Hello,
I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
I have a one year old, abyssinian var catkin (father somali, mother aby).
She is excelent cat and I think about breeding her. But, as far as I know
there's a few controversy with it.
1. Has ABY/SOM vars valuable genetical stuff for breeding ABYs?
Shorthair gene is dominant, so kittens of my cat should give the ABYs.
There's little probability for halflonghair cat.. but not so big.
2. Maybe better is to coupling her with the SOM stud?
ABY enforced gene of ticking, but a chance for a short hairs is fifty-fifty
and that's no good when one's expected SOMys.
What should I do?
Any idea?
Any suggestions?
Thank you
Tomek
Wendy - 18 Nov 2004 12:33 GMT
> Hello,
> I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Thank you
> Tomek
Before you do this please call you're local shelter or SPCA and ask them how
many cats they euthanize a year because they have more cats than there are
homes for them. Then really consider whether you need to add to this problem
by breeding your cat.
W
Robin Cook - 18 Nov 2004 13:40 GMT
Tomasz,
In reading your post, I detect you are not in or of the USA. I'm not sure
what country you are in (or from), but here in the USA I will buy a Cat
Fancy and other cat magazines. You can find listings there of other
breeders and some perhaps in your country. Also, this breeder listing may
be on the Internet as well to explore. My suggestion here would be to call
a few of them to talk about these questions you have and how they have set
things up with breeding concerns (and how they deal with offspring that does
not have the desired showcat qualities). Also, the breeder from where you
got your cat may have the answers to your questions. It appears to me that
you have somewhat already done research and pretty much have answered your
own questions .. you just have to make a decision which way to to breed your
female, and I doubt any breeder will be able to commit to you a 100%
projection perspective of the breeding outcome. But, it would be a good
idea to contact other breeders to give you more information and details
about their own experiences with their breeding outcomes and you can go from
there in making your own decision in what to do.
kaeli - 18 Nov 2004 14:43 GMT
> Hello,
> I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
<snip>
> What should I do?
From the perspective of someone living in the States...
Learn a lot more about breeding and feline genetics before attempting it.
Join cat clubs. Get a breeder who shows, and wins, to mentor you. Make sure
you have a really good vet. You spend more money than you make when you breed
if you're a responsible breeder. Responsible breeders want to better a breed
and breed sparsely with their cats. Responsible breeders ensure all their
kittens that they aren't keeping get wonderful homes.
Everyone else is just adding to the overpopulation problem. A case can be
made that ALL breeders are adding to the problem.
Enough cats are killed in shelters yearly. The last thing we need are cats
with genetic problems adding to the numbers.
I do wonder why you're bothering to purposefully breed a mix, considering how
variable the kittens might be in regards to hair length and markings.
Personality is only one part of what makes a good breeding cat. There are
plenty of cats with awesome personalities waiting to be adopted from the
shelter. Purposeful breeding should be about personality, temperament,
conformation, color and markings to breed standard, size to standard, coat
type, genetic health, and many other things. If your cat doesn't have ALL of
these qualities, it is most irresponsible of you to breed her.
My 2 cents, anyway.

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Orchid - 18 Nov 2004 20:22 GMT
>> Hello,
>> I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
><snip>
>I do wonder why you're bothering to purposefully breed a mix, considering how
>variable the kittens might be in regards to hair length and markings.
A Somali is simply a longhaired Abyssinian -- IIRC they are a
permissable outcross in some registries. A Somali/Aby litter will
probably produce mostly shorthaired kittens that carry for the
recessive longhair gene. Only if the Aby carries for longhair will
you see Somalis come out of it. Careful pedigree research is the
absolute key.
>Personality is only one part of what makes a good breeding cat. There are
>plenty of cats with awesome personalities waiting to be adopted from the
>shelter. Purposeful breeding should be about personality, temperament,
>conformation, color and markings to breed standard, size to standard, coat
>type, genetic health, and many other things. If your cat doesn't have ALL of
>these qualities, it is most irresponsible of you to breed her.
Hear hear.
Orchid
See Orchid's Kitties! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/bengalpage
Want a Purebred Cat? Read This! -- http://nik.ascendancy.net/orchid
Schroedinger's Cat - 19 Nov 2004 04:26 GMT
> > Hello,
> > I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> Enough cats are killed in shelters yearly. The last thing we need are cats
> with genetic problems adding to the numbers.
BTW I want to join in here... I didn't say this in my post but I think
it is great advice! I have seen this in practice and newbies who have
done it this way are streets ahead of the ones who have just started
rubbing 2 cats together to get more cats...good breeders have specific
aims and are focused towards the achievement of these, rather than on
breeding willy-nilly...
