Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / April 2005
Wisconsin voting on hunting free roaming domestic cats (not joking)
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hamandcheese@betweentheknees.com - 07 Mar 2005 04:10 GMT http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721
Mary - 07 Mar 2005 04:25 GMT > http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 It'll never fly.
hamandcheese@betweentheknees.com - 07 Mar 2005 04:47 GMT >> http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721
>It'll never fly. Probably not, but it sure is a symptom of small dick complex to want to shoot animals while sitting on the porch swing.
-mhd
Mary - 07 Mar 2005 04:58 GMT > >> http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 > > >It'll never fly. > > Probably not, but it sure is a symptom of small dick complex to want > to shoot animals while sitting on the porch swing. Yep. And that is an understatement. Bet there are a bunch of Wisconsonians (?!) who love animals up in arms. Or at least I hope there is.
crazy.pikachu@gmail.com - 16 Mar 2005 18:57 GMT Bull. it has in minnesota. If there is a cat on my property it might as well dig itself a hole becasue it is as good as dead. I dont kill cats for fun I kill them because they are no good for the enviroment
Mary - 16 Mar 2005 19:00 GMT > Bull. it has in minnesota. If there is a cat on my property it might > as well dig itself a hole becasue it is as good as dead. I dont kill > cats for fun I kill them because they are no good for the enviroment Since you do not include part of the post to which you are referring nobody knows who you are talking to. Furthermore, coming to a cat group to announce that you like to shoot cats makes you a dickhead. Now f.ck off. I would hope your gun backfires but I am far too nice for that. What goes around comes around, anyway. You will get yours. Dickheads who shoot domesticated animals always do, one way or another.
crazy.pikachu@gmail.com - 16 Mar 2005 19:08 GMT > > http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 > > It'll never fly. It has flown in minnesota and it has for years. you can shoot a cat as long as you are staying within the shooting regulations of the state. I know my neighbors cats and if it is a cat that I have never seen before and I know that it is wild...well it better have a good excuse to st. peter because her is going to the pearly gates in the sky
Mary - 16 Mar 2005 19:26 GMT > > > http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > and I know that it is wild...well it better have a good excuse to st. > peter because her is going to the pearly gates in the sky Oooo such a BIG man. I just get off on a Great Big Man who likes to shoot sweet little furry creatures. What are you wearly, you stud you?
crazy.pikachu@gmail.com - 16 Mar 2005 20:26 GMT > > > > http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 > > > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > "I just get off on a Great Big Man who > likes to shoot sweet little furry creatures." I am glad to hear that you get off to me shooting cats. do you want me to make a video for you so you can get off to that
I dont just shoot any old cat I shoot the ones that are wild. I know what my neighbors cats look like and I dont shoot them I shoot the ones that are wild dont deserve to walk the earth any longer
Hemmaholic - 17 Mar 2005 01:46 GMT The ones that "don't deserve to walk the earth" are not the cats, but the PEOPLE who turned them out to fend for themselves because they (the PEOPLE) could no longer be bothered with their care.
Just because you do not recognize the animal does not mean it doesn't belong to someone and has accidentally escaped, or that there isn't someone who would take it in and care for it.
If I may be so bold to suggest that instead of shotting the animals you contact a TNR Group in your area and let them deal with the "problem" in a more humane and socially acceptable manner?
Under normal conditions, truly feral or "wild" cats will avoid contact with humans and places where humans inhabit. Strays, on the other hand, were once owned by humans and they still associate humans with food.
While I do not dispute that there is an on-going pet population and former pet (feral) over-population going on in this country, shotting on sight is not the answer.
You and all others who would use this means (shot on sight) means of eradication the problem need to educate yourselves on the true causes for the over-population problem and then do something constructive to stop it from happening in the first place.
crazy.pikachu@gmail.com - 17 Mar 2005 04:33 GMT > The ones that "don't deserve to walk the earth" are not the cats, but > the PEOPLE who turned them out to fend for themselves because they (the [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > for the over-population problem and then do something constructive to > stop it from happening in the first place. but I am doing something constructive to stop it. I am shooting the ones that are wild. I live in an area where my closest neighbor is a quarter mile down the road in a house in the woods. i know what his cat looks like. but there have been cats from the past that have been released in the area.
there are programs out there right now that are telling people to keep there cats indoors. but even still there are wild cats and they are getting into my bird pens and eating my birds which must be punished by "death"
Ray - 13 Apr 2005 01:07 GMT I think the reality is that the better solution is to do both: education and eradication (shoot-to-kill); only one or the other would not work.
