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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / February 2005

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the questions never cease

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kitkat - 23 Feb 2005 03:59 GMT
Jasper has developed a twitch upon his return home. Only when he is
laying and starting to fall asleep it seems. But it sure is weird. He
twitches kinda all over...you almost think he could have a seizure or
something. (please, no.) I called earlier and the specialist said that
either he had low blood sugar and to feed him (which we did) or it could
be his meds that he is reacting to. It seems he only twitches, as I
said, when laying there half asleep. When I fed him before, he kinda
sprung up and of course...no twitch. Am I supposed to stay up all night
and make sure he eats something when he starts to twitch? ;) Geesh!

FWIW, the meds he is on: Baytril (antibiotic), metronizadole
(antibiotic) and dexamethasone (steroid). Oh, and pepcid.

Anyone find this worrisome? My gut reaction is just that his system is
still out of whack and he has meds in him and stuff, but im no DVM and
wtf do I know?

He also seems to have an issue right now with bowel control. I guess its
almost like oozing butt or something. Not even sure he's aware of it.

So, to recap: we spent $1500 to get our cat back with one less claw, a
cracked tooth, a twitch, a shaved leg, and an oozing butt. BUT DAMN IM
GLAD HE'S HOME!
LOL.

Pam :):)

I also REALLY wish I could stay home with him tomorrow...but that's
another story altogether. :)
Betsy - 23 Feb 2005 04:28 GMT
I'd clarify with the specialist what kind of reaction to what med he is
talking about.  Metronidazole can cause neurological complications (my cat
had them, I thought he was dying!).  Don't be afraid to call back and get a
clear answer.

> Jasper has developed a twitch upon his return home. Only when he is laying
> and starting to fall asleep it seems. But it sure is weird. He twitches
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
> I also REALLY wish I could stay home with him tomorrow...but that's
> another story altogether. :)
Cathy Friedmann - 23 Feb 2005 04:34 GMT
> Jasper has developed a twitch upon his return home. Only when he is
> laying and starting to fall asleep it seems. But it sure is weird. He
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> FWIW, the meds he is on: Baytril (antibiotic), metronizadole
> (antibiotic) and dexamethasone (steroid). Oh, and pepcid.

I can virtually guarantee you that if Phil sees this post, he is going to
nix the Baytril, in favor of ... oh, cr@p, I can't remember its name!  At
any rate, another drug that's newer thsan Baytril.  (And when my hard drive
was reformatted last year, I lost all of the saved info about this kind of
stuff.)  There was a huge discussion here on rpch+b once, re: Baytril.

Debbie was on it for over 4 years, w/ no apparent probs.  And she had
frequent full panel blood work done, to keep track of her liver enzymes, her
thyroid levels, etc., etc.

Research that was delved into at the time of the discussion showed that only
in high doses (beyond the recommened doasge - way beyond, IIRC) was
blindness or partial vision loss an adverse effect that may (odds were one
in how many? very low, at any rate) occur.  Then again, Jasper's virtually
blind, so perhaps it's a moot point, no matter if he's on the lower -
recommended - dosage, where it's not going to happen, anyway?

It *is* true that Baytril is a strong drug, & is only used when: A) a first
line of defense has proven to be ineffective, or B) the case is severe
enough to warrant the immediate use of Baytril.  Debbie was on amoxicillin
first - it didn't help her, whereas Baytril did the trick, re; her liver
disease.  Same thing with my one of my other cats, Herrie.  He was on an
antibiotic for a UTI, which didn't clear it up, whereas Baytril did.

> Anyone find this worrisome?

The twitching, or the med regimen?  If the twitching, I'd keep an eye on him
& along w/ the oozing butt syndrome you mention below, keep the vet up to
date with his symptoms.

My gut reaction is just that his system is
> still out of whack and he has meds in him and stuff, but im no DVM and
> wtf do I know?
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> I also REALLY wish I could stay home with him tomorrow...but that's
> another story altogether. :)

As long as your plans are set (or ready to e-mail in to the office to give
to a sub), you could take a sick day, or a personal day, I suppose...

Cathy
kitkat - 23 Feb 2005 04:58 GMT
> I can virtually guarantee you that if Phil sees this post, he is going to
> nix the Baytril, in favor of ... oh, cr@p, I can't remember its name!  At
> any rate, another drug that's newer thsan Baytril.  (And when my hard drive
> was reformatted last year, I lost all of the saved info about this kind of
> stuff.)  There was a huge discussion here on rpch+b once, re: Baytril.

This is the time where I have to go with the specialist's medicinal
cocktail! ;) Hopefully, Phil wont take any offense.

> Research that was delved into at the time of the discussion showed that only
> in high doses (beyond the recommened doasge - way beyond, IIRC) was
> blindness or partial vision loss an adverse effect that may (odds were one
> in how many? very low, at any rate) occur.  Then again, Jasper's virtually
> blind, so perhaps it's a moot point, no matter if he's on the lower -
> recommended - dosage, where it's not going to happen, anyway?

Yeps. Jasper=blind=moot point. :)

>>Anyone find this worrisome?
>
> The twitching, or the med regimen?  If the twitching, I'd keep an eye on him
> & along w/ the oozing butt syndrome you mention below, keep the vet up to
> date with his symptoms.

Mostly the twitching. The meds I expected and the oozing butt
syndrome...well...i can't say i expected it but i am not shocked or
scared by it. I think with time it will clear up, when his poops become
poops once again! It's clearly not some sort of behavioral thing.

