Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / March 2006
Another Trip to the ER
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Brandy Alexandre - 21 Mar 2006 19:17 GMT But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people off-topic in some other one.
 Signature Brandy Alexandre
-- Everything tastes better with cat hair in it. =^.^=
Charlie Wilkes - 21 Mar 2006 23:26 GMT >But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this >newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people >off-topic in some other one. Oh, come on. What happened?
Charlie
Brandy Alexandre - 22 Mar 2006 00:23 GMT Charlie Wilkes <charlie_wilkes@users.easynews.com> wrote in rec.pets.cats.health+behav:
>>But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this >>newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Charlie Since you ask. ;)
I came home and there was clear vomit on the floor. (Kind of her to put it on the tile, but it did look like she tried to make it to the carpet.) So, I gave her some Pepcid.
While I was getting ready to meet my trainer, I noticed some poo streaks and then Kami got in and out of the box a few times straining to defecate. Usually it's a pee thing, but this was poo. She try several times, including in the middle of the living room. This confused me because I'm prepared for UTI, this could be constipation, blockage, anal glands, or UTI. So, I gave her some Centrine, sub-q, and decided I'd see how she was doing in an hour when I got back.
She seemed to be doing okay. This is why Dr. Tina gave me the Centrine--to keep us from the ER hopefully putting it off long enough to reach office hours. But as the night went on, she wasn't straining or crying anymore, but bunched up on her thermal pad and trying to bunch smaller, and fidgeting. She just didn't feel well, wouldn't even purr for me. So I finally gave in and scooped her off to the ER.
They have most of her history, and I gave the tech the tales of the evening. She had and empty bladder, empty colon, no lumps, bumps or blocks, but thankfully they were able to get some urine from her FOR ONCE. That almost never happens. I think the waiting time after giving her sub-q was our friend. She had a little bit of blood and a few rods. The vet came out to talk to me and I gave her the run down on what I had done and why. She said, "Wow. You've got this down. There's not much else if you already have some Baytril, so all I can do is give her an injection if you want and call your vet tomorrow."
I'm a proud cat mom. :) I would have given her some Baytril, but I didn't know if I had a crash on my hands. I guess Kami likes to change things up to keep it interesting. There's still the food issue. She felt really good this morning, and wanted breakfast, danced around and meowed, but turned up her nose at three different varieties! I can't seem to conquer this one. Her weight was down at the ER, too. 6.44. She was 7.5 a month and a half ago.
We'll keep on plugging. Viva la SpotBot.
 Signature Brandy Alexandre
-- Everything tastes better with cat hair in it. =^.^=
Charlie Wilkes - 22 Mar 2006 02:21 GMT >We'll keep on plugging. Viva la SpotBot. I'm glad she's feeling better.
As for the eating thing... my neighbors had a cat that lived to be about 23. The last year of its life, they had to cook special meals for it, just to get it to eat. Lord they fussed over that cat.
Charlie
Brandy Alexandre - 22 Mar 2006 17:28 GMT Charlie Wilkes <charlie_wilkes@users.easynews.com> wrote in rec.pets.cats.health+behav:
>>We'll keep on plugging. Viva la SpotBot. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Charlie I found a web site with several recipes for renal diets. I'm planning on trying some of them. It's just hard to get there because I don't even cook for myself, much less the cat. LOL!
BTW, here is why I love Dr. Tina. I had called in a refill for fluids and asked about an appetite stimulant before the ER incident. The next morning I called and asked for more Baytril. The clinic usually calls to follow up after they're faxed records from the ER, but they had a staff meeting and I understand they were a bit behind.
Anyway, I went to pick up the stuff and Dr. Greg wanted to talk to me. Now, I've only had Kami see him once because Tina was on vacation. He's a nice enough guy, but you get used to just one person knowing and treating your cat. But he said he saw in the record that Kami got sick on Baytril and wanted to check before giving it to me.
Fine enough, but I told him it totally killed her appetite and Tina and I decided it was more important for her to eat than finish the Baytril. Then he said that with the bladder infection and the eating issue she probably needed a dental. I told him he supposedly checked her teeth a month and a half ago when he saw her--it was one of my requests. He went on to say it could still be a bad tooth that couldn't be seen at the time. I asked about the stimulant and he said there is one, but he's sure she needs the dental. I said I'd check my schedule.
I emailed Tina when I got home and told her what Dr. Greg said. She wrote back within an hour and said no to the dental. She didn't think it was necessary, more risk than reward, Kami wouldn't eat my food if it was a tooth, her CRF kitties just get upset tummies and I should give her pepcid and fluids for the next five days straight and offer a variety of food before considering an artificial appetite.
See? I think Dr. Greg was just interested in doing the expensive thing and if that didn't work THEN something else. It just made me suspicious and I'm glad I wrote Tina. I'm also glad that she's so willing to get and respond to emails.
It's funny. I'm not being fought on the pills. I'm wondering if Kami's getting a clue.