Trish Dunphy - 17 Mar 2005 05:23 GMT > > > > > http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 > > > > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > what my neighbors cats look like and I dont shoot them I shoot the ones > that are wild dont deserve to walk the earth any longer May you never be homeless, because by your own definition you're open game... now stop playing on daddy's computer and go do your math homework, it's almost bedtime little boy
hamandcheese@betweentheknees.com - 07 Mar 2005 04:51 GMT >http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 Check this out :-)
http://66.109.186.56/~ryan/catsniper.jpg
Mary - 07 Mar 2005 04:58 GMT > >http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 > > Check this out :-) > > http://66.109.186.56/~ryan/catsniper.jpg Heh. I think he has a hunter in a red plaid hat in his sites.
equalizer - 07 Mar 2005 09:48 GMT >http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3037721 Smith, Mark D & Jean Marie
2427 Robinsdale Ave LA CROSSE, WI 54601 608-788-5362
Larry R Harrison Jr - 08 Mar 2005 23:46 GMT I support Wisconsin's move.
Look I have 3 cats and except for the occasional irritation from where they've hopped onto places I don't like them hopping onto--and even that I've managed to break them from doing lately--or in hiding constantly (also something they now don't do anymore), I like them a lot, and would NOT want anyone shooting at them. But I live in an apartment and they are kept strictly indoors.
The urge that some feel towards shooting an offending cat--this wouldn't be an issue if the victim's neighbor would control their animals. Too often they don't, even when they're warned of the problem; they think everyone around them is just supposed to put up with the problems their pet is bringing. No wonder some feel the need to shoot.
And really, where I grew up was in a very rural setting, and it was nothing for people to shoot stray animals with their pistol or rifle; in fact, my own mother, herself a very strong cat lover, though nothing of doing it, especially if the animal was a dog. If a stray dog or cat--usually dog--was bothering your own pets or getting in the trash, you shot it--that was it. No problems. No need to involve animal control, you handled it yourself.
If someone has a cat or dog bothering them in anyway with regards to the animal trespassing into another's yard and creating problems, the victim should be able to do whatever they have to do to remedy the problem. Period. Now they of course should first let the neighbor know of the issues and give the neighbor a chance to rectify it--to control their animals. But if they fail to, the victim shouldn't have to indefinitely keep having to put up with the problems bought on by the offending animal.
Of course it's not the animal's fault, it's the fault of the irresponsible owner. But the victim needs a quick remedy without endless visits or waiting on hold on the phone dealing with animal control if they can handle the problem themselves. It's simply a case of speedy rectification; shooting is a lot quicker than all the legwork one would have to do to have animal control handle things.
And if the owner doesn't want their cat or dog shot, they should take responsibility for their animal and control it. There is no excuses, not even "I can't help what they do when I'm not home." No excuses, period.
So--by all means, try & reason with your neighbor first. But if they won't listen to reason, I say--bang bang bang.
LRH
tracyrose@gmail.com - 09 Mar 2005 05:47 GMT Man. You'd lose your cookies on my block. There's about a dozen free-roaming cats. Around here, we feed 'em and pet him when they stop by. Sometimes I'm really happy to live where I live :>
Larry R Harrison Jr - 09 Mar 2005 12:49 GMT > Man. You'd lose your cookies on my block. There's about a dozen > free-roaming cats. Around here, we feed 'em and pet him when they stop > by. > Sometimes I'm really happy to live where I live :> Actually, I'd be fine with it--as long as they didn't hop on the hood of my car after I had just paid someone to wash & wax it, or go in my trash. If that were the case I'd be fine with it--and maybe even enjoy it as you do.
LRH
crazy.pikachu@gmail.com - 16 Mar 2005 16:31 GMT I'll shoot them too (but only by staying in the legal shooting restrictions in the area)
Mary - 16 Mar 2005 18:53 GMT > I'll shoot them too (but only by staying in the legal shooting > restrictions in the area) Nobody cares, dickhead.
crazy.pikachu@gmail.com - 16 Mar 2005 19:01 GMT I think I will make a hat you know kind of like what they do with coon skins
rodrig462@yahoo.com - 12 Apr 2005 22:10 GMT <<Man. You'd lose your cookies on my block. There's about a dozen free-roaming cats. Around here, we feed 'em and pet him when they stop by. Sometimes I'm really happy to live where I live :> >>
Tracy - - Think of it like cigarette smoking. Most cat lovers are not bothered by the presence of other people's cats.
likewise some act surprised when you ask them not to smoke in your house or leave their cigarette butts on your lawn.
