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The Puppy Wizard - 02 Jul 2003 12:51 GMT

HOWEDY Master Of Deception blackman

"We just installed a PetSafe brand fence this Spring. Two dogs,
two collars We now have one dog and no collars. I used the Wit's
End Training Manual to learn how to train my dog. She is now
Date: 2001-09-29 17:05:04 PST

Hello blackman,

What the heel is wrong with you? You don't warn folks shocking their
dogs might make them vicious and get them DEAD? Even after all the DEAD
DOGS we've seen here have aggression problems as a direct result of
being shocked? That's O.K. by you is it?

<TOTE@dog-play.com> wrote in message
news:9ob66l$22jo$1@nntp1.ba.best.com...

> By "effective" I assume you mean keeping the dog in the
> boundaries.

When I think effective I like to think of not having to KILL a dog
because of his "training" methods, blackman.

> It depends on the dog, and in part how much of a zap you are
> willing to use to accomplish the goal.

YOU'RE FULL OF CRAP blackman. You seem to be fond of shock
collars and beating your dog in the face with a shepherd's crook and
knittling little cover ups for your pronged spiked pinch choke collars.
Your own dog had a five year habit of leash pulling despite all the
PAIN you inflicted. You board your own dogs at a vet clinic because
they're not trustworth at home alone..

> Some dogs won't stay put no matter how big the
> zap, others it takes a tiny reminder.

Did you FORGET your pal leah's dog Cubbe in the thread "1 step
forward?" She snapped at a child she'd been playing with all evening
up till when they approached the shock field. REMEMBER NOW?

That's what I think, blackman. I think you FORGOT.

That could have got Cubbe DEAD blackman. WOULDN'T YOU AGREE?

Yeah. Try "interested in hearin" where your pal Janet boss
overlooked the sock systems responsible for making the little dog
hand/collar shy and aggressive to visitors. Your pal janet told them to
hurt and crate their dog and to kill him to be fair.

And did you FORGET "my dog bit the ups guy?"

That's three dogs in a row YOU FORGOT ABOUT who've become
aggressive AND DEAD as a direct result of being shocked blackman.

Did you FORGET? REALLLY?

> > I bought a bark collar and it was ineffective...he still barks.
> Not a good sign.

What's not a good sign, blackman? That he's HURTING his dog?

> > Your help is appreciated.

You won't be getting any here, our Gang Of Thugs won't level with
you about the RISKS of shocking your dog. It gets every dog nervous
and gets some dogs DEAD.

> http://www.dog-play.com/efence.html

That site will take us to the worst trash on dogs you can find anywhere.

> Keep in mind that if you leave him in a situation where he can see
> people pass close to his property but he can't get close enough to
> investigate that a very common reaction is boundary line
> aggression.

NO blackman. That's ONE instance. Many dogs like Cubbe get
aggressive AFTER they've been shock, REGARDLESS OF HOWE
MUCH blackman. Why do you like hurting dogs and calling it training
like when you beat your dog in the face with a shepard's crook
because she's improperly trained.

> A very quick way of making a dog aggressive is to make it anxious
> about something,

Shocking a dog ONCE can do that for ya, blackman ISN'T THAT RIGHT.

> continually present the anxiety producing stimulous, and never
> allow the dog to relieve its anxeity by investigating the stimulous.

OR it can happen the FIRST TIME, isn't that correct blackman.

> It makes dogs behind real fences aggressive too.

SO SHOCK THE DOG blackman?

> Which is a good reason never to leave a dog unsupervised outside
> if it is in a position to be agitated by activity outside the property
> line.

Given that I just gave you three recent instances of DEAD dogs
because of shocking them don't you think it would be in the BEST
INTEREST of our OP's DOG to advise him NOT to shock his dog or
ANYBODY'S dog blackman?

> A dog that has unsupervised access outside should be protected
> from stimulous that puts the dog into protective mode.

And our readers here deserve to have better INFORMATION than you
gave him you miserable dog abusing Thug.

> That reduces stress to the dog and avoid developing aggression.

YOU'RE FULL OF CRAP blackman. Shocking dogs is dangerous to
the health and well being of dogs and people blackman. That's why
you're a dog abusing THUG and have to get the heel outta here you
miserable s.o.b.

> Diane Blackman
> http://www.dog-play.com/ http://www.dog-play.com/TOTE.html
> " . . . approximately 90 percent of the behavior owners consider
> negative occurs when their pets are isolated or alone."

That's why you crate them.

> "The Body Language and
> Emotion of Dogs" by Myrna M. Milani, DVM.

