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Cat Forum / Cat Anecdotes / April 2008URGENT TO GINGER-LYN
Does anyone know Ginger-lyn's phone number or real email? I wanted to get this to her before they do surgery on Cosmo... Ginger-lyn, Demi had the exact same thing - it's called a hematoma - when Sammy swatted her upside the head. My vet said they could aspirate it, but it would come back and it would cause a cauliflower ear; or they could do surgery and the surgery would probably cause a cauliflower ear; or we could just leave it alone and eventually it would go away, but it would probably cause a cauliflower ear. Since all the outcomes were the same (except that the first two could possibly introduce an infection which could be very bad/fatal), and since Demi is terrified of the vet, we choose to just leave it alone and it did eventually go down (didn't ever seem to cause her pain). And, yes, she has a cauliflower ear (but she's still gorgeous). http://www.possibleplaces.com/catnipped/Demi21/ I'm hoping you read this before you subject Cosmo (and your pocketbook) to surgery. Hugs, CatNipped  SignatureHugs, CatNipped See all my masters here: http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/ I just e-mailed you the e-mail addresses I've got for her. Dan > I just e-mailed you the e-mail addresses I've got for her. > > Dan I just read your email and called Ginger-lyn right away but Cosmos is already in surgery. She expects to hear something between 11 - 12 edt. I asked her to let us know as soon as she could but she has some things she had to do this afternoon and may not be able to update the group until later. She does have Merlin giving her meows and purrs - I could hear her talking to Ginger-lyn the entire time we were talking. Additional purrs are always welcome, however. Julie >> I just e-mailed you the e-mail addresses I've got for her. >> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > talking. Additional purrs are always welcome, however. > Julie ARGH! Oh well, hopefully all will be well with Cosmo - but I'm really bummed about not seeing this last night and responding. I know Ginger-lyn is in some financial straits right now (something I can, unfortunately, relate to) and I'd liked to have told her in time that she could have avoided this additional expense. Hugs, CatNipped > Does anyone know Ginger-lyn's phone number or real email? I wanted > to get this to her before they do surgery on Cosmo... [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > CatNipped Now that you mention that, CatNipped, our friend's d*g had the same thing! It eventually gets reabsorbed into the body and goes away. Thank you for realizing that's what her baby has! kili > Does anyone know Ginger-lyn's phone number or real email? I wanted to get > this to her before they do surgery on Cosmo... [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > I'm hoping you read this before you subject Cosmo (and your pocketbook) to > surgery. Just an FYI on hematomas- more often than not they must be repaired as they cause a lot of pain/discomfort and possibly infection. I have a cat that had a hematoma and it was quite painful for him. He was treated (the surgery is fairly minor and is actually kind of cool) and it was much better to take care of it than force him to deal with the pain for a prolonged period of time. Treating it quickly also resulted in his healed ear looking fairly normal as well, although I wouldn't have loved him any less if he had ended up with a cauliflower ear! You can see how the surgery looks here (it's in a dog, but the way the ear looks with stitches is the same for cats): http://www.thepetcenter.com/sur/hema.html I think Ginger-Lyn did the right thing to get her kitty's ear fixed. On Apr 16, 8:35 am, "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote: > Does anyone know Ginger-lyn's phone number or real email? I wanted to get > this to her before they do surgery on Cosmo... [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > I'm hoping you read this before you subject Cosmo (and your pocketbook) to > surgery. Just an FYI on hematomas- more often than not they must be repaired as they cause a lot of pain/discomfort and possibly infection. I have a cat that had a hematoma and it was quite painful for him. He was treated (the surgery is fairly minor and is actually kind of cool) and it was much better to take care of it than force him to deal with the pain for a prolonged period of time. Treating it quickly also resulted in his healed ear looking fairly normal as well, although I wouldn't have loved him any less if he had ended up with a cauliflower ear! You can see how the surgery looks here (it's in a dog, but the way the ear looks with stitches is the same for cats): http://www.thepetcenter.com/sur/hema.html I think Ginger-Lyn did the right thing to get her kitty's ear fixed. ======================================================= Yes, there is some pain - just like when you bruise yourself or get a blood blister. However, the surgery or aspiration *can* introduce infection. I would have no idea how an infection could be introduced if there was not break in the skin were you to let it heal on its own. Moreover, the pain of an incision and stitches would be, I would think, worse than the bruise-like pain of the hematoma itself. More to the point, Ginger-lyn is in such *dire* financial straits now that I think the vet not giving her the same information my vet gave me is really unethical. Hugs, CatNipped > <tripsoverc...