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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / February 2007Beware of this Ragdoll breeder
I just bought a ragdoll kitten for $600 from weepurrs (Phyllis Mikesell) in Calgary. The kitten has been diagnosed with Feline Infectious Peritonitis, which he got from his mother and will kill him. The breeder has a one year health guarantee but has refused to return any of my calls. The vet says he sees this all the time and that I will probably never see my money again. Worse, I have two children who have to probably put their beloved kitty to sleep. Her house smelled TERRIBLE when I picked up the cat. Being an unexperienced cat buyer I thought this may be normal for a cattery but IT IS NOT! Please do not make the same mistake I made. If you have a bad feeling about the breeder, walk away. And DO NOT buy a cat from this cattery. Thanks If you have a contract that states a health guarantee then how about if you had a lawyer contact her. It may put a scare into her and she will refund your money. Sorry to hear about the sick kitty. > I just bought a ragdoll kitten for $600 from weepurrs (Phyllis > Mikesell) in Calgary. The kitten has been diagnosed with Feline [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Thanks Thanks, Stormlady .... unfortunately I did not get ANYTHING in writing. I paid her cash. I had my kids with me and we were so excited to get Simon home that I didn't get any paperwork. I know - I probably deserve to have been cheated. (blush) I just hope that this posting will prevent this from happening to other inexperienced cat buyers and that woman will never make another DIME off a kitten. > Thanks, Stormlady .... unfortunately I did not get ANYTHING in writing. > I paid her cash. I had my kids with me and we were so excited to get > Simon home that I didn't get any paperwork. I know - I probably > deserve to have been cheated. (blush) Well, it wasn't a wise move. I still hope you report her, because no cattery worth it's salt would smell as you described. The fact the kitten was sick shows that she is not following any kind of professional standards. She could be gotten possibly for neglect. > I just hope that this posting will prevent this from happening to other > inexperienced cat buyers and that woman will never make another DIME > off a kitten. Six hundred dollars is a lot of money. Next time, maybe find a friendly, approachable cat at your local shelter. That's how we'll put these loons out of business. No more buying cats - just adopting cats : > Six hundred dollars is a lot of money. Next time, maybe find a > friendly, approachable cat at your local shelter. That's how we'll put > these loons out of business. No more buying cats - just adopting cats :> What a wonderful idea, Tracy. The more I read about breeder horror stories (not to mention the genetic defects that many of these purebred cats have) the more I am convinced that I will do just that - adopt a nice kitty from a shelter. There is an organization called A.R.F. (Animal Rescue Foundation) here in town whose web site I have visited - there are some beautiful cats that I think would make a fine addition to our family. Thanks for the kind words :-) > The more I read about breeder horror stories (not to mention the > genetic defects that many of these purebred cats have) the more I am [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > that I think would make a fine addition to our family. > Thanks for the kind words :-) The most wonderful cat I have every had came from a shelter. If you get a young adult that has been at the shelter for a few months, you get a fully socialized cat that is pretty much guaranteed to eliminate where it is supposed to, and the volunteers have had time to watch and get to know it, so that they can tell you things like, does it like other cats, kids, dogs, etc. My neighbor got a lovely Ragdoll (or Ragdoll lookalike) from my local no-kill shelter last year, and they just love her. Needless to say, they have lots of kitten too, if that is what you want. This looks to be the same posting that was in the rec.pets.cats.rescue group. I have to wonder why the OP bought a cat from a breeder when there are many cats in the shelter are needing good homes.  SignatureCat Galaxy: All Cats! All The Time! www.catgalaxymedia.com Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of Your Computer Needs! www.panthertekit.com > >> Thanks, Stormlady .... unfortunately I did not get ANYTHING in writing. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >> inexperienced cat buyers and that woman will never make another DIME >> off a kitten. I bought cats from a shelter years ago (2 of them) - they ended up being terribly sick with a respiratory virus and had to be taken back. The ended up destroying them. I bought from a breeder because I like the qualities of the Ragdoll breed and because I thought I was getting a healthy cat. I resent having to defend myself. I have nothing wrong here and am working very hard right now to put this woman out of business. I hate to tell you but you HAVE done something wrong - (unknowingly). You helped this woman stay in business by buying from her. Many people have adopted shelter kittens and ended up with healthy, wonderful cats. All it takes is to click onto http://www.petfinder.com and look at all the kittens and cats that are available. My Tiger came from a shelter and my only complaint is that he eats too much! It's up to you now to make sure the shelter is put out of business. ---MIKE--- It is a shame a shelter would euthanize a cat for something that could have possibly been cured. But that is no reason to give up on adopting other cats that need a good and loving home. BTW, shelter cats are just as good as purebreds which also make their way into shelters and are also dumped on the city streets. SignatureCat Galaxy: All Cats! All The Time! www.catgalaxymedia.com Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of Your Computer Needs! www.panthertekit.com >I bought cats from a shelter years ago (2 of them) - they ended up > being terribly sick with a respiratory virus and had to be taken back. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > I resent having to defend myself. I have nothing wrong here and am > working very hard right now to put this woman out of business. > This looks to be the same posting that was in the rec.pets.cats.rescue > group. I have to wonder why the OP bought a cat from a breeder when there > are many cats in the shelter are needing good homes. What's the point in attacking the person for that now? He/She's (sorry, don't know!) trying to do something good and get this shitty breeder shut down. Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net "Wake up, and smell the cat food" -TMBG Thanks for standing up for me, Kelly. Some people just need to get off their high horse. > Thanks for standing up for me, Kelly. Some people just need to get off > their high horse. I think you've seen the error in buying from a breeder, no need to beat up on you. And if you hadn't bought from this breeder, then she might never have been exposed. Things happen for a reason. How is the kitten, btw? Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net "Wake up, and smell the cat food" -TMBG He's doing OK - his ear infection has cleared up but his corona titer came back today and the prognosis is not good. The vet suggest that I take the kitten back; just leave him on the doorstep, but I can't find it in my heart to do that. I would rather spoil him and love him until the time comes when he starts to suffer and has to be put down. > He's doing OK - his ear infection has cleared up but his corona titer > came back today and the prognosis is not good. The vet suggest that I > take the kitten back; just leave him on the doorstep Oh, really? Who is your vet? >> He's doing OK - his ear infection has cleared up but his corona titer >> came back today and the prognosis is not good. The vet suggest that I >> take the kitten back; just leave him on the doorstep > >Oh, really? Who is your vet? Indeed. That's appalling that a vet would suggest such a thing. And a sick kitten, no less. Sherry >>> He's doing OK - his ear infection has cleared up but his corona titer >>> came back today and the prognosis is not good. The vet suggest that I [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Sherry Boy, that would send me to a new vet immediately. If he doesn't care enough, who says he is diagnosing this right? I mean, that's just strange. > >>> He's doing OK - his ear infection has cleared up but his corona titer > >>> came back today and the prognosis is not good. The vet suggest that I [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Boy, that would send me to a new vet immediately. If he doesn't care enough, > who says he is diagnosing this right? I mean, that's just strange. I'm still thinking about what I want to do to the vet if he or she actually said this. But maybe I just had a rough day. I agree. I am not going back to that vet. I know these guys see a lot and maybe get desensitized but their decisions should be made based on compassion for the animal, first and foremost. > I agree. I am not going back to that vet. I know these guys see a lot > and maybe get desensitized but their decisions should be made based on > compassion for the animal, first and foremost. It is part of their job to make you feel comfortable and to at least *appear* to care about your animal. If a vet can't get that part right, what else is he getting wrong? If he really made that suggestion (to leave the sick kitten on the breeder's doorstep) I have a few things I would like to say to him. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- From: "catlvr" <lmitchell@eba.ca> >The vet suggest that I >take the kitten back; just leave him on the doorstep, but I can't find >it in my heart to do that. I would rather spoil him and love him until >the time comes when he starts to suffer and has to be put down. Damn right! He's not a defective product. You've got a kitten that needs the love and care you can provide. The dealings with the breeder should be a separate issue. You should get your money back, and the breeder should be shut down. But your kitten neither knows nor cares about that. He only cares that he's found a loving home with someone who will take care of him. People like you help to restore my faith in the goodness of humans. Wow, talk about weird karma. It is extremely cold here in Calgary this morning, and when I went to get the paper there was a frozen cat on my doorstep. His fur was covered in frost and he came in the house right away. We fed and watered him but he seems to have some problems with his hind legs. It's hard to tell if it's from age or if he's been injured. (It looks like arthritis to me.) Anyway, I am keeping him separate from the other cats in my bedroom, and during my son's birthday party (which starts in an hour!) I'll take him to the emergency animal hospital. He is very sweet and seems used to other animals, because he went right up to my cat Trixie (although she didn't appreciate the gesture very much.) I'll post an ad at the local grocery store and in the paper to let people know where to look for him. He must be a neighbourhood cat, although I can't imagine why anyone would let their cat out in weather like this. > Wow, talk about weird karma. It is extremely cold here in Calgary this > morning, and when I went to get the paper there was a frozen cat on my [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > although I can't imagine why anyone would let their cat out in weather > like this. Oh please keep us posted. Poor kitty!!! I went to a few houses in the neighbourhood and some people have seen the cat before but didn't know who he belonged to. I took him to the Emergency Veterinary Clinic this afternoon. It was -20 degrees celsius here today (the high) ... I can't imagine someone leaving an animal outside like that! The clinic is going to keep me updated on his file. They seemed concerned about the hind legs and the weakness he was was exhibiting. I hope they can help him. I am really starting to lose my faith in human beings. I called the emergency clinic last night where I left the cat. He turned out to be about 7 or 8 years old, and had suffered apparent frost bite in his hind legs and tail. He was also dehydrated and had an upper respiratory viral infection. The woman said his owner came for him, and I said, "oh great!". Well, she said, the owner didn't want to pay the medical fees (which were nominal) for the cat and left him there. Can you believe it??!! Anyway, I told her to keep me posted and if he goes to the SPCA and doesn't find a home, I will take him. (My husband is just FREAKING out because of all these cat crises this week. He doesn't understand.) > I am really starting to lose my faith in human beings. I called the > emergency clinic last night where I left the cat. He turned out to be about [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > take him. (My husband is just FREAKING out because of all these cat crises > this week. He doesn't understand.) Yes, I can believe it. There are some truly irresponsible people out there. Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* >I am really starting to lose my faith in human beings. I called the >emergency clinic last night where I left the cat. He turned out to be [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >and doesn't find a home, I will take him. (My husband is just FREAKING >out because of all these cat crises this week. He doesn't understand.) What kind of bills are we talking here? It wasn't much - under $50. They tried to keep everything to a minimum because they didn't know if anyone will pick up the cat. Very sad. >It wasn't much - under $50. They tried to keep everything to a minimum >because they didn't know if anyone will pick up the cat. Very sad. That's horrible. Tell you what, you're taking the cat? I'll pay for the vet fees if you want. I offered to pay the vet fees but they said it wasn't necessary - I guess they see this happen a lot. I phoned again last night and apparently the owner paid the fees yesterday and picked up the cat. I almost wish she hadn't - she doesn't deserve to take care of animal. If the cat had gone to the SPCA, someone would have adopted him; he was a real sweetheart - if not, I would have taken him and given him a life of luxury. Sometimes I wish I was a cat! (At least one of mine!) No she doesn't. I wonder if she paid out of embarrassment? SignatureCat Galaxy: All Cats! All The Time! www.catgalaxymedia.com Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of Your Computer Needs! www.panthertekit.com >I offered to pay the vet fees but they said it wasn't necessary - I > guess they see this happen a lot. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > would have taken him and given him a life of luxury. Sometimes I wish I > was a cat! (At least one of mine!) An update on Simon ... I am pleased to report that he is doing great .... eating well, playing up a storm, and being loved by all who meet him. Even Trixie, his new sister, is warming up to him. Trixie is a very FAT ginger tabby with the most expressive eyes I have ever seen in a cat ... she swatted at him a couple of times at first, but she has grown to accept him, even sleeping on the same bed with him! I don't know enough about FIP and maybe that's a good thing - if I had followed the vet's advice I would have either put him down or taken him back to that horrible woman's house. It's been almost two weeks now since I bought Simon, and I can't imagine life without him. I hope that he will continue beating the virus (IF that is what he has) and stay with us for as long as possible. He is a joy to be around, and if it wasn't for him, this "breeder" from whom I bought him, would perhaps not have been made accountable for her actions. > An update on Simon ... I am pleased to report that he is doing great > .... eating well, playing up a storm, and being loved by all who meet [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > "breeder" from whom I bought him, would perhaps not have been made > accountable for her actions. Well, we DO know that FIP is often diagnosed, so it could be some other infection. Please keep us updated. Simon is a very lucky kitty so far. >> An update on Simon ... I am pleased to report that he is doing great >> .... eating well, playing up a storm, and being loved by all who meet [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >Well, we DO know that FIP is often diagnosed, so it could be some other >infection. Please keep us updated. Simon is a very lucky kitty so far. I know you meant misdiagnosed. I agree, if the kitten is recovering, playing, eating well--it's very unlikely he has FIP. >> An update on Simon ... I am pleased to report that he is doing great >> .... eating well, playing up a storm, and being loved by all who meet >> him. Even Trixie, his new sister, is warming up to him. Trixie is a >> very FAT ginger tabby with the most expressive eyes I have ever seen in >> a cat ... she swatted at him a couple of times at first, but she has >> grown to accept him, even sleeping on the same bed with him! >> I don't know enough about FIP and maybe that's a good thing - if I had >> followed the vet's advice I would have either put him down or taken him >> back to that horrible woman's house. >> It's been almost two weeks now since I bought Simon, and I can't >> imagine life without him. I hope that he will continue beating the >> virus (IF that is what he has) and stay with us for as long as >> possible. He is a joy to be around, and if it wasn't for him, this >> "breeder" from whom I bought him, would perhaps not have been made >> accountable for her actions. >Well, we