And that's where you learned all you know. Read:

misty" <Momisty@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:6946-3B6337A1-329@storefull-233.iap.bryant.webtv.net...

> We just installed a PetSafe brand fence this Spring. Two dogs,
> two collars We now have one dog and no collars.

> Peach and Zelda would run thru the fence, not want to come back
> in the yard and would run for days. The last time, Peach didn't
> come back home.

> I used the Wit's End Training Manual to learn how to train my dog.
> She is now border trained. A few minutes each day reinforces
> her desire to stay in the yard. She no longer runs out into the
> road, I can stop her from chasing cats and she no longer cringes
> when we walk around the yard.

> I can not say loud or long enough how much I hate the e-fence and
> its collars. If you can't get a regular fence then you need to
> train your dog. I will never rely on an electronic collar to keep my
> dog in our yard again.

> The price was too high:-(

> ~misty

===========================

<"Terri"@cyberhighway

> Hey, do like me, and killfile Jerry.
> He has millions of people aleady reading his posts and
> watching him extract his soggy foot out of his mouth!
> Out of these MILLIONS, I've only seen 2 naive childs
> come forward and actually believe in his training manual.

Robert Crim writes:

I assume that I and my wife are those two naive childs since
I freely admit to having read and, I hope, understood enough
of the manual and it's counterparts by John Fisher and the
posts of Marylin Rammell to believe and use it. This naive
child would like to say thank you to both Jerry and Marylin for
putting up with a constant barrage of really infantile crap at
the hands of supposedly adult dog lovers.

The other naive child (LSW) has to put up with the nagging
idea that if people like them had been posting earlier, maybe
we would not have had to hold the head of a really
magnificent animal in our arms while he was given the
needle and having to hug him and wait until he gasped
his last gasp.

To my mind, "naive" is believing you can terrorize a dog into
good behavior. Naive is believing that people that hide
behind fake names are more honest than people that use
their real names. Naive is thinking that dilettante dog
breeders and amateur "trainers" like Joey (lyingdogDUMMY,
j.h.) are the equal or better than those that have studied and
lived by their craft for decades.

"Stupid" is believing that people do not see kindergarten
level insults for what they are. Really stupid is believing that
people like Jerry Howe and Marylin Rammell are going to
just go away because you people act like fools. Why do you
act like fools? I really have no idea, and I don't really care.

> And, to date: I've not seen ONE come forward and actually
> admit to buying and having success with his little black
> box.

I think I'm going to get one myself for Father's day and take
it down to the Animal Shelter for their use and testing. You
would never believe the results, so you'll never know.

> Anyone by now that doesn't see a scam man coming by
> Jerry's posts deserves to get what is sure to be coming to
> him! LOL!

I don't see a "scam man", so I guess I and Longsuffering
Wife and Rollei will just have to get what we deserve, eh?
As Joey (Dogman) says, "poor Rollei.".......right.

>Terri

Reply to this Message

The Puppy Wizard - 02 Jul 2003 13:35 GMT

blackman Says "Wow, That Was Really Great Reading" To:
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog Actually I'd Call It A Sharp Tap
On The Nose I Know Jack Would Not Do It If He Though
FEAR AGGRESSIVE Solo Couldn't Take It." melanie
Date: 2001-09-29 21:32:11 PST

Hello melanie,

> This is the way I look at it.

You abuse your dog.

> I don't expect everyone to have the same level of control over their
> dogs that I do.

You've abused Solo since day one.

> I wouldn't have this much control over Solo if I didn't have to.

You'd have had perfect control over Solo in ten days had you followed my
methods. BUT I DON'T TEACH HURTING DOGS, so it don't look like training
to you.

> Believe me,

You're a dog abuser. Why would we believe you.

> I would love to be able to throw the ball and just turn
> around and start chatting with the other dog owners, but I can't.

Because you hurt and intimidate Solo as you were taught at the
university behaviorists. You refused to discuss what they taught you.
You've been giving your dog behaior control medication for months with
no success.

> I don't want the other dogs or the other owners to disappear.

Your concern is your collossall fragile ego.

> One of the great merits of the park is that it is a good place to
> socialize Solo.

I don't think decent folks are going to enjoy socializing with a dog
abuser melanie. Do you? Really?

> He's not the only "issues" dog at the park, and people are very
> understanding about his background, for the most part.

They can see you've got some major psychological technical
difficulties...

> And they are normally courteous about space and toys.

No doubt they clear out when they see you coming. They don't want to
watch you choke and beat you dog for playing in the park.

