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Laser-Pens: Cat/Dog Exercise Danger

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Tales of Orpheus - 23 Nov 2004 21:56 GMT
Hello Everyone,

I have seen a number of articles and websites recently where the
laser-pen has been extolled as a great way of exercising cats or dogs
(you stay stationary and shine the "light" around the room, and the
animal rushes round in a frenzy of delight after the bright red dot).

It's a brilliant idea, but unfortunately in the rapidity of movement and
the excitement of the cat or dog, it's more than possible that the beam
will hit the animal's retina and even though that they may occur for
only a second or so, repeated exposures can cause serious damage to a
pet's eyesight.

Better to stick with a tickler dangling from a piece of elastic on the
end of a long cane.

Thomas.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Laser pen abusers to get long prison terms

The pens look innocent but can cause serious eye damage.
UK Home Secretary, Jack Straw, has warned that people found guilty of
using laser pens to cause injury, can expect up to five years in prison.

His statement comes after three Hampshire police officers were seriously
injured when a beam temporarily blinded them.

They join many others who have fallen victim to a device that experts
say is too dangerous to be used by the untrained.

The pens look innocuous but in the wrong hands they are dangerous
weapons. Pressing a button releases a thin but powerful laser beam with
a range of up to 200ft (61m).

The pens are intended as a replacement for the old-fashioned pointing
sticks used by lecturers. But increasingly they are being abused.

When shone directly into the eyes, the effect is temporary blindness or
even more permanent eye damage.


Patrick Rafter recovers after being hit by a laser

At the Paris Indoor Tennis Open two weeks ago, the Australian Patrick
Rafter became a victim. A laser beam shone by a spectator was directed
at the player's face. The game had to be halted while he recovered.

Other sportsmen and pop stars have been targetted too.

In South Yorkshire one bus company has recorded 32 separate incidents in
the past month. Drivers say they have been picked out by people intent
on causing an accident.

Dr Ajoy Kar, a physicist from Heriott-Watt University who specialises in
lasers, has tested those on sale in Britain - some for as little as Ł15.
Of 43 studied, only five met safety standards with beams of less than
one milliwatt. But even those which conform to standard could still
cause serious harm.

"A laser pen is a hundred million times brighter than a television
screen, it's like staring at the sun," he said.

Trading standards officers have been told to remove from sale laser pens
which do not meet safety standards but there is to be no complete ban.
The UK Home Office says people who use lasers as weapons or intend to
cause injury can already be imprisoned.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/29333.stm
Steve G - 23 Nov 2004 22:13 GMT
> Hello Everyone,

Hello.

(...)

> It's a brilliant idea, but unfortunately in the rapidity of movement and
> the excitement of the cat or dog, it's more than possible that the beam
> will hit the animal's retina and even though that they may occur for
> only a second or so, repeated exposures can cause serious damage to a
> pet's eyesight.

Nope, 1) the beam is projected onto the floor (typically) and it's
exceptionally unlikely that the cat will look along the axis of the
beam, 2) the beam is in motion, and rapid movement of the dot across
the eye is harmless. Repeated exposures are also harmless, as long as
they aren't occurring in rapid succession. As long as the human isn't a
complete pickle brain, a laser pointer is a safe cat toy.

> Better to stick with a tickler dangling from a piece of elastic on the
> end of a long cane.

Sure, if you are going to stand there and attempt to burn a hole in
your cat's retina. Otherwise, a laser pointer is entirely safe.

(...)

> They join many others who have fallen victim to a device that experts
> say is too dangerous to be used by the untrained.

Untrained? Bwahahahaha.

> The pens look innocuous but in the wrong hands they are dangerous
> weapons. Pressing a button releases a thin but powerful laser beam with
> a range of up to 200ft (61m).

'Thin but powerful'. Man, I love sensationalist journalism.

(...)

> At the Paris Indoor Tennis Open two weeks ago, the Australian Patrick
> Rafter became a victim. A laser beam shone by a spectator was directed
> at the player's face. The game had to be halted while he recovered.

He recovered.

(...)
> one milliwatt. But even those which conform to standard could still
> cause serious harm.
Yeah, someone might accidentally swallow one.

Steve.
---MIKE--- - 23 Nov 2004 23:17 GMT
I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be fooled by
it.  Tiger chased the spot a few times but quickly learned that it was
not something he could catch.  Neither cat is interested now.

                 ---MIKE---
Mary - 23 Nov 2004 23:40 GMT
> I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be fooled by
> it.  Tiger chased the spot a few times but quickly learned that it was
> not something he could catch.

