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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / December 2007

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Cold, Virus, Antiobiotics Questions

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Lump - 04 Dec 2007 02:13 GMT
I am sorry to bother you all again.  You were so kind to me when my
cat, Madeleine, got sick and then died early this year.  I haven't
contributed anything, really.  I feel like i don't know anything
anymore.

Madsie's sister, Grendel, is still with me.  Grendel is fifteen years
old but has now been diagnosed with a herpes virus.  We found this out
when i became concerned because of how she was sneezing and had
symptoms very like what i remember Madeleine having.  Her chest just
sounded congested, so we took her to the vet and that is when he
diagnosed the virus.  He prescribed antibiotics for her, too and gave
her an antibiotic shot.  I realize that antibiotics don't cure the
virus but that perhaps they get rid of any other infection she might
have?

Well, i am very worried because Grendel actually seems worse than she
was before.  It's been a few days and i don't have a good feeling.

I should also mention that she has early stage CRF and we feed her
special food because of that.

So, with that information, there are some things i am wondering and
worrying about.

Can antiobiotics make a cat very sick?  I know from my own personal
experience that the ones for humans can make me feel a little sick but
nothing really extraordinary.  Ever since she came back from the vet
it is hard to get her to eat and we have reluctantly force fed her so
that she will have nutrition and so that we can give her the
antibiotics with something in her stomach.  She does still drink on
her own but not as much as she usually does.

She just hasn't seemed like herself since she came back from the vet.
I would have expected to see at least a little improvement by now.

I know antibiotics are not supposed to be stopped, but i am really
afraid they're making her sick.  I know i am not a doctor but my
observation is that, before we took her to the vet, she did had those
sniffly, congested symptoms, but she was herself, alert, trotting
around, happy... but since the vet visit, the shot, and giving her the
antibiotics, she has gotten much worse.  She is very lethargic and
eats hardly anything, she is starting to be afraid of us because of
the force feeding and having to force the antibiotics, too.  (We've
tried different forms back in the past, the liquid with the dropper,
the pills and the pill pockets.  She actually liked the pill pockets
at first but got to where she hated them.  We hid this morning's pill
in some butter and it actually worked relatively well, for her.)

Anywa, the less she eats the weaker she gets.  The more we force feed
her, the more she hides and is afraid.  It breaks my heart to see her
so stressed out.  That is how she seems, very stressed out like she
just wants to be left alone, when normally, she is an extremely lovey-
dovey, cuddley, and energetic cat.

I am going to take her to a different vet if she is not improved
tomorrow.  I am starting not to trust our main vet.

I guess my main questions are, could the antibiotics actually be
making her worse?  And is there anything i should ask my vet about,
any special meds, or any exams, any ideas at all?

I feel so stupid because i have been taking care of cats all my life.
I have never had such bad experiences as with Madeleine, and now with
Grendel.  I used to feel like i always knew what was going on but now
i am perplexed and feel like i know nothing at all.

I still have not gotten over Madeleine's death this year, i doubt that
i ever will, and i am feeling very scared, wary, and suspicious.  If
Grendel gets any worse, of course i will do everything i can for her,
but i don't know how i am going to handle myself.  I love her with all
my heart and i am afraid of making a mistake.

If anyone has any knowledge or ideas, i would be so grateful to know.

Thank you all again.
Matthew - 04 Dec 2007 03:19 GMT
Call your vet ASAP   Yes antibiotics can be bad for a cat if it is allergic
to it or having a bad reaction to it

>I am sorry to bother you all again.  You were so kind to me when my
> cat, Madeleine, got sick and then died early this year.  I haven't
[quoted text clipped - 71 lines]
>
> Thank you all again.
cindys - 04 Dec 2007 03:30 GMT
Hi, Lump. I was thinking about you just this morning and wondering how you
were doing.

>I am sorry to bother you all again.

You're not a bother, not at all.

If you don't mind, I'm going to cut to the chase. I don't know the answer to
your question about the antibiotics, but I do want to comment about the food
part of your post:

1.  The number one issue (besides the respiratory problem) is that Grendel
needs to eat.  Forget the special kidney diet. I am now on my second cat
with CRF, and I don't feed him a low protein kidney diet and his numbers
have actually improved in the last year and a half.  For the last year of
Molly's life, the only thing she would eat was human tuna. So, that was what
I fed her and supplemented her with a feline vitamin so that she would get
all the nutrients, especially the taurine, that isn't found in human tuna.
At the very end, I went to the butcher and bought a rib steak and cooked it
and shredded it and handfed it to her. Molly lived for two years with the
diagnosis of CRF.