Cheers!
Cat
Steve G - 18 Nov 2004 23:15 GMT
> I have a one year old, abyssinian var catkin (father somali, mother aby).
> She is excelent cat and I think about breeding her. But, as far as I know
> there's a few controversy with it.
> 1. Has ABY/SOM vars valuable genetical stuff for breeding ABYs?
(...)
> What should I do?
If you have to ask these questions here, then you should not do it.
Steve.
Schroedinger's Cat - 19 Nov 2004 03:58 GMT
> Hello,
> I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Shorthair gene is dominant, so kittens of my cat should give the ABYs.
> There's little probability for halflonghair cat.. but not so big.
You will have a 50% chance of getting variants in this litter. But
they will all look like shorthairs. It can be difficult to impossible
to determine which kittens are homozygous for the shorthair gene...
> 2. Maybe better is to coupling her with the SOM stud?
> ABY enforced gene of ticking, but a chance for a short hairs is fifty-fifty
> and that's no good when one's expected SOMys.
Somalis are ticked as well - they just look different because they
have longer coats.
> What should I do?
Why did the breeder sell you this cat? Was it as a pet? It sounds
likely that the breeder was breeding a Somali back to the Abyssinian
in order to improve type in the Somali (it's also done in other
breeds, eg Balinese & Siamese). Is this cat truly of good type and
was surplus to the breeder's requirements, or was she sold as a pet
because the breeder considered her type not good enough to breed from?
If she is the latter then there is probably no point adding to the
population of pet-quality purebreds, beautiful though they are. If
she was considered "good" enough to breed, and the breeder is
agreeable with what you are doing then why wouldn't you mate her to a
Somali? You will get 50% chance of Somalis and 50% Abyssinian
variants which will look the same as Abys and make great pets or show
neuters (if you go to the Aby, you won't be able to tell which of her
kittens are homozygous for the shorthair gene anyway). Also, is the
cat registered and does the breeder know what you are considering
doing (I only ask because where I come from some cats are sold
unregistered because the breeder doesn't want them to be bred; they
are meant to be neutered in due course - often they aren't which is
why most of the breeders I know now neuter their pet kittens before
they are sold). Does the breeder have any suggestions?
Also, I guess it's worth asking if there is a cat overpopulation
problem in your country/area - I think if one is to breed more cats it
would be worth knowing the chances that the kittens will find homes,
and whether there is an abundance of strays/dumped cats (might make
you change your mind about breeding). And, if you will neuter your
pet-quality kittens prior to placement...
Cheers and good luck,
Cat
Phil P. - 19 Nov 2004 10:29 GMT
> Hello,
> I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
> I have a one year old, abyssinian var catkin (father somali, mother aby).
> She is excelent cat
Join the club. We all have excellent cats.
> and I think about breeding her.
Why, is there a shortage of cats in your country? If so, we have a few
million in shelters that will be executed if homes cannot be found for them.
> What should I do?
> Any idea?
> Any suggestions?
Just one. Go to your local kill shelter on kill day then see how you feel
about adding to the killing. http://maxshouse.com/heartache.JPG
Diane L. Schirf - 19 Nov 2004 12:49 GMT
> > I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
> > I have a one year old, abyssinian var catkin (father somali, mother aby).
> > She is excelent cat
>
> Join the club. We all have excellent cats.
I've had an excellent moggy. :)

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MaryL - 19 Nov 2004 14:59 GMT
>> > I'm looking for a advice from ABY/SOM breeders...
>> > I have a one year old, abyssinian var catkin (father somali, mother
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> I've had an excellent moggy. :)
My cats have all been excellent. In fact, I think they are "beyond
excellent" -- they are wonderful in every way. But, if I had purebred cats,
then my first cat (a feral) would not have been trapped and saved; then
Amber would not have been rescued from an abusive home; then Holly would not
have been adopted from a woman who had herself rescued her from certain
death (a breeder who had mixed two different purebred breeds and then wasn't
satisfied with the results of her "experiment"); and Duffy (my blind cat)
would surely have perished in the shelter once kitten season hit and they
had to have more cages (they had already kept him there for several months
without finding a home -- despite his wonderful disposition -- because of
his "handicap" which has turned out to be *not* a handicap at all). In
other words, why not adopt a cat and save a life?
MaryL
(take out the litter to reply)
Photos of Duffy and Holly: >'o'<
http://tinyurl.com/8y54 (Introducing Duffy to Holly)
http://tinyurl.com/8y56 (Duffy and Holly "settle in")
MaryL - 19 Nov 2004 15:22 GMT
Sorry...my message should have been posted directly to Tomasz (the OP).
MaryL