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Lab results OT

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Christina Websell - 14 Jun 2005 01:44 GMT
Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know whether the
tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I rang the secretary
of the surgeon who did the op.
She asked me if I had a date for a follow up appointment.  I haven't.  It
should have been fixed when I was discharged from the hospital, it wasn't.
She looked up my details and said the surgeon had written to my own doctor.
That's worse than useless.
Two years ago, my doctors didn't contact me when they had a notification
that I had an abnormal result from a cardiogram in August and it only came
to light when I attended for a routine appointment in October.
So I am not holding my breath that I will get to know unless I pursue it.  I
phoned my doctor's surgery several times today and always engaged on the
phone.
I might make a personal visit down there tomorrow.
Can you imagine what it's like to wait all this time to know whether my
tumour was malignant or not?
It's just terrible to wait like this and I might just need some purrs and
prayers while I'm waiting to hear.

Tweed
mlbriggs - 14 Jun 2005 02:02 GMT
> Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know whether
> the tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I rang the
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> Tweed

This is one of those occasions when it is best to do the followup
yourself.Shall definitely purr for a good report, but don't wait any
longer -- the waiting is the hardest part. Purrrrrr!   MLB
Yowie - 14 Jun 2005 02:35 GMT
> Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know whether the
> tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I rang the secretary
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> It's just terrible to wait like this and I might just need some purrs and
> prayers while I'm waiting to hear.

How unimaginably frustrating!

Lots of purrs and prayes on the way.

Yowie
Irulan - 14 Jun 2005 03:18 GMT
Tweed, purrs and prayers that everything clean and ok.
Jazz & his mama

Signature

Irulan
from the stars we come
to the stars we return
from now until the end of time

> Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know whether
> the tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I rang the
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Tweed
Sam Nash - 14 Jun 2005 04:07 GMT
> Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know whether
> the tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I rang the
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Tweed

You got it, Tweed!  Purrs and prayers for a good result on the tests.
Sam, closely supervised by Mistletoe
O J - 14 Jun 2005 05:58 GMT
Tweed wrote:

--------------------<snip>---------------------
>Can you imagine what it's like to wait all this time to know whether my
>tumour was malignant or not?

This is hard to believe.  There's no excuse for keeping you in
suspense like that.  Give 'em hell.

--
Regards and Purrs,
O J
Christina Websell - 15 Jun 2005 16:19 GMT
> Tweed wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> Regards and Purrs,
> O J

This is what happened up to now.  Yesterday morning, fairly early, I finally
managed to get through to my doctor's surgery.  Actually to speak on the
phone to one of the doctors is like getting an audience with the Pope so I
explained to the receptionist what my request was, i.e. that someone,
*anyone* for gawds sake, should finally get round to telling me, since the
surgeon's secretary said that my docs had been sent all his recent letters.
She then obviously brought up my records on the computer, because after she
said "bear with me a minute"  she was obviously reading things to herself,
you know how people do.  It goes a bit like this.  "Mmmm.  uh, uh, uh, uh,
mmm.    Uh, uh..."
I interrupted to ask if she could view the letters on the computer, and was
that what she was reading?  She said yes.  I asked her if she felt she could
share this information with me.  She said, no, she was not allowed to.
Aaargh, so she *is* allowed to read it but not tell ME!!

She said she would get a doctor to call me that morning.  I hardly dared go
to the bathroom in case I missed the call, but needless to say, I heard
nothing and the facility I have on my phone said no-one had called since a
call I could identify from a friend the day before.

This morning I began to get annoyed.  I am slow to anger as a rule, but to
know whether I might live or die is important to me.
I rang the surgery again, spoke to the same receptionist - she has a
distinctive voice.  She did not remember taking a call from me yesterday, so
I explained all over again that a doctor had not called me and the
circumstances.  She said that the doctor had acknowledged on her message
request that she had called me.  Not so.