Unless otherwise instructed, the *polite* thing, is to assume that no one wants to be around your cat. If one of your ten dozen neighbors asks you to control your cat, that should be enough.
I agree with Larry. Many pet owners just haven't signed the social contract, when it comes to getting along with neighbors.
rsquared
Daniel Augustus - 12 Apr 2005 23:23 GMT This is not a good law to have on the books, I would imagine that there are those that would abuse it for their own strange pleasure.
Also, in a more suburban setting, mistakes could be made. Why not increase state funding for dealing with feral colonies..Or develop some contraceptive spray that could be released over an entire colony.
Bandwidth - 12 Apr 2005 23:54 GMT DNR knocked that law down. It isn't going to happen.
> This is not a good law to have on the books, I would imagine that there > are those that would abuse it for their own strange pleasure. > > Also, in a more suburban setting, mistakes could be made. Why not > increase state funding for dealing with feral colonies..Or develop some > contraceptive spray that could be released over an entire colony. Bandwidth - 12 Apr 2005 23:56 GMT link http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=3199512&nav=51s6YZQY
> DNR knocked that law down. It isn't going to happen. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > increase state funding for dealing with feral colonies..Or develop some > > contraceptive spray that could be released over an entire colony. Mathew Kagis - 13 Apr 2005 07:34 GMT This kind of thing gets me... Let me see if I have the whole Wisconsin thing straight::
- Irresponsible humans, abandon their un-fixed domestic cats. Over time this creates a large feral population.
- These cats are BETTER at catching prey than your average gun toting hunter. Thereby depleeting hunter's supply of targets.
-Average gun toting hunter now wants to kill cats.
Do I have that about right? Because if I do, this looks like a case of envy/revenge from some PISS POOR preadators. Mathew Butler to 2 kittens: Chablis & Muscat En Vino Veritas
CatNipped - 13 Apr 2005 14:28 GMT > This kind of thing gets me... Let me see if I have the whole Wisconsin > thing straight:: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Do I have that about right? Because if I do, this looks like a case of > envy/revenge from some PISS POOR preadators. Yep, the hunters want a license to hunt the predators who are killing the hunter's prey.
Said it before... I want a license to hunt the predators who are killing the cats' prey.
Hugs,
CatNipped
> Mathew > Butler to 2 kittens: Chablis & Muscat > En Vino Veritas rodrig462@yahoo.com - 13 Apr 2005 15:15 GMT Matthew -
Something lost in the translation:
"- These cats are BETTER at catching prey than your average gun toting hunter. Thereby depleeting hunter's supply of targets. "
Cats and hunters tend not to hunt for the same things.
rsquared
tracyrose@gmail.com - 13 Apr 2005 07:40 GMT "Tracy - - Think of it like cigarette smoking. Most cat lovers are not bothered by the presence of other people's cats"
You could think of it in lots of ways, really. I'm not a car owner and I'm really bothered by the prescence of other people's big honking SUV tanks, especially when they park in the space in front of my house, grab all the available space and block my view. I'm also not a cell phone owner and I am terminally annoyed when people invade my space and my property with their stupid ringing songs and their private conversations that I am forced to overhear. Yet last I heard, this annoyance does not give me the right to flatten their tires or grab their cell phone and smash it.
"Unless otherwise instructed, the *polite* thing, is to assume that no one wants to be around your cat. If one of your ten dozen neighbors asks you to control your cat, that should be enough"
Ten dozen neighbors? My kitties visit three neighboring yards encompassing less than a dozen people in toto. And they all have cats and dogs themselves. The puppy next door regularly dumps his leash and runs over to my yard to visit the cats. I don't shoot him, even though, horrors, he always takes a crap in my yard while visiting. I hug him ... and return him. What's so hard about acting like a human being?
And the polite thing to assume is that many things that you do in my prescence may well annoy me, but due to the social contract of living in a community, I do not pick up arms when I am annoyed and shoot the perpetrator. Living in a community involves mutual tolerance, not hair-trigger stupidity over minor matters.
Do you guys duel at dawn about late night noise or an overgrown hedge?
