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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / October 2007End of my cat pee-pee rope!
Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic measures. But I am at the end of my rope with Mimi. Mimi is my tortie I have had since she was 7 weeks, and she's 17.5 now. Off and on over the last 5 or 6 years she's peed outside the litterbox, I thought, as an accident - she'd hang her butt over the edge and pee. It would happen every few weeks. No big deal. Well, since we lost Peewee, it got worse - I thought it was the litterbox, so I changed to a covered box. That worked great for about 2 or 3 months. Now she's (I think) hanging her butt out the end of the covered box and peeing on the floor. It's happening every day now, and it's frustrating as hell. She's got beginning stages of CRF, so she's peeing more than normal. She's been to the vet and other than a bit of arthritis in her back hips which she's had forever, and the CRF, everything else checks as normal. I have tried (over the years and the last few months) huge, wide and low boxes, a box with the side cut down so she didn't have to step much into it, Jumbo pans and the covered pan. The litter she likes is unscented and I stick with it. I tried a couple others and it made the peeing worse. At this point, I have to think it's behavioral, and the vet agrees. I am completely fed up with cleaning up copious amounts of pee every day - as horrible as that may sound to some, it's the truth. I don't really know what to do about it. I'm considering making her a heated house outside (storage shed), and putting a sandbox in the yard. The dog could be out there with her, and she could pee wherever she wants. The yard is completely fenced, and I doubt she would leave the yard. I see this as preferable to euthanizing her, and I *really* don't want to do that over a behavioral issue. But dammit, I seriously can't cope with the peeing. Euthing her would kill me - living outside is a solution I am thinking may be the only thing we can try. (I live in OR - the weather is moderate here, so freezing isn't a problem.) I guess I'm posting mainly to get this off my chest. I keep thinking about Rhonda from alt.cats who eventually had to euth her white long- haird cat years ago, after she pooped and peed on the floor forever, and Rhonda had tried everything. I never wanted to be in her shoes, and here I find myself, 6 years later (or so). :/ -L. > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > -L. I think you've probably heard me tell this story before about Yoda. It made me join the "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" club. Long story short, Yoda pees on anything in floor. I started putting a clean towel down, every day, next to the litterbox. He pees on it, and I toss it in the washer. We're both a lot happier now. Anyway, I was wondering if you can't put down a towel folded next to the box, where she "hangs over". Might make cleanup a little easier? Sherry > > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > > Sherry My Tigger used to do the same thing, until I started treating his CRF. What your cat is doing is a sign of pain, and straining. Are you doing anything to treat the CRF? Here is a great group on Yahoo where you can learn about it: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/Feline-CRF-Support/ Tigger no longer pees out side of the box. I guess I am more concerned about what you are doing to treat the disease than I am with the peeing outside of the box, at this point. You can always put plastic with paper towels on top to catch the pee if needed. But the most important thing is the crf. debnfurboys > > > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > > > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic > > > measures. But I am at the end of my rope with Mimi. My cat loves the outdoors and spents most her time out. Maybe your will like the outdoors too. Being so old probably won't have to worry about her jumping over the fence. On Oct 21, 4:57 pm, "debora...@gmail.com" <debora...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > > > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] > about what you are doing to treat the disease than I am with the > peeing outside of the box, at this point. I used to be a vet tech. I am giving her sub-Qs at home and she's on Royal Canin vet diet. I'm not one to take drastic measures in a geriatric cat. -L. > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > and Rhonda had tried everything. I never wanted to be in her shoes, > and here I find myself, 6 years later (or so). :/ ------------ I have been using puppy training pads with Alex (who is 16 years old and has CRF). I put one in front of the entrance of each of my (covered) litter boxes. It also helps prevent tracking of the litter. I set it so that the litter box is partly setting on it. At some point, for reasons I can't fathom, Alex decided that a particular corner (in a hallway off the kitchen) was a perfect location to urinate. He started using this as his spot to urinate (although he continued to poop in the litter box). I just keep a puppy training pad in that particular corner at all times. Every time Alex urinates, I dispose of it and replace it with a new one. No fuss, no muss, no aggravation. I also keep a bottle of Simple Solution handy for the rare occasions where he misses and some of it goes on the floor. I have been doing this for months and months. Alex and I have reached an understanding. He doesn't like it when the pad is wet, so sometimes, if he needs to go again, he will wait for me to change it. Admittedly, we go through a lot of pads because of the CRF. I order the Simple Solution pads (23 x 24 inches) off Amazon for $13.95 for a jumbo pack of 56, which is less than half the price I would pay at Petco for a similar product. Best regards, ---Cindy S. > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > and Rhonda had tried everything. I never wanted to be in her shoes, > and here I find myself, 6 years later (or so). :/ If you don't mind giving one last thing a try, PetsMart has an igloo looking litterbox. The