@msn.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > an incision and stitches would be, I would think, worse than the bruise-like > pain of the hematoma itself. Hematoma's can elicit much more pain than that of a bruise and while your cat may have been okay, many are not. My cat was a perfect example and would cry even when his ear was lightly touched. It's not right to minimize what can be a very painful condition. > More to the point, Ginger-lyn is in such *dire* financial straits now that I > think the vet not giving her the same information my vet gave me is really > unethical. I don't think you're being fair to the vet, or to Ginger-Lyn for that matter. From what I've read, her vet is very aware of her situation and I've never seen her complain about her vet or their recommendations. Since you didn't see the hematoma or witness the exam, it is unreasonable to make a judgement as to what treatment Ginger-Lyn's cat actually needed. I have no doubt Ginger-Lyn would have asked the vet if there was anything they could do that was non- surgical and I think she is also smart enough to know when her cat really needs a necessary treatment. I give her props for getting this taken care of, even though it was difficult for her financially. That's the sign of a responsible, caring cat slave. On Apr 16, 1:18 pm, "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote: > <tripsoverc...@msn.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 52 lines] > bruise-like > pain of the hematoma itself. Hematoma's can elicit much more pain than that of a bruise and while your cat may have been okay, many are not. My cat was a perfect example and would cry even when his ear was lightly touched. It's not right to minimize what can be a very painful condition. ======================================================= Of course it hurts to touch a bruise or blood blister (hematoma) why would you think it would not??! That is not to say that an *untouched* bruise or hematoma is unbearably painful. I agree there might be a situation where surgery is mandated, but I also feel you should weigh all your options before subjecting an animal (or a person) to the risks of anesthesia or the possible risks to the surgery itself. ======================================================= > More to the point, Ginger-lyn is in such *dire* financial straits now that > I > think the vet not giving her the same information my vet gave me is really > unethical. I don't think you're being fair to the vet, or to Ginger-Lyn for that matter. From what I've read, her vet is very aware of her situation and I've never seen her complain about her vet or their recommendations. Since you didn't see the hematoma or witness the exam, it is unreasonable to make a judgement as to what treatment Ginger-Lyn's cat actually needed. I have no doubt Ginger-Lyn would have asked the vet if there was anything they could do that was non- surgical and I think she is also smart enough to know when her cat really needs a necessary treatment. I give her props for getting this taken care of, even though it was difficult for her financially. That's the sign of a responsible, caring cat slave. ======================================================= I would say that neither of us is there to judge the severity of the situation, but it didn't appear to me that her vet had given her the same information mine gave me. I'm sorry you find fault in my attempt to get information to her that may have given her some questions to ask her vet, but please don't imply that I am *not* a responsible, caring cat slave because my vet gave me different information to use in my decision making and I chose the more conservative approach. Choosing *NOT* to spend money one doesn't have when it is *NOT* necessary is not being irresponsible or uncaring. Hugs, CatNipped > Hematoma's can elicit much more pain than that of a bruise and while > your cat may have been okay, many are not. My cat was a perfect [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > before subjecting an animal (or a person) to the risks of anesthesia or the > possible risks to the surgery itself. If you read Ginger-Lyn's original post, she said that the vet said that if they drained it it would just fill up again and that surgery was the only option. For that to be the case, it was probably very similar to my cat's hematoma and I would venture a guess to say that it was pretty large. > > More to the point, Ginger-lyn is in such *dire* financial straits now that > > I [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > situation, but it didn't appear to me that her vet had given her the same > information mine gave me. Again, they said they could drain it but it would just fill up again and that surgery was the only option. It's clear they gave her the