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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / July 2006Phil and all concerned - Questions about Hills Science Diet ingredients
Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were by-products followed by corn, etc. Don't you find it strange that such a highly thought of brand has those ingredients? For example - their sensitive skin product: http://www.hillspet.com/zSkin_2/products/product_details.jsp?PRODUCT%3C% 3Eprd_id=845524441760711&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302037387&CONTENT% 3C%3Ecnt_id=10134198673427816&bmUID=1154034219970 Ingredients Brewers Rice, Corn Gluten Meal, Chicken By-Product Meal, Ground Whole Grain Corn, Animal Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), Dried Egg Product, Soybean Oil, Chicken Liver Flavor, Potassium Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Choline Chloride, DL-Methionine, L-Lysine, vitamins (L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), Vitamin E Supplement, Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Vitamin A Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin, Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Folic Acid, Vitamin D3 Supplement), Vitamin E Supplement, Iodized Salt, Taurine, Fish Oil, minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite), preserved with Mixed Tocopherols and Citric Acid, Beta-Carotene, L- Tryptophan, Rosemary Extract. Although there's no wheat, I thought that corn was also a no-no for cats with skin problems - and what's with the by-products? Even their Nature's Best® with Real Chicken Adult product has chicken meal listed before chicken. How about the Advanced Protection® Senior 7+! There's some nice vitamins in there, but those first few ingredients! Ingredients Brewers Rice, Chicken By-Product Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Ground Whole Grain Corn, Animal Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), Dried Egg Product, Soybean Mill Run, Chicken Liver Flavor, Powdered Cellulose, Fish Oil, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, DL- Methionine, Calcium Carbonate, Vitamin E Supplement, Iodized Salt, Natural Flavor, Calcium Sulfate, Taurine, vitamins (Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Folic Acid, Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement, ), L-Cysteine, minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite), Potassium Citrate, L-Carnitine, preserved with Mixed Tocopherols and Citric Acid, Magnesium Oxide, L-Arginine, Beta-Carotene, Rosemary Extract. I just took a look at their z/d and d/d prescription lines (both wet and dry) and they appear to be very promising in ingredients. What a pity that these foods aren't sold over the counter (and given away in samples to see if cats like them). fem...@nospam.org wrote: > Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science > Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were > by-products followed by corn, etc. > > Don't you find it strange that such a highly thought of brand has those > ingredients? No. Hill's is peddaled by vets because they get benefits for doing so. It's sh.t food - always has been, always will be. -L. > fem...@nospam.org wrote: >> Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > -L. Well, my Tigger lived to be almost 19 on Science Diet. Could be the food, more than likely she just had good genetics. OTOH the only health problem she ever had was arthritis in her last 2-3 years so the food didn't do her any damage either. I must say though that none of my cats have liked the SD canned food so I feed them a different brand that they will eat. I had never noticed before that they put L-Lysine in the food. Have they always done that? W > fem...@nospam.org wrote: >> Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > -L. Any evidence to back that up... such as a reference to a study or independent nutritional analysis of the food? >Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science >Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were >by-products followed by corn, etc. So let's see....We have a pet food company which has been researching feline nutritional needs for more years than most of us have been living. Their line is fairly high-priced, so probably they aren't using inferior ingredients to cut corners and sell the product cheaply. We seem to have reliable evidence that many thousands of cats have lived well into old age without serious health problems while being fed nothing else but this line of cat foods. Is it just remotely possible that these people know more about how to make a quality cat food than we do? The fact is that neither "by-products" nor "[meat] meal" nor even the inclusion of (horrors!) grains, is any indication of inferior cat nutrition. When you read about how bad all these things are in cat foods, chalk it all up to faddism, urban myths and conspiracy theorists.  SignatureWayne M. > Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science > Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > preserved with Mixed Tocopherols and Citric Acid, Beta-Carotene, L- > Tryptophan, Rosemary Extract. > Although there's no wheat, I thought that corn was also a no-no for cats > with skin problems - and what's with the by-products? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > that these foods aren't sold over the counter (and given away in samples > to see if cats like them). First of all Science Diet food is very high quality food. There are high levels vitamins and nutrients that are found in the "by-products" of meat and not in other cuts of meat. They are not feeding feet or anything like that. Second of all, many of the other food brands are not actually that great for your pet. You should always look at the labels and understand them fully before you start criticizing. You should consider whether or not the food is actually made of what it says. There are specific guidelines on what a food can be called. Many other food brands will say that they are made with chicken when in fact they are made with whatever meat is cheaper at that time. Corn is perfectly fine to feed to any cat or dog. When they begin to have "skin problems" it is generally related to a food allergy and not because the food is terrible. In that case, z/d is a great product for them because it is hypoallergenic so it has completely limited ingredients so as to reduce the allergens in the food. It is not a food to feed to every animal who does not need this prescription diet. You wouldn't stop eating peanuts just because other people are allergic to them. I think that science diet gets a bad rap because it is so popular, however, it is so populare because it is a great food. I hope this helps you. > Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science > Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] > > The story about a food isn't always told by ONLY reading the ingredients list... try looking at the nutritional analysis as well. Most folks spend far too much time focusing on the ingredients with very little if any attention paid to the