 Signature Brandy Alexandre
-- Everything tastes better with cat hair in it. =^.^=
Charlie Wilkes - 23 Mar 2006 01:34 GMT >See? I think Dr. Greg was just interested in doing the expensive >thing and if that didn't work THEN something else. It just made me >suspicious and I'm glad I wrote Tina. I'm also glad that she's so >willing to get and respond to emails. Yeah. Isn't it amazing how many professional people DON'T use email? One would think they could save a lot of time.
>It's funny. I'm not being fought on the pills. I'm wondering if >Kami's getting a clue. I'll bet she is just getting used to it. Animals are pretty adaptable, more than people give them credit for, I think.
Charlie
Rhonda - 23 Mar 2006 09:10 GMT I've thought about that in the past regarding vets -- and I think it's a time-saver for them NOT to have email. There are so many things that have come up with our animals that I would have sent off an emailed question to a vet. Since mine don't have email, I either try to find the answer myself (usually on the web) or I call the receptionist. Many times, she yells back to the vet or to a vet tech and just tells me over the phone.
If the vet had to stop and type out answers to numerous emails, I think that could take up a big portion of their day.
Having worked for one of the f-500 companies, there is so much time wasted with emails. Many times it's a great thing to reach someone instantly, but typing out answers to endless back and forth emails drove me crazy (yep, that's what did it.) Lots of times after about the 3rd round on one subject and facing another question of "what about this?", I'd pick up the phone and call them.
Rhonda
> Yeah. Isn't it amazing how many professional people DON'T use email? > One would think they could save a lot of time. Joe Canuck - 23 Mar 2006 14:15 GMT > I've thought about that in the past regarding vets -- and I think it's a > time-saver for them NOT to have email. There are so many things that [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >> Yeah. Isn't it amazing how many professional people DON'T use email? >> One would think they could save a lot of time. Email and the diagnosis and delivery of medical information don't exactly go hand-in-hand.
Usually, the vet needs to see the animal and make a determination on the basis of first hand observance rather than email information.
Agreed, email can be a huge time waster.
D. - 23 Mar 2006 15:14 GMT > Usually, the vet needs to see the animal and make a determination on the > basis of first hand observance rather than email information. I call my doctor and tell him I have what feels like a blocked ear; a friend convinces me it's a simple ear infection, which sounds reasonable. The doctor has me come in for an appointment, looks around, sends me to an audiologist for a hearing test. The audiologist tells me I have a raging ear infection in the blocked ear (mechanical hearing loss) and sensorineural hearing loss in both (previously unnoticed), more severe in the blocked ear than in the other. She sends me to an ENT. He tells me it's not an infection, but clear fluid because of eustachian tube dysfunction -- something is blocking the tube and the fluid from draining as it normally would. He looks at it via my nose and doesn't like what he sees. He has an MRI done and ends up performing both a biopsy (in case the blockage is a tumor) and a tube placement. He also suggests hearing aids, at least in the future if not now.
And all because my ear felt blocked.
I can't imagine a medical professional trying to practice by e-mail.
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Charlie Wilkes - 24 Mar 2006 08:01 GMT >> Usually, the vet needs to see the animal and make a determination on the >> basis of first hand observance rather than email information. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > >And all because my ear felt blocked. I think you have been mis-diagnosed, because the MDs are not taking into account that you are the world's foremost expert on everything.
All that knowledge has to fit somewhere, Diane. It is putting tremendous pressure on your brain, which is swelling and putting pressure on your ears. It's like a big fat goiter inside your skull. Next, your eyeballs will start to bulge, and you'll look like Marge Simpson with Jeri Curls.
And then... Ever see "Scanners"? The guy was giving a speech, and the pressure built up, and all of a sudden, BLAM! His head just exploded into little blobs of bloody flesh and bone.
The secret to a long life in your particular situation, Diane, is to offload some knowledge. Start by shedding the knowledge that you pulled out of your big fat a.s, without having any information to go on... like your knowledge of reality TV, for example.
>I can't imagine a medical professional trying to practice by e-mail. Oh, I think it's a perfectly fine idea. They could have little sensors that you tape all over your body, and you would sit in front of a web cam totally nude. "Good morning, Diane. How's that Jurassic Beaver? Are the defossilizing pills working?"
Charlie
Brandy Alexandre - 24 Mar 2006 14:13 GMT Charlie Wilkes <charlie_wilkes@users.easynews.com> wrote in rec.pets.cats.health+behav:
>>I can't imagine a medical professional trying to practice by >>e-mail. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Charlie They do it with astronauts... ;)
I don't think there's any harm in the way my vet makes recommendations for Kami via email. She has first knowledge of her disease and overall condition, and experience with animals of similar condition. I questions Dr. Greg's dental suggestions because he only saw her that one time and I would bet didn't even check her teeth as requested. He was making a recommendation without having seen her except that one time 2 months ago, and in retrospect, Dr. Tina was absolutely right.
