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chronic pancreatitis

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teri - 03 Mar 2006 02:11 GMT
Does anyone have experience with chronic feline pancreatitis?
Seamus was diagnosed by ultrasound Feb 1, and has been on torbutrol
for the pain since then.  He is no better when I have tried to wean
him off the pain med.  He has a great appetite, no vomiting or
diarrhea (soft stools when the torb is decreased), just the signs of
pain - hunching, very quiet,  not running or playing (he is normally
*very* active).  This is his first bout with this, and it is a long
time to have to see him like this.  He is getting 1/2 of a torb once
or twice a day before meals, then he will play.  I am also concerned
about keeping him on the opoid that long.  When will he feel better?
Teri
yngver - 03 Mar 2006 19:17 GMT
> Does anyone have experience with chronic feline pancreatitis?
> Seamus was diagnosed by ultrasound Feb 1, and has been on torbutrol
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> about keeping him on the opoid that long.  When will he feel better?
> Teri

Pancreatitis is hard to diagnose and often seems to resolve by itself
no matter what you do. Our cat had the symptoms you describe (although
the vet did not do ultrasound) and on a hunch the vet sent out for a
pancreatic enzyme assay (called TLI). Unfortunately this kind of test
takes 3-4 weeks to get results and by the time the results did come
back, my cat had completely recovered. But the vet said the test did
show evidence of pancreatitis. I think this test is not certain either,
but the best test currently available. While our cat did show signs of
pain (hunching, walking very slowly) she was also not eating. Thinking
it might be some kind of infection the vet also prescribed an
antibiotic and he gave us an appetite stimulant. Once she started on
the antibiotic, it only took one dose of the appetite stimulant and she
started eating again. After that she began to recover.

I guess my point is that it's hard to be sure that a cat has
pancreatitis--the vet isn't even sure that our cat really had it
despite the assay. However, if your cat has been in pain from
pancreatitis for a month, I'd think I'd want the vet to see if anything
more can be done. It is a painful condition and I think sometimes vets
prescribe Fentanyl patches to control the pain. But it seems to me that
in a month it would have started to heal and become less painful.
-Yngver
Alice - 03 Mar 2006 22:10 GMT
Hi Teri, keep giving him torbutrol! Chronic feline pancreatitis outlook
is usually judged to be bad to fair. Opioids are really the least of
your problems.

While pancreatic inflammation can be visible via ultrasound the only
way to diagnose it is to do PLI/TLI blood test (the turn-around is
usually 7 days - the test needs to be sent to laboratory in Texas; my
cat's results came back in 5 days). TLI alone, especially in cats, is
not always indicative. PLI/TLI test IS conclusive. It is important to
do this test because lymphoma has exactly the same symptoms and also
presents as an inflammation on abdominal ultrasound (you'll need biopsy
or at least laparoscopy to fully diagnose lymphoma).

It's wrong to think that chronic pancreatitis resolves itself - it
does not. It's a chronic disease marked by returns of acute periods.
Once it presents itself, it always comes back. There is, at present, NO
treatment for it.

Sometimes, but not always, pancreatitis is caused by infection in the
GI track. The theory goes that bacteria backs down to pancreatic ducts
and causes inflammation. For that possibility vets usually prescribe a
short course of antibiotics. The antibiotics do nothing for
pancreatitis. Be resistant to prolonged use of antibiotics if there is
no improvement after first two weeks.  My cat's pancreatitis wasn't
caused by infection and I wasted a month giving him antibiotics.

Another thing, if he's not getting better maybe you should consider
steroids? My cat, for as long as he was only on painkiller and some
supportive medicine, did NOT improve. In fact, he got worse and I ended
up regretting I didn't give him steroids sooner (this disease took a
lot out of him, he's aged a lot). Budesonide (rather 'mild' steroid)
made him better in just few days. (Btw, it's important to exclude
lymphoma because steroids without chemo are not a good cancer
treatment.)

Other things you might want to consider before adding steroid therapy:
- Subcutaneous fluids (really easy to learn and very helpful)
- Vit. B12 injections (can be added via IV port during sub-q fluids)
- Vit. C injections (unless there is UTI or CRF present, administered
same way as B12)
- Vit. E
- Omega 3 (salmon oil)
- Denosyl (if liver enzymes are elevated as well)
- Pancreatic enzymes derived from animal pancreas not plants with every
meal (my cat hated it and I had to syringe him immediately after every
meal with a mixture of food, water and incubated enzymes - I thought
it was essential that his pancreas gets a rest).

