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Cat Forum / Cat Anecdotes / June 2007Sorry if this offends anyone (OT) - What's up with these religious people?!
A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she never cracked a smile. He said, "Hi, remember me?" Uh, yeah, you're the guy who bought some clothes from me at the yard sale two years ago." Yep! That's me! This guy is a preacher. A minister at some church. I told him 2 years ago, when he wouldn't pay a lousy $1.50 for a perfectly nice skirt (alledgedly buying it for one of his parishioners) I wasn't interested in attending his church. But he came over yesterday to ask if I wanted to attend his church. Maybe attendance is down; who knows why he's trolling door to door trying to drum up business. When I said no thank you, he started to argue with me. Ahem! I didn't invite you over, would you please get off my patio? It was 5 o'clock in the evening and I was having a glass of wine. He said to me, "Oh, I see you've been 'into' something." Excuse me?! I'm 47 years old, I don't need anyone's permission to have a glass of wine. Did I invite this man over to invade my privacy and then criticize my actions? I most certainly did not. And that poor young woman, scowling, she didn't look like she wanted to be here anymore than I wanted them to be here. What is it with these people? They think they can knock on your door and then try to tell you how to live? There's a reason I'm not into the whole organized religion thing. This just proves it. Jill > A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there > with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Jill What a freak. What's really disgusting is how people like that wave their "preacher" title when in fact, they're just hurting their church and the rest of their faith by putting people off with his behavior. He needs a serious lesson in WWJD, I think. Especially WRT the remark about the wine. Sherry >> Maybe attendance is down; who knows why he's trolling door to door >> trying to drum up business. When I said no thank you, he started to [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > faith by putting people > off with his behavior. Yeah, like that makes him somehow better than anyone else. Got news for ya, you can become an ordained minister with the Universal Life Church simply by signing onto their web site. > He needs a serious lesson in WWJD, I think. > Especially WRT > the remark about the wine. It's none of his business what I do in the privacy of my own home. I wasn't out driving around drunk; I was getting ready to cook dinner and sipping a glass of wine while chopping vegetables. The only good thing I have to say about him was he wanted to know what Persia's KittyWalk enclosure was for. I should have told him it was to stuff self-righteous people like himself into ;) Jill >A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there > with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Jill Jill I call the police on these people and have trespass warning placed against them. I have a big sign out front that say no business or religious solicitation. I have several Jehovah witness with trespassing charges against them for repeated coming onto my property that has notice saying above and no trespassing signs all along the fence. Someone like that I would definitely let the police know preacher or not nowadays you never know >A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there >with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > >Jill Well, I've never been a religious person, but I had a religious upbringing, and a thorough religious education, so I understand something of the sense of urgency many religious people have about missionary work. They believe it is a matter of eternal life or doom. They believe they are trying to save souls. Compared to that, personal freedom does not rate very high-- in fact, from that point of view, personal freedom is a big part of what is ruining everything for devout people. It's the same reason why the abortion issue will never be resolved to everyone's satisfaction, for example. I was brought up in the Catholic Church, which believes abortion is murder, plain and simple. So if you start with that premise, you can't accept that anyone should have a choice to commit murder. Theresa Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh Make Levees, Not War >>A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there >>with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] >and simple. So if you start with that premise, you can't accept that >anyone should have a choice to commit murder. PS, Jill, after reading and replying to your message, I had a tremendous urge to go to the fridge and pour out a nice glass of white wine for myself. ;) Theresa Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh Make Levees, Not War >>> But he came over yesterday to ask if I wanted to attend his church. >>> Maybe attendance is down; who knows why he's trolling door to door [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > tremendous urge to go to the fridge and pour out a nice glass of white > wine for myself. ;) Cheers! I just poured one myself and it's not even 2PM here! :) But it's plenty hot outside; I even put an ice cube in it! Persia isn't the only one who can have ice cubes. <wink> >>>>But he came over yesterday to ask if I wanted to attend his church. >>>>Maybe attendance is down; who knows why he's trolling door to door [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > plenty hot outside; I even put an ice cube in it! Persia isn't the only one > who can have ice cubes. <wink> Like I've said elsewhere, I've nothing against alcoholic beverages, but where does anyone get the idea they're COOLING (ice cubes or not)? >>>>> But he came over yesterday to ask if I wanted to attend his church. >>>>> Maybe attendance is down; who knows why he's trolling door to door [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > beverages, but where does anyone get the idea they're > COOLING (ice cubes or not)? They're not, but after a half-dozen, who cares how hot it is? (Sorry, it's a cliche of a joke, but I couldn't help it.) I'm reminded of one of my favorite George Burns quotes: "It takes only one drink to get me drunk. The trouble is, I can't remember if it's the thirteenth or the fourteenth."  