DO know that FIP is often diagnosed, so it could be some other >infection. Please keep us updated. Simon is a very lucky kitty so far. I know you meant misdiagnosed. I agree, if the kitten is recovering, playing, eating well--it's very unlikely he has FIP _____________________________________________________________ I am replying in Google, so please don't call me stupid or lazy as some have here .... I dutifully cut and paste so you all know what I am talking about and to whom I am replying. Looking at this site through Google makes it appear that it really is as simple as "reply" ... but I guess some die-hard users are set in their ways and don't tolerate any deviation. Simon had a bout of diarrhea a few days ago (rubbing his little bottom all over the carpets to clean himself!) but he seems himself again. He is still sneezing frequently and making these hacking, coughing sounds once in a while. He will have to get neutered soon (he is coming up to seven months) but the vet really doesn't seem very optimistic about his prognosis in regard to FIP. He is going to do another globulin test before the neuter and if it is high I know he will try to dissuade me from having the procedure done. But really, it's only about $100 and if that means we are all happier, even for a short while, it's worth it. If you could see this little cat you would know why we have fallen so in love with him. He is the most loving little creature that I have ever seen - he sleeps between me and my husband, head on the pillow, just like a little man! >>> An update on Simon ... I am pleased to report that he is doing great >>> .... eating well, playing up a storm, and being loved by all who [quoted text clipped - 49 lines] > ever seen - he sleeps between me and my husband, head on the pillow, > just like a little man! Everyone deserves a chance and if he is loved that is the most important thing. He sounds like he is doing pretty well if it is FIP. I've never heard of cats improving once it is diagnosed. I would sure be tempted to see a feline specialist if your vet is not one. Everyone deserves a chance and if he is loved that is the most important thing. He sounds like he is doing pretty well if it is FIP. I've never heard of cats improving once it is diagnosed. I would sure be tempted to see a feline specialist if your vet is not one. The diagnosis was based on globulin and corona tests, and from the research that I have done, it really does look like FIP. The vet seems very knowledgeable about the subject and he is definitely not freshly out of vet school, but this is a general veterinary practice so I might take him to the feline vet for a second opinion. Perhaps it's a case of his environment helping his health, I don't know ... I keep his dishes/litter box scrupulously clean, he eats the best catfood that I can find, and he gets LOTS of love from everyone in the family. He looks incredibly healthy now - he has gained some weight since I bought him and his coat is thick and bushy. He is a gorgeous cat, but when you get up close you see the red-rimmed eyes sometimes, and his breath is very bad. When he has diarrhea he also smells bad sometimes because he can't clean himself thoroughly. *sigh* ... it's really awful. In a way I wish this was over, but then again every minute with him is precious. What shots has this cat had there are some shots that are related to giving a cat FIP I would wait to neuter him it's toooo much stress to put him under Beverley This reminds me of a story that my brother and sister-in-law told me about a cat they rescued and adopted. The cat had one paw stuck through his collar like a flag and had to survive like that in the wilderness area near their house. It was remakrable that the cat was able to hunt like this at all let alone survive in an area where there were other predators. The cat apparently needed medical treatment when they found him. When the vet found the cat's human he refused to pay for medical treatment and pretty much said that if someone wanted the cat that they can have them. My brother and sister-in-law paid for the medical treatment and adopted the cat they named Cody. It is upsetting to know there are people in the world who look at money being more important than the animal but at least their are some decent people willing to step in and help. You can't lose faith in humanity despite a select few that are willing to drop a cat because they don't want to take responsibility for their care and well being. Just know there are others out there that actually give a darn. SignatureCat Galaxy: All Cats! All The Time! www.catgalaxymedia.com Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of Your Computer Needs! www.panthertekit.com >I am really starting to lose my faith in human beings. I called the > emergency clinic last night where I left the cat. He turned out to be [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > and doesn't find a home, I will take him. (My husband is just FREAKING > out because of all these cat crises this week. He doesn't understand.) >It is upsetting to know there are people in the world who look at money >being more important than the animal but at least their are some decent >people willing to step in and help. It is really frustrating. We paid over $700 for a stray cat. We didn't have to, they would have found a home for him. But he was so sweet, and we wanted to keep him. So, we paid the vet fees. He ended up dying, but I am still glad we did it. Signature-- Meghan & the Zoo Crew Equine and Pet Photography http://www.zoocrewphoto.com >I am really starting to lose my faith in human beings. I called the >emergency clinic last night where I left the cat. He turned out to be [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >and doesn't find a home, I will take him. (My husband is just FREAKING >out because of all these cat crises this week. He doesn't understand.) Poor thing. Don't feel alone; I lost faith in human beings a long time ago. Bless you for taking responsibility for him. I get so tired of taking responsibility for other people's animals. My last stray was in the worst shape I ever saw to still survive. And even months later the vet found a BB lodged in her side. I hate people sometimes. Sherry Just remember not to give away too much information. If someone does contact you, let them descibe the cat to you. Anyone could say they lost a cat only to cause that feline harm. SignatureCat Galaxy: All Cats! All The Time! www.catgalaxymedia.com Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of Your Computer Needs! www.panthertekit.com > I'll post an ad at the local grocery store and in the paper to let > people know where to look for him. He must be a neighbourhood cat, > although I can't imagine why anyone would let their cat out in weather > like this. If a vet says that, he shouldn't be in the business. SignatureCat Galaxy: All Cats! All The Time! www.catgalaxymedia.com Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of Your Computer Needs! www.panthertekit.com > He's doing OK - his ear infection has cleared up but his corona titer > came back today and the prognosis is not good. The vet suggest that I > take the kitten back; just leave him on the doorstep, but I can't find > it in my heart to do that. I would rather spoil him and love him until > the time comes when he starts to suffer and has to be put down. > The vet suggest that I > take the kitten back; just leave him on the doorstep, but I can't find > it in my heart to do that. You need to find a new veterinarian, too. Signaturehttp://www.slywy.com/pages/hodge.html >He's doing OK - his ear infection has cleared up but his corona titer >came back today and the prognosis is not good. The vet suggest that I >take the kitten back; just leave him on the doorstep, Okay, I've gotta know which vet, 'cause if I use happen to use that vet, I'll make certain that they lose at least 7 cats worth of business. This is the Woodlands Veterinary Clinic in Calgary. Other than that, they vets I dealt with seemed very nice - this statement really surprised me. They also do animal dentistry, which leads me to a questions - is it common to have kittens' teeth pulled? The vet told me that Simon (my sick kitty) had two baby teeth that should have fallen out by now, and should be taken out because they are impeding the growth of adult of teeth. I want to know if this is true or if it's just another "cash cow". I guess I just don't trust people any more. > This is the Woodlands Veterinary Clinic in Calgary. Other than that, > they vets I dealt with seemed very nice - this statement really [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > teeth. I want to know if this is true or if it's just another "cash > cow". I guess I just don't trust people any more. Well, teeth do often need to be pulled for being bad and that helps overall health. I don't know about baby teeth not coming out being common. I