alternative to surgery and also gave her the likely outcome to that alternative. > I'm sorry you find fault in my attempt to get information to her that may > have given her some questions to ask her vet, I did not find fault with what you did, and I never said I did. If you look at my reply to you I simply pointed out that hematomas can be a lot more serious than what you dealt with and that surgery is usually warranted. Hematoma's aren't usually that easy to deal with. That was all. >but please don't imply that I > am *not* a responsible, caring cat slave because my vet gave me different > information to use in my decision making and I chose the more conservative > approach. Choosing *NOT* to spend money one doesn't have when it is *NOT* > necessary is not being irresponsible or uncaring. I never implied anything with regards to you. I said Ginger-Lyn was doing a great thing to get her kitty taken care of even though the finances are compromised. It was a compliment to her. If you want to get defensive about that and twist it to make it about *you* (which it wasn't) then I think you need to look within yourself rather than accuse me of doing something I did not do. On Apr 16, 1:48 pm, "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote: > Hematoma's can elicit much more pain than that of a bruise and while > your cat may have been okay, many are not. My cat was a perfect [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > the > possible risks to the surgery itself. If you read Ginger-Lyn's original post, she said that the vet said that if they drained it it would just fill up again and that surgery was the only option. For that to be the case, it was probably very similar to my cat's hematoma and I would venture a guess to say that it was pretty large. ========================================================= My vet also told me if they drained it it would just fill up again. However he also told me that surgery was *NOT* the only option that leaving it alone to go away on its own was an option (and in his opionion, since that would not involve the risks of anesthesia, the surgery itself, or infection from breaching the skin, the *BEST* option). I don't think either of us know the size of the hematoma or if that plays a part in the decision of how to treat it. ========================================================= > > More to the point, Ginger-lyn is in such *dire* financial straits now > > that [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > situation, but it didn't appear to me that her vet had given her the same > information mine gave me. Again, they said they could drain it but it would just fill up again and that surgery was the only option. It's clear they gave her the alternative to surgery and also gave her the likely outcome to that alternative. ========================================================= Again, so did my vet say it would fill up again which is why he definitely would *NOT* recommend that option - however he gave me another alternative to surgery which, it appears, Ginger-lyn's vet did not give her. I don't know how to make it any clearer that I was only trying to give Ginger-lyn information that her vet had obviously not given her. Not all vets are conservative, not all vets are ethical. I have no idea what Ginger-lin's vet may be like, but I question him not giving her all the options open to her. Saying that surgery was the only option is clearly wrong since I chose another option that worked out perfectly well in the end without the pain of an incision and stitches, without the risks associated with surgery and without any drain on my already drained pocketbook. ========================================================== > I'm sorry you find fault in my attempt to get information to her that may > have given her some questions to ask her vet, I did not find fault with what you did, and I never said I did. If you look at my reply to you I simply pointed out that hematomas can be a lot more serious than what you dealt with and that surgery is usually warranted. Hematoma's aren't usually that easy to deal with. That was all. ========================================================== To say that surgery is usually warranted is wrong. Have you ever had a blood blister in your life? Did your doctor feel the need to operate to heal it? My vet told me that surgery was not the only option that in fact it was not the best option. ========================================================== >but please don't imply that I > am *not* a responsible, caring cat slave because my vet gave me different > information to use in my decision making and I chose the more conservative > approach. Choosing *NOT* to spend money one doesn't have when it is *NOT* > necessary is not being irresponsible or uncaring. ========================================================= I never implied anything with regards to you. I said Ginger-Lyn was doing a great thing to get her kitty taken care of even though the finances are compromised. It was a compliment to her. If you want to get defensive about that and twist it to make it about *you* (which it wasn't) then I think you need to look