SignatureRemember: It it To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> >>>>>> But he came over yesterday to ask if I wanted to attend his church. >>>>>> Maybe attendance is down; who knows why he's trolling door to door [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > "It takes only one drink to get me drunk. The trouble is, I can't remember > if it's the thirteenth or the fourteenth." OR famous saying of W.C.Fields: "A man has to believe in something -- I believe i"ll have another drink!' MLB >>> PS, Jill, after reading and replying to your message, I had a >>> tremendous urge to go to the fridge and pour out a nice glass of [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > beverages, but where does anyone get the idea they're > COOLING (ice cubes or not)? I agree if you drink a lot of alcohol, particularly in the heat, you'll feel the affects much faster. However I was inside in the air conditioning. >>>> PS, Jill, after reading and replying to your message, I had a >>>> tremendous urge to go to the fridge and pour out a nice glass of [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > feel > the affects much faster. However I was inside in the air conditioning. I don't know about overall cooling, but nothing tastes better when you are hot and thirsty than that first swallow of ice cold beer. Jo >>>>>PS, Jill, after reading and replying to your message, I had a >>>>>tremendous urge to go to the fridge and pour out a nice glass of [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > I don't know about overall cooling, but nothing tastes better when you are > hot and thirsty than that first swallow of ice cold beer. Oh, I didn't say it doesn't TASTE good! (But it does make you sweat, which you're already doing, in hot weather.) > >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Oh, I didn't say it doesn't TASTE good! (But it does make > you sweat, which you're already doing, in hot weather.) Maybe that's why it cools you: you sweat more; sweating cools you; ergo the effect is to feel cooler! (Anything to justify a good, ice-cold beer whenever. :-) SignatureRemember: It it To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> >>>I don't know about overall cooling, but nothing tastes better when you are >>>hot and thirsty than that first swallow of ice cold beer. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > (Anything to justify a good, ice-cold beer whenever. :-) LOL! Who needs justification? I was simply stating a fact. > A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there > with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Jill It is a good idea to have a peep hole in your door and then don't open the door if you don't know the person. MLB >> A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing >> there with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > It is a good idea to have a peep hole in your door and then don't > open the door if you don't know the person. MLB My doors are glass paned. Don't need a peep hole. I did recognize the guy, that's the only reason I opened the door. Didn't know he was planning to give me a lecture about my lifestyle, though. As though it's any of his business. Sheesh! Jill > My doors are glass paned. Don't need a peep hole. I did recognize the guy, > that's the only reason I opened the door. Didn't know he was planning to > give me a lecture about my lifestyle, though. As though it's any of his > business. Sheesh! > > Jill Even if you had come to the door falling-down drunk, what business would it have been of his? ;-) >>> A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing >>> there with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > > Jill One should NOT be forced to hide in their own home. I fully understand the moment some people feel about their religious beliefs but they also need to understand simple courtesy. When I say I am not interested in this discussion they need to leave BEFORE I get angry. Most religious people DO show respect for other beliefs the rest are just plain a.ses. Andy Next time you meet, will you give him a few polite words about his missionary approach? That might not be totally polite, but I do reccomend to communicate directly with the person who offended you. Otherwise, he'll never know. And he may not ever think to improve his approach. SignatureChristopher A. Young You can't shout down a troll. You have to starve them. . : My doors are glass paned. Don't need a peep hole. I did recognize the guy, : that's the only reason I opened the door. Didn't know he was planning to : give me a lecture about my lifestyle, though. As though it's any of his : business. Sheesh! : : Jill > Next time you meet, will you give him a few polite words about > his missionary approach? That might not be totally polite, but I > do reccomend to communicate directly with the person who offended > you. Otherwise, he'll never know. And he may not ever think to > improve his approach. I was polite. He was pushy. I had told him before I wasn't interested in attending his church but he still felt the need to come back two years later and launch into a lecture. That's not the way to generate interest, IMHO. I was just as polite when I asked him to please leave my patio. Jill >> My doors are glass paned. Don't need a peep hole. I did recognize >> the guy, that's the only reason I opened the door. Didn't know he >> was planning to give me a lecture about my lifestyle, though. As >> though it's any of his business. Sheesh! >> >> Jill >>A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there >>with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > It is a good idea to have a peep hole in your door and then don't open the > door if you don't know the person. MLB If you remember to USE it! I've had one, the last three paces I've lived (meaning at least ten years) and I NEVER think to look, first. (I do have a gadget - somewhat more secure than a "security" chain - that allows me to open the door only a fraction, but I seldom even REMEMBER I have a peephole.) > A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. I'm lucky in that where I live it's virtually impossible to get a knock on