cat has to walk up a spiraled ramp on the *inside* of the box and make a complete 180 then to *down* the ramp slightly before reaching the litter. Since it's a ramp it shouldn't be hard on her arthritis (I have a feeling that was one reason for the design) but another benefit is they can't hang their butt over the side to pee. I know if it's totally a behavior problem she may just not bother with the litter box at all, but it's a shot. Knowing you, I'm sure you've ruled out any medical problem, UTI, interstitial cycstitus, etc. But it could be something as simple as aging eyesight or a touch of alzheimers. Whatever you decide to do, good luck and please keep us posted about Mimi. Hugs, CatNipped Hugs, CatNipped > -L. > If you don't mind giving one last thing a try, PetsMart has an igloo looking > litterbox. The cat has to walk up a spiraled ramp on the *inside* of the [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > CatNipped Thanks, guys, for the input. I'll see if I can find this box, and also look for the Pee Pads. Towel is a great idea, Sherry, but not practical for me at this point (I am doing way to much laundry as it is). I'm not giving up on her yet - just really, really frustrated. :/ We know her eyesight is not the best, and that may be part of it too. I leave a light on for her, so she can see the box at night. Thanks again - you guys are great. :) -L. > > -L. >> If you don't mind giving one last thing a try, PetsMart has an igloo >> looking [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > part of it too. I leave a light on for her, so she can see the box at > night. -------- I had meant to comment earlier that it is not uncommon for older cats to go in the box and urinate over the side of it. I went through this with Molly (of blessed memory), and my sister went through this with one or more elderly cat as well. According to my sister's vet, there is actually a physiological cause for this, but my sister couldn't remember what it was. I am guessing that maybe because of muscle weakness or arthritis, it gets difficult for the cat to hunch with her butt close to the litter without actually touching it and she may be leaning against the side of the box for support. Or maybe they lose their sense of proprioception (knowing where certain body parts are in space). I also wanted to mention that if you do decide to go the towel route at some point as Sherry suggested, make sure you put some plastic sheeting under it. I will have to replace a part of my wooden floor because there was urine on the towel (this was before I discovered the pee pads) and I didn't realize the towel was wet, and it soaked through to the floor. That having been said, I have considered going back to using a towel (on top of plastic sheeting) simply because Alex goes through six or more pads on any given day, and I think those pads are like disposable diapers, filling up the landfills. I have also considered using washable diapers on top of plastic sheeting. I think that would also be a lot more economical and earth friendly. Anyway, good luck. Best regards, ---Cindy S. >> If you don't mind giving one last thing a try, PetsMart has an igloo >> looking [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > is). I'm not giving up on her yet - just really, really > frustrated. :/ I know exactly how you feel - one of my children was a bed wetter and it was very hard and frustrating to constantly have to change his bedding, sometimes two or three times a night. As much as you love your family, you can't help but be exasperated when they cause you constant extra work and aggravation. Hugs, CatNipped > We know her eyesight is not the best, and that may be > part of it too. I leave a light on for her, so she can see the box at [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >> > -L. > > If you don't mind giving one last thing a try, PetsMart has an igloo looking > > litterbox. The cat has to walk up a spiraled ramp on the *inside* of the [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > -L. I hear that. If I had laundry to do for a whole family instead of just us 2, it would be different. I think you're just venting though, and I also think that's perfectly natural. We all have days where there's too much litter kicked in the floor, too much hair all over our clothes, too many hairballs to step in. Plus a family to clean up after, no matter how much we love the family *and* the cats, it's enough to make you want to throw your hands up sometimes. Sherry > I hear that. If I had laundry to do for a whole family instead of just > us 2, it would be different. I think you're just venting though, and I [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > enough to make you want to throw your hands up sometimes. > Sherry I think that's it, in a nutshell. I am stretched pretty thin lately and the cat pee is more than I can take some days. I have had a bad run of bad pees this week. :/ By the way, it was Renee B. (not Rhonda) and her cat Cleo, with the story in alt.cats, if anyone wants to read her story. It was a sad story. It has stuck with me for a long time. -L. Response from "-L." <MonkeySnaps@gmail.com>: >> I hear that. If I had laundry to do for a whole family instead of >> just us 2, it would be different. I think you're just venting [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > the story in alt.cats, if anyone wants to read her story. It was > a sad story. It has stuck with me for a long time. I don't suppose you have a Message-ID for it do you? I did a little search and only came up with someone running their trap something to the effect of every animal Renee has ever had has been euthanized. I also saw you come to her defense. : ) Or do you know the title of the post? Thanks, and I hope your poor kitty and you can come to a reasonable solution. I think the outside shed idea is perfect by the way.  Signature-Lost Remove the extra words to reply by e-mail. Don't e-mail me. I am kidding. No I am not. > Response from "-L." <MonkeySn...