I got a phone call from a doctor.  " Is this Christine?  (omg how I hate
being called that, only because it's not my name..)This is Dr T, how can I
help you?"
I asked her if she knew what it was about.  After all she had two messages
explainingly everything fully.
She then said  "No, why don't you tell me?"
I saw red at that point but hid it.  Explained everything again.  She said
"why don't you ring the hospital?"  I said I had done, and the consultant's
secretary said that my local surgery had all the information.  She said she
thought it would be a good idea if I rang them again.  I said not, and that
*you* have the information I need there, at that surgery, so please tell me
one way or the other because I feel I can't wait much longer.

Well, believe it or not, she said no, that ethically she would not consider
discussioning a diagnosis on the telephone and besides that, she did not
have the relevant information to hand!!!!  2 days notice of what I wanted
would seem enough time to me to gather all the info she needed.  She said
that she would  "find time to see me in the surgery to discuss it over the
next few days if I could make an appointment with the receptionist."  She
was unable to transfer me back to reception "because she was fairly new and
had the worst phone "and told me to ring in again.
Of course, it was engaged for hours.

I did get through eventually, spoke to the same receptionist again and
explained that Dr T had said I must come in to the surgery to find out.
"Next Monday?" was the innocent reply.  I said no, before that, it's
important.  She said "No, I can't fit you in until Monday."

My fuse finally blew, my very slow fuse.  I said why can't you find me an
appointment until Monday?  She said because all the doctors are busy until
then.

I remembered what you said  "give them hell."  So I said I was not happy
with this, and that I did not care who told me, but I wanted to know soon.
"Bear with me.."
"You can have an appointment with a clinical nurse at 11.20 tomorrow
morning."
I said that will do for me.

Tweed
BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.
Lesley - 15 Jun 2005 16:39 GMT
> "You can have an appointment with a clinical nurse at 11.20 tomorrow
> morning."

Purring for good news for you Tweed. Let us know as soon as you can

> BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.

And purring for Jean as well

The Fabulous Furballs are really earning their ham today!

Lesley

Slave of the Fabulous (and purring up a storm for you and Jean!)
Furballs
Adrian - 15 Jun 2005 17:08 GMT
<snip>
> My fuse finally blew, my very slow fuse.  I said why can't you find
> me an appointment until Monday?  She said because all the doctors are
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> morning."
> I said that will do for me.

I'm amazed you stayed as cool as you did, I would have been livid. Mega
purrs that the results are good.

> Tweed
> BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.

Major purrs for Jean. Does anyone know how long she'll have to stay in
hospital after her op?
Signature

Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
A house is not a home, without a cat.

Karen - 15 Jun 2005 17:11 GMT
> I remembered what you said  "give them hell."  So I said I was not happy
> with this, and that I did not care who told me, but I wanted to know soon.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> Tweed
> BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.

I was wondering when Jean's surgery was. THanks!  I am glad you got stern
with those darn people! I don't understand it. My mom gets a run around like
that too sometimes, but I can't convince her to be stern with them :(
Yoj - 15 Jun 2005 18:15 GMT
> This is what happened up to now.  Yesterday morning, fairly early, I finally
> managed to get through to my doctor's surgery.  Actually to speak on the
[quoted text clipped - 65 lines]
> Tweed
> BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.

My blood pressure must have gone up 20 points just reading this.  I can't
imagine what must be happening to yours.  I think that's totally outrageous!
Are you in the United States?  I'm pretty sure U.S. laws now say that
patients are entitled to information about their medical condition.  I know
that information can't be released to anyone else without your written
permission, but the idea that they wouldn't give it to you is infuriating.

Purrs for Jean are ongoing.

Joy
Howard C. Berkowitz - 15 Jun 2005 19:44 GMT
> My blood pressure must have gone up 20 points just reading this.  I can't
> imagine what must be happening to yours.  I think that's totally
> outrageous!
> Are you in the United States?  I'm pretty sure U.S. laws now say that
> patients are entitled to information about their medical condition.  