the door from an unexpected visitor, other than a neighbor within the building. When I lived elsewhere and got those knocks you referred to, I, too, found it annoyingly invasive and their manner offensive. You have every right, if they don't leave after you politely ask them to or tell them that you're not interested, to "suggest" in no uncertain terms, "go fry your a.s." I find that very effective. :-) The only time I encounter self-righteous proselytizers now is on the street, and I have to say I find them mostly amusing. That *must* be the case, because my spontaneous reaction these days is to laugh in their faces. I thank my mom and dad (both RB, if that applies to people, too) for the ability to laugh at people, and that includes myself. (On the rare occasions I do something foolish.) ba-dum-bum SignatureRemember: It it To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> >... I was having a glass of wine. He said to me, >"Oh, I see you've been 'into' something." Excuse me?! I'm 47 years old, I >don't need anyone's permission to have a glass of wine. I think I'd say that Jesus himself not only drank wine but "created" some at Cana. I've been told that it was really only grape juice. Excuse me, but I think the wine steward would know the difference between wine and grape juice! Jeanne >>... I was having a glass of wine. He said to me, >>"Oh, I see you've been 'into' something." Excuse me?! I'm 47 years old, I [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > juice. Excuse me, but I think the wine steward would know the > difference between wine and grape juice! As would the guests! (Isn't there something about some of them marveling that "most people serve the best vintages first, but these folks kept the best for last"?) > What is it with these people? They think they can knock on your door and > then try to tell you how to live? There's a reason I'm not into the whole > organized religion thing. This just proves it. If they only knew how many people they turn OFF with those tactics! I've never found Presbyterians to be particularly aggressive in their proselytizing, but it was attending a Presbyterian-affiliated college that made me part ways with ALL organized religion until I began pursuing my dream of being an opera singer, and encountered paying choir jobs. (My locker at school was right outside the room used for voluntary early morning chapel every day, and I got more than a little ticked off by the kids who attended it, then left discussing how they planned to cheat on the test in their first hour class!) Not all "fundmentalists" are hypocrites - some of them actually try to practice the faith they profess - but unfortunately I've seen too many of the kind who confuse "God's will" with their own. >A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there > with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Jill Please don't judge all churches or religious people by offensive idiots like that. Joy >>A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there >> with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > Please don't judge all churches or religious people by offensive idiots > like that. Thankyou Joy. I've had two sets of really nice Jehovah's Witnesses knocking at my door. The first knocked on my door whilst I was having an aweful migraine. I opened the door looking like death warmed up. Instead of starting with the usual spiel, he apologised for disturbing me, and asked me if I had anyone to look after me. When I mumbled "its OK, I'll be fine" he asked me if he could call anyone to let them know. When I said 'no' he once again apologised for disturbing me and went on his way. The second set was just last Saturday. As the launched into their speil, I politely said "I won't waste your time, we're not interested. But its a beautiful day, I hope you enjoy your walk around the neighbourhood." They smiled, wished me well, and went on their way. Whilst it certainly isn't within my own religion to go door-to-door prosetylising, I can't see the point of being rude to people who sincerely believe they are doing The Right Thing. If they do get argumentative, I reiterate I'm not intersted and tell them I'm shutting the door. And then I just shut the door. I don't see the point of worrying about it. There are nice people in organised religions just as much as there are @ssholes, just as htere are nice people and @ssholes who aren't involved in organised religions. Jill, I'm sorry you met one of life's @ssholes, but he would have been like that regardless of what religion (or no religion) he cared to follow. I'm surprised you bothered to engage with him after you knew he was there to preach. Yowie > I've had two sets of really nice Jehovah's Witnesses knocking at my door. > The first knocked on my door whilst I was having an aweful migraine. I [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > you enjoy your walk around the neighbourhood." They smiled, wished me > well, and went on their way. All the JWs I've met have been like that. I could never take their belief system seriously but I have a lot of respect for them as people. ============== j-c ====== @ ====== purr . demon . co . uk ============== Jack Campin: 11 Third St, Newtongrange EH22 4PU, Scotland | tel 0131 660 4760 <http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack/> for CD-ROMs and free | fax 0870 0554 975 stuff: Scottish music, food intolerance, & Mac logic fonts | mob 07800 739 557 <snip> > What is it with these people? They think they can knock on your door and > then try to tell you how to live? There's a reason I'm not into the whole > organized religion thing. This just proves it. Anyone can come to my door selling anything - and I can respond any legal way I want, including by closing the door immediately. Something so easily solved is hardly worth getting worked up over. SignatureCheryl That's an incredible illustration. Thanks for posting it. It reminds me of a friend of mine I see now and again. His 18 year old daughter had been dating a fellow, and then switched to a different boy friend. I went to see the crew last Saturday. The daughter was home, and the ex boyfriend stopped by. They got into a shouting match. I wanted to pull him aside and remind him that shouting at a woman