Well THAT is because you didn't play with it right! You have to make
it disappear about every fourth time they chase it, just when their paw
comes down on it! ;)
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 01:04 GMT
> I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be fooled by
> it.  Tiger chased the spot a few times but quickly learned that it was
> not something he could catch.  Neither cat is interested now.

I had the same problem.  At the beginning my girls went nuts over it, then
they became bored with it and probably frustrated.

Then I found this:

http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/Jade+APMouse.jpg  (Jade waiting for it too
move)

Its a radio-controlled mouse with a range of about 30'.  They *love* this
toy!  When I make the mouse go under furniture, they hunch down, wiggle
their little butts and get ready to pounce on it.  The best part about the
mouse is they can actually catch it if their fast enough!  If they lift
their paw, hit the forward button and mouse "runs" away - like the real
thing.

My girls have so much fun with it, I bought another one.  The mice are on
the same frequency so you can use one controller.   They're cheap, about $20
from the Animal Planet.

Phil
Sherry - 24 Nov 2004 01:52 GMT
>My girls have so much fun with it, I bought another one.  The mice are on
>the same frequency so you can use one controller.   They're cheap, about $20
>from the Animal Planet.
>
>Phil

Ha! That looks *fun*. Does it roll well on carpet, or do you have to stay on a
hard surface?

Sherry
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 02:40 GMT
> >My girls have so much fun with it, I bought another one.  The mice are on
> >the same frequency so you can use one controller.   They're cheap, about $20
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Ha! That looks *fun*. Does it roll well on carpet, or do you have to stay on a
> hard surface?

The wheels are tiny so if you have a deep pile carpet the wheels may get
stuck - especially the front wheels since they turn. I have a very thin
oriental area rug in one room and the mouse works fine on that but it works
better on hardwood or linoleum.

The batteries (3 AA) go in the controller, not the mouse.  You charge the
mouse for 60 secs and it runs for about 10 minutes.

Here's another shot of Jade sleeping next to it!  She loves the thing!

http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/Jade+APMouse-2.jpg

Phil
Yngver - 24 Nov 2004 16:16 GMT
>The wheels are tiny so if you have a deep pile carpet the wheels may get
>stuck - especially the front wheels since they turn. I have a very thin
>oriental area rug in one room and the mouse works fine on that but it works
>better on hardwood or linoleum.

Does it make a lot of noise though, especially on hardwood floors? Our cats
have rejected many an automated toy because they don't like noisy ones. They
just sat and stared at the Cy-purr Mouse, although it broke as soon as it got
on the carpeted area anyway. That's the one that's activated by a motion
sensor.

>The batteries (3 AA) go in the controller, not the mouse.  You charge the
>mouse for 60 secs and it runs for about 10 minutes.
>
>Here's another shot of Jade sleeping next to it!  She loves the thing!
>
>http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/Jade+APMouse-2.jpg

She sure seems to!!!
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 17:22 GMT
> >The wheels are tiny so if you have a deep pile carpet the wheels may get
> >stuck - especially the front wheels since they turn. I have a very thin
> >oriental area rug in one room and the mouse works fine on that but it works
> >better on hardwood or linoleum.
>
> Does it make a lot of noise though, especially on hardwood floors?

It makes a buzz but not loud at all. The motor is smaller than a nickel - so
how much noise can it make?  Here's a picture - I had to reduce it to 25%
because the file was huge. but you should be able to see the motor clearly.

http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/mousemotor+nickel-8mp.jpg

The tires are rubber (yep, rubber) so they don't make any noise on hardwood.

You're not buying a Lamborghini, for chrissake - the mouse only costs about
$20!

Our cats
> have rejected many an automated toy because they don't like noisy ones. They
> just sat and stared at the Cy-purr Mouse, although it broke as soon as it got
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> >
> She sure seems to!!!

When I started playing with it to take a picture of the motor, she came
running in - I had to hold her back with one hand and try to take a macro
picture with the other! LOL!

Titi doesn't chase it much, she lies in ambush then pounces on it when it
passes her.  Chatter too.

I ran the mouse into Sugar's foot - and she ran away - but she went through
the kitchen, down one hallway then the other to come up behind it in the
living room - then pounced on it with both paws!  It was hysterical!  I was
amazed how she actually planned her ambush and attack!

Jazz (18) just watches it.  Probably thinks "I don't have to be bothered
chasing mice, I have a waiter who serves me"! LOL!
Yngver - 24 Nov 2004 22:06 GMT
>> >The wheels are tiny so if you have a deep pile carpet the wheels may get
>> >stuck - especially the front wheels since they turn. I have a very thin
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
>http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/mousemotor+nickel-8mp.jpg

Thank you, that's a great picture. My husband will love to see that--shows in
great detail how the thing works.

