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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / October 2007"blacklights" found in pet stores, don't work for me
Hi, one of my 2 kitties is peeing on my bed sometimes. He isn't ill, just nervous kind of guy. It's OK, I use tarp under the sheets and wash the sheets. I want to make sure he doesn't do that elsewhere, on carpets. So I bought the "blacklight/UV" light found in pet stores. It does not seem to work! After he pees on the sheets, I darken the room and use the light to see how it works. Well, it does not - nothing shows up. Nothing shows up when the urine is fresh. Nothing shows up when it's dried. Nothing shows up even when it's night and everything is pitch black. I tried 2 different brands, one of them really big, lots of batteries. Nothing. I look really carefully and follow instructions carefully. Make sure the batteries are new. Nothing, even when I can see and smell the urine myself. So of course this is never going to work on carpet or anywhere else. What's going on? Why don't they work? Is there one urine detector that really works? I have seen this thing AntiIckyPoo UV flashlight - it does not use batteries, but extension cord and electricity from an outlet, and is really expensive $70 (the lights found in pet stores are $30 or less). Is this going to work? Please give me recommendations. Thank you very much. Mark Galeck www.urinegone.com comes with a blacklight I have had no problems using it before it is about $25.00 > Hi, one of my 2 kitties is peeing on my bed sometimes. He isn't ill, > just nervous kind of guy. It's OK, I use tarp under the sheets and [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Mark Galeck well thank you I appreciate your reply, but this item looks exactly like the ones I bought... it's even smaller and free add-on... do you know why this one would work and the others did not? Thank you again, I know I am being picky, it's just that I tried others like this one... > well thank you I appreciate your reply, but this item looks exactly > like the ones I bought... it's even smaller and free add-on... do > you know why this one would work and the others did not? Thank you > again, I know I am being picky, it's just that I tried others like > this one... Is it only on the bed or does it show it elsewhere. If it is the bed it might be the material. Not sure I use mine when I stay in hotels to show what has been missed > well thank you I appreciate your reply, but this item looks exactly > like the ones I bought... it's even smaller and free add-on... do > you know why this one would work and the others did not? Thank you > again, I know I am being picky, it's just that I tried others like > this one... Why on earth do you NEED a black light to see where pee is? Follow your nose. Look for the wet spot. >> well thank you I appreciate your reply, but this item looks exactly >> like the ones I bought... it's even smaller and free add-on... do [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Why on earth do you NEED a black light to see where pee is? Follow your > nose. Look for the wet spot. ------- Sometimes it's not wet anymore. I have come downstairs at times and smelled it. I knew it was somewhere in the living room but not sure exactly where. Sometimes, there are multiple spots. For the first 16 years of Molly's life she used her litter box without fail, but in her last year, when she was elderly and maybe a little confused, she decided that the living room carpeting, mostly behind the couch, made a perfect litter box. (She did not have a urinary tract infection - I had her checked). She must have used that spot dozens and dozens of times. But she actually went in many places all over the living room. We pulled up the carpeting behind the couch and treated the wooden floor with Nature's Miracle and vinegar to eliminate the odor. The odor is gone but the floor is still stained black. Eventually, we will pull up all the carpeting, and replace the damaged sections of wood. But my point is that its not always so easy to find the spot, especially when "the spot" is actually multiple "spots." Best regards, ---Cindy S. > Why on earth do you NEED a black light to see where pee is? Follow your > nose. Look for the wet spot. Thank you for your advice. But if a cat pees while I am at work, by the time I am back, there is no wet spot, there may be a vague smell, and if so, I can't tell exactly where the smell is coming from. Human noses are not good enough for that. If they were, blacklights would not sell. Let me return an advice for you - if you have such a wonderful directional nose, why don't you hire yourself as a dog sniffing bags at the airport? Thanks. >> Why on earth do you NEED a black light to see where pee is? Follow your >> nose. Look for the wet spot. > > Thank you for your advice. But if a cat pees while I am at work, by > the time I am back, there is no wet spot Wow. Are your cats really, really tiny? Because when my cat gets mad at us and pees on the carpet, there is a big wet spot. Even 24 hours later. "Mark_Galeck" <mark_galeck_spam_magnet@yahoo.com> wrote> Let me return an advice for you - if you have such a > wonderful directional nose, why don't you hire yourself as a dog > sniffing bags at the airport? Thanks. How did you know what I do for a living? Are you stalking me? Mark. : Once a day, maybe while your coffee is brewing or your mail is downloading or your wife is talking to you and you are ignoring her, walk around the rug in your bare feet. There's a really good chance the wet spot is cat urine. Idiot. > www.urinegone.com comes with a blacklight I have had no problems using > it before > it is about $25.00 ----------- I bought urinegone with the black light on e-bay, and that black light didn't work for me either. I'm glad to know I'm not the only person with this problem. Best regards, ---Cindy S. >> Hi, one of my 2 kitties is peeing on my bed sometimes. He isn't ill, >> just nervous kind of guy. It's OK, I use tarp under the sheets and [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] >> >> Mark Galeck I will admit that they are cheap pieces of work. Mine that I got burn the bulbs out quick. I put a higher rating one in there no problems since but it went thru 2 bulbs before I found the correct one. http://www.blacklight.com is where I got the better bulbs but that was a while ago. I found a better product called nature's miracle to remove urine. You weren't the only one Cindy >> www.urinegone.com comes with a blacklight I have had no problems using >> it before [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] >>> >>> Mark Galeck >I will admit that they are cheap pieces of work. Mine that I got burn the >bulbs out quick. I put a higher rating one in there no problems since but [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > I found a better product called nature's miracle to remove urine. ------- I agree the Nature's Miracle is like a miracle. Another product which also works really well is SimpleSolution. To my experience, the two are interchangeable. I buy them by the gallon. Best regards, ---Cindy S. >Hi, one of my 2 kitties is peeing on my bed sometimes. He isn't ill, >just nervous kind of guy. It's OK, I use tarp under the sheets and [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >outlet, and is really expensive $70 (the lights found in pet stores >are $30 or less). Is this going to work? Not all blacklights are the same wavelength. Urine flouresceses at a particular wavelength, and the black lights sold in party stores, etc. is not the right wavelength. I don't have the particulars in front of me which is the correct UV band to light up urine, sorry. I suspect that if you can find a blacklight that is also used to check for counterfeit money, it will probably also work for spotting stains, I believe that they are in the same UV band. But please, I'm not guarantee'ing that, but I am fairly sure about the party type lights not working as I have one as well and it doesn't work on stains. Some gem/rock collecting folks use these as well, might be somewhere to look for a supplier as they will have blacklights in different bands. I believe the urine glows under UB B type lights, the party ones are UV A. $.02 d. Great! This may be what I needed. For some reason the wavelength is wrong. Even the ones found in pet stores, could be wrong wavelength. In the meantime, being a guy, I went for "brute force" method (which may be invalidated by your remark). I went to a big hardware store and bought the biggest UV lamps I could find, 80 Watts total, much bigger than anything sold in pet food stores, operated from an outlet, so I also bought a long extension cord. This thing is so bright I better don't walk around with naked skin or I might get sunburned or something :) I pointed it at my Litter Robot drawer, with urine clumps from 2 different cats (thinking that maybe my aforementioned cat is weird and does not have that particular thing in the urine that makes it show under UV). NOPE. None of the clumps glow even the faintest. Everything else in the bathroom glows like crazy (my bathroom is orderly, but, uhm, not super-clean let's say), but the cat urine clumps - no. OK then, DougD is really on to something and I need to find out the proper wavelength. Quick research on the web finds that the "Urine- off" brand UV light, does advertise that it has the proper wavelength, OK I will try it. Thanks Doug! > Great! This may be what I needed. For some reason the wavelength is > wrong. Even the ones found in pet stores, could be wrong [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Thanks Doug! This is a timely discussion for me, so thanks for starting the thread. My one attempt to locate cat urine using a blacklight was unsuccessful, and now I know why. I will also have to get the above mentioned kind, which I suppose is not in pet stores.... I can smell the cat pee, but I can't pinpoint it precisely....  