Yes, with some narrowly defined exceptions, mostly for psychiatric
material; this was put into the latest set of laws amending the HIPAA
core law (if anyone cares, it was the quaintly named HIPAA
Administrative Simplification act, amending the Health Insurance
Portability and Availability Act).

This gives you access to the records. The problem is that medical charts
are very structured and use specialized terminology, as well as
typically bad handwriting. It can be difficult for a layman to tell what
the main notes really mean.

>I
> know
> that information can't be released to anyone else without your written
> permission, but the idea that they wouldn't give it to you is
> infuriating.
mlbriggs - 15 Jun 2005 18:16 GMT
>> Tweed wrote:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 78 lines]
> Tweed
> BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.

Perhaps you should threaten to sue the dunderheads.  What about your
personal doctor who referred you to this surgeon?   MLB
Kreisleriana - 15 Jun 2005 18:19 GMT
>> Tweed wrote:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 78 lines]
>Tweed
>BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.

{{{{{{{{{{{Christina}}}}}}}}}}}

Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
Christina Websell - 15 Jun 2005 19:04 GMT
>>> Tweed wrote:
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 93 lines]
>
> {{{{{{{{{{{Christina}}}}}}}}}}}

Aw Theresa, thank you.  I am so fed up with myself at the moment that I'm
crying.  Which makes me annoyed that I am so pathetic.

Tweed
Kreisleriana - 15 Jun 2005 19:14 GMT
I have had my own battles with the health care profession, and know
how it makes one feel like one's head is going to freakin' EXPLODE--
that's over and above what's wrong with your body.:P
  Make sure your kitties take good care of you.

Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
Adrian - 15 Jun 2005 19:16 GMT
>>>> Tweed wrote:
>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 99 lines]
>
> Tweed

You are not pathetic! You've through a lot over the last few years, you
wouldn't be human if it didn't get you down sometimes. Purrs that your
life gets better from now on.
Signature

Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
A house is not a home, without a cat.

Jo Firey - 15 Jun 2005 19:38 GMT
> Aw Theresa, thank you.  I am so fed up with myself at the moment that I'm
> crying.  Which makes me annoyed that I am so pathetic.
>
> Tweed

I can only imagine just how frustrating it is for you to be alone, with
limited energy and trying your best to take care of yourself.  And then to
have to deal with this.  And especially frustrating as I suspect that if you
were well and in "fighting form" you could tear several of the people in
that medical office a new one.

I'm really wondering why they haven't had you in for a follow-up post
surgery appointment my now to check on your progress.

Is there someone who can go with you to your appointment.  Just to keep them
from brow beating you as they seem to be determined to do?

Jo
mlbriggs - 15 Jun 2005 23:36 GMT
>>>> Tweed wrote:
>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 96 lines]
>
> Tweed

Do you remember the poem that goes something like this?

"I hate to be a kicker
I always long for peace
But the wheel that does the squeeking
Is the wheel that gets the grease."

Wish I had the rest of it.

Purrs for you.   MLB
Howard C. Berkowitz - 15 Jun 2005 19:41 GMT
> > Tweed wrote:
> >
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> > Regards and Purrs,
> > O J

{{{Tweed}}}

It's hard for me to give suggestions, because I don't know what is
customary in the UK system. In the US, you do have rights to the
information, but it usually isn't necessary to demand them.  Some of
these rights went into law only recently, so they wouldn't have applied
to the situation I describe below with my mother.

Unfortunately, there are difficulties on both sides here, where a
pathology report is involved. Let me share my experience with my mother,
who had a mastectomy at one hospital but was going to receive followup
radiation at a different hospital. They gave her a *sealed* envelope of
medical records to take to the other hospital.

They should have known better; she promply opened them.  Now, my mother
was a psychiatric social worker and hospital administrator, so, in
certain fields, she wasn't a layman.  Anyway, she called me in
unprecedented tears, about the surgeons lying to her.  I was able to get
her to fax me the pathology report, which is what upset her.