If your cat is still eating consider yourself lucky but don't count on
it long term. Cats with pancreatitis get anorexic sooner rather than
later. The medical solutions are not very good (assisted feeding,
e-tube, appetite stimulants that make cats behave oddly). He should eat
often (every 3 hours even at night) and small amounts (empty stomach
and/or a lot of food at once tend to induce pain). Watch for symptoms
of pain and give him food in the intervals, when he's physically able
to eat. The attacks tend to wear off in 4-8 hours. Painkiller is your
friend. Watch how rested he is after an attack that was helped with
painkiller and how hard it is for him to bounce back when he didn't get
it. He needs strength to fight pancreatitis. (Btw, I'm not sure if
torbutrol comes in liquid version, buprenex, which is a similar drug
does. You squirt it into the cheek pouch, the results are immediate.
So you can actually wait until the attack starts and not give it on
regular basis.)

L. acidophilus (probotic) shows some potential in helping soft stools.
And try slippery elm bark powder, which should also help with some
discomfort, diarrhea/soft stools and nausea.

My cat had his last attack in January and was battling the more acute
version of the disease since September. And I'm not sure he's really
over it yet. Be prepared: this may be long term. And yes, he's worth
the trouble.

Good luck,

Alice
teri - 04 Mar 2006 19:48 GMT
Hello.

>While pancreatic inflammation can be visible via ultrasound the only
>way to diagnose it is to do PLI/TLI blood test (the turn-around is
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>presents as an inflammation on abdominal ultrasound (you'll need biopsy
>or at least laparoscopy to fully diagnose lymphoma).
Lymphoma was thought to be the worst case scenario of his differential
diagnoses when he had the ultrasound, but the Dr. who did the study
found no evidence of any cancer and concluded that he had pancreatitis
based on his findings.

>It's wrong to think that chronic pancreatitis resolves itself - it
>does not. It's a chronic disease marked by returns of acute periods.
>Once it presents itself, it always comes back. There is, at present, NO
>treatment for it.
From all the reading I have done I see that while it does not become
cured, it does have to resolve itself and needs symptomatic,
supportive treatment.  But as you say, unfortunately no treatment for
the inflammation itself.

>Another thing, if he's not getting better maybe you should consider
>steroids?
Seamus was initially suspected to have IBD, so he was given a week of
prednisolone.  That was started after only two weeks of him having
symptoms of decreased activity (but still playing to a fair extent,
just not as wild as his usual self), crouching at times, and having
about half of each stool being very soft.  After four days of the pred
was when he then basically stopped playing altogether so we decided it
was not IBD.  He did then wean off the pred over the next week and a
half.

>Other things you might want to consider before adding steroid therapy:
>- Subcutaneous fluids (really easy to learn and very helpful)
Would that be necessary would you think even if he is eating and
drinking normally?  There has been no change in the amount of pees
daily between the two cats.

>- Denosyl (if liver enzymes are elevated as well)
So far they have been wnl along with bile acid studies.

What is it meant by having attacks?
Seamus never really seems to have any variation in how he feels other
than more active about an hour to two after the torb is given, but
never had vomiting, or any signs of worse pain than crouching and
being quite which is what he has been doing for a month and a half
now.
Oh, at this past week's visit his dr. wanted to do the PLI test but he
was not fasting so I took him in this morning to have that drawn.  

I am going to start with the small frequent feedings, but every three
hours is not going to work on weekdays.  I will spread them out as
much as possible though and continue to give the torb every 12 hours.

Thanks.
Teri
Alice - 05 Mar 2006 17:21 GMT
Hi Teri,

> Lymphoma was thought to be the worst case scenario of his differential
> diagnoses when he had the ultrasound, but the Dr. who did the study
> found no evidence of any cancer and concluded that he had pancreatitis
> based on his findings.