CatNipped - 13 Apr 2005 14:34 GMT > And the polite thing to assume is that many things that you do in my > prescence may well annoy me, but due to the social contract of living [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Do you guys duel at dawn about late night noise or an overgrown hedge? Oooo, oooo, can we make *one* exception? The people who blare rap music from their cars that you can hear from 3 miles away? Could we *please* shoot them????! ;>
Hugs,
CatNipped
CatNipped - 13 Apr 2005 14:50 GMT >> And the polite thing to assume is that many things that you do in my >> prescence may well annoy me, but due to the social contract of living [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > from their cars that you can hear from 3 miles away? Could we *please* > shoot them????! ;> Speaking of which... funny story. A young friend of mine was a rookie police officer riding in the car with a veteran cop when they saw the following. An elderly man was sitting in his car, stuck in a massive traffic jam in Houston (there's *always* a massive traffic jam here in Houston). It was summer and cars tend to overheat quickly when not moving along briskly, so air conditioners were turned off and windows were rolled down. A young man in a car three cars away was blaring rap music so loud it could have been heard in the next county. The rookie cop could see the elderly man was getting more and more irritable the longer it went on (they were all stuck in the same spot for more than 20 minutes). Finally the elderly man got out of his car, walked over to the young man's car, aimed a gun, and shot the stereo several times until it was dead. As the elderly man walked back to his car other drivers started applauding.. The rookie cop started to get out of the squad car but the veteran cop put out his hand and stopped him. The rookie said, "Shouldn't we go handle this problem?" and the veteran cop replied, "Son, it looks to me like it's already been handled." ;>
> Hugs, > > CatNipped rodrig462@yahoo.com - 13 Apr 2005 16:25 GMT <<Finally the elderly man got out of his car, walked over to the young man's car, aimed a gun, and shot the stereo several times until it was dead. As the elderly man walked back to his car other drivers started applauding..>>
Sounds like an urban legend to me... That old man would be quite lucky to survive walking around between cars, in a traffic jam, with a gun - - in Texas no less.
This perpetuates the perception that gun owners are emotionally unbalanced and confrontational.
rsquared
Mel - 14 Apr 2005 08:05 GMT Who says he was either? One can only put up with so much S***. By the sound of things, a lot of people wished they had been able to do it, but for some reason or another, were unable. Some other person might have had a not-so-pleasant conversation with this less-than-considerate idiot.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out that you do not sit in bumper-to-bumper stalled traffic on an abnormally hot day when tempers are bound to flare even without added provocation, and add a powder keg to the flame.
Some non-gun owner could just have well gone up and pounded the jerk a good one, and to heck with the stereo.
This perpetuates the perception that gun owners are emotionally unbalanced and confrontational.
rsquared
Mel - 14 Apr 2005 07:59 GMT elderly man got out of his car, walked over to the young man's car, aimed a gun, and shot the stereo several times until it was dead. As the elderly man walked back to his car other drivers started applauding.. The rookie cop started to get out of the squad car but the veteran cop put out his hand and stopped him. The rookie said, "Shouldn't we go handle this problem?" and the veteran cop replied, "Son, it looks to me like it's already been handled." ;>
> Hugs, > > CatNipped If this is for real, I applaud that elderly gentleman as well. He did no harm to the inconsiderate poop-head who had to have known that he was making a lot of people angry, and DID NOT CARE, but he did a big favor for all those who were boiling over with aggravation at having to listen to that booming crap in a bad situation in unbelievable heat.
I have often wished I could just go out back (live near a high school where the no-mind teenagers love to crank their boom-box car stereos) to the school parking lot and blow out the trunk amplifiers of the losers who think they can do whatever they want. It is illegal to wear Walkman headphones in a car, but you can shake the foundations of every building for 3 miles around?!!!! Talk about stupid laws!!!!
Love your story, CatNipped!!!
Mel
Christopher C. Stacy - 15 Apr 2005 04:28 GMT That would be several felonies; unlikely to be a true story.
Mel - 19 Apr 2005 21:19 GMT Which story? (Just curious, as all the text was cut out.)
That would be several felonies; unlikely to be a true story.
Mel - 14 Apr 2005 07:53 GMT >Oooo, oooo, can we make *one* exception? The people who blare rap music >from their cars that you can hear from 3 miles away? Could we *please* >shoot them????! ;>
>Hugs,
>CatNipped Hey, I'm with you there, CatNipped! Hand over the petition, I'll sign that one! :) A whole truckload of neighbours' cats wandering around my yard couldn't possibly annoy me anywhere NEAR as much as those ignorant, inconsiderate, self-centered idiots!!! The cats don't know they are being annoying!
