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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / July 2004Shitty Kitty Update
Odin, my six month old cat, had been doing bowel movements on the tile floor in my bathroom every day since the day I got him from a shelter when he was 4 months old. I tried everything you can think of to change this behavior. We had to go away for nearly two weeks. I paid $110 for him to have three visits a day. I confined him to a small room with his litter box and closed off the bathroom he always evacuates his bowels in. (Can I please say "sh.t" now?) I got four urgent phone calls about his bowel movements, but not because he had gone where he wasn't supposed to, but because he had spraying diarhea. (I came back and washed the crap off of the walls when I got home. He is such an incredibly disgusting foul cat!) Today we attempted to let him have free run of the house again. It's too hard keeping him away from that bathroom, it's the main downstairs powder-room and I have little kids and clients who use it and don't pay attention to the sign I put on it saying "Please close door tightly." As a precaution I bought some citris oil spray (I heard cats don't like it) and sprayed it all around that room. He went in there and peed in the little corner litterbox I left in there just in case. Then he sh.t on the floor. I've now spent $300 on this animal and he sh.ts on my floor every single day he can. Oh, and yesterday he peed on the upstairs bathroom floor. Tell me one reason why I ought not to bring him back to the shelter? Dally In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", Dally <dally@myself.com> artfully composed this message within <news:2l3m52F87ndvU1@uni-berlin.de> on 07 Jul 2004: > Tell me one reason why I ought not to bring him back to the > shelter? Because, Dally, he will be put to death. If you can live with that, it certainly is your choice, I guess. In these two months, your household is probably way too hostile for him now. No offense meant, because I'm not so sure how I'd react; I've never had a cat with incontenence problems yet.  SignatureCheryl > In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", Dally > <dally@myself.com> artfully composed this message within [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Because, Dally, he will be put to death. If you can live with that, > it certainly is your choice, I guess. That definitely weighs heavily on me. > In these two months, your > household is probably way too hostile for him now. I had to think about your accusation that the house might be too hostile. We don't mistreat him in anyway. He's quite a nice cat - affectionate, purrs easily, gets along well with everybody, enjoys everybody's company (including our dog)... that's why we didn't return him the first day. Or the first month. Or the second month. But I'm not willing to live with cat sh.t every day. It's not HIM, it's his behavior that I object to. I can distinguish. > No offense meant, > because I'm not so sure how I'd react; I've never had a cat with > incontenence problems yet. No offense taken. I think maybe if I didn't run a professional business from my home (and hence try to keep the powder-room presentable for client-use) I wouldn't be so uptight about this. But even if it were just me and my family, I never wanted to be one of those houses that you walk into and find that it stinks to high heaven of pet sh.t. We're currently successful pet owners of a dog (who has her Cannine Good Citizen award), a parakeet, a gecko lizard, and an aquarium that has been going for 10 years now. Our family cat passed away in February. It's not like I've never dealt with pet issues before. I'm stunned that this has me so flummoxed. Dally In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", Dally <dally@myself.com> artfully composed this message within <news:2l3rbgF8bk88U1@uni-berlin.de> on 07 Jul 2004: >> In these two months, your >> household is probably way too hostile for him now. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > But I'm not willing to live with cat sh.t every day. It's not > HIM, it's his behavior that I object to. I can distinguish. My first thought was, if you have to deal with cat sh.t daily like you are, how are you reacting? If you react in an angry manner, or even if you think you don't but Shitty Kitty is picking up on negativity, that is what I meant by hostile. Seriously, you can't help but act a certain way, particularly if you are posting here at your wits end. Read Megan's email. She can probably help. You're going to make your own decision based on what you can handle, anyway, so it can't hurt to go see some suggestions. Best wishes and purrs to you all. SignatureCheryl > My first thought was, if you have to deal with cat sh.t daily like > you are, how are you reacting? If you react in an angry manner, or [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > anyway, so it can't hurt to go see some suggestions. Best wishes > and purrs to you all. Thank you. And I did respond to Megan's email as well as the other email I received. I appreciate your ideas. Dally > > In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", Dally > > <dally@myself.com> artfully composed this message within [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > > > Because, Dally, he will be put to death. If you can live with that, it certainly is your choice, I guess. > That definitely weighs heavily on me. So you did NOT get him from a no-kill shelter? >>>In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", Dally >>><dally@myself.com> artfully composed this message within [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > So you did NOT get him from a no-kill shelter? I don't know their status for sure. I know they only take "placeable" animals, but I'm under the impression that animals that just aren't placeable (that they have for one reason or another) are disposed of. It's called a "humane society" if that offers clues to people. Dally >I don't know their status for sure. I know they only take "placeable" >animals, but I'm under the impression that animals that just aren't [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Dally "Humane Society" doesn't mean anything at all. It's just a name. It doesn't mean it's no-kill, or that it's affiliated with any other humane society, or that it's even humane. I could start up a shelter tomorrow and call it "Sherry's Humane Society" with no regulations governing it except my own. Sherry > > So you did NOT get him from a no-kill shelter? > > I don't know their status for sure. I know they only take "placeable" animals, but I'm under the impression that animals that just aren't placeable (that they have for one reason or another) are disposed of. > It's called a "humane society" if that offers clues to people. Then you can be sure they will euthanize this cat after knowing what you have been through. > Then you can be sure they will euthanize this cat after knowing what you > have been through. Dally, please check your email. If this indeed is NOT a no-kill shelter, I can get him into the shelter I volunteer at. Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net Check out www.snittens.com > > Then you can be sure they will euthanize this cat after knowing what you > > have been through. > > Dally, please check your email. If this indeed is NOT a no-kill shelter, I > can get him into the shelter I volunteer at. Sorry to piggyback on my own post, but before anyone yells at me about the evils of shelter life, if we do get this cat in, either I or someone else will foster him, or he will go into the kitten room since he is under one year. The kitten room is a large room where the under one year-old cats and kittens get to run and play. I think this cat might like being in there, sounds like he would enjoy the company. Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net Check out www.snittens.com > Sorry to piggyback on my own post, but before anyone yells at me about the evils of shelter life. O my God, do people do that? > > Then you can be sure they will euthanize this cat after knowing what you > > have been through. > > Dally, please check your email. If this indeed is NOT a no-kill shelter, I can get him into the shelter I volunteer at. Truly, no cat deserves to die because he likes pooping in a single room that the pertinent humans just CANNOT keep the door shut to. >Truly, no cat deserves to die because he likes pooping in a single room that >the pertinent humans just CANNOT keep the door shut to. I'm missing something, and maybe someone can clue me in. What happens when the door to that room is shut? >>Truly, no cat deserves to die because he likes pooping in a single room that >>the pertinent humans just CANNOT keep the door shut to. > > I'm missing something, and maybe someone can clue me in. What happens when the > door to that room is shut? He uses one of his two litterboxes upstairs. Even though I'm trying to keep him out of there, I've got a fairly small litterbox in there right now. His chosen place is directly to the right of the toilet and I'm not wild about having an open litterbox there, but I figured I may at least give him a place to go when he sneaks in there. Yes, in case you're joining late, I've put larger litterboxes in there. He still poops outside them most of the time, including at least once a day, although he'll use the litterboxes sometimes. One memorable time I had the entire area covered with two large litterboxes and a trashcan and he squeezed behind the toilet to poop there. Dally >From: Dally dally@myself.com >I had the entire area covered with two large litterboxes and a trashcan >and he squeezed behind the toilet to poop there. I believe you mentioned you have a dog. Is it possible the dog is somehow "marking" the litterbox (even just by digging in it or smelling around the area), and so the cat doesn't feel safe going there and instead chooses behind the toilet? ________ See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm >>From: Dally dally@myself.com > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > area), and so the cat doesn't feel safe going there and instead chooses behind > the toilet? The opposite is the case: the cat goes in plain site of the door, next to the toilet but not under it or deep into the corner. Sort of mid-thigh if you're sitting on the toilet. (Can this thread GET any more graphic?) The only time he squeezed behind the toilet was when I had covered all the rest of the area with kitty litter boxes - jam packed all over that entire corner of the bathroom. He just got as close to his corner as he could. FWIW, at the moment I've got the floor on that entire end of the bathroom, both sides of the toilet, covered in citris-oiled plastic wrap with some bubble wrap thrown in for good measure. He's been downstairs all evening and hasn't done anything in there [yet]. Dally > >Truly, no cat deserves to die because he likes pooping in a single room that the pertinent humans just CANNOT keep the door shut to. > I'm missing something, and maybe someone can clue me in. What happens when the door to that room is shut? He poops where he's 'posed to. >> >Truly, no cat deserves to die because he likes pooping in a single room >that the pertinent humans just CANNOT keep the door shut to. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >He poops where he's 'posed to. Well. If that's just not the weirdest thing I've ever heard of. Makes you wish you could see the wheels turning in that little brain. Sherry >>>>Truly, no cat deserves to die because he likes pooping in a single room >> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Well. If that's just not the weirdest thing I've ever heard of. Makes you wish > you could see the wheels turning in that little brain. Exactly. Dally > Well. If that's just not the weirdest thing I've ever heard of. Makes you wish you could see the wheels turning in that little brain. Yep, I think this is what is really getting to Dally, in addition to the mess. >From: Dally dally@myself.com > Our family cat passed away in February. >It's not like I've never dealt with pet issues before. I'm stunned that >this has me so flummoxed. Hi Dally, You have taken him to a vet for a complete physical exam, right? This would be the first step. ________ See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm > Odin, my six month old cat, had been doing bowel movements on the tile > floor in my bathroom every day since the day I got him from a shelter [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > of the walls when I got home. He is such an incredibly disgusting foul > cat!) He may have been stressed about the confinement and everyone being gone. > Today we attempted to let him have free run of the house again. It's > too hard keeping him away from that bathroom, it's the main downstairs [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Dally If you got him from a no-kill shelter, which I think you said you did, then return him. There's obviously something going on that is beyond your capabilities to deal with. Just curious, where are you? Signature-Kelly kelly at farringtons dot net Check out www.snittens.com > If you got him from a no-kill shelter, which I think you said you did, then > return him. There's obviously something going on that is beyond your > capabilities to deal with. Just curious, where are you? We're in Western MA. The shelter said they'd take him back and "give me a credit towards a different cat." As if I want another cat. Cat piss, cat sh.t, cat dashing out the doors (he's an indoor cat, dammit) and having to be chased... I've spent uncounted amounts of money on trying different kitty litters, I've gotten him neutered and gotten all his shots, I've bought food and toys and litter boxes (he has three) and spend significant amounts of every day cleaning up after him. (He also throws up about once a week but I recall our former cat doing that, too.) And was does this cat give us in return? My husband says we should keep him because the kids and dog are attached to him. He says, (and I'll quote) "I don't mind cleaning up cat sh.t." Please note that in two months he's cleaned it up three times. I've done about 40 times. Plus I clean all three litter boxes and wipe the diarhea off the walls and clean up the puke. My daughter is the primary cat lover in the family (I would have said I liked cats, too, before this one) and she's out of town for the week. I hate to return him without giving her a chance to plead for his life. Someone else said it earlier: there's a cat out there who's going to be put to death that deserves it a lot less than this one. But at this point I'd have to be talked into even getting another cat ever again. (This was my third cat and the only one that's ever made me feel this way.) He's meowing loudly in the laundry-room right now. I feel like I've got an autistic foster child in the house. Dally > Plus I clean all three litter boxes and wipe the >diarhea off the walls and clean up the puke. Could the cleaners and sprays you use to discourage him from that room be causing this? -mhd > > Plus I clean all three litter boxes and wipe the > >diarhea off the walls and clean up the puke. > > Could the cleaners and sprays you use to discourage him from that room > be causing this? We've already established that she used bleach, which can have an ammonia smell to cats and attract them to eliminate there. >> > Plus I clean all three litter boxes and wipe the >> >diarhea off the walls and clean up the puke. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >We've already established that she used bleach, which can have an ammonia >smell to cats and attract them to eliminate there. She also mentioned some "oil" substance that supposedly discourages cats. I have since seen that she also has plants that the cat may have gotten into. -mhd >> > Plus I clean all three litter boxes and wipe the >> >diarhea off the walls and clean up the puke. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >We've already established that she used bleach, which can have an ammonia >smell to cats and attract them to eliminate there. I thought that got shot down since bleach mainly contains chlorine which does not mix with ammonia. -mhd >>We've already established that she used bleach, which can have an ammonia >>smell to cats and attract them to eliminate there. > I thought that got shot down since bleach mainly contains chlorine > which does not mix with ammonia. I've used cleaners with bleach (as well as enzyme cleaner) in the powder-room that he is not supposed to have access too. Yesterday I opened up the door to the powderroom and sprayed it with the orange oil in an attempt to make the room less enjoyable to him. I had never exposed him to the oil before yesterday and during the time he was having diarrhea he had no access to the powder-room with any cleaning residue (?) or any of the cleaning chemicals. This morning he was nosing at the powderroom door (which is back to being closed) and I sprayed him with a spray bottle. Aversion therapy is the next step: get kids to camp out on guard and spray him and shake loud objects when he goes in there. (That's what the oil was supposed to be about.) Dally > >>We've already established that she used bleach, which can have an ammonia > >>smell to cats and attract them to eliminate there. [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Dally Ok, I'm really feeling wierd abuot this whole thing now. So is this powder room the ONLY place "accidents" happen (aside from the diahrea which, he would have had NO control over , poor thing)? If so, why is not just keeping the door closed to that room an acceptable tactic? Why must you terrorize the cat even when the door is shut? I mean, treating the cat like this with kids squirting him and rattling at him when he isn't DOING anything is just going to make him more nervous and unhappy. To be honest, after reading all the posts, I really think maybe you all should not have a pet at this time in your lives. I'm beginning to really feel for the cat. > Ok, I'm really feeling wierd abuot this whole thing now. So is this powder > room the ONLY place "accidents" happen (aside from the diahrea which, he > would have had NO control over , poor thing)? Yes. (BTW, the diarrhea was in the litterbox.) > If so, why is not just keeping > the door closed to that room an acceptable tactic? I've mentioned this elsewhere. A half dozen kids come in and out to use that door. A half dozen clients have access to it a day, too. I've got a sign on the door asking to close it tightly, I've been training everyone, but still the door gets left ajar nearly every day at some point or another. And then the cat slips in there and comes up with a special surprise just for me. > Why must you terrorize > the cat even when the door is shut? I don't know that I must. My next step was to spray him or shake things at him when he goes in there to squat. Unfortunately, I've never, ever, ever caught him in the act, even though I follow him in there everytime I see him wonder over. I sprayed him at the door because it seemed like the next best thing. > I mean, treating the cat like this with > kids squirting him and rattling at him when he isn't DOING anything is just > going to make him more nervous and unhappy. He seems very happy and completely unphased. > To be honest, after reading all > the posts, I really think maybe you all should not have a pet at this time > in your lives. > I'm beginning to really feel for the cat. Do you think I should just let him sh.t on the floor every day? Some days he does it twice a day. Would that be being kind to him? Or should I send him back to the shelter as unadoptable? Would that be kind? My husband wants to send him to his brother's barn, figuring a neutered cat with rabies shots would be a welcome addition to the feral population. Would that be kinder? Honestly, what do you think I should do? Dally > > Ok, I'm really feeling wierd abuot this whole thing now. So is this powder > > room the ONLY place "accidents" happen (aside from the diahrea which, he [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > > Dally Well, Dally, we have given you loads of ideas. My plan would be keeping the door closed. Get a door closer. Megan has probably sent you extensive expert advise, use it. All I know is that there is a GREAT deal of hostility in your posts and you did NOT make it clear the diarrhea was in the box and you sounded MAD that the cat (disgusting cat as you called him) had gotten diarrhea on the walls. What are we to think? Honestly, I think you should contact Kelly H who would foster the cat. You do not sound like you are happy with this cat at all and that in turn is setting you up for failure no matter what you do. Maybe it's different in real life, but EVERYTHING you have posted oozes hositility towards this cat. We can only gather what we read. > Well, Dally, we have given you loads of ideas. My plan would be keeping the > door closed. Get a door closer. Megan has probably sent you extensive [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > EVERYTHING you have posted oozes hositility towards this cat. We can only > gather what we read. Fair enough. I came here two weeks ago and went off to use the ideas I got then. I came back when I failed. Yes, I'm frustrated. Yes, I'm venting. No, you're not wrong for picking up on my hostility. I'm starting to seriously consider giving him up, which necessitates some distancing. And I'm certainly hostile to the concept of a house covered in sh.t with a shit-tracking cat odorfying every inch of it. But I think you'd be wrong to consider me as behaving hostilely to the cat. Dally >But I think you'd be wrong to consider me as behaving hostilely to the cat. No I don't think that, but cats pick up the most subtle levels of stress and stress is transferable. -mhd > >But I think you'd be wrong to consider me as behaving hostilely to the cat. > > No I don't think that, but cats pick up the most subtle levels of stress and stress is transferable. Quite true and she is relatively new to the house, too. >>>But I think you'd be wrong to consider me as behaving hostilely to the > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Quite true and she is relatively new to the house, too. But this is too circular. We waited until we returned from a nice Florida vacation and then went kitty hunting at the beginning of May. We brought him into a happy, de-stressed situation. We were not particularly stressed about his first couple of poop incidents, just figured we'd better get his choice of litter box into that location. I certainly got stressed about it as the vacation approached at the end of June and I knew I had to hand off this problem kitty to pet-sitters, but I came back relieved to have conquored the problem (through the confinement solution) which turned out to only work until he got access to the room again. Voila, stress follows poop. Poop can't therefore be caused by stress. Dally > But this is too circular. We waited until we returned from a nice Florida vacation and then went kitty hunting at the beginning of May. > We brought him into a happy, de-stressed situation. We