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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / February 2005One more Jasper update
Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid therapy and all that good stuff. Here is the lo-down. We had them do another round of blood tests and xrays. The blood tests confirm pancreatitis, with elevated lipase counts. The vet said though that what we don't know is if the pancreatitis is the primary problem or if it is secondary to some larger problem. The xrays show two things: 1. an irregular, rounded liver and 2. an enlarged, rounded heart We are scheduled for a consult in the morning with a specialist who according to this vet is one of the top internists in the state of Illinois. We plan to have an ultrasound done to see what is going on with the heart and the liver. I guess that is really all for now. I am very glad we took him in. He was indeed VERY dehydrated and weak and his 3rd eyelid was starting to yellow. If this is *just* pancreatitis, it is as I know, fairly treatable in the long run. But if Jasper has some serious liver or heart problems (or both) we are not inclined to put him through too much more trauma. He is blind and deaf to begin with and I just can't see him having to endure all kinds of poking and prodding and cutting and slicing...etc. Before we got him, we was very much loved by his previous mommy, but really not well cared for. We are going to try to do right by him...we just aren't exactly sure what the hell that means at this point. I'll be meeting with the specialist tomorrow at 9am. Think of us, okay? I need all the strength I can get!!!!! I think even Luna is worried. Pam Hi Pam - I'm glad you went to the Emergency Vet. Poor Jasper! My heart goes out to you all. Thinking good thoughts for you and your baby....Carol > Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency > Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid therapy [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > Pam > Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency > Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Pam It sounds like you have a better handle on things now. I sure hope that you get soem answers so you know what to do. I'll be thinking of you guys. > Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency > Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid > therapy and all that good stuff. Good old Phil. Bet you feel better now. > Here is the lo-down. > We had them do another round of blood tests and xrays. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > was indeed VERY dehydrated and weak and his 3rd eyelid was starting to > yellow. I didn't realize you could see his third eyelid. It is a good thing you took him in. [..] Think of us, okay? I need > all the strength I can get!!!!! Sending all the good energy we can, Pam. >>Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency >>Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid >>therapy and all that good stuff. > > Good old Phil. Bet you feel better now. Well, I wouldn't exactly say I feel "better"...actually we are quite depressed over here and Im having trouble sleeping yet again (despite being very tired.) But yes, I know we did the right thing and for that I am glad. And grateful for Phil's presence here. And everyone else's for that matter. > I didn't realize you could see his third eyelid. It is a good thing > you took him in. Well, I thought his eyes looked rather squinty and bad today. It was the vet who mentioned the 3rd eye. I guess we are learning a lot as we go. Ive had Luna for a long time, but knock on wood...she has been healthy and before Luna, the last cat I had was as a little girl. So, I don't have much experience with sick kitties. Another reason I am grateful for rpchb. Well, off for another attempt at some sleep. I wont be far from this ng though, that's for sure. Thanks y'all. (yes, I say y'all even though Im from Chicago...dont know why) Pam > >>Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency > >>Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > am glad. And grateful for Phil's presence here. And everyone else's for > that matter. > > I didn't realize you could see his third eyelid. It is a good thing > > you took him in. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > have much experience with sick kitties. Another reason I am grateful for > rpchb. I read somewhere that this is a clear sign of sickness, usually serious. > Well, off for another attempt at some sleep. I wont be far from this ng > though, that's for sure. Thanks y'all. (yes, I say y'all even though Im > from Chicago...dont know why) Pam, I will be checking in throughout the day, and will keep you and Jasper and Tim in my thoughts. Let us know how he and you are doing. > Pam, I will be checking in throughout the day, and will keep > you and Jasper and Tim in my thoughts. Let us know how he > and you are doing. Well. Acute pancreatitis again is confirmed. The tissue around the pancreas and the liver are thickened and that could be inflammation or it could be disease. The lymph nodes are swollen and again, that could be simple inflammation or it could be lymphoma. Of course the only way to know is to do a biopsy. The key problem is that Jasper is truly a terrible patient. He is TERRIBLY agitated and fights the vets with everything he's got. This really bothers me and speaks volumes. The "plan" at this point is to take it day by day...but only for a few days. We have already been quoted a pretty large sum of money for his round the clock care for the next 3 days...with no real guarantee of him getting better and feeling good. I could bring him home and have to bring him back and forth to the clinic daily for sub-q treatments, etc. But I think that is mean and cruel. I just don't think he should be moved around each and every day like that. He has lost almost a pound since Friday. Things don't look so