Mel
CatNipped - 14 Apr 2005 15:02 GMT > Hey, I'm with you there, CatNipped! Hand over the petition, > I'll sign that one! :) A whole truckload of [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > self-centered idiots!!! The cats don't know > they are being annoying! Mel
Here in Houston a local radio station's DJs have started a "Ban Second-hand Rap" campaign. They feel that is non-smokers can legally ban smokers from invading their personal sphere with second-hand smoke, and women can legally ban coworkers from displaying pornography on their computer screens, they why shouldn't we be able to legally ban someone from assaulting our ears with second-hand rap??! ;>
Hugs,
CatNipped
 Signature "The only thing necessary for the triumph of stupidity is for smart (wo)men to do nothing."
-CatNipped
Mel - 22 Apr 2005 05:46 GMT >> Hey, I'm with you there, CatNipped! Hand over the petition, >> I'll sign that one! :) A whole truckload of [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > CatNipped YES!!!! I love that one! Actually, I would like to take that one step further - - this may not bother you, but I DESPISE boom-box crap-cars. You can just hear all the tin rattling with every bass boom, and all the screws jumping a turn with every rattle. Why should I be forced to listen to someone's crap taste in music (and yes, it usually is crap-rap!!)
I would take doggy-doo on my lawn any day rather than have to put up with that. Okay, let's get those petitions going - - - second hand rap-crap I do not want assaulting my ears either. Let's face it. Does a lot more damage to your health than a few wandering critters.
Mel
sriddles@aol.com - 22 Apr 2005 06:03 GMT > > CatNipped > > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Mel One city I lived did actually pass a "noise ordinance" brought bout by boom boxes. It prohibited playing any kind of music that could be heard so-man-feet, I forget exactly how far...from the source.
Sherry
Mel - 25 Apr 2005 06:54 GMT > One city I lived did actually pass a "noise ordinance" brought bout by > boom boxes. It prohibited playing any kind of music that could be heard > so-man-feet, I forget exactly how far...from the source. > > Sherry You are so fortunate! I wish they would do that here!!
Melody
Mary - 14 Apr 2005 17:47 GMT >Oooo, oooo, can we make *one* exception? The people who blare rap music >from their cars that you can hear from 3 miles away? Could we *please* >shoot them????! ;>
>Hugs,
>CatNipped Hey, I'm with you there, CatNipped! Hand over the petition, I'll sign that one! :) A whole truckload of neighbours' cats wandering around my yard couldn't possibly annoy me anywhere NEAR as much as those ignorant, inconsiderate, self-centered idiots!!! The cats don't know they are being annoying!
Mel
When this happens in traffic (the music not the cats!) I just smile, knowing the idiots will be eventually be deaf.
rodrig462@yahoo.com - 13 Apr 2005 15:04 GMT I never proposed that one would shoot SUV owners or mobile telephone users. It seems you shifted the focus from the social responsibility of the *prepetrator* to the irrational response of the *victim*, reducto ad absurdum.
If you focus on the most bizarre behavior on the fringe of society, you can reach equally bizarre conclusions. Let's try to keep it centered.
I agree with you wholeheartedly:
"Living in a community involves mutual tolerance, not hair-trigger stupidity over minor matters. "
It seems we can agree that each has responsibilities. When something bothers us, the preferred way to make the *perpetrator* aware is to discuss options for remedying the situation, but I will take the "dueling at dawn" under advisement. ; )
Example:
"I like 'Mittens' but I notice she has been chasing birds away from my feeder and howling under my window at night. Can you help me remedy that?"
"What should I do when that happens?"
"What if that fails, can I call you to come retrieve her?"
In some cases, cat owners will give you a polite dismissal while thinking to themselves, "Idiot, that's what cats are supposed to do." but you still have to request the assistance before taking it to the next level.
In *most* cases, it is a completely unfamiliar tom who is MUCH further than three houses away from the ranch. What then?
rsquared
deborah.trujillo@verizon.net - 13 Apr 2005 23:48 GMT The following news item was posted today:
News Break 04/13/2005 15:59:11 EST
Wis. Governor Rejects Cat-Hunting Idea BY RYAN J. FOLEY Associated Press Writer
MADISON, Wis. - A proposal to legalize the killing of feral cats is not going to succeed, Gov. Jim Doyle said Wednesday.
"I don't think Wisconsin should become known as a state where we shoot cats," said Doyle, a Democrat who neither hunts nor owns a cat. "What it does is sort of hold us up as a state that everybody is kind of laughing at right now."
He told reporters his office had received calls from around the country denouncing a proposal adopted Monday at meetings of the Wisconsin Conservation Congress, a public advisory group, that would classify wild, free-roaming cats as an unprotected species that kills song birds and other wildlife.