were not particularly stressed about his first couple of poop incidents, just figured we'd better get his choice of litter box into that location. Dally, even in humans any change is stressful. Just his being in a new place had to be stressful. And damn, your house has tons of traffic, kids and bigass LAB, right? Not quite the same thing as my rescue coming from the shelter to a two-person, both adults household with three levels one of which is essentially all hers and mine. > "Dally" <dally@myself.com> wrote in message >>We brought him into a happy, de-stressed situation. We were not > particularly stressed about his first couple of poop incidents, just [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > shelter to a two-person, both adults household with three levels one of > which is essentially all hers and mine. Okay, I'll grant you that he may have gone in the bathroom the first time out of stress. Or just not remebering where the litter box was. Or not being able to hold it until he got upstairs. That's why I wasn't worried about it. But shouldn't I expect the stress to have settled down by now? No one is mistreating him: the Lab doesn't chase him, the five year old adores him a bit too much but doesn't pull his tail or anything... he's a cat that likes to be around action. Did I mention that I brought our dog with us to the shelter when we were interviewing cats? We picked Odin partly because he was so great with our dog. They routinely lie stretched out side by side. I've seen the dog sniffing Odin's outstretched belly while Odin purrs. Our last cat was intimidated by the dog and I didn't want to go through that dynamic again. I kept wanting to lock our cat and dog in a small room and let them work it out, but the family insisted I just keep them apart. I'm still convinced that the dog would have emerged with a bloody nose and new respect for the cat and the cat would have emerged with renewed self-confidence, but I was consistently vetoed on this plan. (In retrospect it's just as well. Our cat developed a heart condition and dropped dead suddenly after we'd only had the dog about 14 months.) Dally Just a thought. maybe the stream of visitors using that room is the trigger. -mhd In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", 2004: > Just a thought. maybe the stream of visitors using that room is the > trigger. > > -mhd That thought crossed my mind, too. I also wonder if possibly trying something "off the wall" like garden soil in the litter box might lure him to it? Might be messy at first, but once he forms a habit it should be easy to slowly switch the mix over to kitty litter. SignatureCheryl > In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", > 2004: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > lure him to it? Might be messy at first, but once he forms a habit it > should be easy to slowly switch the mix over to kitty litter. Interesting idea. Lots of stranger in his territory. > In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", > 2004: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > lure him to it? Might be messy at first, but once he forms a habit it > should be easy to slowly switch the mix over to kitty litter. Another thing to try. Thanks. Dally In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", Dally <dally@myself.com> artfully composed this message within <news:2l7mljF9r4i9U2@uni-berlin.de> on 09 Jul 2004: >> In the fine newsgroup "rec.pets.cats.health+behav", >> Jul 2004: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Dally Good luck whatever you end up doing. I've sort of lost track of all the suggestions but I'm sure someone suggested putting a Feliway diffuser in the bathroom; it might help. SignatureCheryl >> "Dally" <dally@myself.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > > Dally I'm glad your family prevailed. It just would have terrified both of them. The cat may have died even sooner. >>Our last cat was intimidated by the dog and I didn't want to go through >>that dynamic again. I kept wanting to lock our cat and dog in a small [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > I'm glad your family prevailed. It just would have terrified both of them. > The cat may have died even sooner. I've been wondering whether this is worth debating. I let my family decide this one, but I always hated that I had to segregate my cat and dog. And the cat got the short end of the stick, she took to my daughter's bedroom with a swoon at the arrival of the dog and her days were severely circumscribed every after. I think what she lost in quality of life was significant - all because she wouldn't deal with the dog. Honestly, one swipe on the nose and that puppy would have learned her place! We didn't know at the time that the cat had a heart condition. We found out a year after the dog arrived. I've always wondered if the inactivity and weight-gain that came when the cat took to her room might be at least partially to blame for the heart problem. So who knows. I might have been right. I'll never know. Dally > >>Our last cat was intimidated by the dog and I didn't want to go through > >>that dynamic again. I kept wanting to lock our cat and dog in a small [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Dally I think that there was another choice. You could have done a gradual introduction, as most people do. Maybe you tried that, but your post does not suggest it. > > Well, Dally, we have given you loads of ideas. My plan would be keeping the > > door closed. Get a door closer. Megan has probably sent you extensive [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Dally How cat that possibly be when you admit to having so many hostile feelings involving the cat? Cats pick up on things you know. Or maybe you don't. They can tell when air pressure changes let alone tempers. You don't have to beat on him for him to sense your displeasure, especially when you are so vituperative about it here. >A half dozen clients have access to it a day, too. What are you running, a coffee shop? :-) -mhd >>A half dozen clients have access to it a day, too. > > What are you running, a coffee shop? :-) Close. Dally > > Ok, I'm really feeling wierd abuot this whole thing now. So is this powder > > room the ONLY place "accidents" happen (aside from the diahrea which, he [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > > Dally put a litter box in his 'chosen spot'.? That's how you housetrain a rabbit. They pick the spot and stay with that spot, you just put the paper down. >put a litter box in his 'chosen spot'.? >That's how you housetrain a rabbit. They pick the spot and stay with that >spot, you just put the paper down. We had a rabbit litter trained. Once she was comfortable with the litterbox we could put it anywhere, she'd always use it even when she was given free run of the house. SignatureSticks and stones may break my bones, but, whips and chains excite me. > >>We've already established that she used bleach, which can have an ammonia smell to cats and attract them to eliminate there. > > I thought that got shot down since bleach mainly contains chlorine which does not mix with ammonia. > I've used cleaners with bleach (as well as enzyme cleaner) in the powder-room that he is not supposed to have access too. Yeah, that was it. The bleach apparently keeps the enzymatic cleaner from working. And one of our resident chemists did shoot down the bleach/ammonia connection, but I think it was due to the fact that bleach had to be mixed with another sort of cleaner to release ammonia? > Aversion therapy is the next step: get kids to camp out on guard and spray him and shake loud objects when he goes in there. (That's what the oil was supposed > to be about.) Well bless you