within yourself rather than accuse me of doing something I did not do. ========================================================= There was a reason I used the work "imply" rather than "state" - do you need the definition of either word? What Ginger-lyn did might not have been "great", it may have been an uninformed (by her vet), misguided (by her vet), wrong decision had something gone wrong during surgery. It doesn't appear that you are being convinced by anything I have to say and I'm certain that you are wrong in what you are saying, so lets just agree to disagree before this gets out of hand. Hugs, CatNipped cat nipped, this is a general pattern I have seen with this poster and is why I have blocked this individual, ginger made her decision, and all you did was offer your experience, that is enough, Lee > On Apr 16, 1:48 pm, "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 125 lines] > > CatNipped > cat nipped, > > this is a general pattern I have seen with this poster and is why I have > blocked this individual, ginger made her decision, and all you did was > offer > your experience, that is enough, Lee Ah, I was beginning to wonder. Thanks for the heads up. Hugs, CatNipped I hate blocking people, but it is not in my tolerance level when someone is always right, I mean we all have experience, different cats, different vets, different issues, money, lifestyle and so on, but when one thinks they are always right, or always anything for that matter, THEY need to look inside themselves and see about that issue, Lee, not feeling very tolerant of anything today > > cat nipped, > > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > CatNipped > I hate blocking people, but it is not in my tolerance level when > someone is always right, I mean we all have experience, different > cats, different vets, different issues, money, lifestyle and so on, > but when one thinks they are always right, or always anything for that Please do not block Lori, I am sure in time she will realize she should not have called GLs vet unethical. She is just having a busy time right now. >> I hate blocking people, but it is not in my tolerance level when >> someone is always right, I mean we all have experience, different [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > not > have called GLs vet unethical. She is just having a busy time right now. LOL! Sometimes UseNet reminds me of that game where kids line up and the first one whispers something in the ear of the next and by the time it gets to the end it turns into something entirely different. JFTR I didn't call Ginger-lyn's vet unethical and I apologize if it came out that way. I *DO* think it was wrong *IF* GL's vet did not mention to her the "do nothing" option. Hugs, CatNipped > JFTR I didn't call Ginger-lyn's vet unethical Well, yes you did and you did so without having any knowledge of the actual conversation: "More to the point, Ginger-lyn is in such *dire* financial straits now that I think the vet not giving her the same information my vet gave me is really unethical." tripsovercats@msn.com wrote in news:13dc7393-eb8b-41e1-a9be- 40e4fa1cc04b@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com: >> JFTR I didn't call Ginger-lyn's vet unethical > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > really > unethical." Over time you will notice that Lori is a deeply emotional (read caring) person and because of that she sometimes speaks in moral certainties that strictly speaking may not be perfectly articulated. I _like_ that about her. You on the other had like to speak with technical accuracy (to a degree which may not be 100% appropriate for this type of group). I like _that_ about you (even if you ruffle feathers) but clearly you and Lori (and some others) will always be somewhat incompatible. Hopefully all of use can look past those strange differences we have and see the cat lovers we all are. I now return to my regularly scheduled cynicism. > tripsoverc...@msn.com wrote in news:13dc7393-eb8b-41e1-a9be- > 40e4fa1cc...@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com: [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > I now return to my regularly scheduled cynicism. Thank you for your thoughtful reply. :-) You're right in that my style may not be 100% approriate for this group, but I'm glad you recognize that I am indeed trying to be technically accurate. I am what I am and I feel that it is very important, especially in discussions on health issues, and even more especially when disagreement arises. I very much appreciate your take on this. On Apr 16, 5:43 pm, outsider <not@this_address.com> wrote: > tripsoverc...@msn.com wrote in news:13dc7393-eb8b-41e1-a9be- > 40e4fa1cc...