As I said, the twitching seems to only happen when he is practically in
a state of slumber. And it doesn't seem to have gotten any worse. So I
suppose that's good.

>>I also REALLY wish I could stay home with him tomorrow...but that's
>>another story altogether. :)
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Cathy

I used both of my personal days in December for my wedding...and I just
took a sick day (for me and Jasper..hehe) on Friday. I really can't take
tomorrow off. :(

Pam
Cathy Friedmann - 23 Feb 2005 16:29 GMT
> > I can virtually guarantee you that if Phil sees this post, he is going to
> > nix the Baytril, in favor of ... oh, cr@p, I can't remember its name!  At
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> This is the time where I have to go with the specialist's medicinal
> cocktail! ;) Hopefully, Phil wont take any offense.

I hope so, too.

> > Research that was delved into at the time of the discussion showed that only
> > in high doses (beyond the recommened doasge - way beyond, IIRC) was
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> scared by it. I think with time it will clear up, when his poops become
> poops once again! It's clearly not some sort of behavioral thing.

I agree, re: the oozing butt bit.  About the twitching - too bad we can't
have access to the vets' version of the PDR; that would give, in detail, all
of the possible adverse effects that are known for each drug.  At least I
don't *know* of a way to see a copy, unless at the vet's office, if one
asks.  I don't think public libraries have them, as they do PDRs.  At any
rate, if he keeps doing it, I'd explain exactly to the vet what you're
seeing & ask if it could be an adverse effect to nay othe drugs.  IIRC, last
night someone posted about one of his meds (ewhich one? - not the Baytril
nor the Pepcid) possibly being the cause, in their experience. And, if not
drug-related, what could be going on, to cause it?

> As I said, the twitching seems to only happen when he is practically in
> a state of slumber. And it doesn't seem to have gotten any worse. So I
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> Pam

I can see where that's a problem, then.  I've had to take a couple of sick
days over the years for a cat's illness (or death).  Hey, I figure people
w/kids get "x" amount of "family" days/year, but people w/ no children are
gypped out, so...  Plus, those days were taken before the rules for personal
days were amended - when one had to be getting married, having a house
closing, a court appearance, etc. - no "unspecified" personal days allowed
then.  Or else have had to drop off the cat at the vets' at 8:00, & wind up
going into work a little late, then picking said cat back up after work.
Not the best scenario, but not a lot of choice.

Cathy
Phil P. - 24 Feb 2005 06:55 GMT
> Jasper has developed a twitch upon his return home. Only when he is
> laying and starting to fall asleep it seems. But it sure is weird. He
> twitches kinda all over...you almost think he could have a seizure or
> something. (please, no.) I called earlier and the specialist said that
> either he had low blood sugar and to feed him (which we did) or it could
> be his meds that he is reacting to.

Metronidazole can cause tremors or other neurological signs.  Baytril - even
at the 'new' dose can cause ataxia and seizures - but very rarely.

If hypoglycemia is a potential problem, you might want to think about
picking up a glucometer to monitor is blood glucose.  Urine dipsticks are
useless for detecting hypoglycemia - the lowest they go is just negative for
urine glucose.  You buy an Accu-Chek meter and I'll send you a double box of
100 test strips. How's that?

It seems he only twitches, as I
> said, when laying there half asleep. When I fed him before, he kinda
> sprung up and of course...no twitch. Am I supposed to stay up all night
> and make sure he eats something when he starts to twitch? ;) Geesh!

Did you ever pick up a tube of Nutri-Cal?

> FWIW, the meds he is on: Baytril (antibiotic), metronizadole
> (antibiotic) and dexamethasone (steroid). Oh, and pepcid.
>
> Anyone find this worrisome? My gut reaction is just that his system is
> still out of whack and he has meds in him and stuff, but im no DVM and
> wtf do I know?

Metronidazole & steroid is a standard protocol for IBD.  Metronidazole is
'Flagyl' which is used to treat Giardia and anaerobic infections but it also
surpresses cell-mediated immune responses in the intestines - which may be
why he's not vomiting (?).  Its a little hard to tell if he had a
self-limiting bout of acute pancreatitis or if he's responding to IBD
therapy ;-/   Right now, who cares which - as long as he's stabilized and
improving!  You probably won't know which until your vet tapers or
discontinues the meds.

I'm not a proponent of Baytril - but I'm not sure why he even prescribed *a*
fluoroquinolone.

> He also seems to have an issue right now with bowel control. I guess its
> almost like oozing butt or something. Not even sure he's aware of it.

Metronidazole and Baytril can both cause diarrhea. It might take him a few
days to equilibrate the meds and eating again.

> So, to recap: we spent $1500 to get our cat back with one less claw, a
> cracked tooth, a twitch, a shaved leg, and an oozing butt. BUT DAMN IM
> GLAD HE'S HOME!
> LOL.

Leaky butt and all! ;-)

> Pam :):)
>
> I also REALLY wish I could stay home with him tomorrow...but that's
> another story altogether. :)

Pam, you don't look very well.... better play it safe and call in sick
tomorrow..... ;-?

Phil
John Doe - 24 Feb 2005 07:44 GMT
>Jasper has developed a twitch upon his return home. Only when he is
>laying and starting to fall asleep it seems. But it sure is weird.
>He twitches kinda all over...you almost think he could have a
>seizure or something.

Umm. I think cats, like dogs, sometimes twitch when they are
dreaming.

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