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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / February 2006What to do if you and spouse disagree it's "time"
i just wrote this to one of my friends. excuse the lack of caps. i have a moral dilemma regarding my cat, scottie. i'm just looking for answers: scottie's still here but not doing very good. looking very thin. has a very hard time eating just gravy, gags on it. tony doesn't think it's "time." he thinks because abbey was supposed to die and didn't that we should hold out and make absolutely sure scottie has no chance. that's not what i would like to do. it makes me too sad to see him hungry and not able to eat. of course, maybe that's a selfish reason...just so i don't have to see him uncomfortable. it's always so hard. he's on mega injectable steroids and they don't seem to make a difference anymore other than he is fairly perky despite getting so thin. still walks around with his tail up and purrs when you pet him and watches birdies and plays a little. it's all too awful. maybe it isn't time yet, i just don't know. but i can't see how he can survive. i'm trying to decide whether to do an endoscopy. it's not the $$, it's the putting him thru it and basically having to tell them to put him down during the procedure if they find something awful. then i wouldn't be able to be with him. i can't miss anymore work, i've left a billion times early and had last wed-fri off hoping things would resolve one way or another. so i have to go to work. i would have to just drop him off in the a.m. and wait for a phone call. this is awful. it seemed more clear cut with emily, cory, and miles. it was still awful but this seems more prolonged and with tony balking it makes it harder. he gets all pissy if i try to reason with him. but maybe he's right and i'm wrong. i hate it!!!! scottie doesn't seem to be in pain, just uncomfortable at times when he is gagging but that is probably a total of a half hour to 45 minutes a day, spread out, and the rest of the time he is almost normal acting. so maybe i shouldn't be so eager to end it all but i prefer to not have them get really bad. sorry, i'm just rambling, i know you know how icky it is, but this tony thing is a complicating factor. i'm the one who takes scottie to the vet, who tries to find different liquid-y things he can eat, but then i can't make the ultimate decision without feeling bad. he says i can take him in anytime but he won't go when he doesn't think it's right and i'm sure he would never quite forgive me for doing it too soon. i think scottie should have his dad there at the end since he likes him best. tony does love the kitties and spends a lot of time petting and playing with them and normally feeds them so it's not like he has no interest or rights in the whole affair. it sucks. pray for my little kitty... Candace [...]. still walks around with his tail up and purrs when you pet him > and watches birdies and plays a little. it's all too awful. maybe it > isn't time yet, i just don't know. Candace, I would err on the side of giving him time to recover, as much as I know you don't want him to suffer. Since Tony feels the same way, I am sure you can persuade him to share the nursing responsibilities. [..] it sucks. pray for > my little kitty... You bet. > [...]. still walks around with his tail up and purrs when you pet him > > and watches birdies and plays a little. it's all too awful. maybe it [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > same way, I am sure you can persuade him to share the nursing > responsibilities. In this case, I would, too. I went through a month with Pudge where she couldn't/wouldn't eat, and it turned out the last antibiotic did the trick. There's too much mystery here yet. > [..] it sucks. pray for > > my little kitty... > > You bet. Me, too.  SignatureWeb site: http://www.slywy.com/ Message board: http://www.slywy.com/phpBB2/ Journal: http://slywy.blogspot.com/ Candace Please givee your kitty more time. You will absolutely know when the right time is. Then there will be no regrets. We pray for all kitties. Candace, We've gone through this a few times. I know we've always waited to long, but I could not have forgiven myself if I was not absolutely sure there was no hope. If a cat of mine was still purring, I don't think I could do it. You have to know in your heart and each case is different. I know how this can tear you up and can create some tension in the household. I will pray for your Scottie. I'm hoping for a miracle. Rhonda > scottie's still here but not doing very good. looking very thin. Rhonda <san-toki@attremovethis.net> wrote in rec.pets.cats.health+behav: > Candace, > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Rhonda But Rhonda, even severely ill cats will purr. I agree it's hard when you think they're communicating contentment, but even with Kami's stealth purr, if she were doing it all the time, I would have to wonder. I still fall back on quality vs quantity. Life for lafe's sake is no life at all. If it is only going to get worse, I would rather call the game before it's absolutely OBVIOUS the cat is dying and in distress. I hope I don't hurt anyone's feelings with this, but someone recently