SignatureJean B. >> OK then, DougD is really on to something and I need to find out the >> proper wavelength. Quick research on the web finds that the "Urine- [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >stores.... I can smell the cat pee, but I can't pinpoint it >precisely.... One thing that may be possible, is to spray something more conventional on the area's that are suspect, and the combination of urine and a second material could cause it to flouresce under the cheaper party light type UV lamps. Something with phosphorus in it like laundry soap may work, I'll try and do some experiments as it would be a heck of a lot easier and cheaper than having to hunt down a specific lamp type. The other thing is possibly stealing a trick from the CSI folks.. The reason the cheap lamps don't work isn't nesc. because they aren't causing the urine to glow, it's just that it's a weak flourescense compared to the broad UV of the cheap lamp. By looking for the stain's under something like orange colored glasses, it would cut down on the amount of black (er.. blue) light in the visible, while allowing the shifted light from the stain which would appear in the yellow wavelengths to pass through and be seen. Again, it might be a long shot, but that IS how the UV light is used for spotting fingerprints, the oils in the print glow yellow under the UV. Even bright green from a YAG laser can light up the prints, but that's an awful lot of light!! d. >>> OK then, DougD is really on to something and I need to find out the >>> proper wavelength. Quick research on the web finds that the "Urine- [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > d. Interesting. How about red glasses? I don't have orange ones, but my daughter has red ones. One obviously needs to locate all of the pee. Yuck! BTW, I did gaze at the lights in the pet stores and noticed they are supposed to be 2-3 inches from the area--which implies one has to be crawling around with the light. (I think I would try to use my daughter's grabber, since I don't much relish crawling all over the place.) Also, the apparently ineffective lights in the pet stores are much more expensive than the one that was recommended in this thread.... SignatureJean B. >Interesting. How about red glasses? I don't have orange >ones, but my daughter has red ones. Red would be too dark, the urine flouresces in a dull yellow color, so maybe yellow type hunting/pilot sunglasses, or orange. Some hardware stores carry orange shades to be used with laser levels so that you can see the beam better, and they're not expensive compared to the "real thing" that are sold by laser and forensic supply companies. >One obviously needs to locate all of the pee. Yuck! > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >apparently ineffective lights in the pet stores are much more >expensive than the one that was recommended in this thread.... Well, I spent about 3 hours last night hunting down the answer to this blacklight question from what resources I can find on the net. I'm going to compile it all together and put it up here in the next day or so as I have one last place I want to check out as the answer to this question is still a bit murky... d. >> Interesting. How about red glasses? I don't have orange >> ones, but my daughter has red ones. [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > d. Thanks, Doug. In the meantime, Mingy has used his potty--and who knows what else he has done. SignatureJean B. > Well, I spent about 3 hours last night hunting down the answer to this > blacklight question from what resources I can find on the net. I'm going [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > d. Doug, if you could write what you found, please do, because from what I can see, all these things simply do not work. I got in the hardware store a huge blacklight, 70 watts of power, and now I tried 2 different lights bought in pet stores, and also one that is specifically advertised on the internet as having "the correct wavelength", which you mentioned could be the problem. My kitty a few days ago peed on my pants left on the floor - how nice of him, reminding me to put away my clothes. Instead of washing them, I dutifully dried them up on the balcony, and with urine dried, I tried all the lights. According to instructions, completely dark, 2-3 inches etc. NOTHING. Not a thing, no faint yellow glow, no glow of any kind. Mark >Doug, if you could write what you found, please do, because from what >I can see, all these things simply do not work. Ok, I did post my "findings" about a week ago, maybe it didn't make it to the different news servers, so I'll put it up again as it's not that much material. > I got in the hardware store a huge blacklight, 70 watts of power, and >now I tried 2 different lights bought in pet stores, and also one that [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Mark Hmm, don't know what to tell you. I didn't have any luck either with the knock off "BLB" 20 watt lamp that I have that "should" have worked if it was a real BLB type lamp. It is very easy for someone doing knock-off's to make a black light that will flouresce things like Day Glo paint, and anything with phosphorus in it. It's much more difficult to make the narrow band UV filter such as the one that's spec'd by GE in their BLB lamp, so part of the problem is dealing with knock-off's. If you can find either a real GE, Sylvania, or Osram BLB type lamp, it should work. One problem may be that you're using too large of a lamp. That much UV is going to play some tricks with your vision, making