When I read it, I was both pleased because it showed extremely little
evidence of spread, and puzzled why she saw it so negatively.  I got her
back on the phone and went through it word by word. It turned out that
she had read "rare tumor cells in the lymphatics" and thought that meant
"tumor cells in the lymph nodes."  The two are NOT the same thing;
lymphatics are ducts for drainage and lymph nodes are masses of tissue
that can collect cells.

> This is what happened up to now.  Yesterday morning, fairly early, I
> finally
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> share this information with me.  She said, no, she was not allowed to.
> Aaargh, so she *is* allowed to read it but not tell ME!!

So, the problem is that one needs experience and training to make
inferences from a pathology report. The receptionist probably does not
have that experience, and also the very relevant skills of how to
present either good or bad news.

I do agree that the surgeon has an ethical requirement to reach you.

> She said she would get a doctor to call me that morning.  I hardly dared
> go
[quoted text clipped - 54 lines]
> morning."
> I said that will do for me.

An appropriately trained nurse may be quite qualified to do this. If you
get further problems, however, I would suggest not calling the surgical
office again, but calling specific places at the hospital.  
Unfortunately, I don't know if the terms are the same in the UK.

I'd start with the Chief of Surgery. Failing that, I'd ask for Quality
Assurance or Risk Management.

> Tweed
> BTW Jean Hobbs is having her op today, please purr your heads off.
Cheryl Perkins - 15 Jun 2005 23:21 GMT
<snip>

> An appropriately trained nurse may be quite qualified to do this. If you
> get further problems, however, I would suggest not calling the surgical
> office again, but calling specific places at the hospital.  
> Unfortunately, I don't know if the terms are the same in the UK.

> I'd start with the Chief of Surgery. Failing that, I'd ask for Quality
> Assurance or Risk Management.

I'd suggest finding a new GP and explaining in writing to your old one why
you are leaving. I have a vague memory that there are some more
formalities in doing this in the UK than there are here, where basically,
all you have to do is find a GP who is accepting new patients (sometimes a
challenge), call up and make an appointment. And of course, you need to
locate a *good* GP with *efficient* office staff, which is somewhat more
complicated than just calling up the local medical board and asking for a
list of GPs in your area accepting new patients.

It sounds to me like the communication problem is GP-Tweed, not
Surgeon-GP or Surgeon. Mind you, when I had surgery years ago, all the
followup was handled by the surgeon's office.

Signature

Cheryl

Howard C. Berkowitz - 16 Jun 2005 01:28 GMT
> <snip>
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> Surgeon-GP or Surgeon. Mind you, when I had surgery years ago, all the
> followup was handled by the surgeon's office.

I don't know the procedure in the UK or Canada. In the US, the American
College of Surgeons gives the followup responsibility to the surgeon,
unless there are special cases such as the operation being done far
away.  One of the ACS rules is that the surgeon may not charge
separately for followup visits, to be sure the patient feels free to
call or visit for any complication.
Hopitus - 16 Jun 2005 18:39 GMT
I did read your entire dilemma, Christina. But I've only read all of
Howard's posts to the thread, as I consider him an excellent medical advisor
here. Many times over the 30 years I worked in xray I knew what was the
patient's prognosis, but also what was going on @ the time re their
treatment/diagnostic work. One of the tenets of my profession is never give
out 411 either good nor bad, as we are neither doctors nor the final word,
just employees who produce the film records necessary for patient's docs to
utilize in ultimate game plan. I have, over the many years, heard fellow
techs breaking this rule and discussing patients' prognoses w/them, but I
never budged from the tenet.
One reason I preferred working in the area I most xray'd folks in (ER) over
the long run was that that is the first step to anything else and you know
*nothing* to tell or keep secret most of the time in the ER. I found it most
stressing to be working on (in the radiology dept.elsewhere) what I
considered (correctly most of the time) doomed patients - a downer mentally
for me. When patients got really obnoxious w/wanting to try and extract 411
about their state of health from me I would always tell them to talk to
their doc.
Someone w/lesser mental stability than you, Christina, told over the phone
(or even in person by someone other than their doc) a bad or even *iffy*
diagnosis/result of any test - not just labs - could very well just stroll
out and step in front of a truck as their way of avoiding the pain and
suffering associated w/their disease. Also, I am a trained professional used
to reading xray interpretations (that's what radiologists - my former
bosses - do for a living! - dictate interpretations of films) and I've seen
some doozies...example: explaining my ex's entire spinal column xrays to him
from the reports, which his doc gave him but failed to explain to his
satisfaction that I had to look up words in Merck's Manual to fathom
meaning.
A non-medical worker would very well be apt to misenterpret meanings as
Howard's Mom did with God knows what results.....bless you, young lady;
relax, enjoy being home w/your pet critters all, and get well again. He has
given you a second chance and I for one am so grateful and pleased. The
Hopitus wishes you continued good health ongoing.