@gmail.com>: > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Or do you know the title of the post? It was on-going for months. She really worked to try to save Cleo. :( http://groups.google.com/group/alt.cats/search?group=alt.cats&q=cleo+renee&qt_g= Search+this+group -L. > Thanks, guys, for the input. I'll see if I can find this box, and > also look for the Pee Pads. Towel is a great idea, Sherry, but not [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > part of it too. I leave a light on for her, so she can see the box at > night. Hey Lyn, If she is hanging her rear over the end, can you find a litter box with taller sides? It sounds like the current entry is too low. We've even resorted to looking in the Rubbermaid/plastic container section of stores for tall-sided things to use as litter boxes. Hope you find a solution. Is this on a carpet? If so, you can get a big scrap of linoleum to put under the box. Good luck, Rhonda > > Thanks, guys, for the input. I'll see if I can find this box, and > > also look for the Pee Pads. Towel is a great idea, Sherry, but not [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Rhonda I have had her in 5 or 6 different boxes over the last year. The stupid thing is, as soon as I posted this, she quit peeing outside the box (knock on wood!). -L. > Mimi is my tortie I have had since she was 7 weeks, and she's 17.5 > now. Off and on over the last 5 or 6 years she's peed outside the [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > the covered pan. The litter she likes is unscented and I stick with > it. I tried a couple others and it made the peeing worse. Can you get some kind of large tray to set the litter box in, so that any urine that goes over the side just drips into the pan, which can be easily pickd up and rinsed out? It would probably take up quite a bit of floor space but if you have the room, it's another option. Stinky, one of our cats at work, will sometimes end up dripping outside the box. She backs up into a corner and many times some of the urine ends up outside. It happens with covered & uncovered boxes (we have 4). I don't think her problem is behavioral, more like she had her back end up a little too high that time. Most of the urine is in the box. We have one big, tall storage tub that I use as one littler box and all urine stays in that one. She has no trouble getting in & out of boxes but an arthritic cat might need a step to help her access a tall box. -- Liz I had that problem with my 17 year old cat too. She'd poop inside the box, but pee over the edge. Solution: I went to Walmart & got some puppy training pads & layed one in front of the box. Problem solved. I called them her diapers! And usually changed the pad once a day. Sometmes you just gotta "go with the flow". (No pun intended.) :-}..pj > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > -L. Sorry, I meant to put this link in my earlier reply: http://www.catsplay.com/bci_683805.php3 Hugs, CatNipped On Oct 15, 10:19 am, CatNip...@comcast.net wrote: > > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > > CatNipped That is cool! Thanks! -L. L, I am sorry you are so frustrated. . but at her age, I think putting Mimi outdoors would be too difficult of a life change for her. Have you considered confining her to part of the house instead, perhaps a kitchen/bathroom/den area where clean up is easier? Have you asked the vet about medication? I don't usually advocate medication, but with her age and the loss of Peewee, it's possible she's having some stress/anxiety issues and meds might help her. Keep the faith and help her enjoy the remainder of her life as best as possible. Rene > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > -L. Poor you... I feel for you because I went through this one too, & sometimes It does feel like you have reached the end of your tether @ times. I have already read most of the comments & noted that washing is a bit of an issue too, but I thought I might as well mention that the answer we came up with was to buy a couple of cheap bath mats that you use to stand on when you get out of the shower or the bath. Because the other side is rubber, it saves your floor, & keeps everything on the top surface, & it's very easy to get rid of any nasty packages & stops the floor getting soaked too. If you have a couple of them, you can have one in the machine whilst the other one is down ready to collect any leaks Mimi might make, all be it by accident. Just a thought.... Sheelagh >"o"< Suddenly, without warning, -L. exclaimed (10/14/2007 11:30 AM): > Most of you know me from me posting here over the last - who knows how > many years. I don't give up easily and I don't advocate drastic [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > since we lost Peewee, it got worse > -L. I'm just back from leave so haven't read all the followups - though I did see the suggestion of pee-pads and towels. My vote would be for the pee-pads. Meep is the same - she occasionally pees outside the box. She's done it less since I've switched her to all wet food, and add water to it, so her cystitis is finally under control (re the vet). But she still does, every once in a while. I worry sometimes that she's got some chronic problem from the cystitis, because when I catch her at it, sometimes what she does is start with her butt low, and it rises slowly, seems like it's taking a certain amount of force to pee, and the force causes her butt to lift. It's not cystitis, and she doesn't do this every time. Does Mimi do this? Usually, for Meep, it's a matter of cleanliness. If she's used the box *once* and it hasn't been cleaned, she'll often pee outside the box. So this is something I usually find when I clean the box first thing in the morning. Yea, she has me well-trained :) What I've considered doing is finding a small, shallowish pan that I can set in front of the box, to catch the miss. Like a 9x9 brownie pan or something? What I have right now is a really gigantic litter mat (http://tinyurl.com/2mukfg - the really big one); if she pees over the edge and I can't get to it right away, I just sprinkle some litter over the wet spot. That soaks up the problem, and I can clean the mat at a better time. Good luck. I understand your frustration.
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