I think one has to reserve the judgment based on whether the "practice by email" is from a doc who knows the history and has a trusted pattern of accuracy.
 Signature Brandy Alexandre
--Everything tastes better with cat hair in it. =^.^=
Brandy Alexandre - 23 Mar 2006 21:40 GMT Rhonda <san-toki@attremovethis.net> wrote in rec.pets.cats.health+behav:
> I've thought about that in the past regarding vets -- and I think > it's a time-saver for them NOT to have email. There are so many [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Rhonda I think Dr. Tina uses it because it definitely saves her time. Given the size of the practice, returning fewer non-urgent calls frees up her face time in the clinic and she can respond with more detail. And certainly I can give a more thorough explanationof the issue than taking up face/phone time. Here is my email exchange with her regarding this incident. She's always very thoughtful. ________________________
Dr. Tina:
I spoke to Dr. Greg today about Kami showing interest in food, but not eating it. He suggested that I bring her in for a dental and I wanted to know if that's something you agree with. She eats my food without a problem, so I would think if she needed dental attention should wouldn't want anything. She really just seems to be against her food, no matter what it is. I tried a trick, and made a small portion of scrambled eggs and sat in my spot and she wanted them. When I got up and put the plate down in her spot for her to eat, she walked away.
I asked Dr. Greg about an appetite stimulant first, but he seemed to want dental first. I'm just suspicious about trying the most expensive thing first. I've always be willing to do what is necessary for her, but I want to make sure it's necessary.
Thanks!
________________________
Good morning, I'm not sure a dental is what's needed. The best way to tell that is just to look at her teeth and see if there is any sign of infection and irritation such as red gums or heavy tartar. Often with my kidney patients they want to eat but are nauseated from the actual disease. I would increase the fluid frequency for a few days and try a pepcid ac to see if that helps. Before we try an appetite stimulant I would recommend a recheck exam to make sure that she is doing well. Also, try a different food for awhile to see if a change will help her appetite. Keep me posted. Dr.T ___________________________
Replying again, you seem to be right on the money, as usual. The few days of straight SQ, plus three days of pepcid seem to be doing the trick. She did vomit what looked like the days' dining this evening a few hours after giving the Baytril, but she's been going back and eating a few bites every once in a while. She hasn't been "put off" by the episode. If ever your clients ask, I HIGHLY recommend the Bissell SpotBot carpet cleaner between the barfing and scooting.
She finally focused in on a Fancy Feast variety that isn't the best for her, but given the alternative... I used to have low blood pressure, but now it's high. I wonder how that happened...
I love Kami dearly, but I feel more like a hospice than a home with a cuddly pet sometimes. I really don't know what to do from here. I promised her I would be here for her the rest of her natural life. But when is it not natural anymore? ___________________________
Good morning, Glad to read she is eating some. I agree with you, who cares what it is as long as she's eating something right now. I think you have been giving her the best care and it's a shame that renal failure is 100% fatal. All we can do is manage it to slow the process down and buy some time. It's my true belief that to go on when they have more bad days than good is only for us. Allowing them to rest without fighting to the end is the biggest and hardest act of love we ever do for our babies. I will help you to know when it's time. Take care and thanks for the updates, Dr.T
 Signature Brandy Alexandre
--Everything tastes better with cat hair in it. =^.^=
Charlie Wilkes - 24 Mar 2006 00:57 GMT >I've thought about that in the past regarding vets -- and I think it's a >time-saver for them NOT to have email. There are so many things that [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >round on one subject and facing another question of "what about this?", >I'd pick up the phone and call them. I guess so. Sometimes I think it's easier to shoot out an email than return a call, however.
Charlie
cybercat - 22 Mar 2006 00:35 GMT > >But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this > >newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people > >off-topic in some other one. > > Oh, come on. What happened? *G*
-L. - 22 Mar 2006 01:01 GMT > > >But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this > > >newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > *G* Sigh. They're both so predictable...
-L.
cybercat - 22 Mar 2006 02:26 GMT > > > >But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this > > > >newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Sigh. They're both so predictable... Yeah. But at least Charlie is up front--"intellectually honest," as he says.
:) Joe Canuck - 22 Mar 2006 02:30 GMT >>>>> But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this >>>>> newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Yeah. But at least Charlie is up front--"intellectually honest," as he says. > :) On the newsgroups, Charlie is whatever he says he is... which doesn't necessarily reflect reality.
-L. - 22 Mar 2006 06:29 GMT > Yeah. But at least Charlie is up front--"intellectually honest," as he says. > :) Now, now, that's not fair to ole Cumbucket. One first has to have intellect in order to be honest with it...;)
-L.
-L. - 21 Mar 2006 23:45 GMT > But then I'm not allowed to discuss Kami's health issue in this > newsgroup, so I'll vent with normal, logical, and reasonable people > off-topic in some other one. > > -- > Brandy Alexandre You are reaping what you have sown, Cumbucket.
-L.
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