isn't likely to help her to be romantic. Sure sounds like an ineffective approach to me. Do they need sensetivity training? I wouldn't give up on all organized religion. After all, you're only seeing a sample. SignatureChristopher A. Young You can't shout down a troll. You have to starve them. . : A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there : with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] : : Jill > A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing > there with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > Jill I doubt very much that I would haved been as patient as you were, I would have told him where to go in no uncertain terms. SignatureAdrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera) Cats leave pawprints on your heart. http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk >A knock at the door yesterday afternoon. There's this guy standing there > with a smile on his face and a young lady (12, 13?) who is scowling; she [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Jill I do not like the sound of the person who knocked on your door and critisised you for having a glass of wine. That is wrong. I do have a certain amount of sympathy for religions that require missionaries to visit private homes, like LDS or Jehovah's. I was very surprised a couple of weeks ago. I was at my cousins house, very devout LDS, and 2 Jehovah's W came to the door. I really expected her to clear them off given her religious persuasion but she didn't. She thanked them for coming and took their leaflets, saying only that she had family here at the time and would talk later. Apparently she welcomes them into her home usually for a really robust talk around religion. Maybe I should do that instead of turning them away. Tweed > I do not like the sound of the person who knocked on your door and > critisised you for having a glass of wine. That is wrong. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Tweed Maybe you should. I'll admit I've had "interesting" discussions with some of the folks I've met on the street (never with those who knocked on my door.) Oddly, after every one of these discussions I come away feeling stronger than ever in my own belief system, and I feel more sorrow for them because they're so obviously lost and trying so hard to find themselves. SignatureRemember: It it To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> > What is it with these people? They think they can knock on your door and > then try to tell you how to live? There's a reason I'm not into the whole > organized religion thing. This just proves it. If it weren't a waste of perfectly good wine, I would have thrown the contents of my glass at him. The nerve of this *sshole! SignatureVictor M. Martinez Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM) Send your spam here: uce@ftc.gov Email me here: pistorLITTER@BOXaustin.rr.com >> What is it with these people? They think they can knock on your >> door and then try to tell you how to live? There's a reason I'm not >> into the whole organized religion thing. This just proves it. > > If it weren't a waste of perfectly good wine, I would have thrown the > contents of my glass at him. The nerve of this *sshole! I like the way you think, Victor! He was absolutely not worth the waste of a glass of wine :) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- From: "jmcquown" <jmcquown@bellsouth.net> >But he came over yesterday to ask if I wanted to attend his church. Maybe >attendance is down; who knows why he's trolling door to door trying to drum >up business. When I said no thank you, he started to argue with me. Ahem! >I didn't invite you over, would you please get off my patio? After years of trying to be polite to the door to door evangelists, I've found the perfect way to get rid of them. As soon as I know that they're pushing religion, I say three words. "I'm a Satanist". Then I get a trance-like, far away, look in my eyes and slowly reach out to touch their forehead. They leave REAL quick. Jehova's Witnesses will leave skid marks. Word must have gotten out because I haven't been bothered in several years. And for the record......No, I'm not really a Satanist. >As soon as I know that they're pushing religion, I say three words. >"I'm a Satanist". >Then I get a trance-like, far away, look in my eyes and slowly reach out to >touch their forehead. The record for getting rid of doorstep JW's has long been held by a friend of mine, Tasha. She was in her kitchen doing some chores when her doorbell went so she opened the door and this guy got as far as "Hi! We'd like to talk to... ." before the pair of them ran for it She'd been cutting up meat for her dogs at the time and without thinking answered the door holding a long knife and wearing rubber gloves bloodied to the elbows... Lesley Slave of the Fabulous Furballs >> As soon as I know that they're pushing religion, I say three words. >> "I'm a Satanist". [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Slave of the Fabulous Furballs Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on my way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give blood". As I looked at the needle in my arm I realised what they must have thought and laughed. SignatureAdrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera) Cats leave pawprints on your heart. http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on my > way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give blood". As I looked > at the needle in my arm I realised what they must have thought and laughed. And of course, one of the oddities of their beliefs is that that they don't BELIEVE in blood transfusions. (Or Christmas, or Easter, or Birthdays.....) I remember a divorce case back home (the wife was JW, the husband a neighbor boy I grew up with) in which the judge awarded him custody of his kids for all holidays, claiming that they were part of the heritage of ALL American children, and since the mother didn't believe in celebrating any of them, the choice was obvious. >> Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I >> was on my way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > that they don't BELIEVE in blood transfusions. (Or > Christmas, or Easter, or Birthdays.....) My middle