bright. I guess I feel that no matter how much money we spend, there is not much of a guarantee that he will ever heal enough to be independent, eating and happy again. I don't think it is worth doing the biopsy because I simply can not imagine putting an old, blind, deaf cat thru chemo if he does in fact have cancer. It seems like most of the stuff we can do for him beyond basic supportive care would be selfish and more for us than for him. Tim had to go to work today so he is not even around for me to discuss this all. That is not helping. I will be going back to the clinic to see Jasper later. I also brought in his blanket that he had been camped out on most of the time so hopefully the smells of home will comfort him. Smell is all he can go on right now...and that just makes me soooo sad. Not fun stuff. pam That is so sad. I wish you all strength to keep going no matter what the future holds. Hugs and fury headbuts from Memphis and Phoenix too. Sandra > > Pam, I will be checking in throughout the day, and will keep > > you and Jasper and Tim in my thoughts. Let us know how he [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > terrible patient. He is TERRIBLY agitated and fights the vets with > everything he's got. This really bothers me and speaks volumes. My 2 cents (based on previous experience with a super-sick cat): If you want to have a biopsy done, I highly recommend a needle biopsy, as I had done for Debbie's liver condition, when we didn't know if we were dealing with cancer or some other liver condition. She was very ill when the biopsy was done (couldn't tolerate a surgical biopsy), but the needle aspiration (& sonogram) truly didn't stress her out. The internist/oncologist gave her a muscle relaxant prior to the procedure & as a result, she was very calm (& literally laid-back!) about the whole thing. *If* you go the biopsy route, & *if* it's then determined that a treatment plan _can_ help him out, & if that includes sub-Q fluids, I'd also highly recommend doing them at home, after having the vet (&/or vet tech) give you lessons at the office. Then, *if* it's cancer, & if the vet thinks there's a very good chance for remission through chemo, remember that cats tolerate chemo **way** better than humans do. Cathy The > "plan" at this point is to take it day by day...but only for a few days. > We have already been quoted a pretty large sum of money for his round [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > pam >>>Pam, I will be checking in throughout the day, and will keep >>>you and Jasper and Tim in my thoughts. Let us know how he [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Cathy Just out of curiosity, how old was Debbie when all of this happened? The specialist also said that even if they found cancer, that chemo would really only be buying him time...probably about 8 months to a year. He is already an old geezer with the problem of being deaf and blind. To me, most of what we are doing seems like torture. Pam > >>>Pam, I will be checking in throughout the day, and will keep > >>>you and Jasper and Tim in my thoughts. Let us know how he [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > Just out of curiosity, how old was Debbie when all of this happened? She was 11. Cathy > The specialist also said that even if they found cancer, that chemo > would really only be buying him time...probably about 8 months to a > year. He is already an old geezer with the problem of being deaf and > blind. To me, most of what we are doing seems like torture. > > Pam > > Pam, I will be checking in throughout the day, and will keep > > you and Jasper and Tim in my thoughts. Let us know how he [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > terrible patient. He is TERRIBLY agitated and fights the vets with > everything he's got. This really bothers me and speaks volumes. I know this has to be hard to watch. I'm not sure I could deal with it. The > "plan" at this point is to take it day by day...but only for a few days. > We have already been quoted a pretty large sum of money for his round > the clock care for the next 3 days...with no real guarantee of him > getting better and feeling good. I could bring him home and have to > bring him back and forth to the clinic daily for sub-q treatments, etc. > But I think that is mean and cruel. I agree with you 100%. I understand that cats left at the vet usually adapt somewhat while they are there and calm down. Remember how resiliant they are! It is change they hate, and the very scary vibrations (in Jasper's case) of the car and such. Leaving him there is the best thing you can do. I just don't think he should be > moved around each and every day like that. He has lost almost a pound > since Friday. Things don't look so bright. I guess I feel that no matter [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Not fun stuff. I'm so sorry, Pam. It could be that you will decide to treat the pancreatitis but not do the biopsy and just wait and see. I think that might be my decision with an older cat with Jasper's vision and hearing problems. But of course nobody knows what you should do but you. I have no doubt that you will make the right decision. Believe in yourself and your instincts. You love this cat and he knows it. > I'm so sorry, Pam. It could be that you will decide to treat the > pancreatitis but not do the biopsy and just wait and see. I think [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > decision. Believe in yourself and your instincts. You love this cat > and he knows it. That is the plan at this point. I know we have no intention of doing further diagnostic testing, such as biopsies. We hope to get him feeling well enough to eat and tolerate food again so that he can come home and hang with us. I'll be keeping my fingers and toes crossed. And at this point, I am quite grateful for my credit card with a nice big limit. Thanks for the words of encouragement from all. Pam >I could