>> <snip>
>>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
> separately for followup visits, to be sure the patient feels free to
> call or visit for any complication.
Howard C. Berkowitz - 17 Jun 2005 00:47 GMT
> I did read your entire dilemma, Christina. But I've only read all of
> Howard's posts to the thread, as I consider him an excellent medical
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> techs breaking this rule and discussing patients' prognoses w/them, but I
> never budged from the tenet.

In general, that's a good idea, since the film alone, in complex
conditions, is only part of the problem. Now, when I've been an ER
patient and the films were hung in my general area, I'd take a look.  
Two occasions stick in my mind.

On one, I had inhaled a bit of hamburger and couldn't stop coughing.
They visualized the area with a barium swallow containing a local
anesthetic.  Much to my surprise, the barium preparation was vanilla
milkshake flavored and DELICIOUS -- and, with the local anesthetic,
stopped me coughing for a while.  Yep, the foreign body was visible.  

I called an ENT specialist I knew to remove it, who managed to annoy me
by giving everyone in the ER, including my wife, a look through his new
fiber laryngoscope -- but he wouldn't give me a look.

The other was something of a comedy. I had fallen on a wet floor, and,
indeed, was defended from the well-meaning maid by Clifford (RB), who
became 16 pounds of hissing Halloween black cat. She was trying to
massage my (broken) ankle...not the thing to do. Clifford was clearly
saying "call 911, stupid hoomin."

Anyway, I thought it was a sprain. I happened to be off to see my
physician-acupuncturist, who agreed, and hit it with a few more needles.
My insurance wouldn't let him X-ray it in his office, so I went to a
nearby hospital.

The radiology tech, whom I had told I had sprained it, sort of sucked in
his breath when he looked at the film.  I looked at it too, and we said,
in one voice, "it's not sprained". The ER physician put it in an open
cast.

When I saw my orthopedist the next day, his first comment, on looking at
the films, was "I don't THINK I need to operate..."

If I had seen one more medical professional, given the increasing
severity everyone saw, an autopsy might have been the next
recommendation. As it was, I was put into a boot, given LOTS of
painkillers, and flew off a couple of days later, from Washington DC to
Vancouver. I taught a seminar from a wheelchair, and, while I was
HEAVILY medicated, got good reviews.

> One reason I preferred working in the area I most xray'd folks in (ER)
> over
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> mentally
> for me.

>When patients got really obnoxious w/wanting to try and extract
> 411
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> to reading xray interpretations (that's what radiologists - my former
> bosses - do for a living! - dictate interpretations of films)

Other than for trauma, and sometimes not even then, the X-ray won't give
a definitive answer unless considered with at least the physical exam.
As you well know, radiologists' reports tend to be noncomittal anyway.
Were the X-ray machine been available during the French Revolution, an
attending radiologist might have given a report on Marie Antoinette's
head as "the interpretation is consistent with decapitation."  He
wouldn't diagnose Dr. Guillotine's syndrome without further information;
diagnosis was the responsibility of the attending physician.