2.  Alex was diagnosed with CRF a little over a year ago. His BUN and
creatinine numbers have actually improved. I do not and never have fed him a
special kidney diet. The rationale for the low protein diet is that
digesting protein puts stress on the kidneys. But the flip side is that cats
need protein to maintain muscle mass. But at this point, the main thing is
that Grendel needs nutrition. If I were you,  I would go to the local Petco
or Petsmart (or even your local supermarket) and pick up a variety of canned
cat foods and see if any of these appeals to Grendel. It doesn't matter
which one. The best one for Grendel at this point is the one she is willing
to eat. Pro-Plan has a reputation for being tasty. Just try to pick one that
doesn't have high phosphorus, if you can. Alex really likes Fancy Feast
Salmon Feast. Unfortunately, that is a little higher on the phosphorus scale
(he is taking a phosphorus binder). Science Diet canned food for 7+ year old
cats is very low phosphorus. I got lucky with the beef flavor. The turkey
and chicken flavors didn't interest him. Here is a webpage which lists
phosphorus content for a variety of canned cat foods:
http://webpages.charter.net/katkarma/canfood.htm But the main thing is to
get her to eat on her own.

CRUCIAL POINT: *****3. Another thing is that a major reason why CRF kitties
don't eat is because they feel nauseated. Ask your vet if you can give
Grendel 2.5 or 5 mg of Pepcid (famotidine) each day. You should see an
improvement within 24 hours. You may also want to try offering her some
plain yogurt (no fruit).*****

Please call your vet first thing in the morning and ask about the Pepcid. I
really think that could make a huge difference in her eating. And please
keep us posted. I will be checking frequently for your follow-up.
Purrs and hugs for Grendel and you.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.

>You were so kind to me when my
> cat, Madeleine, got sick and then died early this year.  I haven't
[quoted text clipped - 71 lines]
>
> Thank you all again.
cindys - 04 Dec 2007 13:24 GMT
Regarding the food issue: One more thing I want to mention is that there is
a prescription food called A/D which is supposed very appealing to cats.
When we went away for a few days last year, I made the mistake of boarding
Alex at the vet. He was upset at first and wouldn't eat. So, they offered
him canned A/D and he wolfed it down. The unfortunate part is that it needed
to be introduced SLOWLY, mixed with other food, if the cat will eat it.
Otherwise, the cat will get diarrhea, which is what happened to Alex. They
subsequently admitted Alex was eating his Fancy Feast in short order (once
they gave him his Pepcid), so he really didn't require the A/D. They just
panicked. But I understand they meant well. (It took a day or two of plain
yogurt and Pepcid to get things back in order). Anyway, A/D would be another
possible option for Grendel (in SMALL quantities).
Best regards,
---Cindy S.

> Hi, Lump. I was thinking about you just this morning and wondering how you
> were doing.
[quoted text clipped - 125 lines]
>>
>> Thank you all again.
cindys - 04 Dec 2007 14:45 GMT
Lump, one more thing:  Can you take Grendel to another vet? My gut instinct
tells me you should do that.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
Lump - 05 Dec 2007 19:09 GMT
I meant to post last night but was so tired.

I want to thank you both for replying.  Cindy, thank you so much for
all the details, you're so kind to take the time and i appreciate it
and am grateful to you.

Grendel is so much better.   The night i posted, i had such a bad
feeling and i was afraid to give her the antibiotic so i didn't.
Yesterday morning she seemed a little better and we got her into the
other vet yesterday afternoon, by which time she seemed even more
improved.  He is so much more thorough than the vet we usually go to
and, as i mentioned before, i don't trust our regular vet anymore.

He said there are a lot of things that could be going on and i'm
afraid i am too tired to even remember it all.  Basically, though,
after checking her over, he said she seemed well and didn't appear to
have any infections and that it was okay to stop giving her the
antibiotics.  He said if she didn't seem fully well this morning to
bring her back.

Well, last night she was back to her old self.  Meowing, trotting
around, purring and with the look in her face.  She definitely has her
appetite back, as if she's trying to make up for all the time she
couldn't eat.  This morning, she is her usual cuddly self and seems
happy and well.  :)

Thank you again! <3
cindys - 05 Dec 2007 19:20 GMT
>I meant to post last night but was so tired.
>
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>
> Thank you again! <3
-----------
Happy! Happy! Happy! I am SO glad you posted back. I was really fearing the
worst.
Many, many purrs for Grendel's continued good health!
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
Sheelagh>"o"< - 06 Dec 2007 16:21 GMT
> I meant to post last night but was so tired.
>
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>
> Thank you again! <3

Hi Lump,

It is great to see you around again. I'm just sorry that it isn't
under better circumstances. I have been away for just under a week, so
only just read your post.
I'm delighted to hear that you took Cindy & Matthew's advice because
it is very good advice. We are also very pleased to her that you do
trust your current vet. this can be a very important factor when it
comes to allowing someone to treat your precious little Grendel. Go
with your gut feeling & follow his/ her advice. The more comfortable
you feel, the easier it is to talk to them about your hopes & fears.
They will understand how important this is to you, also once this is
achieved, you can trust them implicitly.

To hear that Grendel has got over this little Blip is excellent.
Please don't allow yourself to become too worried, simply because her
sister, Madeleine, had a similar experience. It is all too easy to
become convinced that you will go over old ground, because the
symptoms are somewhat similar. In 90% of cases, it might not be the
same thing at all.

Personally, I think you already knew what you needed to do, & you went
with your instinct's, which resulted in how well she seems today. Well
done :o)

Keep us posted with how things are going, when you have the time to if
you wouldn't mind of course? Also, thank you for sharing this news
about Grendel too.
Warm Regards,
Sheelagh >"o"<
 
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