> At my park, there is an area that is actually the "dog park" that is
> fenced and has a fountain for the dogs to drink out of. Then there
> is a lot of open space

For dog abusers like you, melanie?

> (OK, not a lot -- maybe a football field's worth altogether, in
> discontinuous pieces of lawn) and people whose dogs have
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> in there and Iknow them and their owners -- it's too small, and too
> much of a free-for-all.

And Solo isn't used to being controlled without a beating with a stick.

> Solo and I are usually playing a ways off from the others
> in the open space, because his play sessions are necessarily more
> structured than the other dogs'.

That little matter of needing to choke and beat him, no doubt.

> If the park is sparsely populated and a dog Solo particularly likes is
> there, the other owner and I will allow them to play and wrestle >
> together.

You mean if you can find a RL pal who's fine with you HURTING Solo.

> Solo has become more and more interested in playing with other
> dogs, but we're taking it one step at a time.

Because most people would have you arrested and thrown into the NUT
HOUSE for beating your dog.

> He's not ready to run in the scrum yet.

BECAUSE YOU CAN'T BEAT HIM IN PUBLIC.

> He might not ever be.

Because people would have you locked in a mental institute for the
criminally INSANE if you beat your dog in front of them for PLAYING.

> I also respect other people's space.

You fear being discovered to be a dog abuser.

> If someone else is playing a game of fetch with their dog, I don't
> then go and start throwing a ball around in the same area, any
> more than I would cut into someone else's lane
> doing laps at the local swimming pool.

Because you never know when you just gotta beat Solo. The park isn't the
same as being in the company of other dog abusers like your sheep dog
people like blackman who also beat their dogs in the face with a
shepherd's crook...

> I live in the city, which unless you think no dogs should live in the
> city, you won't hold against me.

We should hold against you having space on our planet...

> For me and for other city dog owners,

Don't lump yourself in with decent society. You're a dog abusing Thug.

> open space is a precious commodity.

Shove it.

> The more considerate everyone is,

Funny that, you talking about being CONSIDERATE? YOU BEAT AND CHOKE YOUR
DOG.

> the more people can share this commodity. For the most part,
> people are very considerate and

They won't tolerate you beating your dog to train him.

> so at my park we have a good mix of dogs and owners
> -- shy dogs, outgoing dogs, intact dogs, small dogs, big dogs -- all
> using the same space without incident.

You mean some folks don't freak out and want to call the heat when you
BEAT Solo...

> It's not as if I don't take Solo other places so we can do our own
> thing -

You mean BEATING Solo to train him.

> - I drive 100 miles each way once or twice a week to work him on
> sheep with an instructor I like.

The guy who BEATS you man shy fear aggressive dog Solo for you.

> But the fact that people are considerate enough to make enough
> room for a dog like Solo at the dog park is a godsend for us.

You mean sometimes there's only a few folks there who condone HURTING
dogs, and on those occasions you can get to reinforce your training you
learn from the Thug who BEATS Solo around the sheep he's allowed to
molest because he's untrained.

> I'm not asking for every dog at the park to be an OTCH. All I ask is
> that a dog have a recall, drop toys on command, and that an owner
> pay attention to what his or her dog is doing.

You mean you wish others would't threaten to call the cops on you when
you go to BEAT Solo for playing.

> Is that really too much to ask?

Naaah. We should all tolerate other people's methods of training, it's a
matter of CHOICE, and this is a free country still, ain't it.

> -- Melanie and Solo the Red

Your new found friend melanie allows a stranger to "work" her dog
and whack her man shy, fear aggressive dog Solo in the nose with a
shepherd's crook:

"A while back someone posted about an Alasdair MacRae clinic: "Is
he gonna hit my dog?!?" Well, Jack did hit my dog. Actually I'd call it
a sharp tap of the crook to the nose, and I doubt it was very painful,
but it did sort of freak me out and it DEFINITELY got Solo's attention.

And yeah, I admit that I would prefer not having my dog whacked,
but I signed on to this clinic to take in the methods wholesale. In this
context, the correction worked -- it's not something I would do in
civilian life, but Solo can take a lot more around stock than he could
anywhere else since he wants the sheep so badly.

And I know Jack would not have done it if he though Solo couldn't
take it," melanie chang.

<TOTE@dog-play.com> wrote in message
news:9756l2$25su$2@nntp1.ba.best.com...

> On 22 Feb 2001 17:58:14 GMT Melanie L Chang

<mlchang@mail1.sas.upenn.edu>
whittled these words:

> > If you are interested, I posted a description of my experiences on the
> > Border Collie Boards that you might find interesting. The URL for the
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> Be true to your own principles, and hold to them,
> else complain not when the world runs contrary.

misty" <Momisty@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:6946-3B6337A1-329@storefull-233.iap.bryant.webtv.net...