posted a link that eventually linked to pics of their cat's last days. It was exceedingly difficult to look at. I personally would have called it quits before Kami looked that sick and miserable. I look at it this way: If I'm right, I've relieved the cat of its suffering. If there were a few more "good" weeks, I've relieved myself of watching a painful decline to the inevitable end. I have not read all of Scottie's saga. But generally, if it's fixable, I do it. If it's never going to get better, I wouldn't. I have my own difficulties seeing that with Kami. It's a constant one step forward, two steps back. She's still walking, talking, trying to eat, staying close, etc. I hope I'm alert enough to the minute change from the gentle touch she gives to say I'm here," to the gentle tap that mens, "hello? Let's go now." SignatureMargarita Salt "...practically no one in the world is entirely bad or entirely good... motives are often more important than actions." -- Eleanore Roosevelt > I still fall back on quality vs quantity. Life for lafe's sake is no > life at all. If it is only going to get worse, I would rather call the > game before it's absolutely OBVIOUS the cat is dying and in distress. I agree. The thing here is it isn't obvious he's dying; he might have something fixable or healable. And I truly don't think he is in distress...discomfort at times but mostly feeling pretty good. I've heard that creepy purr when it means they're not doing well. My late cat, Cory, did it sometimes when he was very ill (he had several bad illnesses during his 18 years). It had a subtly different sound to it than a regular purr and it wasn't triggered by happy times. Scottie's isn't like that and his only happens when you're holding him and petting him, just like always. I guess I am fortunate that I don't have to go through it all alone. I had my original 2 cats when I was single and one of them (Cory) did get pretty ill a couple of times so I know how it is to have to deal with it alone. I guess Scottie might be lucky I'm not on my own, too, or he might already have been PTS. You have us to talk to about Kami at any rate :) Candace Candace <maccandace@aol.com> wrote in rec.pets.cats.health+behav: > I agree. The thing here is it isn't obvious he's dying; he might > have something fixable or healable. And I truly don't think he is > in distress...discomfort at times but mostly feeling pretty good. I'm with you there. I would continue on if it's fixable. That's been my whole motto. Good luck with the tests. SignatureMargarita Salt "...practically no one in the world is entirely bad or entirely good... motives are often more important than actions." -- Eleanore Roosevelt > i just wrote this to one of my friends. excuse the lack of caps. i > have a moral dilemma regarding my cat, scottie. i'm just looking for [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > hungry and not able to eat. of course, maybe that's a selfish > reason...just so i don't have to see him uncomfortable. That's because it's a compassionate feeling. > it's always so > hard. he's on mega injectable steroids and they don't seem to make a [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > sorry, i'm just rambling, i know you know how icky it is, but this > tony thing is a complicating factor. Nothing like conflict on top of anticipatory grief and making the decision... > i'm the one who takes scottie to > the vet, who tries to find different liquid-y things he can eat, but [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > he has no interest or rights in the whole affair. it sucks. pray for > my little kitty... sh.t Candace, I don't know what to tell you. I have BTDT with my dog Tosh last year. I went back and forth so many times, I didn't know what to do. Despite all of her trouble, she remained happy and loyal right to the end, which made it even harder. DH left it all up to me. Let me babble for a minute...in the end I couldn't see her suffer anymore, although most of her suffering was only during potty breaks, when she would spin around in the yard for 10 or 15 minutes, trying to poop. After a particularly difficult session, she seemingly looked me in the eyes and said "End it, please." with a smile on her face. I made the call when we came in the house. Could I have waited another week or two? Probably. Could I have waited even longer? Sure. But in the end, the outcome was the same, and her suffering was stopped, and at the time, that was what seemed important, although over the past 10 months I second-guessed myself and beat myself up a million times over doing it when I did. Looking back on the situation, I now look at photos of her over her last months and I can see a marked decline. At the time I was blind to all of that. I guess my input at this point would be to ask Tony participate in the food-making and finding. He's probably in denial. You can't let Scottie starve to death, and I know that's what is bugging you. Here's a link that might help: http://angelshavenhere.homestead.com/makingthedecision.html Have Tony read it, too. I know what you mean by not wanting their last minutes to be cold and alone on the operating table, or for their last memory to be a trip to the vet. The bottom line is, you're