Outdoor enthusiasts approved the proposal 6,830 to 5,201 at Monday's spring hearings of the group.
The results get forwarded to the state Natural Resources Board for consideration, but any official action would have to be passed by the Legislature and signed by the governor.
Animal rights groups belittled the idea as inhumane and dangerous.
Doyle said he respects the Conservation Congress but "on this one I think everybody recognizes it's not going anywhere."
Some experts estimate that 2 million wild cats roam Wisconsin, and the state says studies show feral cats kill 47 million to 139 million songbirds a year.
South Dakota and Minnesota both allow wild cats to be shot.
Two state senators - Scott Fitzgerald and Neil Kedzie - had promised to do everything they can to keep the plan from becoming law.
Kedzie, who chairs the Natural Resources and Transportation Committee, called the issue "a distraction from the main tasks we have at hand."
___
On the Net:
Department of Natural Resources: http://www.dnr.state.wi.us
Mel - 14 Apr 2005 08:08 GMT Melody states:
The following news item was posted today:
News Break 04/13/2005 15:59:11 EST
Wis. Governor Rejects Cat-Hunting Idea BY RYAN J. FOLEY Associated Press Writer
MADISON, Wis. - A proposal to legalize the killing of feral cats is not going to succeed, Gov. Jim Doyle said Wednesday.
"I don't think Wisconsin should become known as a state where we shoot cats," said Doyle, a Democrat who neither hunts nor owns a cat. "What it does is sort of hold us up as a state that everybody is kind of laughing at right now."
He told reporters his office had received calls from around the country denouncing a proposal adopted Monday at meetings of the Wisconsin Conservation Congress, a public advisory group, that would classify wild, free-roaming cats as an unprotected species that kills song birds and other wildlife.
Outdoor enthusiasts approved the proposal 6,830 to 5,201 at Monday's spring hearings of the group.
The results get forwarded to the state Natural Resources Board for consideration, but any official action would have to be passed by the Legislature and signed by the governor.
Animal rights groups belittled the idea as inhumane and dangerous.
Doyle said he respects the Conservation Congress but "on this one I think everybody recognizes it's not going anywhere."
Some experts estimate that 2 million wild cats roam Wisconsin, and the state says studies show feral cats kill 47 million to 139 million songbirds a year.
South Dakota and Minnesota both allow wild cats to be shot.
Two state senators - Scott Fitzgerald and Neil Kedzie - had promised to do everything they can to keep the plan from becoming law.
Kedzie, who chairs the Natural Resources and Transportation Committee, called the issue "a distraction from the main tasks we have at hand."
___
On the Net:
Department of Natural Resources: http://www.dnr.state.wi.us
Excellent news!!!
Mel
-- "It is necessary and urgent that following the example of the poor man [St Francis], one decides to abandon inconsiderate forms of domination, capture and custody with respect to all creatures." -Pope John Paul II- (quoted in Animals and Christianity, 1990)
"Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace." - Albert Schweitzer, Ph.D., M.D. - (Nobel Peace Prize-winning Humanitarian, 'The Philosophy of Civilization, 1949)
Mel - 14 Apr 2005 08:14 GMT Mel states:
In *most* cases, it is a completely unfamiliar tom who is MUCH further than three houses away from the ranch. What then?
rsquared
In that case, you get your garden hose, turn on the tap, and give the tom a good hosing. If he returns after the first time, I doubt he will after the second. Humane, and deterring. No firearms required.
If a cat is bothering a particular area, ie: your birdhouse, get bloodmeal from a greenhouse and work it in and around the soil of that area, some on top. Cats hate the scent. That way, they won't go near it if you aren't there to turn on the hose.
Anyone who would rather pull the trigger than use these two simple methods is already proving themselves emotionally unbalanced and overly emotional. So you can stop being concerned about the elderly man for whom carrying a hose in his car is just not feasible, and a gun is. Besides, he is shooting the stereo, not the person.
Mel
-L. - 14 Apr 2005 08:48 GMT > Mel states: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > In that case, you get your garden hose, turn on the tap, and give the tom a good hosing. If he returns after the first time, I doubt he will after the second. Humane, and deterring. No firearms required.
> If a cat is bothering a particular area, ie: your birdhouse, get bloodmeal from a greenhouse and work it in and around the soil of that area, some on top. Cats hate the scent. That way, they won't go near it if you aren't there to turn on the hose.
...or get a live trap and take him to your local shelter.
That being said, I know a guy who's brother shoots any unknown animals on his property - dog, cat, it doesn't matter. He's a deer hunter and doesn't want the ecosystem disturbed by anything. He's also a bit of a loon....
