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Cat Forum / Health and Behavior / February 2004

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Leukemia Cat With Herpes

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rescuerofcats@webtv.net - 12 Feb 2004 22:51 GMT
I have a positive neutered male cat who was squinting. The vet said he
has herpes in the eye. That there are lots of little ulcers and that it
is quite painful. The only thing he advised doing is lubricating the eye
with white petroleum w/mineral oil four times aday. He said the herpes
will clear up on its own but maybe not because of the leukemia. Its only
been 3 days since I've started lubricating his eyes but Miracle is
definitely hurting. Has anyone dealt with herpes in the eye? Thank you!
Mary - 13 Feb 2004 02:17 GMT
>I have a positive neutered male cat who was squinting. The vet said he
>has herpes in the eye. That there are lots of little ulcers and that it
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>been 3 days since I've started lubricating his eyes but Miracle is
>definitely hurting. Has anyone dealt with herpes in the eye? Thank you!

A friend of mine has an FLV+ kitty with herpes around the nose. The nose area
gets red then gets black crusty spots. It goes away in a few weeks. He puts
vaseline on it. The expensive $11 a tube eye ointment is just vaseline and
mineral oil. Your vet is doing you a big favor being honest. I wasn't thrilled
when I read the ingredients on Dr. prescribed eye ointment. Now I just use
vaseline in my eyes at night after skiing. My friend's cat is on Interferon.
Keep the cat indoors, stress free, give it good food and he may be able to live
a fine life.
zuzu22@webtv.net - 13 Feb 2004 04:22 GMT
Mary, please read my post to the OP. Eye ulcers are quite different from
something on a cat's nose and can be very serious if left untreated.
Vaseline is NOT an appropriate treatment.

Megan

                                   
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"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do
nothing."

-Edmund Burke

Learn The TRUTH About Declawing
http://www.stopdeclaw.com

Zuzu's Cats Photo Album:
http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22

"Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one
elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and
splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then
providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision,
raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and
material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his
way."

- W.H. Murray

Mary - 13 Feb 2004 04:59 GMT
>Mary, please read my post to the OP. Eye ulcers are quite different from
>something on a cat's nose and can be very serious if left untreated.
>Vaseline is NOT an appropriate treatment.

I missed the ulcers part. I thought it was just like herpes of the mouth or
nose. Yes, that would need something else. Should the vet at least prescribe an
anti-viral like aclivar (sp?)? I thought about that after my post but just got
home.
zuzu22@webtv.net - 13 Feb 2004 05:49 GMT
>I missed the ulcers part. I thought it was
>just like herpes of the mouth or nose. Yes,
>that would need something else. Should
>the vet at least prescribe an anti-viral like
>aclivar (sp?)?

According to the text I'll include below from
http://www.eyevet.info/herpes.html
Acyclovir does not work for Feline Herpes virus. I used the Idoxuridine
drops and 250 mg of L-Lysine twice a day for the kittens I rescued and
it worked very well. This article states that the Lysine dosage is 125
mg twice a day, but from my experience the higher dose is needed when
you're in the midst of a crisis and/or dealing with an immune
compromised animal.

Megan

Text from eyevet.info:

"If corneal involvement is present, topical antivirals are prescribed.
In the adult cat with recrudescent FHV-1 infection topical antivirals
are best used aggressively early in the course of the disease before
stromal involvement progresses. Three antiviral medications are
available. Idoxuridine (IDU) interferes with viral DNA synthesis by
substituting for the essential nucleotide thymidine. IDU is poorly
soluble and is virostatic. Prolonged contact with the infected tissue is
required. The 0.1% solution must be applied five times daily. IDU is
marketed as Stoxil (Smith Kline & French) and Herplex (Allergan
Pharmaceuticals). Adenine Arabinoside inhibits viral DNA polymerase and
thus decreases viral DNA synthesis. It is sold as Vira A (Parke Davis)
and the 3% ointment is applied five times daily. Triflurothymidine is
incorporated into the viral DNA and leads to the synthesis of defective
proteins. Sold as Viroptic (Burroughs Wellcome) it is considered the
most effective, least toxic and most soluble of the antivirals. It is
also the most expensive. Available as a 1% solution, Viroptic is applied
every two hours while the animal is awake until the cornea has
re-epithelialized, then reduced to every four hours while awake, for two
weeks more. Acyclovir is the newest antiviral available for human
herpesvirus. It is a tablet given orally and is marketed under the trade
name Zovirax (Burroughs Wellcome). Research by Nasisse indicates that
triflurothymidine is the most effective against Feline Herpesvirus
followed by Idoxuridine then Adenine Arabinoside. Although Acyclovir was
most effective against Human herpes simplex virus, it was not effective
against Feline Herpesvirus. This may be due to the inability of FHV-1 to
induce deoxycytidine kinase.
Other strategies to assist in the treatment of herpetic keratitis
reported in the last few years include topically applied interferon,
oral administration of l - lysine and oral administration of cimetidine.
Interferon is reported to stimulate the local immunity to viral
infection. A 20 to 50 IU/ml solution in artificial tear is administered
topically twice daily. Orally administered l - lysine has been reported
to inhibit herpesvirus growth by competitive inhibition of the uptake of
arginine which is required for viral multiplication. It is given to cats
at a dosage of 125 mg twice daily. Cimetidine has been shown to
generally stimulate cell mediated immunity. It is given at a dosage of
50 mg once daily. Anecdotal reports suggest that maintenance of cats on
one or more of these medications during periods of quiescence, will
result in a longer period of time before recrudescence of infection
occurs, and that when recrudescence occurs, the infection in milder and
of shorter duration."