do believe I've heard of it. Maybe others have some experience. >> This is the Woodlands Veterinary Clinic in Calgary. Other than that, >> they vets I dealt with seemed very nice - this statement really [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >> teeth. I want to know if this is true or if it's just another "cash >> cow". I guess I just don't trust people any more. How old is the kitty? Did they epxlain why they believe it is causing a problem? Chase actually had double fangs for about 4 months. The baby teeth finally fell out on their own. I even managed to find one of them. There were no problems at all, and I was told it was quite natural to have both sets in there at one time. So, unless there is a strange situation here, I don't see how the baby set is impeding the adult set. They come in side by side, and the old ones fall out when it is time. Signature-- Meghan & the Zoo Crew Equine and Pet Photography http://www.zoocrewphoto.com > How old is the kitty? Did they epxlain why they believe it is causing a > problem? [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > how the baby set is impeding the adult set. They come in side by side, and > the old ones fall out when it is time. I imagine it depends on the particular teeth. As a kid my front teeth came out the front of my gums. I had a "shark tooth" effect and my front teeth were angled really badly, so that I couldn't close my upper lip and had to get braces. If you have that sort of situation in a cat ... well, I don't know how far kitty orthodontics have come ... Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* >This is the Woodlands Veterinary Clinic in Calgary. Other than that, >they vets I dealt with seemed very nice - this statement really >surprised me. Ahh okay -- I've never used them, I'm up in the NW. > I just bought a ragdoll kitten for $600 from weepurrs (Phyllis > Mikesell) in Calgary. The kitten has been diagnosed with Feline [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Thanks Report her to Animal Control. Go to the shelter and adopt a cat. I really am sorry about the little one though. FIP sucks :( > I just bought a ragdoll kitten for $600 from weepurrs (Phyllis > Mikesell) in Calgary. The kitten has been diagnosed with Feline [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > unexperienced cat buyer I thought this may be normal for a cattery but > IT IS NOT! <SNIP> THAT SUCKS!!!! I'd say report the biz to the Canadian SPCA, the Better Buiseness Bureau & your local health inspector. A call from a laywer or the RCMP informing her you're intending on filing a complaint might just get your money back. Good Luck... Let us know what happens. Mathew Butler to 2 kittens: Chablis & Muscat En Vino Veritas >> I just bought a ragdoll kitten for $600 from weepurrs (Phyllis >> Mikesell) in Calgary. The kitten has been diagnosed with Feline [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> probably never see my money again. Worse, I have two children who have >> to probably put their beloved kitty to sleep. Exactly how was this kitten diagnosed with FIP? FIP is very difficult to diagnose, and the majority of cats diagnosed with FIP do not have it. If the vet is just going on the basis of the so-called FIP test, that actually only indicates exposure to the feline coronavirus. In a few cats, the coronavirus will mutate into FIP, but most cats that test "positive" (a high titer) for FIP do not have it and never develop it. If the kitten is not currently sick but just has a high titer, it's unlikely he will develop FIP. I would also question how the diagnosis of FIP was arrived at with the mother, if she is in good health. There were extremely high levels of total protein in his blood, and his health is generally poor. (Gingivitis, ear infection, sneezing and sleeping all the time.) We are still waiting for the results from the corona titre. He will not be put down until he shows true symptoms of FIP, if he is still in my care. In the meantime, I have to keep him away from my other healthy cat so that she doesn't get infected. I didn't see the cattery nor the parents, (this was all in the basement of the house) but the stench of cat urine was overpowering when I visited her home, and the vet agrees that this indicates poor health practices to begin with. I have no way of knowing whether the mother has FIP (because I can't contact the breeder), but the vet thinks that's probably where he got it. Another reason that I believe that cat is probably sick with this disease is that the cattery owner has not returned my calls. I would guess that this is not the first time this has happened to her and her "hiding" from me shows that she doesn't care about the cats or her clients. It is appalling to me that such a devious person is not just caring for animals, but is also a mother herself. Her daughter has been answering the phone and just keeps telling me her mom is not there and she doesn't know when she will return. Great life lesson for a little girl. >I didn't see the cattery nor the parents, (this was all in the basement >of the house) but the stench of cat urine was overpowering when I [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >she doesn't know when she will return. Great life lesson for a little >girl. This is a kitten mill. Please, please e-mail me the name and address and I will make some phone calls to see if I can get a local Humane Society to send their abuse team to investigate. I won't mention your name. Sherry > This is a kitten mill. Please, please e-mail me the name and address and I > will [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Sherry Sherry, here it is, she posted it before. Oh wait, it was just the name, but it's a start. Weepurrs in Calgary. I hope someone can get their fast. If this woman feels she's in danger of being found out, she may start getting rid of the cats/kittens. Having them put down, releasing them in different areas. Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net "Wake up, and smell the cat food" -TMBG > This is a kitten mill. Please, please e-mail me the name and address and I > will [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Sherry Me again. She has a website, it's www.weepurrs.com Doesn't list the address though. Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net "Wake up, and smell the cat food" -TMBG >> This is a kitten mill. Please, please e-mail me the name and address >> and I will [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > kelly at farringtons dot net > "Wake up, and smell the cat food" -TMBG Do you one better than this: http://www.catterysearch.com/show_cattery.asp?ID=9132 Gives name, address & phone #. And I agree, the OP *should* contact the local SPCA & alert them to the smell of the place. Also mention that you bought a cat from them (although you have no proof) that has been diagnosed with FIP. --? The ONE and ONLY lefthanded-pathetic-paranoid-psychotic-sarcastic-wiseass-ditzy former-blonde in Bloomington! (And proud of it, too)? email me at nalee1964 (at) insightbb (dot) com http://community.webshots.com/user/mgcmdjeep >> This is a kitten mill. Please, please e-mail me the name and address and I >> will [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Me again. She has a website, it's www.weepurrs.com Doesn't list the address >though. Thanks, Kelly. Usenet access via AOL is screwed up right now. I haven't been able to read this entire thread, and didn't realize the cattery was in Canada. After re-reading the post and looking at the website, it's probably not a full-fledged kitten mill, but a bad backyard breeder. Not a lot of difference as far as the cat's welfare though. I don't have a clue about Canadian practices regarding animal welfare investigations. I still think the woman needs to be investigated. She has something to hide, or she would have gladly shown off her entire brood to the buyer. Sherry >>> This is a kitten mill. Please, please e-mail me the name and address and I >>> will make some phone calls to see if I can get a local Humane Society to [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > the woman needs to be investigated. She has something to hide, or she would > have gladly shown off her entire brood to the buyer. Sherry A whois on their domain turns this up; a good place to start. Was the seller's name Phyllis? Registrant: Weepurrs 128 Valley Meadow Close N.W. Calgary, Alberta T3B-5M2 CA Domain name: WEEPURRS.COM Administrative Contact: Mikesell, Phyllis weepurrs@telus.net 128 Valley Meadow Close N.W. Calgary, Alberta T3B-5M2 CA +1.4032867911 Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* Yes, her name is Phyllis. I will provide phone numbers for her later. She has an ad in the Calgary Herald advertising her kittens. She just recently started advertising bengals too. I have the bengal breeders in Calgary investigating that. Sherry, what is the difference between a back