for continuing to try. However--I have to say--it you cannot manage to persuade children with forebrains, thumbs, and language skills, along with the adults in your house, to keep the bathroom door closed, I have doubts that you will be able to persuade the cat from pooping in there. > Well bless you for continuing to try. However--I have to say--it you cannot > manage to persuade children with forebrains, thumbs, and language skills, > along with the adults in your house, to keep the bathroom door closed, I > have doubts that you will be able to persuade the cat from pooping in there. I had clients straight through from 10:00 until 2:15. I just got up and went into the bathroom and the door was open. A client left it open. I've got a sign on the door, I'm teaching everyone to do it, but I've got three kids, they've all got friends who come over frequently... the downstairs powder-room is arguably the busiest room in the house. I can go days without the cat gaining access to it, but as soon as he does he sh.ts in the same place in there again. And to answer Karen, no, he has no incontinence issues anywhere else. He did urinate on an upstairs floor this week but I think it was in response to a mirror - marking his territory for the cat he saw there. I did NOT use enzyme cleaner on that (I felt like I got the odor up enough for me and figured he'd just remark it if he felt he had to.) His diarrhea episodes were in the litterbox - that was at a time when he had no access to the powder-room. I'm still trying to figure out what he's thinking. It's not the kitty litter, it's not the box, it's not privacy, it's not illness, it's not stress... I believe it has some weird kitty connection in his brain. Another point: he lies and watches us clean it up. In fact, I can tell now from the way he lies intently watching that door that he's sh.t in there. He finds the sight of us handling his sh.t to be very interesting - as if we were holding a catnip ball or something. I wish I knew what he was thinking. He gets some sort of payoff for this. Dally >Another point: he lies and watches us clean it up. In fact, I can tell >now from the way he lies intently watching that door that he's sh.t in >there. He finds the sight of us handling his sh.t to be very >interesting - as if we were holding a catnip ball or something. Every cat I have ever owned loves to watch me do everything from cleaning the litter box to wiring a server closet. They are just curios as hell especially when it's something of theirs I'm messing with. -mhd >>Another point: he lies and watches us clean it up. In fact, I can tell >>now from the way he lies intently watching that door that he's sh.t in [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > curios as hell especially when it's something of theirs I'm messing > with. Good point. I just mention it in case it's some behavioral clue that will help me solve this. I figure if I just spout dialogue long enough some clever diagnotician will see something that triggers an "aha!" moment. Dally circa Thu, 08 Jul 2004 16:41:51 -0400, in rec.pets.cats.health+behav, Dally (dally@myself.com) said, > >>Another point: he lies and watches us clean it up. In fact, I can tell > >>now from the way he lies intently watching that door that he's sh.t in [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > will help me solve this. I figure if I just spout dialogue long enough > some clever diagnotician will see something that triggers an "aha!" moment. Okay, a thought. You know those doormats that are a rough, bristly texture? They're made of sisal or something, but instead of being woven and ropy, they're actually just like a huge bristle brush lying bristle-side up. Can you find some of those, cut them to shape (you'll need a hefty utility knife) and put them everywhere on the floor of that bathroom except where the litterbox is? I know that my cats don't like the texture of those mats under their feet; I'm betting yours won't, either. And if he doesn't like standing on 'em, he probably won't like pooping on 'em, either. Might be worth a shot. Laura SignatureExperience is the name every one gives to their mistakes. -Oscar Wilde > circa Thu, 08 Jul 2004 16:41:51 -0400, in rec.pets.cats.health+behav, > Dally (dally@myself.com) said, [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Might be worth a shot. Thanks, Laura, that was a great suggestion and similar to what I did implement: I laid down bubble wrap which I sprayed with citris oil. It's been nearly a week. I picked the bubble wrap up when I mopped but laid it back down again and it's still there, so I don't know if the habit is broken yet, but the bubble wrap is easy to move around and it appears to be abhorrent to the cat. Dally >From: Dally dally@myself.com >and during the time he was >having diarrhea he had no access to the powder-room with any cleaning >residue (?) or any of the cleaning chemicals. What does your vet say about the diarrhea? ________ See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm >>From: Dally dally@myself.com > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > What does your vet say about the diarrhea? I didn't take him to the vet about the diarrhea. It happened when I was away on vacation and the cat was alone with a jade plant and I think he chewed on it until he got sick. I got the pet-sitter to move the jade tree. By the time I returned home he was all better. He had a physical when he was four months old, then he's been to the vet for neutering, shots and ear mite check. I have discussed his pooping issues with the vet but we think it's behaviorally based, either something he doesn't like about the litter box or some game he's playing. That's why I came here. (Not to troll, as someone suggested!) Dally > "Dally" <dally@myself.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > He may have been stressed about the confinement and everyone being gone. Actually, I think he got access to a houseplant he shouldn't have been eating. He likes to chomp on the asparagus fern, jade tree and philodendren. They appear to give him the runs. I meant to remove all the houseplants, but a jade tree was accidently left in a room he had access to for part of the time we were gone. (When I realized it I had the pet-sitter move it... one of four phone calls I had from the pet-sitter about this damn cat while we were on vacation.) But he may have minded everyone being gone. He's a cat that is particularly interested in hanging out where we are, which I like. He doesn't like to be alone. (This is markedly different from my last cat who couldn't care less if we were around.) That's why I paid petsitters for so many visits. Dally Dally, Could you please send me a valid email addy I could send info to? Thanks. Megan Signature"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -Edmund Burke Learn The TRUTH About Declawing http://www.stopdeclaw.com Zuzu's Cats Photo Album: http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22 "Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision, raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his way." - W.H. Murray > Dally, > Could you please send me a valid email addy I could send info to? > Thanks. This one's valid. I just don't check it much. I'll check it tomorrow. Dally >This one's valid. I just don't check it >much. I'll check it tomorrow. Ok. Keep your chin up. :-) This is by no means a hopeless case without a solution. Megan Signature"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -Edmund Burke Learn The TRUTH About Declawing http://www.stopdeclaw.com Zuzu's Cats Photo Album: http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22 "Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision, raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his way." - W.H. Murray >>This one's valid. I just don't check it >>much. I'll check it tomorrow. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Megan Megan, I'm not just here to rant. Okay, well, maybe I mostly am. :-) But I also think there's just some piece, some insight, some trick that I haven't yet learned. I keep hoping someone will come up with some solution that works for our family. Dally >Tell me one reason why I ought not to bring him back to the shelter? A had a cat who would not poo in the litter box but he'd sometimes pee in there. Turned out his sensitive persian paws were allergic to the litter I was using. I changed it to an unscented type and he never missed again. I had to put extra litter boxes around the house with the new litter. Then I had to clean with enzymatic cleaner all the places he'd soil. I also put upside down carpet runners on those spots. It took some patience but he was okay. He also had colitis and would get diarrhea if he was upset or ate anything other than chicken and rice food that I made for him. >>Tell me one reason why I ought not to bring him back to the shelter? > > A had a cat who would not poo in the litter box but he'd sometimes pee in > there. Turned out his sensitive persian paws were allergic to the litter I was > using. I changed it to an unscented type and he never missed again. This cat just has a fixation on one corner of my downstairs powder-room. We've been through four kinds of litter and he has the litterbox configuration he likes best. When we confine him to the room where his litterbox is he never has an accident. We've been confining him in two different rooms just for variety (a day place and a night place) and he never has any litterbox problems. Until he gets into the downstairs powderroom. Then he sh.ts on the floor. Then he lies on the floor outside the room watching us intently as we clean it up. >I had to > put extra litter boxes around the house with the new litter. Then I had to > clean with enzymatic cleaner all the places he'd soil. I've done this. > I also put upside down > carpet runners on those spots. I haven't tried this. Because the toilet is right there it's hard to carpet it, per se, but I could place foil all over the floor or something. All my other attempts at filling that spot have only resulted in him sh.tting directly in front of the barricade, though, so I suspect this would involve carpeting the whole bathroom. That I just had professionally tiled. Today I allowed him access to the powder-room after two weeks of confinement getting litter-box trained. That didn't work. I also bought a special oil cats weren't supposed to like and sprayed it there. That didn't work. I also watched him walk into the bathroom and pee while I held a spray bottle getting ready to spray him if he squatted. That didn't work - he came back to poop after I stopped watching. > It took some patience but he was okay. He also > had colitis and would get diarrhea if he was upset or ate anything other than > chicken and rice food that I made for him. He got diarrhea unless you made him a special diet? Or if he got upset? And you thought those were acceptable living terms? Dally >>> Tell me one reason why I ought not to bring him back to the shelter? >> [quoted text clipped - 55 lines] > > Dally Why must you leave that door open? >> I haven't tried this. Because the toilet is right there it's hard to >> carpet it, per se, but I could place foil all over the floor or [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >> >> Dally I know I'm piggybacking, sorry. I don't have the original. Dally, it sounds like you've exhausted every avenue that I know of. Is it out of the question for you to consult a animal behaviorist? Sherry > >>Tell me one reason why I ought not to bring him back to the shelter? > > [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > > Dally Have you considered installing an door closer on this bathroom door? That way even if someone forgets to pull the door closed it would close itself. W "Dally" <dally@myself.com> wrote : > He is such an incredibly disgusting foul > cat!) It really does sound like it. And you have done your best. Yes, I would take him back to the shelter--if it is "no kill," I would have no qualms about it. Loving cats does not mean that you have to live with filth. Honestly, if it were me, I'd clean up the cat sh.t for a while longer. At six months, he's just a young 'un and has plenty of time to solve the behavior, which for whatever reason, sounds stress-related. Sometimes it just takes time. If it doesn't bother your husband so much, then why can't bathroom maintenance become his job? Is there some reason why they can't pitch in a bit more? My former feral has had occaisonal incontinence. It used to be a few times a month, and now it's only happened once in the last five months. It's all about her stress level and now that she has a stable living situation and her fear threshold is improving, she doesn't lose control anymore. The only solution was time, patience, good humor and love - the things we do for family members when they have problems. Sure, it's frustrating. And why should you? Because if you don't, then somebody else will have to do it down the line and you've already put two months of cleaning up into it. Why waste it all? Especially if the rest of your family likes the cat. Just make them do their share of the work so it doesn't all fall on you. > Odin, my six month old cat, had been doing bowel movements on the tile > floor in my bathroom every day since the day I got him from a shelter [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > of the walls when I got home. He is such an incredibly disgusting foul > cat!) No, he isn't. He is an incredibly unhappy cat for some reason, one that you cannot seem to identify (not for lack of trying). Cats aren't inherently "foul". It is a behavior he is exhibiting for a reason. Take the cat back to the shelter you adopted him from, and take a break before you consider another pet. He is unhappy, you are unhappy - no reason to continue to make you both suffer. -L. >No, he isn't. He is an incredibly unhappy cat for some reason, one >that you cannot seem to identify (not for lack of trying). Cats [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >-L. That's why I suggested an animal behaviorist that would see first-hand the environment and the cat's behavior. On second thought, there's a whole mountain of resentment now between the cat & owner, and I wonder if there's not "too much water under the bridge." to correct the problem. It's so deep-seated by now, it's not going to be easy to change the behavior while remaining with the same owners. She mentioned there's a woman at the shelter willing to take him and work with him. Maybe she ought to give that a shot. Sherry > That's why I suggested an animal behaviorist that would see first-hand the > environment and the cat's behavior. I'm not against it, although I'm getting sick of throwing (scarce) money at this problem. > On second thought, there's a whole mountain > of resentment now between the cat & owner, and I wonder if there's not "too > much water under the bridge." to correct the problem. The part you're not picking up on, the part I'm not really expanding on (partly because it hurts) is that everyone here really likes this cat. I don't resent the cat, I resent having to live with sh.t on my floor. I don't kick the cat or yell at him, for example. I don't even pick him up and throw him in the laundry-room when I see him watching me clean up his sh.t. I just wonder what he's thinking, what I can do, what's the payoff for him. > It's so deep-seated by > now, it's not going to be easy to change the behavior while remaining with the > same owners. I'm scared of this. Mostly because I have no idea what the pattern is that causes him to use that particular piece of floor. He never goes right outside that bathroom door (the whole area is done in the same tile) nor does he go in any other corner of that room, nor does he go on any other floor in any other room. > She mentioned there's a woman at the shelter willing to take him > and work with him. Maybe she ought to give that a shot. I'm positive that she wouldn't see the problem. Not unless she came to my powder-room. Dally >om: Dally dally@myself.com >The part you're not picking up on, the part I'm not really expanding on >(partly because it hurts) is that everyone here really likes this cat. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >his sh.t. I just wonder what he's thinking, what I can do, what's the >payoff for him. Contrary to what some might believe, IMO cats are not creatures that do things on purpose to upset people. There's a reason your cat is doing what he's doing. I can't help wonder if he's stressed from his living situation. You say you have clients there, plus you also said you have children and a dog. Some cats just do better in a quieter environment. Lauren ________ See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm > >No, he isn't. He is an incredibly unhappy cat for some reason, one > >that you cannot seem to identify (not for lack of trying). Cats [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > of resentment now between the cat & owner, and I wonder if there's not "too > much water under the bridge." to correct the problem. Yep. I didn't want to come right out and say it, but the cat shouldn't stay with anyone who is willing to call it "foul". I'm not saying her frustration isn't warranted, but I don't think anything productive can come from this pairing and the cat is suffering. >It's so deep-seated by > now, it's not going to be easy to change the behavior while remaining with the > same owners. She mentioned there's a woman at the shelter willing to take him > and work with him. Maybe she ought to give that a shot. Yep. -L. > Yep. I didn't want to come right out and say it, but the cat > shouldn't stay with anyone who is willing to call it "foul". I'm not > saying her frustration isn't warranted, but I don't think anything > productive can come from this pairing and the cat is suffering. First of all, this cat is NOT suffering. He's loving, affectionate, happy, calm, beseiged with small people, great friends with the dog... he shows no signs of kitty stress. He doesn't appear to be a vindictive cat (and I've seen those before.) Secondly, calling something foul when discussing unpleasant bowel evacuation habits is not an ad hominem attack. He is foul. I make allowances for him being young. At first he wouldn't cover his poop in the litter boxes he DOES use - possibly because he liked to admire it. I've trained him out of that. But before he covered, he'd frequently step into it and track it around the house. He also doesn't do a good job of licking himself clean. I have wiped his little butt with cotton puffs on a number of occasions. He's not itching or anything, he's just going around with an odorous berry still attached. The spraying diarrhea could happen to anyone. Still doesn't make it less foul. Dally > > Yep. I didn't want to come right out and say it, but the cat > > shouldn't stay with anyone who is willing to call it "foul". I'm not [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > he shows no signs of kitty stress. He doesn't appear to be a vindictive > cat (and I've seen those before.) There is something clearly wrong with this situation, though, or the cat wouldn't be exhibiting the behavior. > Secondly, calling something foul when discussing unpleasant bowel > evacuation habits is not an ad hominem attack. He is foul. I make [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > The spraying diarrhea could happen to anyone. Still doesn't make it > less foul. In your first post in this thread you said, "He is such an incredibly disgusting foul cat!" It isn't the cat's fault, and it sounded like you are blaming him for the behavior. That's not a situation in which I would ever recommend leaving an animal. If I misinterpreted your post, then I'm sorry. -L. >>>Yep. I didn't want to come right out and say it, but the cat >>>shouldn't stay with anyone who is willing to call it "foul". I'm not [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > There is something clearly wrong with this situation, though, or the > cat wouldn't be exhibiting the behavior. Yeah, it must be my evilness. Thanks for you input. Dally > > There is something clearly wrong with this situation, though, or the cat wouldn't be exhibiting the behavior. > Yeah, it must be my evilness. Thanks for you input. "L" is the person who suggested you take Odin back to the shelter when you first posted. Even though this would mean a death sentence for him. You have definitely made mistakes with this cat--but I'm glad you're still trying to work with him. I really think he needs a quieter environment, even if you were to confine him to the upstairs. You have a cat with a problem that you helped create/perpetuate. I understand that you have trouble keeping doors closed in your busy house, but if you want to keep him, can't you keep him upstairs, in his own little area--or at least away from that bathroom for a while? > "L" is the person who suggested you take Odin back > to the shelter when you first posted. Even though this would mean a death > sentence for him. I had forgotten that. I didn't mind that advice, it is still the Last Option and I don't want to say I'd never do it, but I'm here trying to find other options. > You have definitely made mistakes with this cat--but I'm glad you're still > trying to work with him. I really think he needs a quieter environment, even [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > you keep him upstairs, in his own little area--or at least away from that > bathroom for a while? What is "a while"? I'm not being argumentative here, but what do you mean? We kept him confined to two small rooms for two weeks (at night in one room, during the day in another). When we were home during this time I went in frequently to snuggle and play with him (this is also back when I was cleaning his boxes four times a day so you know I really was in there a lot.) Was two weeks not long enough in the life of a 6 month old? I agree that we have a busy house, but Odin's personality seems to thrive on that. We don't force him to come play. Odin tends to prefer to lie smack dab in the middle of the kitchen floor - awake, watching things. He meows to get into rooms if we're behind closed doors and he's outside. I really wouldn't say he suffers from lack of quality attention, except during the 11 days we were away recently (during that time he has three visits a day.) Odin sleeps very little - certainly much less than my obese older cat with a heart condition. We think this is reasonable for a 6 month old male kitten, but perhaps he's hyperthyroid or something. He's certainly "hyper"! For example, he wakes us up at dawn wanting to play. Should we FORCE him to have some quiet time, sort of akin to putting down a baby for a nap? Another interesting thing about Odin - he has never scratched anyone. We were just talking about that last night. My five year old tends to carry him around supported over two outstretched arms. Odin appears perfectly happy with this treatment. He doesn't run and hide from anyone - not the dog, not the boy - and in fact he seeks out activity. Last night he was teasing the dog, trying to get the dog to chase him. Dally > > "L" is the person who suggested