>The tires are rubber (yep, rubber) so they don't make any noise on hardwood.

Okay. We did buy some kind of toy once--I forgot what it was because it's long
since been relegated to the box of toys the cats won't play with--that was
quiet on carpet but made a huge racket on hardwood. So of course they hated it.

>You're not buying a Lamborghini, for chrissake - the mouse only costs about
>$20!

Hey, I paid more than that for the exalted Panic Mouse, which they played with
for about 15 minutes then lost interest, so why not. Thanks for giving me a
great Christmas gift idea for the cats!

>Our cats
>> have rejected many an automated toy because they don't like noisy ones.
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>running in - I had to hold her back with one hand and try to take a macro
>picture with the other! LOL!

LOL. Our cats don't get that enthused about any toys--I wish they would.

>Titi doesn't chase it much, she lies in ambush then pounces on it when it
>passes her.  Chatter too.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>living room - then pounced on it with both paws!  It was hysterical!  I was
>amazed how she actually planned her ambush and attack!

She gave it what for, I guess!!!

>Jazz (18) just watches it.  Probably thinks "I don't have to be bothered
>chasing mice, I have a waiter who serves me"! LOL!

That's what our three usually do with any motorized toy. But we'll see--maybe
this will be the one they can't get enough of.
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 23:22 GMT
> >> >The wheels are tiny so if you have a deep pile carpet the wheels may get
> >> >stuck - especially the front wheels since they turn. I have a very thin
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> Thank you, that's a great picture. My husband will love to see that--shows in
> great detail how the thing works.

> >The tires are rubber (yep, rubber) so they don't make any noise on hardwood.
>
> Okay. We did buy some kind of toy once--I forgot what it was because it's long
> since been relegated to the box of toys the cats won't play with--that was
> quiet on carpet but made a huge racket on hardwood. So of course they hated it.

You gotta rotate the toys.  I've noticed my cats get bored with a toy after
a while.  So, before they get bored, put it away for a few weeks and take
out older toys.  Many times my cats will start playing with a toy they
didn't like before.

The same principal applies with paper bags.  I buy the huge "lawn" 30 gallon
size paper bags at Home Depot - 6 for $1.99.  After a few days, they're
bored with the same bag, so I use it for trash and open up a new one for the
cats.  Home Depot also sells a plastic ring for about $3 that holds the bag
open - but I think my cats like the bags without it - they like to tunnel
into it.

In general, though, I think cats like reflex/coordination and interactive
toys the best.  Static toys seem boring - After all, cats are hunters.

> >You're not buying a Lamborghini, for chrissake - the mouse only costs about
> >$20!
>
> Hey, I paid more than that for the exalted Panic Mouse, which they played with
> for about 15 minutes then lost interest, so why not. Thanks for giving me a
> great Christmas gift idea for the cats!

If you really want to splurge, check out this "Kitty Stroller"!

http://www.hammacher.com/publish/70171.asp?promo=hl_petproducts

Its probably a great prerequisite for getting a cat used to going for walks
on a leash and harness. Breaks them into going outside gently.

Or this  "Safe Outdoor 10-Foot Catwalk" that you can add on to:

http://www.hammacher.com/publish/67056.asp?promo=hl_petproducts#

This is my favorite:

Safe Outdoor Town and Country Catwalk

http://www.hammacher.com/publish/10815.asp?promo=xsells#

> >Our cats
> >> have rejected many an automated toy because they don't like noisy ones.
[quoted text clipped - 34 lines]
> That's what our three usually do with any motorized toy. But we'll see--maybe
> this will be the one they can't get enough of.

I can't wait to see what my girls get me for Christmas... Last year they
gave me a hairball! LOL!

Phil.
Phil P. - 26 Nov 2004 06:33 GMT
> Does it make a lot of noise though, especially on hardwood floors? Our cats
> have rejected many an automated toy because they don't like noisy ones. They
> just sat and stared at the Cy-purr Mouse,

I forgot to tell you: don't just put the mouse down on the floor and let it
go - make it come out of "nowhere" (like from under furniture or out of a
paper bag) - just like a real mouse.  And make it zig-zag and go in
different directions rather than straight lines - real mice don't run in
straight lines.

Phil
Yngver - 29 Nov 2004 16:24 GMT
>I forgot to tell you: don't just put the mouse down on the floor and let it
>go - make it come out of "nowhere" (like from under furniture or out of a
>paper bag) - just like a real mouse.  And make it zig-zag and go in
>different directions rather than straight lines - real mice don't run in
>straight lines.