@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com: [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > I now return to my regularly scheduled cynicism. :Thank you for your thoughtful reply. :-) You're right in that my style :may not be 100% approriate for this group, but I'm glad you recognize :that I am indeed trying to be technically accurate. I am what I am and :I feel that it is very important, especially in discussions on health :issues, and even more especially when disagreement arises. I very much :appreciate your take on this. - - - Have you tried RPCBH?? You'll fit in beautifully there... or, you'll be handed your lunch... cold. ;o/ I am sure, to you, that you mean well, but folks in here think highly of each other for so many more reasons then just our beloved cats. If you bicker too much, you'll end up in a recipe thread! (Which is never a bad thing)!! Signature·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:- ¸.·´ .·´¨¨)) Laurie ((¸¸.·´ ..·´ -:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.· *~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* All that I am or hope to be, I owe to my angel mother. ~Abraham Lincoln >> tripsoverc...@msn.com wrote in news:13dc7393-eb8b-41e1-a9be- >> 40e4fa1cc...@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com: [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > issues, and even more especially when disagreement arises. I very much > appreciate your take on this. I am a technologist and a lover of words and their exacted use. Unfortunately I also have very poor typing skills and am highly dyslexic and because of that I run out of energy very quickly and end up speaking (typing) less succinctly than I might like most of the time so I tend to straddle the two worlds. I do, however, appreciate accurate speech; it tends to be easier for me to follow. I like my science to be science and my poetry to be poetry. I hope that makes sense because I am about out of energy and it is also my bedtime soon since I am up at 3:50. later, Andy > tripsovercats@msn.com wrote in news:13dc7393-eb8b-41e1-a9be- > 40e4fa1cc04b@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com: [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > I now return to my regularly scheduled cynicism. I thought that was your cats' jobs ;-) >> tripsovercats@msn.com wrote in news:13dc7393-eb8b-41e1-a9be- >> 40e4fa1cc04b@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com: [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] >> > I thought that was your cats' jobs ;-) I am definitely more cynical than they are. They keep me on the path. Andy > Over time you will notice that Lori is a deeply emotional (read caring) > person and because of that she sometimes speaks in moral certainties that [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > use can look past those strange differences we have and see the cat > lovers we all are. Very good post, Andy. Very good. SignatureMarina, Miranda and Caliban. In loving memory of Frank and Nikki. >> Over time you will notice that Lori is a deeply emotional (read >> caring) person and because of that she sometimes speaks in moral [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Very good post, Andy. Very good. Thanks. >>> I hate blocking people, but it is not in my tolerance level when >>> someone is always right, I mean we all have experience, different [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > the first one whispers something in the ear of the next and by the > time it gets to the end it turns into something entirely different. We called it Telephone. > JFTR I didn't call Ginger-lyn's vet unethical and I apologize if it > came out that way. I *DO* think it was wrong *IF* GL's vet did not > mention to her the "do nothing" option. Actually I suspect the vet discussed the options but when people relay a conversation they tend to abridge it to the end result but, of course, you know I was just being a trouble-maker anyway. What can I say? It's a gift! Andy >> cat nipped, >> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > CatNipped This was the same poster that last week told me I was endangering my Rumble life because my vet did not know how to use proper nutrition to control his diabetes since the vet has him on wet and dry food but yet his sugar level is normal as is his blood work. This was because his vet said so sorry I still only trust my vet > >news:66n301F2l57cpU2@mid.individual.net... > >> cat nipped, [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > diabetes since the vet has him on wet and dry food but yet his sugar level > is normal as is his blood work. Matthew, I said that your cat was in danger of coming out of remission if he is eating high carb food. This is not my opinion. It's a fact. It happens all the time to diabetic cats that go back to eating dry food. The carbs are harmful. They put stress an an already compromised pancreas. Period. Have you ever tested your cat's blood sugar after 24 hours of being fed only low-carb canned food, then fed your diabetic a dry meal and then tested his blood sugar again? If you actually did this I can assure you you would be unpleasantly surprised. Why do you think cats go into remission when dry food is eliminated from the diet? The stress of unnecessary carbs and the glucose toxicity that is a result of the dry food diet is removed from the equation. That's why. Now, if you want to stop being childish and feel something I have said in this discussion is inaccurate and would like to discuss it or present a different take, by all means be my guest. But if you want to join in libeling Ginger-Lyn's vet or implying she is stupid or incapable of making thoughful decisions with regards to the appropriate care of Cosmo then I will take issue with that. Instead of making this your own personal vendetta, why not just stick to the issue at hand. On Apr 16, 5:14 pm, "Matthew" <Iamacatsl...