                                   
Signature


"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do
nothing."

-Edmund Burke

Learn The TRUTH About Declawing
http://www.stopdeclaw.com

Zuzu's Cats Photo Album:
http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22

"Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one
elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and
splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then
providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision,
raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and
material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his
way."

- W.H. Murray

zuzu22@webtv.net - 13 Feb 2004 04:19 GMT
Rescuer of cats wrote:

> I have a positive neutered male cat who
> was squinting. The vet said he has
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Miracle is definitely hurting. Has
> anyone dealt with herpes in the eye?

You need to take this cat to a veterinary opthamologist IMMEDIATELY and
get correct medication. Vaseline may help lubricate, but it is NOT going
to clear up the ulcers and without treatment they will only get worse,
and the cat will suffer and may go blind and lose its eye. There are
anti-viral drops available for this condition and I have used them with
cats with great success. Do not waste time with home remedies as your
cat, especially with his compromised immune system, needs immediate
treatment to get things under control.
To emphasize this, here is a picture of one of a litter of kittens that
I rescued (all were suffering from herpes) that had not been getting
correct treatment and nearly lost her eye:

http://pic10.picturetrail.com/VOL320/476350/1617042/18983347.jpg
A trip to the opthamologist turned things around and saved her eye,
which would have been lost otherwise. Another kitten in the same litter
unfortunately was worse and did lose most of the vision in one eye.

One thing you can do long term is give your cat 250 mg of L-Lysine (get
the powdered capsule form) mixed in with some canned food twice a day.
Given long term it helps to stop the herpes virus from replicating which
will minimize and sometimes completely eliminate flare-ups.
Regardless, he needs to see an opthamologist, or at the very least a
different vet that can offer appropriate treatment ASAP!

Megan

                                   
Signature


"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do
nothing."

-Edmund Burke

Learn The TRUTH About Declawing
http://www.stopdeclaw.com

Zuzu's Cats Photo Album:
http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22

"Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one
elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and
splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then
providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision,
raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and
material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his
way."

- W.H. Murray

Sharon Talbert - 17 Feb 2004 20:53 GMT
> One thing you can do long term is give your cat 250 mg of L-Lysine (get
> the powdered capsule form) mixed in with some canned food twice a day.
> Given long term it helps to stop the herpes virus from replicating which
> will minimize and sometimes completely eliminate flare-ups.
> Regardless, he needs to see an opthamologist, or at the very least a
> different vet that can offer appropriate treatment ASAP!

Megan, we get our L-Lysine from Costco in tablet at a fraction of the
price and then crush it before adding it to a food or a treat.  Helps the
poor old pocket book.  The anti-viral drops are expensive but they work,
for the flare-ups.  We have one guy in-house whose eyes are so horribly
scarred from herpes that he has very little vision.  We call him Googley.

I hope the OP gets the cat to an eye specialist soon.

Sharon Talbert
Friends of Campus Cats
Phil P. - 13 Feb 2004 15:10 GMT
> I have a positive neutered male cat who was squinting. The vet said he
> has herpes in the eye. That there are lots of little ulcers and that it
> is quite painful. The only thing he advised doing is lubricating the eye
> with white petroleum w/mineral oil four times aday.

Absurd!  That's a prescription for disaster.  Your cat might have ulcerative
or deep keratitis - secondary to a herpesvirus infection - and probably
needs a more aggressive therapeutic plan that includes an antiviral
medication such as trifluridine (Viroptic) or idoxuridine (Herplex) (we've
had better results with trifluridine q4-6h), antibiotics to control
secondary infections and medication for pain management.

You need to seek a second opinion ***ASAP*** - ideally, by a veterinary
ophthalmologist.  If you don't live within traveling range of a`veterinary
university hospital, go to http://www.acvim.org/Kittleson/search.htm and do
a search for a Small Animal Diplomate/Specialist in your area. American
College of Veterinary Internal Medicine Diplomates are about the best there
is.