brother dated a Jehovah's Witness for a time. She insisted she didn't believe in celebrating any of those holidays but boy did she get ticked off when he didn't buy her anything for her birthday! It's more the hypocrites that bother me more than anything else. Some of the (alleged) hard-core Baptists in the southern U.S. claim they don't believe in drinking or dancing. But back in the day when I used to go to clubs with my girlfriends you'd see these same people who railed against both out drinking and dancing! Jill > My middle brother dated a Jehovah's Witness for a time. She insisted she > didn't believe in celebrating any of those holidays but boy did she get [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Jill Some of the biggest wild childs i have ever seen is preachers kids they know hot to party >>> Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I >>> was on my way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > >Jill Jews don't recognize Jesus, Protestants don't recognize the Pope, and Baptists don't recognize each other in the liquor store. ;) Why don't Baptists have sex standing up? It could lead to dancing. What do you get when you cross a Jehovah's Witness with a Unitarian? Someone who rings your doorbell but isn't sure why. ;) Theresa Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh Make Levees, Not War > Jews don't recognize Jesus, Protestants don't recognize the Pope, and > Baptists don't recognize each other in the liquor store. ;) LOL! Never heard that one. I wish I could adapt it, though, to be "Yankees" (as in 'Old New England') don't recognize each other in the liquor store." SignatureRemember: It it To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> > > Jews don't recognize Jesus, Protestants don't recognize the Pope, and > > Baptists don't recognize each other in the liquor store. ;) > LOL! Never heard that one. I wish I could adapt it, though, to be "Yankees" > (as in 'Old New England') don't recognize each other in the liquor store." On Sunday. :) Joyce >>Jews don't recognize Jesus, Protestants don't recognize the Pope, and >>Baptists don't recognize each other in the liquor store. ;) > > LOL! Never heard that one. I wish I could adapt it, though, to be "Yankees" > (as in 'Old New England') don't recognize each other in the liquor store." And Episcopalians used to say (about themselves) "Where two or three are gathered together, you generally find a fifth" ;-) >>> Jews don't recognize Jesus, Protestants don't recognize the Pope, and >>> Baptists don't recognize each other in the liquor store. ;) [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > And Episcopalians used to say (about themselves) "Where two > or three are gathered together, you generally find a fifth" ;-) Oh, THAT one I can use! SignatureRemember: It is To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> > >> Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I > >> was on my way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Jill You've mentioned that several times over the years. It must really bug you, what other people are doing. Don't let them live rent-free in your head like that. Life's too short. :-) Sherry > It must really bug you, what other people are doing. Don't let them > live rent-free in your head like that. Life's too short. :-) Oh, I love that! My dad (with his abusive criticisms) has been living in my head rent-free for over 50 years. Time for that eviction notice. Joyce >> It's more the hypocrites that bother me more than anything else. >> Some of the (alleged) hard-core Baptists in the southern U.S. claim [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > like that. Life's too > short. :-) Actually, it doesn't bug me what they are *doing*. It bugs me what they rail against in the name of religion and then blatantly ignore it when it comes to their own actions. I'd feel the same way about a cat or dog owner who claimed to love animals but then mistreated their own. >> You've mentioned that several times over the years. It must really bug >> you, what [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > comes to their own actions. I'd feel the same way about a cat or dog owner > who claimed to love animals but then mistreated their own. They're still parked rent-free in your head if you let them bug you. It's their problem if their actions don't match up to their stated ideals. You don't need to make it yours. SignatureCheryl > >> You've mentioned that several times over the years. It must really bug > >> you, what [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > comes to their own actions. I'd feel the same way about a cat or dog owner > > who claimed to love animals but then mistreated their own. > They're still parked rent-free in your head if you let them bug you. > It's their problem if their actions don't match up to their stated > ideals. You don't need to make it yours. Well, except that a lot of religious people want to dictate social policy. I won't get specific, because, as I'm sure we're all aware, many of those issues are pretty controversial, and I know folks here don't like controversy. However, when the religious right has clout with our current administration (as well as having local clout in cities, counties, states, etc.), then their "railing" against behaviors becomes more than mere railing - it becomes the law. Or it's always in danger of becoming law. Or they prevent some outmoded laws from being overturned. And then it affects what I can and cannot do - and that *is* my business. I'm not talking about drinking and dancing at this point, except that the same people who rail against that have in fact managed to make life a lot harder for people who just want to be themselves and live the way they want. If all those folks ever did was sit in their backyards and rant, that would be fine. They can do that. They can be hypocrites, too, if they like. But if they try to mess with my life, and *then* they're hypocrites on top of it - well, I can understand why that annoys Jill. Though I still like the metaphor of certain people living in my head rent-free. The ones who make the most trouble in my head aren't religious zealots, generally. Joyce On Jun 8, 7:41 pm, jXwXeXrXmXoX...@sonic.net wrote: > > jmcquown <jmcqu...