@proudtoserve.com> wrote: > "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > diabetes since the vet has him on wet and dry food but yet his sugar level > is normal as is his blood work. Matthew, I said that your cat was in danger of coming out of remission if he is eating high carb food. This is not my opinion. It's a fact. It happens all the time to diabetic cats that go back to eating dry food. The carbs are harmful. They put stress an an already compromised pancreas. Period. Have you ever tested your cat's blood sugar after 24 hours of being fed only low-carb canned food, then fed your diabetic a dry meal and then tested his blood sugar again? If you actually did this I can assure you you would be unpleasantly surprised. Why do you think cats go into remission when dry food is eliminated from the diet? The stress of unnecessary carbs and the glucose toxicity that is a result of the dry food diet is removed from the equation. That's why. Now, if you want to stop being childish and feel something I have said in this discussion is inaccurate and would like to discuss it or present a different take, by all means be my guest. But if you want to join in libeling Ginger-Lyn's vet or implying she is stupid or incapable of making thoughful decisions with regards to the appropriate care of Cosmo then I will take issue with that. Instead of making this your own personal vendetta, why not just stick to the issue at hand. - - - -- - - - First you tried to tell CatNipped that she was trying to make it "about her". Now you're telling Matthew he's trying to make this his "personal vendetta". Purrsonally, I think you're a real pain in the a.s!! (But hey, I could be making this all about me)!! ;oP Signature·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:- ¸.·´ .·´¨¨)) Laurie ((¸¸.·´ ..·´ -:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.· *~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* All that I am or hope to be, I owe to my angel mother. ~Abraham Lincoln > On Apr 16, 5:14 pm, "Matthew" <Iamacatsl...@proudtoserve.com> wrote: >> "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > Purrsonally, I think you're a real pain in the a.s!! (But hey, I could be > making this all about me)!! ;oP I knew there was a reason I was in love with you ;-) the two of you are going to owe me a keyboard, and you are going to have to give my 20 pound cat a bath if you keep this up, he does NOT like coffee on his furs, Lee > > <tripsovercats@msn.com> wrote in message news:3b83141c-de3b-4a0a-b2d9-db2c08cd8bf2@a23g2000hsc.googlegroups.com... > > On Apr 16, 5:14 pm, "Matthew" <Iamacatsl...@proudtoserve.com> wrote: > >> "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message [quoted text clipped - 69 lines] > > > I knew there was a reason I was in love with you ;-) >> On Apr 16, 5:14 pm, "Matthew" <Iamacatsl...@proudtoserve.com> wrote: >>> "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] >> > I knew there was a reason I was in love with you ;-) :)xxoo! Signature·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:- ¸.·´ .·´¨¨)) Laurie ((¸¸.·´ ..·´ -:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.· *~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* All that I am or hope to be, I owe to my angel mother. ~Abraham Lincoln that needed a BW, Lee > On Apr 16, 5:14 pm, "Matthew" <Iamacatsl...@proudtoserve.com> wrote: > > "CatNipped" <CatNip...@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message [quoted text clipped - 66 lines] > All that I am or hope to be, I owe to my angel mother. > ~Abraham Lincoln <tripsovercats@msn.com> < snipped >. Again I trust my vet not a newbie or their vet who I don't know from a hole in the wall. Again as newbie which you are here. I think you really need some people skills and calm down. I think you are passionate about what you think you know and technically understand but cramming it down someone else's throat will never work an any way. Also arguing with someone who is trying to help than saying what you are saying who is the one being childish. I am ginger Lynn friend along with Catnipped also being a friend of both of us. There are plenty of her friends here that she trust. I have never and never will ever call her stupid or incapable of doing something. I really think you need to get of your high horse. > My vet also told me if they drained it it would just fill up again. However > he also told me that surgery was *NOT* the only option that leaving it alone [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I don't think either of us know the size of the hematoma or if that plays a > part in the decision of how to treat it. Exactly. That's why I said I guessed, as this is what we see in the clinic and I experienced myself. Again, you did not witness the conversation between Ginger-Lyn and her vet, yet you are stating that the vet did not give