm used to it, [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > susceptible to urinary tract obstructions which can cause severe damage to > the urethra and bladder and can become fatal if not treated quickly. He had that a few years ago, and it was very serious. I thought he had cystitis as I hadn't heard of this illness, when it didn't get better I took him to an emergency vet as it was a Saturday, and he said it was lucky I had done or he could have died over the weekend. He's not allowed dry food now, which is a shame as he loves it, but he doesn't drink enough water when he has it, and I can't force him to drink. It hasn't recurred since he's been on wet food. > It's a bit embarassing if > > people come over for dinner and he decides to "go". I'm used to it, [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > susceptible to urinary tract obstructions which can cause severe damage to > the urethra and bladder and can become fatal if not treated quickly. When I lived in an apartment I had the litterbox in the hallway, but the hallway here is too narrow and you would have to climb over the box if I put it there. UK houses/apartments are not as big as US ones don't forget, well not unless you're rich. I have a Victorian terraced house which I love but the halls really narrow. > I guess you're all right, I hadn't really thought about it that way. > I just sort of hoped that when we moved to a place with a garden I > would be able to put the litter box outside, it's in the dining room > at the moment as there really isn't anywhere else to put it, apart > from the kitchen, and that's a no no. Have you tried transitioning SLOOOOOOWWWWWW? Or did you just stick it outside and hope? ;) (he currently goes outside in the garden and uses a kitty flap or some such, correct?) It's certainly possible to train him to go outside, but at his age, it might take nearly as long as he's got left. :p Where is the door to your garden? Where do you eventually want him to go in the garden? Is it acceptable if he never goes to the garden, but the box is right outside the door? If you want to try to acclimate him to not having a box at all, you need to get him used to relieving himself in soil. Take a little dirt from that area outside and put it in the box where the box is now. Over the next few weeks to few months, gradually add soil and decrease litter, until the box has soil, not litter, in it and he uses it fine. If at any point he is hesitant to use the box, you moved too quickly. Add more litter back and try again more slowly. Some cats do fine. Some will never even get used to the soil. Once (IF) he's totally used to relieving himself in soil, THEN start the slow and tedious move of the box towards the door to the garden. *g* (or if you're keeping the litterbox with litter in it, start here) Move the box about 5cm at a time (more if he's okay with it, less if he isn't) towards the door. Eventually, move the box just outside the door. Then start moving it towards the garden if you want him to go there. Eventually, the box will be outside in the garden. THEN you remove the box. The process can take months, since you never want him to feel at all nervous about where he's supposed to be relieving himself. Still think it's worth it to make the switch? Don't forget about winter. If it gets cold where you live, do you think at his age, he will want to go out? Does it snow or get icy? What about rain? If it rains frequently, will he go out? Cats used to going out in all weather are one thing -- he isn't. He's an old man. The cold and wet may hurt his joints. So, it MAY be worth your time and effort, or it may not be. You might have just gotten him used to going out and his joints start hurting him too much to go out in the cold or wet. Lots to think about here. Good luck with whatever you choose. Signature-- ~kaeli~ Every calendar's days are numbered. http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace > > I guess you're all right, I hadn't really thought about it that way. > > I just sort of hoped that when we moved to a place with a garden I [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] > > -- Thanks. I've decided not to go forward with it. What I really wanted was for him to still use the litter tray, but have it just outside the back door so it would be near for him to get to. Having thought it through, it's not worth the aggravation, I think it would just confuse the poor old bugger, who's not the brightest to start with, as I would really only want it out there in the Spring/Summer. I will let him stay in the dining room, he does get rather strange when he goes though, sometimes lets out a yowl, runs a couple of circuits round the room, often sits in the litter tray with his bum hanging over the edge, and therefore does his businses on the floor rather than in the tray (nice!), and then spends 5 minutes digging up nothing - making such a mess that I have to hoover the floor every day. Still, it could be worse, such as the odd occasion when he pukes, he never does it in one spot, he leaves about 4 or 5 little piles for me to find throughout the house, is this usual? He only does it every few months so I don't think it's anything to worry about. > Thanks. I've decided not to go forward with it. What I really wanted > was for him to still use the litter tray, but have it just outside the > back door so it would be near for him to get to. Having thought it > through, it's not worth the aggravation, I think it would just confuse > the poor old bugger, who's not the brightest to start with, as I would > really only want it out there in the Spring/Summer. Yeah, I think that would confuse him, too. Many cats get very attached to a particular place to relieve themselves and if you move the box they may still just use the spot where it was. > I will let him > stay in the dining room, he does get rather strange when he goes [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > tray (nice!), and then spends 5 minutes digging up nothing - making > such a mess that I have to hoover the floor every day. Oh, dear! *heh* I know you mentioned your place was small, but did you try a longer or wider tray with smaller edges? Or a box with taller edges, but one smaller side so he can go in and out easily? (I myself love the extra-large sized hooded boxes for just this reason -- messy cats!!) Just like old men, old cats get bad aim, too. LOL > Still, it > could be worse, such as the odd occasion when he pukes, he never does > it in one spot, he leaves about 4 or 5 little piles for me to find > throughout the house, is this usual? He only does it every few months > so I don't think it's anything to worry about. Every few months in a few piles? Sounds like hairballs to me. My lovely Jeffrey has been known to leave me surprises on occasion from hairballs or from deciding he'd like to scarf his food until he pukes today (he has a bit of PTSD from being neglected in the home of a cat collector and occasionally forgets that he *does* get fed twice a day now). Somewhat normal, depending. Obviously, IANAV, but I wouldn't be overly concerned. As always, talk to your vet if you have any health concerns. Signature-- ~kaeli~ Humpty Dumpty was pushed! http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace |
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