@bellsouth.net> wrote: > > > Sherry wrote: [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > Joyce Ohhh... I think I see what you're saying. And even at a local level, particularly in a small town, any particular demonination can have a huge influence on city ordinances, etc. etc. and yes, when a denomination gets too much political influence on the way a town is run, I don't like it either. Or the way the country is run. But they don't live rent-free in my head either. My father is also my main tenant. LOL. I'm past 50 now. When does it end? Sherry > > jmcquown <jmcquown@bellsouth.net> wrote: > > > Sherry wrote: [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > behaviors > becomes more than mere railing - it becomes the law. Yeah, then we go back to the old Blue Laws, some of which are still prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but *only after 12Noon*... that's after most of the church services let out. Doesn't matter which religion, but heaven forbid someone buy a beer before noon on a Sunday! Since when do they have the right to dictate the law saying when I can buy beer? What if I worked the night shift and their morning was my evening? So I'd get off work at 6AM, which to most people would be like 6PM, and want to buy a beer? Can't do it, sorry. It might offend some people! I can recall when retail stores like J.C. Penney and Sears couldn't open before noon on Sundays. It was apparently unChristian to go shopping for clothes or whatnot while church services were going on. Oh puleeeeze! What if I'm Jewish? Sunday isn't the Sabbath! >> Or it's always > in danger of becoming law. Or they prevent some outmoded laws from > being overturned. And then it affects what I can and cannot do - and > that *is* my business. Yep. Definitely. I don't want people with these religious convictions dictating what I can and cannot do *by law*. They have no right to assume I believe as they do. > I'm not talking about drinking and dancing at this point, except that > the same people who rail against that have in fact managed to make [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > hypocrites > on top of it - well, I can understand why that annoys Jill. Thank you! > Though I still like the metaphor of certain people living in my head > rent-free. The ones who make the most trouble in my head aren't > religious zealots, generally. > > Joyce The ones that trouble my head aren't normally religious zealots, either. This was just an example of someone stepping onto my property then criticizing me. I didn't invite the man over, he just showed up. And I'd told him two years ago I wasn't interested in attending his church. That should have been enough. Jill > On Jun 9, 2007, jmcquown wrote: > I can recall when retail stores like J.C. Penney and Sears couldn't open > before noon on Sundays. You baby, you! I can remember when NO STORES could open on Sunday. Go back to your crib! :-P SignatureRemember: It is To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> >> On Jun 9, 2007, jmcquown wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > You baby, you! I can remember when NO STORES could open on Sunday. Go > back to your crib! :-P LOL Actually, I remember that too, but I was too young to want to go shopping then (or to try to earn a living working in a retail store as a woman of 18) :-P > jXwXeXrXmXoX...@sonic.net wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but *only > after 12Noon*... that's after most of the church services let out. snipped Jill Oh, that's too funny. I think it's kind of archaeic that we still have laws that force liquor stores to close on election day. That one honestly should be repealed, IMO. It isn't fair to the business owner to lose a day's business over an out-dated law. Maybe if some of us went to the polls drunk...well...it probably couldn't get much worse. :-) Sherry Sherry I think it's kind of archaeic that we still have > laws that force liquor stores to close on election day. LOL!!! We don't have that one over here.... Given what we currently have on offer politically speaking, making it impossible to drown your sorrows after voting would count as a "cruel and unusual punishment" under the Geneva Convention Lesley Slave of the Fabulous Furballs > I think it's kind of archaeic that we still have >> laws that force liquor stores to close on election day. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > impossible to drown your sorrows after voting would count as a "cruel > and unusual punishment" under the Geneva Convention Well in fairness, we had good reason to close the bars on election day. First off that was where we held the elections. And secondly, if the bars were open, votes were paid for with drinks. So we had to close the bars so decent people could go into the building to vote, and to attempt to keep it honest. Jo >> jXwXeXrXmXoX...@sonic.net wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > Sherry What's nuts about that law is the liquor stores have to close on election day but they can still pour plenty of booze in restaurants and bars! And what's to stop a person from getting all liquored up at home then going to vote? There are a few holidays where the liquor stores are forced to close by law, or so I was told by the proprietor of the store I shop in. Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving (?????!), Christmas and New Years Day. Notice New Years Eve isn't mentioned, nor Christmas Eve. You can get as drunk as you want to those nights :-P I suppose for Independence Day they expect you already stocked up for the picnic/grilling that will take place. Me, I like ice cold lemonade on those hot summer days... at least until after 12PM ;) And Labor Day? Come on, it's a day off from work about work! Jill > There are a few holidays where the liquor stores are forced to close by law, > or so I was told by the proprietor of the store I shop in. Independence > Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving (?????!), Christmas and New Years Day. I think that varies from state to state - I've never (in recent years - it was different when I was a kid) encountered food or liquor stores that were closed on ANY of those days. (Although they may be so by choice - especially New Years - simply because they don't expect enough business for it to be economic to stay open.) On 10 Jun, 09:45, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" <evgm...