not ready to make the decision yet, so give it a few days. Think about it some more. A couple days probably won't make a lot of difference in the overall situation (endoscopy or not, euthanasia or not), but it may make you feel better. My heart goes out to you. I hate this part of pet guardianship. And I am thinking of Scottie. hugs, -L. > The bottom line is, you're not ready to make the decision > yet, so give it a few days. Think about it some more. A couple days [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > hugs, > -L. You're all right (at least that's what I think right this minute). It isn't time. And the endoscopy will occur. I asked Tony to be the one to decide whether we should do that and he said yes so I will make the appt. tomorrow. I imagine they can do it Tues. or Wed. at the latest. And I don't have to tell them to put him down if they find something awful. That can be done later when we're present but maybe it will be something fixable. So I don't have to make dropping him off the last time I ever see him; if euthanasia is necessary, I can be present but I'm going to try to think positively. I'm not a great positive thinker but someone just gave me a pep talk and I'll try :) Thank you to all who said to not make the decision yet. I think that is correct. He's not in pain; he has times of discomfort...it's still very sad when those occur but Rhonda, you're right, he's still purring. Candace Candace <maccandace@aol.com> wrote in rec.pets.cats.health+behav: > You're all right (at least that's what I think right this minute). > It isn't time. And the endoscopy will occur. I asked Tony to be [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Candace I wish you and Scottie the best, Candace. I'm watching for The Sign with Kami these days, and sometimes I wnt to put her down right now so I don't have to see the decine. But on the other hand, she's still seemingly enjoying her life and I don't want to take anything away from her. Of course that flies in the face of our generally held beliefs that there is life after death and things will not only be better, but fantastic! I'm glad you don't have to deal with this alone and somone can offer support or be devil's advocate for you. I only have an artist several hundred miles away working out an urn, a caring vet, and two bosses who wish the cat would just go away. (The third just lost his dog of 14 years and seems to have softened to my plight.) Purring counts if he's smiling and giving those blinks. SignatureMargarita Salt "...practically no one in the world is entirely bad or entirely good... motives are often more important than actions." -- Eleanore Roosevelt Good luck to you. When you have time, let us know how it's going. Sometimes it helps to talk to computerites who've been through something similar. Rhonda > You're all right (at least that's what I think right this minute). It > isn't time. And the endoscopy will occur. I asked Tony to be the one [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Candace > You're all right (at least that's what I think right this minute). It > isn't time. And the endoscopy will occur. I asked Tony to be the one [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Candace Hang in there, girl! Keep us updated as you can. I hope the endoscopy gives you some answers. -L. > i just wrote this to one of my friends. excuse the lack of caps. i > have a moral dilemma regarding my cat, scottie. i'm just looking for > answers: if mamma ain't happy nobodies happy handle your business tell him stay out of it just kidding no im not! do your thang you're goin do it anyway you all do just kidding no im not! who's cat "is it" aight then... thing is...Toni should be a little mo sensative to your level of comfort here. Tell him you let him burn one, if he get back out the way > i just wrote this to one of my friends. excuse the lack of caps. i > have a moral dilemma regarding my cat, scottie. i'm just looking for > answers: Im sorry, I read Candace, was thinking Catnipped but I guess my answer is the same? :) You've got a rough situation, Candace. I agree with the bulk of the comments here, a little more time, and make sure Tony understands that you can't take any more time off from work so he will have to shoulder more of the load. If Scottie isn't in a lot of pain, you can make his life worth living just by doting on him. Maybe you could spare him further procedures and just wait to see if he recovers or not. Charlie > i just wrote this to one of my friends. excuse the lack of caps. i > have a moral dilemma regarding my cat, scottie. i'm just looking for > answers: he is fairly perky despite getting so > thin. still walks around with his tail up and purrs when you pet him > and watches birdies and plays a little. There's your answer. :) It isn't time. I'd have the endoscopy done. I don't think its megaesophagus because it came on too fast. Megaesophagus in cats is *very* rare in the United States. I can't help but think this was caused by improper tube placement since he didn't have this problem before. I think you should have the endoscopy done by a *different* vet than the one who placed the tube. Keep the faith. Phil
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