Thanks, those are great tips. We have a couple of those toy mice that have
sqeaker chips in them--the kind that when the cat bats the mouse, it squeaks.
They love those when they are hidden in a paper bag.

Warning story, however: once when we bundled everyone up to visit grandma, we
brought along one of those toy mice. It was in a suitcase in the trunk, and
squeaked the whole five-hour trip due to the motion of the car. Never again.
Phil P. - 30 Nov 2004 00:59 GMT
> >I forgot to tell you: don't just put the mouse down on the floor and let it
> >go - make it come out of "nowhere" (like from under furniture or out of a
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> brought along one of those toy mice. It was in a suitcase in the trunk, and
> squeaked the whole five-hour trip due to the motion of the car. Never again.

LOL!

Almost as bad as one of my cats starting the can opener in the middle of the
night!
Cheryl - 30 Nov 2004 02:15 GMT
> LOL!
>
> Almost as bad as one of my cats starting the can opener in the
> middle of the night!

A couple of years ago I was cat sitting for an SPCA fosterer with
many many cats. I went over to her house one afternoon to the water
in the kitchen sink running full force. She'd also had a problem with
the cats turning on the garbage disposal and burning it out because
it ran dry, and finally had to tape it in the off position.  In my
house I've only come home to the stereo or the TV on. :)

Signature

Cheryl
/crossing fingers with this new wild kitten duo.

Yngver - 30 Nov 2004 15:55 GMT
>Almost as bad as one of my cats starting the can opener in the middle of the
>night!

How did she do that? Put weight on the top?

I think our worst middle of the night scare was after we had just moved, and
had a bunch of suitcases in a pile in a corner. One cat managed to climb to the
top, and then the whole thing came crashing down--very loudly. Our cat wasn't
hurt, but to this day--and that happened seven years ago, when she was less
than a year old--she is very suspicious of black suitcases.
Phil P. - 01 Dec 2004 01:02 GMT
> >Almost as bad as one of my cats starting the can opener in the middle of the
> >night!
> >
> How did she do that? Put weight on the top?

She would tap the lever with her paw... and tap... and tap...  and tap...
She thought if she tapped long enough, food would come out -- and she was
*right*.

I reinforced the behavior by giving her a little snack because I thought she
might be hungry... The funny part about it is she wasn't really hungry.
She'd nibble a bit and then tap the lever again and look a me as if she was
saying "Good boy!, now do it again".

Needless to say I unplugged the damned thing - but I could still hear her
tapping the freakin' lever... only harder and continiously.  I finally put
the damed thing in a closet... only to hear the closet door slam shut.  The
doors have spring clamps; she could only open the door a little then it
would slam shut.  Was I happy when they came out with pop-top cat food cans.
Her ears still go forward when I open a can of coffee, but that's about it.

> I think our worst middle of the night scare was after we had just moved, and
> had a bunch of suitcases in a pile in a corner. One cat managed to climb to the
> top, and then the whole thing came crashing down--very loudly. Our cat wasn't
> hurt, but to this day--and that happened seven years ago, when she was less
> than a year old--she is very suspicious of black suitcases.

Its not so bad when they land - they land so gracefully.  Its the take-off
that's a bitch!

Phil
Phil P. - 01 Dec 2004 12:38 GMT
Btw, if you haven't decided on the mouse yet, you've got to see these
pictures!

http://maxshouse.com/jade'o_mine+her_mouse.htm

She knows I put the mouse back in the module when we're done playing with
it.  So now she holds on to it! and falls asleep holding it!  When I tried
to gently take it away she pulled the mouse in close and covered it with her
arm and chin!  It was hilarious!  Maybe she thinks its alive!

The picture quality isn't too good because I couldn't get at my good
camera - she was leaning against it and I didn't want to wake her up and
blow the shot. But you can still see what I'm talking about.

Phil
Sherry - 01 Dec 2004 14:13 GMT
>Btw, if you haven't decided on the mouse yet, you've got to see these
>pictures!
>
>http://maxshouse.com/jade'o_mine+her_mouse.htm

Aww, that's so cute! Sleeping with her little paw on it.

Sherry
Phil P. - 01 Dec 2004 14:26 GMT
> >Btw, if you haven't decided on the mouse yet, you've got to see these
> >pictures!
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Sherry

Did you scroll down and see her hugging the mouse while she's sleeping?  I
may be a tad partial, but I think its adorable!

http://maxshouse.com/jadehugmouse.JPG

Phil
Sherry - 01 Dec 2004 14:31 GMT
>Did you scroll down and see her hugging the mouse while she's sleeping?  I
>may be a tad partial, but I think its adorable!
>
>http://maxshouse.com/jadehugmouse.JPG
>
>Phil

She loves her mousie. BTW, she is a beautiful cat. What's her story? How did
you get her, how long have you had her?