it more difficult to see the weak flourescence of the urine. It's a pain, but there is a good reason for the sake of visibility of having to get the lamp close to the area in question. I don't think any lamp will work to be able to just flood the room and then hope to spot the stain. Anyway, here's the material that I dug up last week, maybe there are some answers in here.. D. Ok, here's pretty much everything you'd ever want to know about blacklights, or blacklights to be used for sniffing out cat urine stains. I can't guarantee any of this material, or the sources, I've just tried to get some idea of what may work best for stain spotting. And one thing, not all black lights are black lights!!! Or at least when it comes to cat urine. The ideal flourescent type lamp should have the part designation of BLB on the end of the part number. The BLB stands for: Black Light Blue. The problem is, not all BLB tubes work!!! I have a cheap Asian party light myself with a BLB type bulb in it, but it doesn't work!! The key seems to be staying with high end, well known lamp suppliers such as GE (General Electric), Sylvania, and OSRAM. The GE BLB type lamp has a specific black light filter on the glass of the tube that provides a very narrow band of light in the desired 365nm range. "NM" stands for nanometer, and it's used as a way to numerically label a frequency of light (it's actually a measure of the wavelength, in nanometers. It's pronounced "Nan-O-meters", or "Nann Om OMeters". The resources that I could find on the topic of using UV to spot stains is somewhat sketchy, in that some folks use different numbers as the ideal wavelenght. The GE BLB tube is centered on 365nm. I've found another chart that shows that 380 or 395nm is best, so for the time being, I would think that any UV source from 365 to 395nm should work. Also, some of the URL's below are for LED type UV lamps. These lamps can be purchased for a specific wavelength, so you need to pay attention to that when ordering as they have about 10 variations on what wavelenght is used. Some also have multiple wavelengths in one lamp, which might be handy as long as they are in the range that's desired. So, stay away from any lamp that just has a "BL" on the end, that won't work. And then only stick to the big name suppliers when looking for a BLB tube. All the data is here in these URL's, as well as a good selection of sources for them. Oddly, it would appear that probably the best place to buy one of these urine inspection lamps is from the same folks that sell the removal chemicals. Their lamps aren't much more expensive than any other source, and that way you know that you're getting a lamp that has been tested and works for this application!! OK, I'm worn out.. Good luck, please post your results if you try any of these and they WORK!! Thanks, Doug GEF15T8-BLB 365BLB 368BLB (Good GE part numbers) 380 or 395nm best for cat/human urine. (best suggested if using an LED light source) http://riskreactor.com/Index.htm http://0-0-0checkmate.com/Hot/Portable_Blacklight.html http://www.urine-off.com/ http://www.defensedevices.com/portable-black-light.html *** http://www.sprayalert.com/finding-cat-spray.html (suppliers of flourescent type UV lamps) http://www.acehardwareoutlet.com/(og4xmyfawg0qmuqyc0dryi55)/productDetails. aspx?SKU=3237435 (large 40 watt BLB bulb) http://genet.gelighting. com/LightProducts/Dispatcher? REQUEST=CONSUMERSPECPAGE&PRODUCTCODE=35885&BreadCrumbValues=Specialty_Colored% 20,_%20Party%20Lights_, T8&ModelSelectionFilter=FT0010:Specialty_Colored%20&%20Party%20Lights (Tech Spec's on BLB type lamps) http://genet.gelighting. com/LightProducts/Dispatcher?REQUEST=COMMERCIALSPECPAGE&PRODUCTCODE=10531 (more tech spec's/detail on BLB lamps) http://genet.gelighting. com/LightProducts/Dispatcher?REQUEST=RESULTPAGE&CATEGORY=Lamps&FILTER=FT0010: Specialty_Colored+%26+Party+Lights_Blacklight+Blue&CHANNEL=Commercial&FILTERFI ELD=Specialty&BREADCRUMB=Specialty^Blacklight+Blue (GE's master listing of all black light blue lamps) http://www.theledlight.com/uv_flashlights.html (LED type flashlights) http://www.24hours7days.com//Science/Demonstration.html (school science type projects, with blacklights for sale) >Great! This may be what I needed. For some reason the wavelength is >wrong. Even the ones found in pet stores, could be wrong >wavelength. >NOPE. None of the clumps glow even the faintest. Everything else in >the bathroom glows like crazy (my bathroom is orderly, but, uhm, not [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Thanks Doug! You're welcome. I'm kinda sheepish about this as I really should know the wavelength as that's kinda the biz I'm in (no, I don't go around checking for urine stains). I've been working with visible, IR and UV lasers for the last 20 years, and I can pretty much name most visible wavelengths by their number, but I'm kinda at a loss as to what's out there in UV lamps. I'll try and poke around my resources a bit and see if I can't find the right number. Whether or not that translates into a part number that anyone can phone up a supplier for, well, that's a whole 'nother challenge... d.
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