you take Odin back > > to the shelter when you first posted. Even though this would mean a death [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > What is "a while"? How would I know? Just settle him elsewhere, away from the battle of wills and all the confusion downstairs. Let him out once a week, and if he poops in the bathroom, gently show it to him, and put him back upstairs. Do you want a solution, or do you just want to continue the stand-off with this cat and to bitch about it here? You KNOW this is not working, but you are stubbornly refusing to give in and change the cat's living situation. You cannot bend a cat to your will. Work with him. [snip] > I agree that we have a busy house, but Odin's >personality seems to thrive on that. So let him thrive and clean up the goddamned poop, or make a greater effort to keep the door closed down there. Either you change his living situation or YOU change. Period. You cannot have it your way--status quo--and get him to stop the behavior you dislike. In a nutshell: 1. Clean up the poop and get used to it. 2. Keep the gd bathroom door closed or 3. Confine the cat upstairs, letting him out once a week, then reconfining him if he poops in the bathroom. There are no other solutions unless you just take him back to the shelter where he will be killed. You've tried everything. > So let him thrive and clean up the goddamned poop, or make a greater effort > to keep the door closed down there. Either you change his living situation [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > There are no other solutions unless you just take him back to the shelter > where he will be killed. You've tried everything. Okay, thanks for all your help. I'm not being sarcastic, I really mean it. I've gotten lots of inspiration and insight into this problem here. I regret the way I come across as argumentative when I really ought to be saying, "thanks - usenet comes to the rescue again with a diversity of viewpoints and opinions that help illuminate the issue." Dally >> > "L" is the person who suggested you take Odin back >> > to the shelter when you first posted. Even though this would mean a [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] >There are no other solutions unless you just take him back to the shelter >where he will be killed. You've tried everything. I'm not being obtuse, but I so do not understand the point in all this. Are these assumptions correct? 1. Crapping in the floor is the *only* obstacle to this cat suddenly becoming a loved, happy member of the household. 2. The cat craps nowhere else in the house except the bathroom. 3. If the bathroom door is shut, the cat craps in the litterbox like a normal cat. Shut the door. Keep the door shut. It's not rocket science. All I'm hearing are *excuses* why this can't be accomplished. I so do not get it. Sherry > I'm not being obtuse, but I so do not understand the point in all this. Arethese assumptions correct? > 1. Crapping in the floor is the *only* obstacle to this cat suddenly becoming a loved, happy member of the household. > 2. The cat craps nowhere else in the house except the bathroom. > 3. If the bathroom door is shut, the cat craps in the litterbox like a normal > cat. > > Shut the door. Keep the door shut. It's not rocket science. All I'm hearing are *excuses* why this can't be accomplished. I so do not get it. All your assumptions are correct. That is why I think it is not enough for Dally to stop him from pooping in the bathroom--she wants to bend him to her will. Have her house open, no closed doors, no hassles in changing the behavior of children or clients, but somehow force Odin not to poop in the bathroom. The fact that this is not happening is the source of her frustration. Frankly, if I had clients in and out all day, I would be about as embarrassed by orange-sprayed bubble wrap as by a pile of misplaced poop. > I'm not being obtuse, but I so do not understand the point in all this. Are > these assumptions correct? > > 1. Crapping in the floor is the *only* obstacle to this cat suddenly becoming a > loved, happy member of the household. Correct. We've had other annoyances and adjustments, like him meowing at dawn, him streaking out a door when it's opened (he's an INSIDE cat, dammit), him chomping on houseplants... all of these things are pedestrian accomodations that I don't mind handling. The only truly unacceptable behavior is the powder-room problem. > 2. The cat craps nowhere else in the house except the bathroom. Nowhere else unacceptable - true. > 3. If the bathroom door is shut, the cat craps in the litterbox like a normal > cat. True. > Shut the door. Keep the door shut. It's not rocket science. All I'm hearing are > *excuses* why this can't be accomplished. > I so do not get it. In the end I may have to just do that, and just know that inevitable mistakes closing the warped 1885 solid wood door will end up requiring a cat clean-up, and once in a while a client will be the one to discover this. Maybe I can live with this. I'm just not reconciled to it yet. I'm still holding out for an answer that cures the problem rather than just masks the symptoms. Because I know that your solution isn't a particularly viable one in my household for a variety of reasons (which I udnerstand you believe to be "excuses"). Did I tell you about that door? We found it in our basement and refinished it. It was missing some hardware so I stayed up all night to bid on some period hardware on e-bay that matched the other doors in the house. We custom built the frame and got an antique strike for it, too. It definitely closes, but it's a bit quirky. This was part of an extensive renovation we did to our 1885 Victorian house last summer. We spent gobs of time hunting for period architecture (bead board, moulding, etc) and refinishing it and it really looks great. I'm not normally house-proud, but this particular powder-room was something that was enormously important to me. I don't mean to just be giving you excuses, but the context seems important to me - that room was planned for six years and cost me $15K. It's just not that easy to abandon it to a kitten. Dally > In the end I may have to just do that, and just know that inevitable mistakes closing the warped 1885 solid wood Sand the edges until it closes properly. It will not lose any of its historical significance. If it is hard to close, then whoever hung it did not do a good job. > > In the end I may have to just do that, and just know that inevitable > mistakes closing the warped 1885 solid wood > > Sand the edges until it closes properly. It will not lose any of its > historical significance. If it is hard to close, then whoever hung it did > not do a good job. I'd take the door down, go buy a cheap one, put a door closer on the cheap one so the dang door stays closed. Maybe 6 mo. a year from now try taking the door closer off. If kitty doesn't find the powder room so interesting you put the fancy dancy solid wood Victorian door back up and life goes on. I don't know what your business is but do your customers pay to look at your 1885 solid wood powder room door? Since you just renovated this room I'm wondering if there wasn't some substance, paint, grout, adhesive, caulk ... something that is gassing out and producing an odor that is attracting the cat to this particular room. Give it a period of time the odor might fade and the problem take care of itself if you can keep kitty the heck out of there and let the dust settle around your house. Otherwise rehome this cat. W > > I'm not being obtuse, but I so do not understand the point in all this. Are > > these assumptions correct? [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > Dal |
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