@earthlink.net> wrote: - I've never (in > recent years - it was different when I was a kid) When I was a kid (ie the Dark Ages) everything seemed to shut for a week at Xmas. I remember mum and dad getting huge amounts of things like bread in because the baker would be closed and gallons of milk and everything My mum never got used to the idea that things would be open on Xmas day, every year she would insist on giving me several bags of food, she could deal with the idea that having left home I was able to shop for things most of the year but she seemed to think I would forget everything was closed at Xmas! Actually our local grocers/general store etc is open Xmas day for a few hours. They even have a little party, lay on free mince pies and hand out raffle tickets to regular customers. One year the owner greeted people with a small brandy to go with the mince pies and if you are a regular (as I am been using it since long before the current management came) then with great ceremony you get handed a wrapped present (usually wine) Pubs are allowed to be open for a few hours in the afternoon but not in the evening but over the last few years most pubs including my home from home "The Bow Bells" have had a system where if you're a regular, Xmas evening you can knock on the window and be let in (I remember one very eccentric local landlord who never opened Xmas day afternoon but only in the evening. He reckoned it suited everyone, he and his wife got their Xmas dinner in good time with their family and by the evening a lot of people were so tired of their families and all the festive cheer that they wanted to go out for a few hours- certainly it was a quiet pub but on Xmas day in the evening it was packed!) Lesley Slave of the Fabulous Furballs > Pubs are allowed to be open for a few hours in the afternoon but not > in the evening but over the last few years most pubs including my home [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > festive cheer that they wanted to go out for a few hours- certainly it > was a quiet pub but on Xmas day in the evening it was packed!) In our family, it was traditional to see a first-run movie matinee, after mid-day holiday dinners. (That's when we were kids, of course - also most of the adults did not drink, and the neighborhood "pub" was never the established tradition here that it is in the UK.) > In our family, it was traditional to see a first-run movie > matinee, after mid-day holiday dinners. (That's when we > were kids, of course - also most of the adults did not > drink, and the neighborhood "pub" was never the established > tradition here that it is in the UK.) We never went anywhere on holidays - they were strictly for families at home. Next day, you'd probably start on the visiting of friends, and any movies or bars (never when we were children) or restaurants would come later in the season. I still do much the same thing. I don't go out and about the day itself at all, really, aside from attending church. I like the special-ness of NOT having to go out - particularly not having to go shopping, which I consider at best a tedious chore. SignatureCheryl > We never went anywhere on holidays - they were strictly for families at > home. Next day, you'd probably start on the visiting of friends, That was the same when I was a kid. Xmas Day was immediate family only (parents, kids, grandparents and later on a couple of great aunts who didn't have any family other than their sister my nan (One of them lost her fiance in the war- when I was young and stupid I used to think that was romantic so my dad would pick them up for Xmas dinner) Then Boxing Day was "open house" for friends, other relatives, neighbours etc (I still do this myself through not last Xmas for obvious reasons- I get some food and drinks in and pretty much from 12.00 until midnight or later people drop in and out or stay for the whole day, end up staying the night and get greeted the next morning with breakfast and a "request" to help with cleaning up) then in the evening we would have a family party either at my parents or at my aunt Iris and uncle Roy's place, Lesley Slave of the Fabulous Furballs >>In our family, it was traditional to see a first-run movie >>matinee, after mid-day holiday dinners. (That's when we [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > We never went anywhere on holidays - they were strictly for families at > home. You must remember that I grew up during the "Great Depression", so movies (especially first-run movies) were a very special treat, not something we did regularly. (And of course, that was a long time before TV - we got our first set when I was a senior in college, and we were certainly not among the last to do so.) > Yeah, then we go back to the old Blue Laws, some of which are still > prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but *only [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > 6PM, and want to buy a beer? Can't do it, sorry. It might offend some > people! Be glad you don't live where you can't buy any sort of booze at ALL on Sunday! (Or much of anything else.) I think there are still states where you can only buy it from a stated-owned liquor store (which means no sociable "neighborhood pubs"). > I can recall when retail stores like J.C. Penney and Sears couldn't open > before noon on Sundays. It was apparently unChristian to go shopping for > clothes or whatnot while church services were going on. Oh puleeeeze! What > if I'm Jewish? Sunday isn't the Sabbath! Only since the 1950's have any stores at ALL been open on Sundays in most of the U.S. (Except for a few prescription pharmacies.) If you needed something urgently - milk or whatever - tough! SFAIK, it had less to do with religion than with the idea that everyone should have at least one day a week they didn't have to work! (Thus no working around staggered schedules, when you wanted to get together with friends.) >> Yeah, then we go back to the old Blue Laws, some of which are still >> prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > around staggered schedules, when you wanted to get together > with friends.) We used to