her all the options. You can't possibly know that, or even what the options were in consideration of that particular injury, and are even stating that the vet is unethical. All this based on next to no information. > > > More to the point, Ginger-lyn is in such *dire* financial straits now > > > that [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > would *NOT* recommend that option - however he gave me another alternative > to surgery which, it appears, Ginger-lyn's vet did not give her. Again, she clearly stated that the vet examined Cosmo and said surgery was the "only" option. There was obviously a reason for that, but since neither you or I were there all we can do is speculate. I speculated based on what I have seen come through the clinic and my own cat's hematoma. What I take issue with is your drive to badmouth this vet and make it sound like they are cheating Ginger-Lyn without ANY evidence of this being the case. >I don't > know how to make it any clearer that I was only trying to give Ginger-lyn > information that her vet had obviously not given her. Not all vets are > conservative, not all vets are ethical. I have no idea what Ginger-lin's > vet may be like, but I question him not giving her all the options open to > her. You don't know what was discussed so you can't possibly make a statement saying what was discussed. >Saying that surgery was the only option is clearly wrong YOU DON"T KNOW THIS. You weren't there, you are not a vet, you did not see the injury and as such cannot honestly come to this conclusion. > To say that surgery is usually warranted is wrong. Have you ever had a > blood blister in your life? I suggest you do some research. A hematoma on an animal's ear is not the same as a blood blister on a human. >Did your doctor feel the need to operate to > heal it? My vet told me that surgery was not the only option that in fact > it was not the best option. In *your* case. > I never implied anything with regards to you. I said Ginger-Lyn was > doing a great thing to get her kitty taken care of even though the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > There was a reason I used the work "imply" rather than "state" - do you need > the definition of either word? No. To imply is to express or state indirectly. I did no such thing. Again, I gave Ginger-Lyn a compliment and nothing more. I understand her situation very well as I have been there myself several times, but where there is a will there is a way and kudos to her for finding a way. Too many times we see people come through the clinic that *have* the money to spend, but they are too cheap to do what's needed and the animals are the ones that ultimately pay the price. And there's nothing we can do about it. So when I see someone go to the wire for their animal you bet your a.s I'm going to let them know that there are some people out there that appreciate what they've done. If you want to twist it to make it about you maybe it's because you're feeling guilty about not spending money when maybe you should have. I don't know. But what I do know is that it wasn't about "you* nor was it implied. Period. >What Ginger-lyn did might not have been > "great", it may have been an uninformed (by her vet), misguided (by her > vet), wrong decision had something gone wrong during surgery. Do you realize how insulting this statement is to Ginger-Lyn? You make it sound as though she is stupid and gullible. I have a little more faith in her capabilities than you do apparently.You also make it sound as though her vet is an unethical charlatan when you have nothing absolutely to base this on. > It doesn't appear that you are being convinced by anything I have to say and > I'm certain that you are wrong in what you are saying, so lets just agree to > disagree before this gets out of hand. You have offered nothing other than speculation and libeling of the vet with no facts to base it on. <tripsovercats@msn.com> < snipped > I think you need to learn how to talk to people you are coming off as pushy and over zealous. No one will tolerate this so you are ending up in people kill files I feel I need to jump in here, considering this thread is about me and my cat and my decisions. I have e-mailed both parties with my feelings, and in general, I think that is where they belong -- in private e-mail. I will only say that each situation is different, and what may be right for one may be wrong for the other. I believe I made the right decision for Cosmo; I could not allow him to suffer in pain needlessly, and I wanted to give him a chance to not be in pain and to feel better again, and to live out what life is left to him (and I believe he has quite a bit of life left to him; as someone posted, he *is* a strong cat). Catnipped is someone I consider a friend, and tripsovercats is new here. But in this case, tripsovercats was completely accurate about my situation, what happened, the hematoma, etc. He/she may have come across to some too strongly, but his/her words comforted me greatly. I hope everyone will give him/her a chance, as it sounds like tripsovercats may have a great deal of insight to offer here. I also believe Catnipped was