>and I've
> seen
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> has given you a second chance and I for one am so grateful and pleased. The
> Hopitus wishes you continued good health ongoing.
polonca12000 - 16 Jun 2005 22:37 GMT
Lots of purrs and best wishes for your results to be really good and that
they let you know really soon,
Signature

Polonca & Soncek

> This is what happened up to now.  Yesterday morning, fairly early, I finally
> managed to get through to my doctor's surgery.  Actually to speak on the
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> share this information with me.  She said, no, she was not allowed to.
> Aaargh, so she *is* allowed to read it but not tell ME!!
<snip>
Yoj - 14 Jun 2005 06:16 GMT
> Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know whether the
> tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I rang the secretary
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Tweed

That is absolutely outrageous!  Is there any way you can change doctors?
I'm surprised the surgeon's office wouldn't give you the results.

Some doctors and their staffs are very negligent about reporting results.
Several years ago, my mother, who was 80 at the time, was very ill.  She saw
her doctor, who took a chest x-ray and blood tests.  When she didn't hear
from him, she assumed the tests hadn't shown anything.  A week later, I went
to visit her, and could see she was extremely ill.  I called the doctor's
office and found that the x-ray had showed she had pneumonia, but they
hadn't bothered to let her know or prescribe any treatment.

Joy
Marina - 14 Jun 2005 06:29 GMT
> It's just terrible to wait like this and I might just need some purrs and
> prayers while I'm waiting to hear.

This is horrible! When I had my op they didn't know if the tumour was
malignant or not, but they made the test right then, during the op, in
order to determine whether they should remove just the tumour (if it had
been benign) or remove my whole thyroid (which they did since it turned
out to be malignant). The op took 8+ hours because they did the test
during it, but still. A whole month?? Is Howard around and can he
explain what is going on?

Signature

Marina, Frank and Miranda. In loving memory of Nikki.
marina (dot) kurten (at) pp (dot) inet (dot) fi
Pics at http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/frankiennikki/
and http://community.webshots.com/user/frankiennikki

Howard C. Berkowitz - 14 Jun 2005 18:22 GMT
> > It's just terrible to wait like this and I might just need some purrs
> > and
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> during it, but still. A whole month?? Is Howard around and can he
> explain what is going on?

In most cancer surgery, there are at least two phases of testing.  
Here's the problem: the pathologist has to make extremely thin slices of
tissue so light will come through them under the microscope. In
addition, they need to be stained, usually with a combination of dyes
that makes, for example, the nucleus one color and the cell wall another.

How could anyone possibly make that thin a slice, even of a piece of
ordinary meat, given that the tissue is soft?  They can't.  There are
two techniques that harden the tissue for slicing.

For specimens that need to be evaluated during surgery, they are frozen
(e.g., with liquid nitrogen or a more sophisticated chilling system),
and then sliced. Unfortunately, freezing can distort cells, and a frozen
section simply isn't as reliable as a "permanent" section, which I'll
discuss next.  Also, there is much less time to examine a surgical
specimen with all sorts of supplementary stains and test, while the
patient is on the operating table.

The more definitive tests are made by putting them in a stabilizing
preservative (typically formaldehyde, but others are used for
specialized tests), and then embedding the tissue in wax.  When I say
embedded, I mean that the wax gets between cells.

Unfortunately, wax is incompatible with the water that's in the cells,
even after the fixative was applied.  So, the specimen goes into
increasingly concentrated solutions of alcohol, which replace the water.
You can't just drop it into concentrated alcohol, or the cells would be
distorted.

When the tissue is fully soaked in alcohol, it then goes into wax, and
taken out to harden.  The hardened wax blocks are then split with a
cutting device called a microtome, which makes slices far thinner than
paper.  These slices are then transferred to microscope slides and
attached there -- a very delicate procedure.  