Same here... We opted out of biopsy because he wasn't a good candidate
for chemo. The specialist who interpreted the ultrasound also didn't
think it was cancer. But ultrasound cannot definitely eliminate
lymphoma. Many times intestinal lymphoma does not develop any growths
and the only way to find it is to take a sample and put it under the
microscope. Some months later with no visible progression of the
disease I'm more reassured that it's not lymphoma. (I'm very careful
not to be too optimistic; this disease had so many setbacks...) Also,
IBD and intestinal lymphoma present like identical twins on ultrasound.
Did your internist see any evidence of IBD? Or was the inflammation
contained to pancreas?

> Seamus was initially suspected to have IBD, so he was given a week of
> prednisolone.  That was started after only two weeks of him having
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> was not IBD.  He did then wean off the pred over the next week and a
> half.

Sounds like your cat had a bad reaction to pred, which is not unusual.
Ask your vet about budesonide. It works differently than regular
corticosteroids, has fewer side effects and is much better long term.
It is the choice drug for IBD. (IBD not always responds to steroids,
which makes things even more complicated.)

Have you tried a short course of antibiotics (metronidazole is
prescribed most often)? If his pancreatitis is caused by infection it
would make sense that it presented with soft stools only. If the
infection is chronic wbc would not have to be elevated. It's worth
trying, it's just not worth staying long term on it without visible
improvement.

IBD is yet another disease that's very hard to diagnose. Also symptoms
very much like pancreatitis. Also shows as an inflammation on
ultrasound.  My cat has it, I think. I suspected it for few years but
the only proof I have so far is visible thickening of the intestinal
walls on the ultrasound. Btw, if your internist didn't see IBD on
ultrasound it doesn't necessarily mean it's not there. You might be
fighting an early onset of it and the thickening of the intestine walls
is not visible yet. (I know - this is hell.)

If I may make a suggestion: get rid of (if you haven't yet) foods that
contains wheat gluten, wheat, soy, corn, etc., which are obvious
allergens for cats. There are other good options on the market,
sometimes even from the same brand your cat likes. (There is even dry
food that doesn't contain any of it. I think, Innova Evo?) If it's IBD
it might actually help his soft stools. If it's 'only' pancreatitis
allergens won't stress his digestive track and that will help too.

> Would that be necessary would you think even if he is eating and
> drinking normally?  There has been no change in the amount of pees
> daily between the two cats.

Sub-q fluids for pancreatitis are not just saline solution. Lactated
ringers solution is used instead, the same as IV fluids given to all
post-op human patients. The objective is to infuse the body with
electrolytes, minerals, so it could recover faster. A good analogy
would be a tennis match between two same rank athletes, during the
break when they are not dehydrated yet, one drinks Gatorade (lactated
ringers) and the other water (saline) or nothing - who do you think
is going to have more power in the next set? (A sub-q injection at the
beginning of pain spell often helped me to shorten it by many hours
simply because with fluids he could cope with pain.)

> What is it meant by having attacks?
> Seamus never really seems to have any variation in how he feels other
> than more active about an hour to two after the torb is given, but
> never had vomiting, or any signs of worse pain than crouching and
> being quite which is what he has been doing for a month and a half
> now.

In my cat's case the attacks would usually start with vomiting early in
the morning, nausea (sometimes very severe) would continue thru the day
and he could not eat; then it would all transform into pain that could
last for hours. Sometimes I was able to manage the spell and end it
sooner by giving him in short intervals all possible remedies I had on
hand and by continuously offering food with enzymes. The indicators I
watched for: sitting in a loaf position, hiding, sleeping or lying down
when he should be up, not stretching while sleeping, disinterest,
standing over the bowl with water and NOT drinking, sniffing food and
NOT eating, eating grass, howling, lack of interest in his favorite
foods even if I put it in front of him, lethargy, smacking his lips,
unusually loud eating (the last two are clear indications of nausea).
These indicators on any normal day could well be meaningless.

> I am going to start with the small frequent feedings, but every three
> hours is not going to work on weekdays.

Try putting food in many places, especially 'his' hiding places (a box
he likes to sleep in, his favorite closet). In small places food smells
more intensely and he might be tempted to try it more often. We also
used to divide one 3 oz. can of food into 3 bowls. For some reason
smaller portions seemed less intimidating than large ones. We kept 2
bowls of different foods next to his bed - if he wasn't feeling great
he was probably lying down and if he suddenly felt slight inclination
to eat - he didn't have far to go. Add a little water to can food -
it will stay fresh longer. Wet food proved for us much better
temptation. The other cat was of course tempted too so we had to
separate them while we weren't home. Also, my husband used to call home
and leave messages on our answering machine (we had to turn off our
telco's voice mail). When hearing his voice the cat would come to the
phone and sure enough next to the phone there was food too... There are
many tricks.