only trying to help, and only had the best of intentions. But I believe in this situation, her advice was wrong. I hope that in saying that, we remain friends. So, please, let's stop this. I do not want to be the cause of hurt and angry feelings here. Please just remember that Cosmo made it through the surgery (a surgery both the vet and I agreed was necessary), that he has a good chance of recovery, and that your wonderful purrs and prayers made all the difference. Ginger-lyn "Ginger-lyn" <SabraCat@planetoid.net> No problem Ginger I am still praying and the pack is still purring till Cosmo is home. I am glad everything so far has come out great. I was worried about you both Trips over cats is more than welcome here He/she seems to know a lot about cats but just needs to tone it down and calm down a bit for this group IMO. you are a very good person, Lee > I feel I need to jump in here, considering this thread is about me and > my cat and my decisions. [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Ginger-lyn > I feel I need to jump in here, considering this thread is about me and > my cat and my decisions. [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Ginger-lyn Amen. >I feel I need to jump in here, considering this thread is about me and my >cat and my decisions. [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Ginger-lyn I didn't mean to stir trouble (she says in the midst of trouble she stirred), but only wanted to give you sound advice that my vet gave me (and that worked well for me AND my cat). As you may or may not have noticed I stopped quite a while ago and if "tripsovercats" is determined (as s/he seems to be) to carry on this argument s/he'll have to do so without me. BTW, *did* you vet advise you that a hematoma will be naturally reabsorbed by the body if left untreated? Demi's looked horrible, but she was not in pain and continued to play and eat normally until it eventually went away. Hugs, CatNipped BTW, here is a bit more info on hematomas since this is a condition that, once a cat has it, can recur throughout the rest of their lives - and there really *IS* an alternative to surgery... From: http://www.sniksnak.com/cathealth/hematoma.html "It is an uncomfortable, rather than painful, condition." From: http://www.dolittler.com/index.cfm/2007/8/13/pet.vet.dog.cat.ear%20hematoma.vete rinary "Having suffered this condition multiple times with my long-lost Agatha (a boxer who saw me through vet school), it irks me a little that hematomas are almost invariably treated surgically. The first episode found me repairing the ear with painful consequences. The two following episodes healed blissfully (though somewhat less attractively) on their own. Given a choice, I'd opt always for less pain, more crinkling." My vet told me that the only reason for surgery is to prevent disfigurement. It was my choice to let my pretty little Demi have a cauliflower ear rather than submit her to the stress and risks of surgery. SignatureHugs, CatNipped See all my masters at: http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/ > BTW, here is a bit more info on hematomas since this is a condition that, > once a cat has it, can recur throughout the rest of their lives - and there > really *IS* an alternative to surgery... > > From: http://www.sniksnak.com/cathealth/hematoma.html > "It is an uncomfortable, rather than painful, condition." From peteducation.com: "Ear hematomas, medically known as 'aural hematomas' or 'auricular hematomas,' are a collection of blood and fluid between the skin and cartilage of the ear. A blood vessel in the ear ruptures and the loose space under the skin will fill up with blood. The pressure from the ruptured vessel will often cause the entire surface of the ear to swell creating a very painful condition. These hematomas will occur very quickly, often within minutes of the vessel being ruptured. Affected animals will have a noticeably swollen, fluid-filled ear that is extremely painful to the touch. If left untreated, the pain will subside somewhat after several days, but the swelling will continue and eventually, as the fluid-filled space generates scar tissue, the ear may become permanently disfigured." This is not something I would choose to have any of my cats endure for who knows how long. Having gone the surgery route, I can report that my cat got quick relief and the healing was fairly fast. > My vet told me that the only reason for surgery is to prevent disfigurement. > It was my choice to let my pretty little Demi have a cauliflower ear rather > than submit her to the stress and risks of surgery. And that is your choice and may have worked with your cat, but if you did a little more research you would find that the prognosis using a conservative treatment is poor (one site states about 50%.) Google hematoma ear treatment cats and you'll find plenty of cites. Surgery is by far the treatment of choice and in many instances, as in cases of large vessel ruptures, the only effective treatment. Also, interestingly, it appears that hematomas rarely recur in areas where there has been a surgical repair. |
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