> We just installed a PetSafe brand fence this Spring. Two dogs,
> two collars We now have one dog and no collars.
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> dog in our yard again. The price was too high:-(
> ~misty

<"Terri"@cyberhighway

Rober Crim writes:

I assume that I and my wife are those two naive childs since
I freely admit to having read and, I hope, understood enough
of the manual and it's counterparts by John Fisher and the
posts of Marylin Rammell to believe and use it. This naive
child would like to say thank you to both Jerry and Marylin for
putting up with a constant barrage of really infantile crap at
the hands of supposedly adult dog lovers.

The other naive child (LSW) has to put up with the nagging
idea that if people like them had been posting earlier, maybe
we would not have had to hold the head of a really
magnificent animal in our arms while he was given the
needle and having to hug him and wait until he gasped
his last gasp.

To my mind, "naive" is believing you can terrorize a dog into
good behavior. Naive is believing that people that hide
behind fake names are more honest than people that use
their real names. Naive is thinking that dilettante dog
breeders and amateur "trainers" like Joey (lyingdogDUMMY,
j.h.) are the equal or better than those that have studied and
lived by their craft for decades.

"Stupid" is believing that people do not see kindergarten
level insults for what they are. Really stupid is believing that
people like Jerry Howe and Marylin Rammell are going to
just go away because you people act like fools. Why do you
act like fools? I really have no idea, and I don't really care.

> And, to date: I've not seen ONE come forward and actually
> admit to buying and having success with his little black
> box.

I think I'm going to get one myself for Father's day and take
it down to the Animal Shelter for their use and testing. You
would never believe the results, so you'll never know.

> Anyone by now that doesn't see a scam man coming by
> Jerry's posts deserves to get what is sure to be coming to
> him! LOL!

I don't see a "scam man", so I guess I and Longsuffering
Wife and Rollei will just have to get what we deserve, eh?
As Joey (Dogman) says, "poor Rollei.".......right.

>Terri

Yes it was, and that is sad.

Robert, Longsuffering Wife and Rollei (do I get to listen to the box
first?)

Hello People,

Robert Crim was a former Gang Of Thugs Member, and
hated me a much as the rest of our Thugs do. Robert was a
long time friend and prominent contributor to rpdb, till Jerry
came along and smartened him up. He learned the hard
way, and no longer posts to his former pals, because it is
just too painful knowing his pals would rather HURT and
KILL their dogs than to admit that JERRY is RIGHT.

Margaret Hoffman
Message 1 of 19

Doggy Do Right and Jerry Howe

I just recently looked at this newsgroup and I found it
incredible. I do have a Doggy Do Right and have had it for
about one year. It truly does work - at least on my Dobe,
Chelsea. Chelsea was the unhappy recipient of several failed
attempts at obedience training, both in a "class" environment
and with a personal trainer. She is very high spirited and
strong and, unfortunately, spoiled, since we are an older
couple who doted on our dog. We were lucky enough to find Jerry
Howe and to not only buy a Doggy Do Right, but to also have him
personally work with Chelsea.

His methods are wonderful and effective. Chelsea is not a dog
that you will bully, and I wouldn't dream of hurting her. After
Jerry spent time with her, she no longer jumped on furniture,
ate food off the counter, pulled me incessantly on the leash.
She is calmer and we are all happier. Well, it is a very long
story and I won't bore you with all the details, but suffice it
to say that Jerry Howe saved the day for our dog and for us.

Marge Hoffman. (REWARD PAID BY DW.)

P.S. You can send me the reward money, but I won't sell you my DDR!

> I read up on rotties, pitbulls, etc., and quite a bit of the
> literature suggested I needed to assert my dominance and "make
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> me.
> Charlie

Hi Jerry,

I received email from Mark Shaw on 10/6 which I just read today.
Sorry I didn't have time to get to it sooner. We have had a lot
going on in our area concerning animals. We formed a new Task
Force to address spay/neuter, pet overpopulation and animal
abuse. I needed to do a lot of research before the first meeting and
time was just not available for anything else.

Anyway the letter went on to say that we are in collusion, I tried
to defraud him, and have sent none of the materials that he has
asked for although he has yet to furnish the P.O. Box number that
he wanted them sent to in the first place. He goes on to state that
I am no longer eligible for the "fictions reward." All of this is in
answer to postings that prove I was "sharing" his email with you
which in his opinion was a breach of good manners. His email only
had terms and conditions of the reward which I would consider
"public information."