yard breeder and a kitten mill? This situations sure sounds like a bit of both Beverley >Sherry, what is the difference between a back yard breeder and a kitten >mill? This situations sure sounds like a bit of both > >Beverley Backyard breeders are generally just a family with a couple of queens who think it's a cool way to make extra money and breed & sell kittens with no regard for vet care, genetics, spay/neuter contracts, etc. Most common are Persian and old-fashioned Siamese. A kitten mill is a serious breeding operation, with sometimes hundreds of breeding "stock" that spend their entire lives in cages producing kittens until they're worn out. They wholesale and ship kittens (that's where most pet stores get their kittens), and they'll advertise in the newspaper, but won't let you see the premises. They'll offer to meet you at a mall parking lot or something and bring the kittens. I wish I had a picture on this computer to show you of the one we busted several years ago. Here is one of a puppy mill, a couple years ago, where we seized over 200 dogs. It's pretty much the same scenario, same environment, as cats usually are. http://members.aol.com/gladyss5/pupmill.jpg Sherry >mall parking lot or something and bring the kittens. I wish I had a picture on >this computer to show you of the one we busted several years ago. Here is one >of a puppy mill, a couple years ago, where we seized over 200 dogs. It's pretty >much the same scenario, same environment, as cats usually are. >http://members.aol.com/gladyss5/pupmill.jpg We got a rescued sheltie that used to be a breeder in a puppy mill. They gave her free to a guy who was happy to get a free sheltie that could breed. But she wasn't housebrooken, quite spooky, and had major anxiety issues. After a month with her peeing and pooping all over the house and chewing up everything, he called the local sheltie rescue and told them theyhad one day to get her or she was going to the pound. The rescue lady knew we were looking for another sheltie, so she called us, and we adopted her that night. It took some work, but she was a great dog. But! This dog had major mental and health issues. You could tell the size of her cage by her circular pacing. She could run circles. Always the same size. We had her for several years before she had to put down - recurrant bladder cancer after multiple bladder infections. She never did become a normal dog. Also, the puppy mill said she was only 6 when they gave her to the guy, but she had grey on her muzzle that wasn't just her color pattern. She acted older than her stated age, and was probably much older than that. The puppy mill had no regard for her health or mental state. My other rescued sheltie was from a backyard breeder. She was being saved as a breeder dog even though she was too tiny, and really only fit the ideal for the breed in terms of smarts and temperment. She had prick ears, short poofy coat rather than the typical sheltie coat, no great conformation. She also has an enlarged heart and poor eyesight. She was not breeder quality, but they planned to breed her. And kept her in horrible conditions. Outdoor kennel, never socialized. And abused by their kid. She is doing much better, and is still in good health, but she is losing her sight, and she is reverting back to the spooky dog she once was. The breeder did her no favors either. I have been on both sides of this issue, I have had dogs come from abusive situations. I also received all 3 of my own cats from my mother, and she was a backyard breeder until I convinced her to stop. So, I know what it is like to be on that side of the fence and I know that my mom believed she was a good breeder, even though I now know she was quite ignornant. I have been very lucky with my own cats, and even more so after getting Kira. In fact, Kira is the reason I convinced my mom to stop breeding. Two reasons. One, Kira was from our own male and female. The male was always a bit neurotic. And the female was fine before, but turned into a terror afterward. She was the one who started attacking Maynard because he cried and ran away when he saw the kittens. When my mom gave me Kira, it was with the understanding that somebody Kira would be bred. I didn't think much of it at the time. But it really scared me to think that Kira could end up being the same way after having kittens. And if Kira went after Maynard, what could I do? How could I possibly choose between the two of them. So, that was my main reason. But looking into the situation, I learned more about responsible breeders and the health checks they do as well as checking for genetic problems and that is when I came up with the second reason, and the one that convinced my mom. Without doing checks, we have no idea what genetic issues lurk beneath the surface. And Kira is the perfect example. She is a balinese from two siamese. Both her parents, unknown to us, carried the long hair recessive gene. And she got it from both sides. What if that had been some other gene, one that caused a health problem? We would have no way of knowing. And looking back, we know of two other kittens that were long haired. One went to a friend of my sister's so we heard about that one later. And I can't remember how we found out about the other one. But basically, we had no idea we had been breeding them all along. Obviously, our female, and the tomcats we had chosen all carried the gene. We were lucky, but we were risking problems. So, while I come from a background of believing that backyard breeding was okay, I don't believe that way anymore. Signature-- Meghan & the Zoo Crew Equine and Pet Photography http://www.zoocrewphoto.com So, while I come from a background of believing that backyard breeding was okay, I don't believe that way anymore. Wow, quite the stories. I knew something wasn't quite "right" when I talked to the lady on the phone. She was very defensive and seemed "jumpy". I should have followed my instincts and never gone over there... but you know how your cat "picks" you? Well, Simon immediately responded to me in a way he hasn't with other people, so I know that I was meant to be his. I think I am giving him the best chance that anyone would have, and he has brought so much love into our house. I received an email today from a lady who read my posting here. She also bought a ragdoll from this same woman, and this cat is also unhealthy, although I don't think he has been diagnosed with FIP. I am looking forward to talking more to this woman and hopefully this will help even further in putting the "evil cat lady" (as my kids call her) out of business. The fact that she has so slyly avoided my calls and emails tells me that she is NOT one of the "innocent" backyard breeders but instead someone who consciously exploits people and animals for her own benefit. If anyone else has bought a cat from this woman, please contact me at liesl@shaw.ca. I would like to hear from you. Unfortunately Sherry in Persians we have what I would call "BYB Kitten Mills" then. Persian breeders who have acquired cheaply sometimes free persians with good pedigrees and just pump out those poor little kitties for money. Never go to a show or if they do, it's seldom, are rather dirty with the kitties but it's mainly the way they breed, litter after litter after litter so they are either breeding their females to often or they have a lot of females :)) No matter what, the money is what is important to them and we have a couple in the state of CA that just support themselves from this income or they get their extra money this way. It's sick Beverley Unfortunately Sherry in Persians we have what I would call "BYB Kitten Mills" then. Persian breeders who have acquired cheaply sometimes free persians with good pedigrees and just pump out those poor little kitties for money. Never go to a show or if they do, it's seldom, are rather dirty with the kitties but it's mainly the way they breed, litter after litter after litter so they are either breeding their females to often or they have a lot of females :)) No matter what, the money is what is important to them and we have a couple in the state of CA that just support themselves from this income or they get their extra money this way. It's sick Beverley This breeder (Phyllis Mikesell) has been caught by one of our local breeders associations cross-breeding Himalyans with Ragdolls and then selling the kittens as prebred Himalayans. What just floors me is that this woman is still registered with TICA. I complained to them and they sent me a formal complaint form to fill out, along with a $50 fee which I think is ludicrous! How is that going to encourage people to report wrongdoings? I am lucky to be able to afford it and you're damn right I'm going after her regardless of the cost, but how many others has she ripped off and WHY aren't the local breeders standing by me?! I just found out that the breeder in question (Phyllis