Sherry
Phil P. - 02 Dec 2004 08:05 GMT
> >Did you scroll down and see her hugging the mouse while she's sleeping?  I
> >may be a tad partial, but I think its adorable!
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> She loves her mousie. BTW, she is a beautiful cat. What's her story? How did
> you get her, how long have you had her?

She and Max (as in Max's House) were part of group of about 20 kittens that
where scheduled to die in two days because the neighboring county's shelter
was overflowing with kittens - The kittens in this group "didn't look too
good and were getting too old".

http://www.maxshouse.com/Main_Photos+Graphics/Max-Main.jpg

http://www.maxshouse.com/Main_Photos+Graphics/JADE-Main.jpg

While I was taking the kittens to the vet, Max died of FP on the way, Jade
and the others pulled through.   Its hard to believe that was almost 6 years
ago.  Max was one of those kittens you never forget.

This is the sweet, beautiful cat Jade grew up to become:

http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/Jade-11-16-4-4-ed-511k.jpg

I can only imagine how sweet and handsome Max would have been.  I still miss
the little guy.

Phil
Sherry - 02 Dec 2004 14:34 GMT
>While I was taking the kittens to the vet, Max died of FP on the way, Jade
>and the others pulled through.   Its hard to believe that was almost 6 years
>ago.  Max was one of those kittens you never forget.

And Max won't ever be forgotten. Maxs house is a wonderful tribute, and will
always keep his memory alive for everyone, people that never knew him!
Cute pics. Jade is still quite the young lady, hope you have her a long, long
time.
Sherry
Dick Peavey - 02 Dec 2004 17:01 GMT
> This is the sweet, beautiful cat Jade grew up to become:
>
> http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/Jade-11-16-4-4-ed-511k.jpg

That looks so much like Squeaky, it's amazing. They could be twins. The
markings are Classic Tabby?

Dick
Phil P. - 03 Dec 2004 08:36 GMT
> > This is the sweet, beautiful cat Jade grew up to become:
> >
> > http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/Jade-11-16-4-4-ed-511k.jpg
>
> That looks so much like Squeaky, it's amazing. They could be twins.

I'd love to see this.  Got a picture of her?  If not you can borrow one of
mine. ;->

The
> markings are Classic Tabby?
>
> Dick

When she was kitten, her coat looked more Mackerel.  She's a lot darker
now - and looks more like a Classic.

Phil
Dick Peavey - 03 Dec 2004 13:15 GMT
Re: Laser-Pens: Cat/Dog Exercise Danger

>> > This is the sweet, beautiful cat Jade grew up to become:
>> >
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> one of
> mine. ;->

I've got a picture of him, but I don't know how to post it. I don't have
a web site. Maybe I could get some help to post to the animal picture
newsgroup?

Dick
Mary - 03 Dec 2004 15:45 GMT
"Dick Peavey" <me@privacy.net> wrote >
> I've got a picture of him, but I don't know how to post it. I don't have
> a web site. Maybe I could get some help to post to the animal picture
> newsgroup?

Ahhh, cat pics! Dick, go to yahoo.com where it is easy as pie to set
up a free picture page. I even did it. Also, you get a free email account
that is good to use with Usenet because it has a killer effective spam
filter.
Here is mine so you can see:

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/crazyaboutfelines/my_photos

(I am assuming you have a digital photo of him ...)
Mary - 02 Dec 2004 18:11 GMT
> > >Did you scroll down and see her hugging the mouse while she's sleeping?
> I
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
>
> Phil

Phil, like Sherry, I love to hear these stories. I wish little Max had made
it.
Phil P. - 03 Dec 2004 08:15 GMT
> > > >Did you scroll down and see her hugging the mouse while she's sleeping?
> > I
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
> Phil, like Sherry, I love to hear these stories. I wish little Max had made
> it.

I met a lot of cats in my day but very, very, few affected me like Max did.
To this day, I don't know why.  It was much more than just being cute.

Phil
Mary - 03 Dec 2004 15:36 GMT
"Phil P." <phil@maxshouse.org> wrote >
> I met a lot of cats in my day but very, very, few affected me like Max did.
> To this day, I don't know why.  It was much more than just being cute.