-L.
Karen - 14 Apr 2005 15:55 GMT > > Mel states: > > <rodrig462@yahoo.com> wrote in message [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > -L. That's a little scary.
Klaus - 14 Apr 2005 14:40 GMT > Mel states: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > In that case, you get your garden hose, turn on the tap, and give the tom a good hosing. If he returns after the first time, I doubt he will after the second. Humane, and deterring. No firearms required.
> If a cat is bothering a particular area, ie: your birdhouse, get bloodmeal from a greenhouse and work it in and around the soil of that area, some on top. Cats hate the scent. That way, they won't go near it if you aren't there to turn on the hose.
> Anyone who would rather pull the trigger than use these two simple methods is already proving themselves emotionally unbalanced and overly emotional. So you can stop being concerned about the elderly man for whom carrying a hose in his car is just not feasible, and a gun is. Besides, he is shooting the stereo, not the person.
> Mel Good suggestions. What needs to be overcome, is the natural human resentment that one feels when they have to get out of their chair or spend time & money to deal with another person's negligence. That is not an easy attitude to instill.
I assume you love cats(?). Let's shift the view a bit. If someone persistently parked a muddy Winnebago in front of a house that you were trying to sell, you could remedy the problem by going out and washing it. That's assuming you live in a neighborhood/market that does not prize dirty Winnebagos. : )
For practical purposes, perception is reality. You overcome perceptions on a personal level. Passing laws is not as effective.
We probably come from two separate biases: outdoor-cat, indoor-cat.
>From my point-of-view, regardless of environmental effects, releasing an unsupervised pet into a residential area is inconsiderate. Again, we probably will not agree on that.
We can argue as to their psycho-nature, but people with much more exotic pets manage to adapt and overcome this challenge - - not that I am calling anyone *lazy*, just disengenous.
"No problem, if they mind, they can buy a trap or use a hose." or...
"No problem, they can wash my RV."
Thanks, again, for offering the suggestion. To me, it is worth the trouble of the trap; my conscience demands it. I cannot speak or judge for everyone, of course.
TTFN,
rsquared
Mel - 19 Apr 2005 21:18 GMT Good suggestions. What needs to be overcome, is the natural human resentment that one feels when they have to get out of their chair or spend time & money to deal with another person's negligence. That is not an easy attitude to instill.
To be perfectly honest, if I was really aggravated, there would probably be a bit of adrenalin moving along, and I would have the motivation to move :) I do love cats, yes. I have two indoor-only babies. I would probably use the bloodmeal method, as this is excellent food for plants. I would most likely have flowering vines at the base of the birdhouse post. Double duty. Sprinkle some extra around and work it into the very top layer. Supposed to be extremely effective in keeping deer out of gardens as well, but you would need considerably more :)
If it was a very bad cat, even though I would hate to do this, I would sneak around the house and spray him with the hose.
I assume you love cats(?). Let's shift the view a bit. If someone persistently parked a muddy Winnebago in front of a house that you were trying to sell, you could remedy the problem by going out and washing it. That's assuming you live in a neighborhood/market that does not prize dirty Winnebagos. : )
A real filthy anything wouldn't be too impressive in that situation *s* That would greatly aggravate anyone, I would think! To me, that would require a lot more effort (the washing) than trying to keep errant felines away from the birds. I might be tempted to write 'a.shole' in the dirt on both sides, rght down to the metal, so they wouldn't want to drive it that way *g*.
If I discussed the situation with them repeatedly to no avail, I would eventually be forced to enlist my friendly neighbourhood police friends - - - after all, an eyesore is an eyesore, and I am grateful that out here, you can be fined for filthy yards, etc., if you do not clean them up within a grace period.
Obviously, some neighbourhoods are exempt :)
For practical purposes, perception is reality. You overcome perceptions on a personal level. Passing laws is not as effective.
We probably come from two separate biases: outdoor-cat, indoor-cat.
Are you outdoor cat? One of my neighbour's cats, Phantom, will regularly come over to check out my flower beds. He doesn't usually bother the plants, but did take his afternoon naps in the very center of my catnip plant. What did I expect, right? If I wasn't going to cage it, I knew it was going to draw felines. I guess there are just things I don't get upset about. I figure if cats are going to eat birds, there will always be more birds. My parents live on a farm, with quite a few barn cats. They have far too many birds if you ask me. I figure you need a certain amount of most life forms to keep the circle of life in balance. Look what happened in the middle ages when all the freaked out weirdos who thought cats were evil got rid of them? Rats proliferated and along came the bubonic plague.