To stain the tissue, or to do other tests such as applying immunologic
tests, the alcohol has to come out and be replaced by water. The
step-by-step alcohol process now runs in reverse, until the slides come
out of dilute alcohol and into water. They are now ready for staining.
Some stains are immediate, while others have processing time.  Only
after the staining is complete can the pathologist evaluate them.

When I prepared slides like this by hand, the whole process could take a
week or more, mostly up and down the "alcohol ladder".  I haven't done
this for a while, and there now seem to be automated machines that are
much faster -- but still take 48 hours or more.

You can't be sure of the diagnosis until a pathologist has examined the
permanent slides. It may be appropriate to get additional opinions, or
to perform additional tests.  For example, in breast cancer, you do  
microscopic tests that will tell you if the tumor cells react to various
hormones.  If progestins accelerate their growth, for example, you
prescribe antiprogestins. If estrogens suppress them, you give
estrogens.  These are usually supplementary tests, where the cells have
a radioactive or fluorescent antibody (simplifying a little).  

So, realistically, it will take days or longer to get the final
pathology report. Once it's done, however, there is no excuse not to get
the results to the patient as soon as possible.
Pamela  Shirk - 15 Jun 2005 01:17 GMT
> For specimens that need to be evaluated during surgery, they are frozen
> (e.g., with liquid nitrogen or a more sophisticated chilling system),
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> specimen with all sorts of supplementary stains and test, while the
> patient is on the operating table.

This is why when Rob's brain tumors were first diagnosed, they thought he
had GBM, a much nastier brain cancer, and gave him a life expectancy of 3-6
months.  A week later they had the final pathology results in and were able
to tell us that the average lifespan with the brain cancer he has (Malignant
Anaplastic Ogliodendromia) is/was 2-15 years.  Of course the treatments he
has been receiving weren't available until only two years before he was
diagnosed, and so all bets are off.

Christina, if your Dr doesn't have your results, make a fuss.  If necessary
get a solicitor to help you out.  You have a right to know how you are
doing.

Pam S.
Enfilade - 15 Jun 2005 02:06 GMT
Purrs for you.

--Fil
Christina Websell - 15 Jun 2005 19:57 GMT
>> > It's just terrible to wait like this and I might just need some purrs
>> > and
[quoted text clipped - 67 lines]
> pathology report. Once it's done, however, there is no excuse not to get
> the results to the patient as soon as possible.

Thank you Howard, I had not realised it was quite so complicated.  A month
seems enough though for some sort of verdict.

Tweed
Howard C. Berkowitz - 15 Jun 2005 21:35 GMT
ave
> > a radioactive or fluorescent antibody (simplifying a little).
> >
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Tweed

Certainly less than 2 weeks is reasonable, unless they are very short of
pathologists, or some specimens need to be sent to a specialized
laboratory.
SuzQ - 14 Jun 2005 12:59 GMT
Purrs that its not malignant.
Suz&Spicey
Adrian - 14 Jun 2005 15:25 GMT
> Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know
> whether the tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Tweed

Purrs that your wait will soon be over, and that it will be the best
possible news.
Signature

Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
A house is not a home, without a cat.

Monique Y. Mudama - 14 Jun 2005 21:06 GMT
> Can you imagine what it's like to wait all this time to know whether my
> tumour was malignant or not?

No =/  That's just awful.

> It's just terrible to wait like this and I might just need some purrs and
> prayers while I'm waiting to hear.

Purrs and prayers are welcome, and also a big boot to your doctor's
backside.

Signature

monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully

pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca

Elise - 14 Jun 2005 23:30 GMT
> Well, I thought it was enough to wait for nearly a month to know whether the
> tumour I had removed on 16 May was malignant or not, so I rang the secretary
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Tweed

Purrs for you and litterbox offerings for your doctors.  It's absurd for
you to have to wait so long!

Signature

Elise (supervised by Gossamer & Jeeves)
pics: http://photos.yahoo.com/dragonandthistle@snet.net

 
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