Like people, they sometimes have special attributes that connect with us.
I never felt this until Cheeky, though I have really loved my other cats.
This morning I was smiling over her boney little butt as she minced out of
the room with her long tail straight up like the mast of a tall ship (it's
hilarious for some
reason, maybe because she is so skinny!) and in an instant I was tearing
up, full of dread of the day she dies. And she is barely five! I reminded
myself
that the only way not to feel loss is not to value anything. And other
lame-a.s
rationalizations. Point is, I am nuts for this little creature, as we have a
special
connection. I can tell you did with Max, too.
Yngver - 01 Dec 2004 16:22 GMT
>Btw, if you haven't decided on the mouse yet, you've got to see these
>pictures!
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
>Phil

That is really cute--she sure doesn't want you to take that mouse away from
her!

One of our cats sometimes deliberately covers a favorite toy with her paw or
even sits on it to keep another cat from playing with it--but it's just a
non-mechanized woolly mouse. I don't think she ever fell asleep holding it.
Mary - 01 Dec 2004 17:22 GMT
> Btw, if you haven't decided on the mouse yet, you've got to see these
> pictures!
>
> http://maxshouse.com/jade'o_mine+her_mouse.htm

Oh yeah, that is love. lol!! I'm sold. Where do I get one?
Phil P. - 02 Dec 2004 08:00 GMT
> > Btw, if you haven't decided on the mouse yet, you've got to see these
> > pictures!
> >
> > http://maxshouse.com/jade'o_mine+her_mouse.htm
>
> Oh yeah, that is love. lol!! I'm sold. Where do I get one?

I bought it on discovery.com  - the Animal Planet's website.  If you don't
see it listed, call them.  The item number is 697342 - Radio Controlled
Mouse - its $22.

Charging the mouse is a little tricky at first - You have to tilt the mouse
up in charger (module) a little - if you have a problem, let me know.

Not only will you're cat have a blast - so will you!

Have fun!

Phil
Mary - 02 Dec 2004 18:09 GMT
> > > Btw, if you haven't decided on the mouse yet, you've got to see these
> > > pictures!
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> Phil

Thanks, I'm there!
Nomen Nescio - 04 Dec 2004 06:40 GMT
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From: "Phil P." <phil@maxshouse.org>

>I bought it on discovery.com  - the Animal Planet's website.  If you don't
>see it listed, call them.  The item number is 697342 - Radio Controlled
>Mouse - its $22.

TK's getting an RC Mouse for Christmas.  Thank's for mentioning it!
Elizabeth Blake - 24 Nov 2004 03:01 GMT
> > I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be fooled by
> > it.  Tiger chased the spot a few times but quickly learned that it was
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> http://www.maxshouse.com/Ours/Jade+APMouse.jpg  (Jade waiting for it too
> move)

A year or two ago I bought one of those tiny remote control cars.  Tiger &
Otto seemed shocked the first time I started it up.  Tiger batted it a few
times and Otto always seemed afraid of it.  Is that mouse one furry?  I'd
like to get one and try it on Stinky & Harriet at work, and if it's furry
Stinky would be able to grab it with her claws (that makes any toy more
fun!).  My car started acting funny after awhile and the steering was all
off, and I threw it out before I got a chance to try it on the work cats.

--
Liz
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 14:24 GMT
> > > I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be fooled by
> > > it.  Tiger chased the spot a few times but quickly learned that it was
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Otto seemed shocked the first time I started it up.  Tiger batted it a few
> times and Otto always seemed afraid of it.  Is that mouse one furry?

Yes.

I'd
> like to get one and try it on Stinky & Harriet at work, and if it's furry
> Stinky would be able to grab it with her claws (that makes any toy more
> fun!).

That's what's so great about it!  The cats can actually catch it.  You can
play hide'n seek with it under furniture and watch the cats pounce on it and
hold it - as soon as they let it go, make it take off - its pretty close to
the real thing.  Too bad it doesn't squeek! ;-)

Phil
MaryL - 24 Nov 2004 14:58 GMT
>> > > I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be fooled
> by
[quoted text clipped - 33 lines]
>
> Phil

This sounds great, especially since you mentioned (in an earlier message)
that the battery is in the controller and not the mouse.  I'm going to order
a couple of them.  Holly throws furry mice and other toys all around the
room.  Duffy also likes the little furry mice but doesn't always know where
they are.  One that moves would make it easy for him to locate!

MaryL
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 23:14 GMT
> >> > > I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be fooled
> > by
[quoted text clipped - 39 lines]
> room.  Duffy also likes the little furry mice but doesn't always know where
> they are.  One that moves would make it easy for him to locate!