Be that as it may, I would like to state that you had my permission
to post any email I have sent you regarding DDR including this
email.

I'm very sorry that you have to put up with this type of situation
from someone that obviously never intended to make good on his
reward offer in the first place.

I had a call from a friend of mine with a very aggressive cat. I
have loaned her my DDR for a few weeks to see if it will calm JR
down. I will let you know the results. She goes to the same holistic
vet that I go to and he is also interested.

In case Mark does post to the list again I would like to say that I
do very much believe that DDR will help JR as I know it has helped
my dogs and cats. I have entirely too much to do, to worry about his
opinions or reward.

The only reason I was willing to apply for the reward was on your
behalf as I do think your product is a valuable tool in helping with
aggression and other behavior problems.

I am in Feral Cat Network (we spay and neuter approximately 100
feral cats a month), I am also a member of a local AKC dog
obedience club, member of a local AKC agility club, president of
Pet Rescue, board member of the Alliance for Care and Welfare of
Animals (on the board are: county commissioner, vet. rep., rep. from
AKC dog club, CFA cat club, assistant County manager, head of
animal control, director of two different shelters, etc.).

I listed these not to be on an ego trip but to let Mark know that I
am involved with animals and have very little time to play games
with him also I would not recommend your product if I did not
believe in it.

Please feel free to post this email as it has no copyright on it as
did Mark Shaw's last email to me.

Take care Jerry and don't let the Mark's of the world get you down.

Elaine

Thank you, Elaine. I have been trying to educate the mark's of this
world, with some occasional successes. I guess that's variable
reinforcement?

Yours, Jerry.

Elaine McClung, President of Pet Rescue writes: Sep 9,
2000

"I ordered from Jerry a long time ago.. He was helpful and
the order was filled promptly. Yes, Doggie Do Right does
indeed exist.

I "had" a very aggressive female Pit.. She was showing
aggression not only towards Dok, Rhodesian Ridgeback,
but our cats and even us.

She now plays with Dok, even to the point of allowing him
to take a toy or bone from her. She no longer shows any
aggression towards us. She is showing some aggression
towards the cats but that is down to a warning growl.

It is not just my opinion that all this aggression existed
before Doggie Do Right as we were advised by three vets
to euthanize her.

I do very much believe that DDR will help JR as I know it
has helped my dogs and cats. I do think your product is a
valuable tool in helping with aggression and other behavior
problems.

I am in Feral CatNetwork (we spay and neuter approximately
100 feral cats a month), I am also a member of a local AKC
dog obedience club, member of a local AKC agility club,
president of Pet Rescue, board member of the Alliance for
Care and Welfare of Animals (on the board are: county
commissioner, vet. rep., rep. from AKC dog club, CFA cat
club, assistant County manager, head of animal control,
director of two different shelters, etc.).

Thanks, Elaine,

"I know that most men, including those at ease with
problems of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept
even the simplest and most obvious truth if it would
oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions which they
have delighted in explaining to colleagues, proudly
taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by
thread, into the fabric of their lives."
-Leo Tolstoy-

Is it any wonder that the following sig file has generated
more complaints to my personal email than any other
controversial post I have made to date, bar none?:

CAVEAT
If you have to do things to your dog to train him that you
would rather not have to do, then you shouldn't be doing
them. If you have a dog trainer who tells you to jerk your
dog around, choke him, pinch his ears, or twist his toes,
shock, shake, slap, scold, hit, chin cuff, scruff shake or
punish your dog in any manner, that corrections
are appropriate, that the dog won't think of you as the
punisher, or that corrections are not harmful, or if they
can't train your dog to do what you want, look for a
trainer that knows HOWE.

Sincerely,
Jerry Howe,
Wits' End Dog Training
Witsenddog@aol.com
http://www.doggydoright.com

Nature, to be mastered, must be obeyed.
-Francis Bacon-

There are terrible people who, instead of solving a
problem, bungle it and make it more difficult for all who
come after. Who ever can't hit the nail on the head
should, please, not hit at all.
-Nietzsche-

The abilities to think, rationalize and solve problems are
learned qualities.

The Wits' End Dog Training Method challenges the learning
centers in the dogs brain. These centers, once challenged,
develop and continue to grow to make him smarter.

The Wits' End Dog Training method capitalizes on
praising split seconds of canine thought, strategy, and
timing, not mindless hours of forced repetition, constant
corrections, and scolding.
-Jerry Howe-

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