If you can't find an ACVIM specialist in your area, my second choice would
be an ABVP Diplomate/Feline Specialist (American Board of Veterinary
Practitioners).

go to http://www.abvp.com/diplosearch1.htm http://www.abvp.com/

Make no mistake, without immediate proper treatment, your cat could lose his
eye or at the least his sight.

Please do not delay - or adopt the "wait and see" strategy.  You need to
seek a second opinion ***ASAP***

Best of luck.

Phil.
Yngver - 13 Feb 2004 17:59 GMT
>Absurd!  That's a prescription for disaster.  Your cat might have ulcerative
>or deep keratitis - secondary to a herpesvirus infection - and probably
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>Please do not delay - or adopt the "wait and see" strategy.  You need to
>seek a second opinion ***ASAP***

I just want to chime in to note that even in human beings, herpes in the eye is
very serious and can lead to blindness. My mother just went through a bout of
this and her opthamalogists warned her how serious it was and that it takes a
long time to get under control. She was using three different medications for a
couple months, and it was a very gradual recovery.

You don't want to "wait and see", just as Phil warns. It needs serious
treatment as soon as possible.
rescuerofcats@webtv.net - 14 Feb 2004 23:33 GMT
Had to take Miracle back to the vet on Friday. He had a temp. of 106.1
which the vet thought was great since he said the antibiotics will work
great. Again he said not to put anything else in his eyes and that we
will know if this is caused by his leukemia in a couple of days. He is a
little better today.
zuzu22@webtv.net - 15 Feb 2004 03:06 GMT
Rescuer of cats wrote:

>Had to take Miracle back to the vet on
>Friday. He had a temp. of 106.1 which the
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>leukemia in a couple of days. He is a little
>better today.

You need to find a new vet now. A temp of 106 is *NOT* great! It's a
dangerous temperature to have and the fact that he is telling you not to
treat your cat's eye is malpractice. I am shocked that you have chosen
to ignore the several knowledgeable replies you've received and instead
are risking your cat's vision and health by listening to an obviously
incompetent vet. If you care anything about this cat get it to a
different vet right away and get it the treatment it should have. To
ignore the eye issue and allow your cat to be stay in pain and untreated
is neglectful and abusive.

Megan

                                   
Signature


"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do
nothing."

-Edmund Burke

Learn The TRUTH About Declawing
http://www.stopdeclaw.com

Zuzu's Cats Photo Album:
http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22

"Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one
elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and
splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then
providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision,
raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and
material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his
way."

- W.H. Murray

MaryL - 15 Feb 2004 04:04 GMT
> Had to take Miracle back to the vet on Friday. He had a temp. of 106.1
> which the vet thought was great since he said the antibiotics will work
> great. Again he said not to put anything else in his eyes and that we
> will know if this is caused by his leukemia in a couple of days. He is a
> little better today.

How could your vet possibly think that a temperature of 106+ is "great"?
The normal temperature for a cat ranges from approximately 100.5 to 102.5
degrees fahrenheit.  Some references list a different range, but the
acceptable difference from these numbers is very slight.  *None* show
anything *near* 106 as being "acceptable" (let alone "great").
Take a look at these sites for information concerning "normal" temperature:
http://ask.yahoo.com/ask/20011116.html
http://petplace.compuserve.com/articles/artShow.asp?artID=2911
http://petplace.netscape.com/articles/artShow.asp?artID=2686

Please see another vet ASAP for a second opinion.  My wonderful cat Duffy is
blind, and has been blind from birth.
I would do anything if I could do something to give him sight, and you are
in a position where delay could *cost*
your cat his sight.  If possible, see a veterinary ophthalmologist, but at
the very least get to a competent vet.  PLEASE DO NOT DELAY.

MaryL
(take out the litter to reply)

Photos of Duffy and Holly:      >'o'<
http://tinyurl.com/8y54 (Introducing Duffy to Holly)
http://tinyurl.com/8y56 (Duffy and Holly "settle in")
Phil P. - 15 Feb 2004 11:11 GMT
> Had to take Miracle back to the vet on Friday. He had a temp. of 106.1
> which the vet thought was great

How can you call yourself "rescuer of cats" without knowing the very basics?
106.1 is almost critical!

This is the *second* absurd statement you say your vet made... which I find
very, very hard to believe.  I cannot fathom even the worst of vets saying
106.1* was "great"....   So I think either you're a troll or an idiot too
utterly stupid to be entrusted with a cat's life.... I'm leaning toward the
former...

In the unlikely event that you actually did manage to find the most
incompetent vet on the planet, you now have more than enough reason to take
your cat to another vet... before the cat goes blind or dies.... which would
be *your* fault since you've already been warned by more than one person.
 
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