bring him home and have to bring >him back and forth to the clinic daily for >sub-q treatments, etc. But I think that is >mean and cruel. There's no need to bring him to the clinic every day just to do sub-qs. It is very easy to do and can be done at home. Megan  Signature"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -Edmund Burke Learn The TRUTH About Declawing http://www.stopdeclaw.com Zuzu's Cats Photo Album: http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22 "Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision, raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his way." - W.H. Murray >>I could bring him home and have to bring >>him back and forth to the clinic daily for [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Megan Well, hopefully if he stays there for a few days he wont need them anymore. > Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency > Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Pam Will send heartfelt purrs for Jasper. We don't want him to suffer either. May you be guided in the right direction. MLB Mega purrs coming from Memphis and Phoenix. Hope things get better soon. SignatureSandra > Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency > Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Pam Good thing you brought him in, then. Here's hoping it's primarily a pancreatitis problem; the consult w/ the specialist should help, figuring out where to go from here. Cathy Sorry for responding sooner - we got some snow and I had to dig out feeding stations and shelter openings. > Well, after reading Phil P's last post...we took Jasper to the Emergency > Vet. He is there resting comfortably right now, on an IV for fluid [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > The xrays show two things: 1. an irregular, rounded liver and 2. an > enlarged, rounded heart Don't lose faith! A rounded or enlarged liver could be caused by secondary (or primary) hepatic lipidosis which is *treatable*. 80% of cats with HL survive if they receive treatment in time. A globular heart can be the result of taurine-defiicent dilated cardiomyopathy (TDDCM) -- which is also *treatable* and *reversible* with simple and inexpensive taurine supplementation. > We are scheduled for a consult in the morning with a specialist who > according to this vet is one of the top internists in the state of [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > was indeed VERY dehydrated and weak and his 3rd eyelid was starting to > yellow. That's (jaundice) a classic symptom of HL. Protrusion of the third eyelid can be caused by dehydration or weight loss. If this is *just* pancreatitis, it is as I know, fairly > treatable in the long run. But if Jasper has some serious liver or heart > problems (or both) we are not inclined to put him through too much more > trauma. Please listen. Based on the hundreds of examples of the cat's indomitible spirit in times of extreme hardship and illness that I've personally witnessed over the years, I can say with absolute certainty, given the choice, a cat would choose a few weeks or a few months of discomfort to survive many more years. I think the worst case scenario is that he'll need to be fed via PEG tube. Most cats adapt so well to a PEG tube that I had to withhold feeding to find out that the cats' appetite had returned! He is blind and deaf to begin with and I just can't see him > having to endure all kinds of poking and prodding and cutting and > slicing...etc. All the better - if you take my meaning - he won't be as stressed as a sighted and hearing cat who would see and hear all the strange people and noises! That's why we cover feral traps after the cat is in the trap and why its best to face the front of the carrier towards the seat in a car so the cat doesn't see the motion and get as stressed by the moving car. > Before we got him, we was very much loved by his previous mommy, but > really not well cared for. We are going to try to do right by him...we [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Pam Pam, *please* keep the faith, I really think he can get though this will a lot less stress than you may think. Good luck, Phil > All the better - if you take my meaning - he won't be as stressed as a > sighted and hearing cat who would see and hear all the strange people and > noises! That's why we cover feral traps after the cat is in the trap and > why its best to face the front of the carrier towards the seat in a car so > the cat doesn't see the motion and get as stressed by the moving car. Phil, Please know that your information is considered gold to me. I've been lurking on this group for over a year and only participating in the past month or two, but I know smart when I see it. But also please know this: Jasper's hearing and vision problems are, in my opinion, causing him to be a VERY unhappy camper in that he is literally becoming Damian at the vet. I also realize he is uncomfortable so that adds to his stress levels, but both the vet we saw Friday and the specialist we met with today feel that his not being a model patient is a key issue for us to consider right now. He is not allowing the vets to do some of the things they need to do and I've been told by both that sedation is out of the question and counter-productive. He is VERY stressed and I fear that his stress levels are definitely something for us to consider. That being said, the road ahead is also an expensive one...which in and of itself is not what bothers me. What bothers me is putting the time, effort and money into treatment that may end up resulting in a cat that is still sick and uncomfortable. Hopefully we'll have a better idea within a day or two. I pray that he calms down and acclimates a little better to his surroundings at the kitty hospital. I did bring his blanket from home so that he might be comforted by the smells. :) I do love that kitty!!! Pam
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