Oh yeah! That's right!  He can zero in on the mouse by the sound of the
motor.  I think he'll really enjoy it - I hope he does.

Phil
Cheryl - 24 Nov 2004 04:09 GMT
> Its a radio-controlled mouse with a range of about 30'.  They
> *love* this toy!  

I have one of these, but my whole house is carpeted, not including
the kitchen. When I first got it, I pulled out a huge piece of
panelling that hasn't been installed yet and laid it on the floor and
ran it around on that, but they didn't seem interested.

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Cheryl - 24 Nov 2004 01:57 GMT
> I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be
> fooled by it.  Tiger chased the spot a few times but quickly
> learned that it was not something he could catch.  Neither cat
> is interested now.
>
>                   ---MIKE---

<G> Shamrock loves it! He knows where the dot comes from, but he
doesn't care. When the dot disappears, he looks at me as if to say,
turn it back on!  He's the same way with flashlights, and the light
from the refrigerator when the door is open.

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Cheryl

MaryL - 24 Nov 2004 02:20 GMT
>> I have one of the low powered pens.  Amber was too smart to be
>> fooled by it.  Tiger chased the spot a few times but quickly
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> turn it back on!  He's the same way with flashlights, and the light
> from the refrigerator when the door is open.

Holly loves hers.  She even knows where "the light" is stored.  As soon as I
reach for the door where I keep it, Holly bounds across the room and up onto
the chest, then reaches into the drawer in an attempt to get it.  So, she
does associate the light with the laser device, but she still will chase it
all around the room.

MaryL
Elizabeth Blake - 24 Nov 2004 03:03 GMT
> Holly loves hers.  She even knows where "the light" is stored.  As soon as I
> reach for the door where I keep it, Holly bounds across the room and up onto
> the chest, then reaches into the drawer in an attempt to get it.  So, she
> does associate the light with the laser device, but she still will chase it
> all around the room.

Both cats at work and Otto at home love the laser pointer.  I have small
ones on a keychain and when I pick it up out of the drawer, the keychain
part clinks against the laser.  Otto can hear that sound no matter where he
is and comes running.  Harriet also knows the sound.  When she heard it, she
doesn't run to me, but she flattens herself down on the ground looking for
the dot.  It's very cute!

--
Liz
Hodge - 24 Nov 2004 01:01 GMT
> Nope, 1) the beam is projected onto the floor (typically)

I do mine onto doors and walls so Hodge will run into them. Really, he
loves it. ;)

> and it's
> exceptionally unlikely that the cat will look along the axis of the
> beam,

Hodge tries to, though. He's not stupid. He likes to see his tormentor.
:)

> 2) the beam is in motion, and rapid movement of the dot across
> the eye is harmless. Repeated exposures are also harmless, as long as
> they aren't occurring in rapid succession.

Or for something like 20 seconds straight.

> As long as the human isn't a
> complete pickle brain, a laser pointer is a safe cat toy.

Well, we both love it, and we both still see pretty well. :)
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Dick Peavey - 24 Nov 2004 12:23 GMT
>> Hello Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 54 lines]
>
> Steve.

Well, that's reassuring. I haven't bought one for Squeaky just out of
fear it might cause harm. I think Squeaky is going to get a new toy.

--
Dick
MaryL - 24 Nov 2004 15:05 GMT
>>> Hello Everyone,
>>
[quoted text clipped - 59 lines]
> --
> Dick

I think Squeaky will love it.  The one precaution you need to take is to be
careful when directing the light that it is not aimed in such a way that
your cat could hit a piece of furniture when trying to capture the light.
Holly jumps all around the room after it -- great fun and good exercise --  
but I am very careful to position it so that she could not hurt herself on
the coffee table or anything else with sharp edges.

MaryL
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 17:24 GMT
> I think Squeaky will love it.  The one precaution you need to take is to be
> careful when directing the light that it is not aimed in such a way that
> your cat could hit a piece of furniture when trying to capture the light.
> Holly jumps all around the room after it -- great fun and good exercise --
> but I am very careful to position it so that she could not hurt herself on
> the coffee table or anything else with sharp edges.

That's an *excellent* point.  The cat is so focused on the spot that she
forgets about other potential dangers.  Its the same principal as a male cat
in heat or a cat running from a dog - they'll dash out into the street
without taking their usual precautions because they're so preoccupied.

Phil
Diane L. Schirf - 24 Nov 2004 19:09 GMT
> Its the same principal as a male cat
> in heat or a cat running from a dog - they'll dash out into the street
> without taking their usual precautions because they're so preoccupied.