I'm glad you managed to take the PLI test - the more you know at this
point the better.  Take care!  Things will improve.  

Alice
Alice - 05 Mar 2006 17:40 GMT
Sorry, this is only to fix the subject title of the topic.

Alice
Phil P. - 06 Mar 2006 05:33 GMT
> I am going to start with the small frequent feedings, but every three
> hours is not going to work on weekdays.

I don't think that's such a good idea.  I've had the best results by spacing
the feedings no less than 12 hours apart- gives the pancreas time to rest
and heal between meals.  Feeding stimulates pancreatic secretions which tend
to aggravate the condition.
Alice - 07 Mar 2006 16:36 GMT
Forgive me Phil but I strongly disagree. There are many reasons why
feeding a cat with pancreatitis every 12 hours doesn't make sense to
me:

1) Firstly, 97% of cats with pancreatitis show poor appetite and many
loose a lot of weight during the entire course of the disease. Limiting
their opportunity to eat to only 2x a day just doesn't make any sense.

2) Pancreatitis in cats is likely to cause diabetes (insuline is also
produced by pancreas) or other nasty systemic disorders, including the
infamous triad. About 60% of cases mark concurrent fatty change in the
cats' livers. In older cats, i.e. the ones that tend to get chronic
pancreatitis in the first place, it stresses kidneys enough to cause
CRF (or increase CRF if the condition was preexisting). With these odds
infrequent feeding (like twice a day), for obvious reasons, is really
not a good idea!

3) Many vets say that steady supplementation of pancreatic enzymes is
the key to success in fight against pancreatitis (pancreatic enzymes
are associated with treatment of EPI but what is not commonly known is
that it's also a very effective treatment to ease the extent of
pancreatic secretions and pain in pancreatitis, i.e. you want to
relieve the pancreas - here is your tool).

Usually, the dose is 1/4 tsp of enzymes per meal, which is 2.5-3 oz of
wet food. Average cat eats about 8-9 oz of wet food a day. So, if you
feed your cat twice a day (at least 4 oz of wet food per meal) then 1/4
tsp of enzymes is by definition too little (per meal) to matter. Larger
single dose of viokase (trademark for animal source enzymes) is not
advisable. In humans viokase has been known to cause burns in mouth and
esophagus.

Hence, if you supplement viokase - as you should, you MUST feed the cat
at least 3-4 times a day. And if you supplement it by gelcap (right
after the meal, followed by water), which is a smaller dose than 1/4
tsp - you need to feed the cat more often than 4 times a day.

4) Finally all vets I asked, including a specialist from Madison School
of Vet. Medicine and a feline nutritionist, told me that small,
frequent meals of easily digestible, good quality food were the way to
go. The same applies to human patients with chronic pancreatitis who
are advised NOT to eat large meals _ever again_. And 4 oz IS a large
meal for most cats (there is a reason why single meal can food contains
no more than 3 oz). These days thinking is that large, infrequent meals
are much more likely to aggravate pancreas into flooding itself with
enzymes or spilling the enzymes into abdominal cavity than small,
frequent meals could ever be.

>From my own experience I'll add that had I been advised to feed my cat
every 12 hours and followed this ill advise despite his anorexia I have
no doubt at all that he wouldn't've been alive today.

Alice
Phil P. - 07 Mar 2006 17:06 GMT
> X-No-Archive:yes
>
> Forgive me Phil but I strongly disagree.

That's ok, I don't mind.

This feeding plan has worked for me for many years with many cats that had
pancreatis-  providing, of course, they were not vomiting and still had an
appetite-- which seems to be the case with Terri's cat.  This is not a plan
for all cats with pancreatitis.

You can't always rely on what you read, there is no one ideal treatment for
all cats with pancreatitis.  The treatment plan must be designed
specifically for each individual cat.

I'm pleased that your plan worked for your cat.

Phil
Rhonda - 04 Mar 2006 15:36 GMT
Hi Teri,

Sorry your cat is not feeling so well. Our cat, Bob, also had chronic
pancreatitus. I'll tell you some of his story to see if it helps.