Mikesell) has TWELVE breeding cats in a basement that can't be more than 1000 square feet. No wonder her kittens are sick! >What just floors me is that this woman is still registered with TICA. I >complained to them and they sent me a formal complaint form to fill [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >cost, but how many others has she ripped off and WHY aren't the local >breeders standing by me?! Do either of the registries require any health minimums? I found with horse registries that many of them really don't give a damn about the quality of the horses, or even if they have good health and temperment, as long as the owners pay the registration fees. So, I suspect TICA charges that $50 compaint fee because they know they will lose registration fees if they ban a breeder. It's really too bad that the registries are not willing to take a stand and require some minimums, other than registered parents. Signature-- Meghan & the Zoo Crew Equine and Pet Photography http://www.zoocrewphoto.com Meghan You hit the nail on the head for the registries, it's all about money. They refuse to get into most things and their standard line is "we are just a purebred registry" Beverley For what it is worth, CFA used to have a $100 protest fee and dropped it. If you are to lodge a protest against a breeder for this kind of thing you have to have all of your ducks in a row to prove it If she registers in CFA I would lodge a protest in CFA for animal cruelty and in TICA I would go to the agricultural department in the Province as well as Agriculture Canada. "WHY aren't the local breeders standing by me?!" That is a really good question, I would suspect they fear retaliation !! Beverley > > This is a kitten mill. Please, please e-mail me the name and address and I > > will [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Me again. She has a website, it's www.weepurrs.com Doesn't list the address > though. Cats (12/22/04) PUREBRED RAGDOLL KITTENS Also Bengals, Reg'd, vaccinated. weepurrs.com Call 827-2684 Calgary Herald, Area Code 403 Such a cute name, too . . . Signaturehttp://www.slywy.com/ Thank you so much for offering to help, Sherry. I have her address at home and will email it to you this afternoon. She lives in the northwest of Calgary. Her name is Phyllis Mikesell and the cattery is called Weepurrs, as mentioned later in this thread. Her web site is deceivingly professional, NOTHING like her home. I have saved an .html copy of her page mentioning the health guarantee, etc. in case she wipes that out if this goes to litigation. The smell was so bad that I could smell if outside. I wonder if her neighbours have ever complained. I just feel so stupid for ever buying a kitten from her, but if this saves other cats or people from going through the same thing, it was worth it. > There were extremely high levels of total protein in his blood, and his > health is generally poor. (Gingivitis, ear infection, sneezing and [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > has FIP (because I can't contact the breeder), but the vet thinks > that's probably where he got it. [snip] I thoroughly checked out the breeder I got my two Burmese kittens from, including a home visit before returning to pick up the kittens. The place was spotless and clean smelling; kittens & adult females looked healthy; adult males were kept separate in a clean outdoor enclosure; I got a written health guarantee - and yet my two kittens were diagnosed with FeLV. (The breeder later discovered a new stud was carrying the virus.) Unlike your experience, my breeder has not hidden from me, and has acknowledged her debt. She hasn't gotten around to a refund, but has promised one and I'm willing to wait. She took quite a hit for her negligence (taking someone else's word that the stud was healthy rather than testing him herself) and appears to be doing her best to ensure it never happens again. I agree that the conditions in your breeder's home, as well as the lack of any written guarantee, should have been a warning. A hard lesson to learn. But appearances aren't everything, either, as my experience (above) shows. And even the best shelters can make mistakes. I guess my point is don't be too turned off about breeders based on one lousy experience, or assume all shelters that look good are going to give you a positive experience. I've gotten kittens from breeders (and taken in strays) since the 1960s, and this is the very first time I've ever had a serious health problem with a cat that wasn't genetic (epilepsy in my first Burmese). All my cats (excluding the current ones: the two FeLV+ kittens who live separate from the three healthy 4 year olds) lived to be seniors - including the epileptic Burmese. Good luck with your kitten, and you're being wonderful to try to do the best for the cat. Gail Happily owned by: Lao Ma, Ephiny, Minya, Mattie & Harry >There were extremely high levels of total protein in his blood, Elevated total serum protein is seen in many illnesses, including calci virus and upper respiratory diseases. I'm not saying it's not FIP, but that usually it's not. and his >health is generally poor. (Gingivitis, ear infection, sneezing and >sleeping all the time.) High fever that doesn't respond to antibiotics? That is another indicator of FIP. The other symptoms you mention could be an upper respiratory illness or a generally depressed immune system, as with FeLV. This is why FIP is so hard to diagnose--the symptoms are usually all non-specific. We are still waiting for the results from the >corona titre. He will not be put down until he shows true symptoms of >FIP, if he is still in my care. In the meantime, I have to keep him [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >has FIP (because I can't contact the breeder), but the vet thinks >that's probably where he got it. Once cats develop FIP, they die pretty quickly so that's why I wonder about the mother, whether she would even still be alive. Likely the kitten was exposed to the feline coronavirus from the mother or other cats in the cattery, but as I mentioned, the coronavirus mutates into FIP only rarely. >Another reason that I believe that cat is probably sick with this >disease is that the cattery owner has not returned my calls. I would [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >she doesn't know when she will return. Great life lesson for a little >girl. It is irresponsible of the breeder not to return your calls and discuss the matter if she gave you a one year health guarantee (although frankly, one year sounds like quite a long time to offer to guarantee a kitten's health.) Can you pay her a visit since she won't return your calls? However, even with the health guarantee, what is it you would like her to do? Usually that means the breeder will replace the kitten--is that what you want? I realize you didn't know this when buying a kitten for the first time, but it's up to the buyer to do research on what constitutes a good breeder/cattery. You certainly want to visit the cattery and see for yourself how the cats are kept--are they all in cages or mostly underfoot? Are they skittish or well-socialized? If you have any doubts, take your time and visit several catteries, or better yet, go to cat shows so you can meet the breeders and talk to them. As for FIP, when breeders say their catteries are FIP free, you want to find out what that means. It might mean they've never had a case of FIP, but it could also mean that all their cats have zero titers for the feline coronavirus (this can be hard to achieve sometimes in a cattery, however). If a cat is never exposed to the coronavirus, it cannot ever develop FIP. I definitely don't want another cat from this breeder. I spoke with the SPCA and two cat breeders associations here in Calgary a little while ago. The SPCA has been called to this woman's house several times, and every time they go, it is spotless, so they don't want to go again, although they admit that they are sure something is going on there. The cat breeders have also heard of her. Apparently she was cross-breeding ragdolls with himalayans and then selling the himalayans as purebreds. So it seems that Phyllis Mikesell is truly a devious, dishonest, horrible person, but nobody can do anything about it. All we can do is spread the word and make sure that nobody buys from her again. I do happen to know her husband's name and where he works... I wonder if he knows what she is up to. Does anyone know how to post a web site that might come up if anyone searches "weepurrs"? I would like to tell this story and maybe prevent someone from buying from her. My next stop is the Better Business Bureau. <SNIP> > My next stop is the Better Business Bureau. Don't foreget the health inspector!!!! They like to make suprise visits. ;-) SignatureMathew Butler to 2 kittens: Chablis & Muscat En Vino Veritas >I definitely don't want another cat from this breeder. > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > horrible person, but nobody can do anything about it. All we can do is > spread the word and make sure that nobody buys from her again. Ugh.. that's too bad. Do they come over unexpected? What if they set up a fake "buy"? Had someone pretend to be interested in a kitten? How about contacting a local TV station's consumer reporter? > Does anyone know how to post a web site that might come up if anyone > searches "weepurrs"? I would like to tell this story and maybe prevent > someone from buying from her. > My next stop is the Better Business Bureau. Sure. If you made a website, got a domain such as "weepurrssucks.com", and used the words "wee purrs" in the text of the website, it will show up on Google. It takes a while, sometimes a few weeks to a month before Google realizes a new website is out there. You can also use some tools on Google to help them recognize your site and know what it's about. I think you could even check out Google Ads, the listings that pop up on the right, to guarantee that it comes up. I think you should contact the BBB. Someone needs to stop this woman. Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net "Wake up, and smell the cat food" -TMBG Great advise, thanks. I have formally filed a complaint with the BBB already - we'll see if that does anything. She had no prior complaints against her, surprisingly enough. I wish more people would strike back when something like this happens to them, especially when there are defenseless animals involved. > Great advise, thanks. > > I have formally filed a complaint with the BBB already - we'll see if that > does anything. She had no prior complaints against her, surprisingly enough. > I wish more people would strike back when something like this happens to > them, especially when there are defenseless animals involved. My experience with the BBB is that their only interest is in getting the two parties to communicate. They really don't care about the specifics. Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* >> Does anyone know how to post a web site that might come up if anyone >> searches "weepurrs"? I would like to tell this story and maybe prevent [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > guarantee that it comes up. I think you should contact the BBB. Someone > needs to stop this woman. Be careful with this. I had a negative experience with a business and consulted a lawyer. Once you've made public claims about a business, you need to be very sure that you have the facts to back it up, or you can be in a world-of-hurt lawsuit over loss of income, libel/slander, etc. I am not a lawyer, but the lawyer I consulted did tell me not to go that route. (I was thinking of handing out flyers in front of the business, putting up a webpage, etc.) Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* Nobody has mentioned contacting CFA or TICA depending on which organization she registers her cats in. Both organizations I believe would be very interested or should be. I find it inexcusable that the SPCA do not want to go back especially if there is proof that this woman is breeding and selling sick animals, that is animal abuse. Beverley > I just bought a ragdoll kitten for $600 from weepurrs (Phyllis > Mikesell) in Calgary. The kitten has been diagnosed with Feline > Infectious Peritonitis, which he got from his mother and will kill him. Sorry to hear that. > The breeder has a one year health guarantee but has refused to return > any of my calls. The vet says he sees this all the time and that I will > probably never see my money again. Worse, I have two children who have > to probably put their beloved kitty to sleep. Darn. > Her house smelled TERRIBLE when I picked up the cat. Being an > unexperienced cat buyer I thought this may be normal for a cattery but > IT IS NOT! It *isn't*??? Because when I picked up Mico from the breeder, I couldn't let go of how bad her house smelled. But I thought that was just normal, I mean un-neutered males *have* to spray to mark their territory, and that's difficult to control, right? > Please do not make the same mistake I made. If you have a bad feeling > about the breeder, walk away. > And DO NOT buy a cat from this cattery. Sorry you had such a bad experience. - Ruby Tuesday > Thanks >> Her house smelled TERRIBLE when I picked up the cat. Being an >> unexperienced cat buyer I thought this may be normal for a cattery but [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >mean un-neutered males *have* to spray to mark their territory, and that's >difficult to control, right? It isn't at all normal. While intact males do spray, this is why responsible breeders who keep males have special rooms for them that are easily cleaned -- and cleaned daily. Some males are confident enough that they do not spray, and thus are allowed to roam the house (wearing stud pants). But either way, a responsible breeder's house should not smell overpoweringly of cats. Orchid See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid > >> Her house smelled TERRIBLE when I picked up the cat. Being an > >> unexperienced cat buyer I thought this may be normal for a cattery but [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > the house (wearing stud pants). But either way, a responsible > breeder's house should not smell overpoweringly of cats. Well then, I'll consider myself lucky that Mico was healthy when I got him. I'll be on the lookout should I be in that situation again. Thanks for the info. - Ruby Tuesday > Orchid > See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage > Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid > Some males are confident enough that they do not spray, and thus are > allowed to roam the house (wearing stud pants). Am I the only one who got a mental image of a cat strutting about in tight leather chaps here? Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* >> Some males are confident enough that they do not spray, and thus are >> allowed to roam the house (wearing stud pants). > >Am I the only one who got a mental image of a cat strutting about in tight >leather chaps here? No, I had envisioned tight disco-style polyester bell bottoms ala John Travolta/Saturday Night Fever. That evolved into the plaid bell bottoms of the Festrunk brothers/SNL. I even pictured a cat in these pants doing the "wild and crazy guys" strut. Never once did it evolve into leather chaps. Until now. L. >>> Some males are confident enough that they do not spray, and thus are >>> allowed to roam the house (wearing stud pants). [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > "wild and crazy guys" strut. Never once did it evolve into leather chaps. > Until now. *grin* Okay, I had to look them up. Apparently, "stud pants" don't look very studly: http://www.canvasbackpets.com/ShopSite/product779.html ... especially with a name like "Hygienic Panty" I don't quite understand the use, as I suppose they need to be removed at some point to let the cat actually eliminate ... Honestly, the more I learn about unaltered pets, the less I understand why anyone would want to deal with the hassle. And that's aside from the whole "too many unwanted pets" issue. Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* >Okay, I had to look them up. Apparently, "stud pants" don't look very studly: No, they're not exactly the most butch thing out there. :D >... especially with a name like "Hygienic Panty" Or 'Bitches Brtiches'. *BFG* >I don't quite understand the use, as I suppose they need to be removed at some >point to let the cat actually eliminate ... It means that a stud cat can have some time interacting with the household as a whole and not just be in a stud room. It's a quality of life issue, and one that most breeders spend a lot of time thinking about -- how long to keep a male intact, etc. >Honestly, the more I learn about unaltered pets, the less I understand why >anyone would want to deal with the hassle. And that's aside from the whole >"too many unwanted pets" issue. Well, with dogs it's because dogs must be intact to show -- the AKC takes the stand that the point of showing is to determine breedworthiness, and an altered dog cannot be bred. For cats, it's because if someone didn't keep the studs and queens the various breeds of cats would die out. I personally think that we would be the poorer for the lack of the responsibly bred purebred cat, but I know that others disagree. Orchid See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid >>I don't quite understand the use, as I suppose they need to be removed at >>some point to let the cat actually eliminate ... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > and one that most breeders spend a lot of time thinking about -- how long > to keep a male intact, etc. Okay, that makes sense. It's good to know that (some, anyway) breeders are concerned about this. How long to keep him intact? Do breeders snip their stud animals after they're done breeding them? And why would they be done breeding them? >>Honestly, the more I learn about unaltered pets, the less I understand why >>anyone would want to deal with the hassle. And that's aside from the whole [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > personally think that we would be the poorer for the lack of the > responsibly bred purebred cat, but I know that others disagree. Well, those arguments have been hashed and rehashed a thousand times. I just wish that a lot of animals didn't have to suffer through some nasty physical characteristics just to accentuate a supposedly positive breed trait. Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* >Okay, that makes sense. It's good to know that (some, anyway) breeders >are concerned about this. > >How long to keep him intact? Do breeders snip their stud animals after >they're done breeding them? And why would they be done breeding them? Yep. A stud cat's 'career' is generally only 3-4 years, and then they are neutered and placed into pet homes (or kept as a pet by the breeder). And for why they are done breeding them, you have to understand the goal of a responsible breeder. A responsible breeder breeds to improve the breed and to act as a caretaker for it. Part of being a good caretaker is taking genetic diversity and population into account. The reason to breed a stud is in the hopes that he will throw a kitten that is as good as he is or better. When a stud throws that kitten that is better than he is, most breeders will keep that kitten and then neuter the stud -- he has done his job and there's a new 'best' for breeding the best to the best. If a stud has not thrown a kitten as good or better than he in a certain number of litters (usually five at the most), then it's decided that he's probably not going to, and he's neutered because he doesn't pass on his good traits. >Well, those arguments have been hashed and rehashed a thousand times. I just >wish that a lot of animals didn't have to suffer through some nasty physical >characteristics just to accentuate a supposedly positive breed trait. I think that the majority of breeds don't have to suffer through nasty physical characteristics. There are a few, yes, but most do not. Orchid See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid > Yep. A stud cat's 'career' is generally only 3-4 years, and then they are > neutered and placed into pet homes (or kept as a pet by the breeder). And [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > probably not going to, and he's neutered because he doesn't pass on his > good traits. Thanks for explaining this. >>Well, those arguments have been hashed and rehashed a thousand times. I >>just wish that a lot of animals didn't have to suffer through some nasty [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I think that the majority of breeds don't have to suffer through nasty > physical characteristics. There are a few, yes, but most do not. A few breeds; a lot of cats. Just a few in percentage points, but still too many as far as I'm concerned. But then, I've already said that I have trouble distinguishing one cat breed from another. They're all just "cats" as far as I'm concerned. Now, if you asked me how I felt about dog breeds, I might have a different answer. But I doubt I'd ever buy a dog from a breeder, anyway, both because plenty of shelter pups need homes and because I'd be worried about the hip problems in many of my favorite breeds. Signaturemonique, roommate of Oscar the (female) grouch ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eros was adopted! Eros has a home now! *cheer!* Sorry to hear about your kitty. A "cattery" situation should not smell at all. And nobody should buy from this kind of a situation. I would suggest that you contact the Agricultural Department in the Province of Calgary and Agriculture Canada and inform them of this situation, and if you have a contract definitely sue her and don't forget the emotional stress that it is going to put your children, to have a loving pet put to sleep because of her irresponsibility. You may never see your money but they may put her out of business, this is inexcusable and breeders like this should be stopped, this gives good breeders a bad name. Beverley I'm was happy to see this thread appear on Google last night. I purchased a Ragdoll from this breeder just a few months ago - possibly a litter mate of your kitten - and was disgusted by the stench as well. Phyllis had an explanation for the smell, saying that the keeper she had hired while on vacation hadn't done the job properly. The next couple of visits were noticeably better, but I still could not have lived in that house. My eyes watered from the smell. My kitten was vet checked immediately after bringing him home, just to be safe. He had an upper respiratory infection, which the vet explained was very common in catteries, but that it wasn't bad enough to warrant medicating. Two months later he was still sneezing at times so I took him in for another vet check. At this point he still had an upper respiratory infection as well as a mouth infection. Could be teething, could be as a result of the lingering URI, but she did give me medication at this point. He does wheeze if he's been playing in the dusty basement, but it's short-lived and the vet feels it's likely just a sensitivity to the dust that unfinished basements are common for - either that or it could be feline asthma. She stated it was common in Rags. I know my kitten doesn't have a fever and has no signs of diarrhea. I've tried to search out the symptoms of FIV, because this thread has made me very nervous, but I don't honestly think my kitten has this virus. On the other hand, I know Phyllis is very hard to reach. Her personal life is a mess (apparently) and she spends very little time at home in the evenings. I've always approached her in a friendly manner and she's been more than happy to answer my questions - even when I was very direct. She's an American citizen and I don't think she wants to rock the boat here in Canada. A criminal charge could mean deportation. If you're interested in having her cell number, I can provide it, but not online. I would be careful about slandering this breeder online. Although I agree with all of the comments here and feel that this breeder doesn't deserve to be in the business if she's not going to stand behind her contracts, I think it's something that the local authorities should deal with. The SPCA is aware of her, since she's a cattery, but I don't know if they have any idea how large her operation is. She has 12 breeding cats, continual litters of kittens, but is registered through TICA and the CFC and seems to be a legitimate cattery. I contacted TICA about the conditions of her home (the smell of urine), out of concern, but they're not interested in getting involved at all. Apparently they're not concerned about the state of catteries that are registered with them, which surprised me. I spent a lot of time researching cats before buying mine. Rather than buying a purebred dog, I decided to buy a registered cat. I've given a home to strays and rescued cats over the years, but this time I wanted to choose the colour, breed and personality of my cat so I felt justified in going through a breeder. If I'm going to live with him for up to 20 years, I was going to be picky this time. But I have to confess that, after giving her a deposit and really getting a bad feeling about dealing with her, I decided that I had to 'save' this kitten from the environment he lived in. Not a good idea. I've since realized that all I've done is contributed to her continued business. I would suggest that, if calling the SPCA doesn't work, trying calling child welfare to see if they approve of children living in that kind of environment or go to a more national level, maybe the WSPA? No doubt the neighbours are fed up, you can smell the stench from the sidewalk. Maybe approach them to see if they would sign a petition. The squeaky wheel gets the grease! But I would think that your personal situation is more likely to be dealt with in small claims court than through the SPCA. If they aren't concerned about the animals that live in that house, maybe the court will at least be concerned about your well-being! Good luck! I hope your kitty is going to be fine. Please email me at this address if you have also had any experience dealing with Phyllis Mikesell at Weepurrs Cattery. I am going to have something done to shut down this business. I had a bad experience as well but want to remain anonymous for now. catloverforever8@yahoo.ca >I just bought a ragdoll kitten for $600 from weepurrs (Phyllis >Mikesell) in Calgary. The kitten has been diagnosed with Feline [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > >Thanks |
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