>From my point-of-view, regardless of environmental effects, releasing an unsupervised pet into a residential area is inconsiderate. Again, we probably will not agree on that.
No, we do agree there. I don't mind Phantom coming over for a short visit. Mine is the only place he does go (I wonder why *g*). I disagree with him being outside particularly as he is a front declaw, but trying to convince Juanita did not work. I feel, not only from the consideration angle, that it is not correct for the cats to roam. There are so many dangers out there, psycho people being just one of them.
If people were responsible and did not let their pets outdoors, always spayed and neutered them, did not ever just dump them unwanted somewhere, I feel that we would have a good handle on the feral issue. (I believe this should include farm cats as well, except for the first point.) There is always going to be that one that got away, but that would be so minimized as to be inconsequential. Humane education in schools should start at the earliest level.....preschool, kindergarten, whatever. Informed people make informed choices.
We can argue as to their psycho-nature, but people with much more exotic pets manage to adapt and overcome this challenge - - not that I am calling anyone *lazy*, just disengenous.
Are we talking about the people here? *G* My cats have NO inclination to put their feet past the front door threshold. Osker will just stand there and look around. It is as though there is a wall of glass. I know for a fact he will not place one toe forward. (I am standing there always, I do not ever leave him there alone.......I will be coming in from taking out the trash or getting the mail, things like that.) Twinkle is a recent adoption, 3 years old, petrified of open space. She was an animal control confiscation from an animal hoarder - - 36 cats and 16 dogs. Getting up too close to my large windows terrifies her still. If someone tells me it is cruel to keep my cats inside, I raise my eyebrows and tell them how these 2 react.....and then ask if they think I would be nice by pushing them outside when they are petrified to go out, where they face dangers....and I list them.
Some people are so incredibly stupid.
"No problem, if they mind, they can buy a trap or use a hose." or...
The hose is a not-bad idea, but I wouldn't appreciate someone hosing down MY cats. Of course they are going to freak out. Maybe run in the wrong direction, head for the road, get run over. (This is my wild imagination taking over, worst case scenario.)
Therefore, MY cats are indoor-cats only. And I do not want them going through the anxiety of being trapped. Who KNOWS how that neighbour will treat your precious pet? You don't. Maybe they will be nice. Maybe they will shoot them with a cross-bow and let them suffer. Maybe they will give them to some crazy pit-bull trainer for bait. I, for one, am not going to take that chance.
"No problem, they can wash my RV."
Ha ha, fat chance. Maybe soap their windows so THEY have to actually wash part of it, then might as well wash it all, hee hee.
My 19 year old female decided around last autumn that she wanted to start going outside for little 'walks' . She was quite stiff, and suffering from chronic renal failure, hyperthyroidism, and diabetes. She couldn't walk or run faster than I, so I decided to forego harness and lead. They would have been horribly uncomfortable on her excessively skinny frame. She stuck mostly to the wide front flower bed, cozying into the puff of catmint (different than catnip, related, but most cats don't react to it), then moving on to the babies' breath......nibbling the grass along the edge of the border.
She was still doing this when it was cold in November and I thought her bones must be like chunks of ice, but if I tried to pick her up to take her in I got quite the tongue-lashing. :)
She passed away January 12.05-----it was pretty obvious that she just wanted something different before she died, but no roaming involved. I would never let my cats roam. I had the lead and harness for my "fat boy" +Feb. 22/98 - - who loved to go for "walkies".....just to graze in the grass.
People who think it is "cruel" to confine a cat indoors have obviously never seen what cruelties can be exacted on a wandering feline just by creep humans alone - - not to mention other cats, dogs, skunks, raccoons, vehicles, transferrable illnesses, being caught in a shed without food or water for days, etc.etc. Working in a vet clinic and at the SPCA can really make you start to despise the human race after a while.
Thanks, again, for offering the suggestion. To me, it is worth the trouble of the trap; my conscience demands it. I cannot speak or judge for everyone, of course.
It would be a good idea to send the neighbour (if you know who the cat owns) an anonymous or otherwise note, that the cat went to the shelter because it was eating your birds. At least they can retrieve it and hopefully they learned their lesson. I would hate to see the cat die just because the person it lives with is a perfect moron.
There, now that you are snoozing away after this extreeeemmmmely long post :) it appears that we ARE in agreement :) You never know who you are going to get for a neighbour, and I like having my cats be where I know they are.
Mel
TTFN,
rsquared
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