His started six months after his diabetes diagnosis (which happened
right after a steroid shot for allergies...)

Bob would throw up, have diarrhea, a high fever and just be listless. He
was in pain and would yowl if we picked him up. During his first six
months after diagnosis, he probably had about three major attacks that
sent him to the hospital, some for a week at a time. He was always
treated by an internist vet, a specialist. He was on an IV and his fever
watched carefully. He usually had to be force fed. The internist said
anti-nausea drugs do not work with cats. The treatment was basically
supportive care to get him through the episode. They also always sent
him home with metronidizole (sp?).

The vet said once a cat has pancreatitus, it changes the lining inside
of the pancreas which is why it often becomes a chronic problem. She
also said that the way to treat it in dogs is to fast them and rest the
pancreas. Because of the way cats are built, they cannot be fasted
without possible liver damage -- so treating it gets more complicated.

At the end of that six months, we were frazzled and a few thousand
dollars shorter. At Christmas, we found Bob again in pain and we didn't
know what to do. My sig. other thought maybe it was time to let him go
because this was no way to live, but I told him I could not think of
letting Bob go yet. We took him to the hospital again, he got better and
voila! No more attacks for a year!

Bob had a wonderful, pain-free year, relaxing on his window. I told you
all of this because watching your cat go through such pain can be
harrowing, plus the expense and the vet trips -- but they can have long
periods of a wonderful life.

In case you're wondering, Bob died that next year of cancer. It was not
related to his pancreas problems.

Good luck with your cat,

Rhonda

> Does anyone have experience with chronic feline pancreatitis?
> Seamus was diagnosed by ultrasound Feb 1, and has been on torbutrol
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> about keeping him on the opoid that long.  When will he feel better?
> Teri
teri - 04 Mar 2006 19:58 GMT
Rhonda,

>Sorry your cat is not feeling so well. Our cat, Bob, also had chronic
>pancreatitus. I'll tell you some of his story to see if it helps.
Thank you for your thoughts and for telling my Bob's story.  I am
happy for you that he did have that good year on his window after all
he was throught, and I am very sorry for your loss at that point.
This is hard,  and you, along with some new friends have given me
encouragement that is much needed.  I go thru days where I just feel
so depressed about him, and others where I am sure this period will
end soon and he will be himself again.  I realize that he most likely
will have relapses and while the doctor is talking to me about that
all I can think of is that he needs to feel better first before we
worry about that.
So I continue reading and re-reading articles, asking questions, and
working with what I learn along the way.
Thank you.
Teri
yngver - 06 Mar 2006 16:19 GMT
> Rhonda,
>
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> Thank you.
> Teri

Teri, try not to be too depressed. After reading these stories I
suppose what our cat had was acute mild pancreatitis and not chronic,
but she had it more than two years ago, recovered completely and so far
it hasn't happened again. Of course, although the pancreatic enzyme
assay was indicative of pancreatitis the vet could still not be 100
percent sure that's what she had, so maybe it was some kind of
infection that mimicked pancreatitis. But my point is that you don't
know for sure that your cat will have relapses once he recovers. Since
he is eating and drinking normally I'd take that as a good sign. Good
luck to you.
-Yngver
teri - 13 Mar 2006 00:26 GMT
The results on my cat's PLI have come back - 3.3.  WNL.  That would be
great if he were looking better.  To recap:  He has been showing what
to me looks like signs of abdominal pain.  He doesn't play or run
around the house,he sits around hunching down much of the time.  That
is his only symptom.  Other than that he is eating great, no vomiting,
occasional soft stool, no diarrhea, no weight loss.  Palpating his
abdomen seems ok, no crying or fighting with that.  He had an
abdominal ultrasound Feb. 1 that showed a very inflammed pancreas
which is where the diagnosis of pancreaitis came from, and a smaller
liver.  Liver studies have all been normal including bile acid
studies.  Dr.s concluded that is just normal for him.  He has been on
Torbutrol since Feb. 1 which does help him and make him look more
comfortable - plays, doesn't hunch down as much.  He still needs the
torb, but he is down to a quarter of a tablet BID which is down from a
half.   Just started on Metronidazole, thinking IBD could be causing
the abdominal pain signs.  He has been in Hill's ID since mid January.

Any other ideas on why he doesn't feel better despite a normal PLI?
Teri
 
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