Or teenagers in heat. ;)

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Mary - 23 Nov 2004 23:39 GMT
> Hello Everyone,

> Better to stick with a tickler dangling from a piece of elastic on the
> end of a long cane.

Noooo! Without the laser pointer we could not do Kitty Olympics every night!
Both cats chase it, but Cheeks uses the front hall as a kind of air strip
and
if I do the laser just right, she leaps damned near to the top of the front
door!
(I am very careful with it--and they love it like no flashlight we have ever
tried.)
Tales of Orpheus - 24 Nov 2004 17:49 GMT
I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their cats and
dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing the dot of light
at the end of a laser beam.  However, the question that owners ought to
take responsibility to ask themselves is, "If I were to play this form
of frenetic and unpredictable game with children, would I even dream of
using a laser beam?".

Thomas.
Mary - 24 Nov 2004 17:56 GMT
> I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their cats and
> dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing the dot of light
> at the end of a laser beam.  However, the question that owners ought to
> take responsibility to ask themselves is, "If I were to play this form
> of frenetic and unpredictable game with children, would I even dream of
> using a laser beam?".

Is it possible that the little keychain model that most of us are
using is a lot weaker than the kind you are worried about?
MaryL - 24 Nov 2004 18:01 GMT
>I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their cats and
> dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing the dot of light
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Thomas.

Yes, but what about children playing basketball or tennis or almost any
other active sport?  Have you ever noticed how "frenetic" a game of pick-up
basketball can become?  Don't children become very active in play and get
both pleasure and exercise from it?  Likewise, a laser should not be used to
the point where the cat becomes exhausted or frustrated (but I find that
Holly is smart enough to stop voluntarily when she has "had enough"; as a
result, I only use the pointer for a few minutes at a time).  It would not
make sense to use a laser beam to play with children, but it also would not
make sense to try to play basketball with a cat.  Cats and children have
different needs.

MaryL
Phil P. - 24 Nov 2004 18:33 GMT
> I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their cats and
> dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing the dot of light
> at the end of a laser beam.  However, the question that owners ought to
> take responsibility to ask themselves is, "If I were to play this form
> of frenetic and unpredictable game with children, would I even dream of
> using a laser beam?".

No - because my kids wouldn't chase or ambush and pounce on a laser beam!
If they would, I would!

Never saw kids play football or hockey have you?  How about wrestling???

The next time you come up with another idea that you think is a brainstorm,
remember, its only a light drizzle for most of us.

.
Diane L. Schirf - 24 Nov 2004 19:09 GMT
> I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their cats and
> dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing the dot of light
> at the end of a laser beam.  However, the question that owners ought to
> take responsibility to ask themselves is, "If I were to play this form
> of frenetic and unpredictable game with children, would I even dream of
> using a laser beam?".

Why not?

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Yngver - 24 Nov 2004 21:57 GMT
>> I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their cats and
>> dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing the dot of light
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
>Why not?

Yeah, actually now that the question is posed, why not? Sounds like a great way
to wear out an over-energetic toddler--if you could only get them to chase it.
Diane L. Schirf - 24 Nov 2004 22:12 GMT
> >> I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their cats and
> >> dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing the dot of light
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> to wear out an over-energetic toddler--if you could only get them to chase
> it.

Well, I really meant that the person is over-reacting to fabricated
dangers. A toy laser wouldn't harm a child any more than it would a cat
or dog. Obviously, a child might not have the same reaction to it. :)

(Curious -- has anyone tried one on fish or reptiles?)

As for "frenetic and unpredictable," that's kind of the definition of
childhood, is it not?

(Well, at least kittenhood. ;)

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Cheryl - 25 Nov 2004 03:33 GMT
> I fully appreciate that lots of people have found that their
> cats and dogs get an enormous amount of pleasure out of chasing
> the dot of light at the end of a laser beam.

I did a little bit of "research" tonight when I took out the laser
toy to divert Shamrock (3.something years old) from attacking
Bonnie (2 years old, born feral, "domesticated" at about 4-6 months
old).  The kittens (they are about 10 weeks now) followed the light
and went NUTS over it. I wondered if some see it, some don't, some
don't get excited over it, and mostly why Bonnie doesn't show any
interest in it at all. She doesn't even seem to see the dot. Out of
the two new test subjects, only one was so interested that she
wanted to climb the wall to get the dot. While Rhett (the other 10
week old) followed the dot, Scarlett was the one who hopped and
pounced her way across the room trying to kill it. So from this
tiny study of 4 cats, 75% notice the dot.  50% go totally crazy
trying to kill it.  25% don't notice it at all, or don't care about
it.

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