nutritional analysis. One could have a food with meat ingredients listed as the first two items, yet the nutritional analysis for the same food could be way off what is considered healthy. If you want some clues as to what is considered healthy in terms of nutritional analysis I suggest you can start with reading the archives of this group. > Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science > Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were > by-products followed by corn, etc. > > Don't you find it strange that such a highly thought of brand has those > ingredients? Nope. Try looking at the nutrient levels- they're more important. Science Diet has about the best nutrient levels in the industry. > Nope. Try looking at the nutrient levels- they're more important. Science > Diet has about the best nutrient levels in the industry. I have never met a cat that would eat it. At the vet we threw it away by the bucketful...yet the vet still continued to feed it...I fed our long-time borders other food just so they wouldn't starve to death...which apparently one did before I got there. -L. > > Nope. Try looking at the nutrient levels- they're more important. Science > > Diet has about the best nutrient levels in the industry. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > -L. You've *never* met a cat that would eat Science Diet??? Are you sure about that or are just saying that because you hate the company? > > > Nope. Try looking at the nutrient levels- they're more important. > Science [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > You've *never* met a cat that would eat Science Diet??? Are you sure about > that or are just saying that because you hate the company? My Marziale eats Science Diet. She has only ever eaten SD for her dry food, and she loves it. The other cat in our house has been on numerous different foods in an attempt to get her to eat something and like something, and as much as Marziale has on a few occasions snuck over to try her food, she always returns to her bowl of SD to 'mow down'. > You've *never* met a cat that would eat Science Diet??? Are you sure about > that or are just saying that because you hate the company? Why do you think I hate the company, Phil? I have never met a cat that would eat the sh.t, yet vets push it left and right. You'd think after having umpteen dozens (hundreds?) of bags returned, they's get a clue... -L. > > You've *never* met a cat that would eat Science Diet??? Are you sure about > > that or are just saying that because you hate the company? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > having umpteen dozens (hundreds?) of bags returned, they's get a > clue... My cat that lived to be twenty loved it and did great on it. It was just the regular dry, smelled fishy and seemed greasy. It was obvious that she used more of it because she pooped less, no kidding. (This is compared to other, cheaper dry food. Canned gave her really nasty stinky diarrhea.) She was on it for 15 of her 20 years. She had all her teeth when she died and never had a single illness. THAT said, I do believe she was genetically blessed. I think of the mechanism that produced her as Survival of the Stump Stupid and Mean as a Snake. :) > My cat that lived to be twenty loved it and did great on it. It was > just the regular dry, smelled fishy and seemed greasy. It was obvious [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > produced her as Survival of the Stump Stupid and Mean as a Snake. > :) I don't doubt there are some cats that eat the stuff - I have just never met one. That being said, my brother's cat live to over 20 on Meow Mix. She would never eat anything else, so that's what he fed her. :p Sometimes I think we make way too much out of trying to feed our cats the "best nutrition". A lot of the time that boils down to whatever they *will* eat. -L. > > You've *never* met a cat that would eat Science Diet??? Are you sure about > > that or are just saying that because you hate the company? > > Why do you think I hate the company, Phil? Gee, I can't imagine what could've given me the notion..... other than the fact that you've been badmouthing the food since you've been posting here. I have never met a cat that > would eat the sh.t, yet vets push it left and right. You'd think after > having umpteen dozens (hundreds?) of bags returned, they's get a > clue... We have adoption centers in 4 Petsmarts in 2 states. We get the pick of the returned pet food before it gets donated. Even though I don't take open bags of pet food, I'd be hard pressed to find more than a few bags of SD in the returns. Compared to all the other brands excluding Purina, SD has about the least returns of the premium foods in the 4 stores that I know of. I think you might be referring to prescription diets because most vets- at least in my area- don't sell OTC SD lines- only the prescription diets. Its not difficult to understand why a cat would refuse a prescription diet. > Gee, I can't imagine what could've given me the notion..... other than the > fact that you've been badmouthing the food since you've been posting here. That's not what I meant. I meant I hate the company because cats won't eat their food yet vets push it like crack. > I have never met a cat that > > would eat the sh.t, yet vets push it left and right. You'd think after [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the returns. Compared to all the other brands excluding Purina, SD has > about the least returns of the premium foods in the 4 stores that I know of. Vets feed the returned bags to the cats in-house. > I think you might be referring to prescription diets because most vets- at > least in my area- don't sell OTC SD lines- only the prescription diets. Its > not difficult to understand why a cat would refuse a prescription diet. They all got returned although I will admit c/d was the one with the most returns. -L. >> Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science >> Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >Nope. Try looking at the nutrient levels- they're more important. Science >Diet has about the best nutrient levels in the industry. My Cinder was loing weight until I put her on Science Diet kitten. It works for me. > Just curious. I was looking at the ingredients of some of the Science > Diet dry foods and was amazed that the first or second ingredients were > by-products followed by corn, etc. > > Don't you find it strange that such a highly thought of brand has those > ingredients? No, it's really a good way for them to make a profit. Personally, I fed it to my previous cats and they did poorly on it. I know there's some cats they do okay on it but mine never did. I've known people who were feeding it and thought their cats were doing fine on it. But when they tried a better food, they were amazed that their cats did better on the new food compared to the Science Diet. Here's a really good article on feline nutrition. It's kind of long, but it's a good read: http://www.catinfo.org/zorans_article.pdf Lauren see my cats: http://tinyurl.com/8glfv
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