have some very strange Sunday trading laws in the UK, it was illegal to buy books but not magazines, so you could buy a copy of Playboy for example but not a copy of the bible. SignatureAdrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera) Cats leave pawprints on your heart. http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk >>> Yeah, then we go back to the old Blue Laws, some of which are still >>> prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > illegal to buy books but not magazines, so you could buy a copy of Playboy > for example but not a copy of the bible. It got fairly odd here when they were getting rid of the blue laws as well. There was even a point where you could buy beer on Sunday, but not milk. Jo >> Yeah, then we go back to the old Blue Laws, some of which are still >> prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > stated-owned liquor store (which means no sociable > "neighborhood pubs"). (snippage) There are still "dry counties" not far from where I live. They don't sell booze of any kind, any time. There is invariably a liquor store right across the county line and all those tax dollars march right across it, too. I can't remember which art show we were doing, we were driving back and on one side of the railroad tracks liquor was legal, the other side it wasn't. They even had a bar with a line painted down the middle - one side was the drinking side, the other side was the non-drinking side, because it sat right in the middle of one of those drink/no drink counties. LOL Guess which side had more customers? Jill > I can't remember which art show we were doing, we were driving back and on > one side of the railroad tracks liquor was legal, the other side it wasn't. Very similar. In Camden in London there is a road (I think it may be Camden High Street) where one side of the road comes under the Borough of Camden and the other under the Borough of Westminster. Camden did not allow people to drink alcohol out of cans or bottles in public but Westminster didn't have any such rules at the time (they may have changed. A lot of local councils have bye-laws against this- thankfully ours doesn't since as we don't have a back garden (it belongs to the flat downstairs, the family that used to live in it had no problem with us sitting on the back steps but the people there now complain, which is a pity, I have some lovely memories of Fugazi (RB) sniffing the flowers out there- it had a good high fence to keep her in and as she wasn't an outdoor cat she never ventured far from where we were sitting and as soon as we got up to go in, she was at the door before we were) and our flat gets very hot, Dave and me have from time to time been so hot we have taken a couple of cans of cold beer and sat on the front steps or the front garden wall to cool down. It annoys the people downstairs through) anyway I digress - apparently the Camden side was quiet and the Westminster side was packed. The irony I am told was there was a very cheap off licence of the Camden side much patronised by those who think a Carlsberg Special Brew is an acceptable breakfast (I think its only acceptable poured down the nearest sink!) and they would run out of there with their purchases and stand right on the line in the middle of the road and open the can and have a drink It was claimed the police used to watch the more unsteady one's doing that to see if they would stagger backwards and thus be breaking the law but I don't know if that;s true and I hope it isn't since the police have better things to do with their time Lesley Slave of the Fabulous Furballs >>>Yeah, then we go back to the old Blue Laws, some of which are still >>>prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > right in the middle of one of those drink/no drink counties. LOL Guess > which side had more customers? When I was young, I lived for a while in Council Bluffs, Iowa. (Iowa was then a dry state - I don't know whether it still is, we're talking nearly fifty years ago.) Since Ohaha, Nebraska (NOT a dry state) was right across the river from Council Bluffs, the city fathers had relaxed the rules a bit. Although they were theoretically only for dancing, there were a number of places in Council Bluffs where you COULD buy drinks when you went out for the evening. That's OMaha, Nebraska, of course! (I have dyslexic fingers.) >>>> Yeah, then we go back to the old Blue Laws, some of which are still >>>> prevalent where I live. For example, I can buy beer on Sunday but [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > there were a number of places in Council Bluffs where you COULD buy > drinks when you went out for the evening. > It's more the hypocrites that bother me more than anything else. Some of > the (alleged) hard-core Baptists in the southern U.S. claim they don't > believe in drinking or dancing. But back in the day when I used to go to > clubs with my girlfriends you'd see these same people who railed against > both out drinking and dancing! LOL! For several years I was alto soloist for First Baptist Church of Los Angeles (definitely NOT "Southern" Baptist). I was on quite friendly terms with the choirmaster (a fellow-Episcopalian), who was also the church business manager. Like me, he was under the impression Baptists don't drink, until he accepted a dinner invitation from one pillar of the church. According to him, the first words out of his host's mouth when he walked in the door were "What will you drink, scotch, bourbon or a Martini?" (And of course, several of us used to meet for supper before the weekly choir rehearsal - at a neighborhood barbecue place that served the biggest vodka gimlets in the city!) >> Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I >> was on my way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > since the mother didn't believe in celebrating any of them, > the choice was obvious. That's what made me laugh later, I wasn't thinking when I said it. SignatureAdrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera) Cats leave pawprints on your heart. http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk >> Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on >> my [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > And of course, one of the oddities of their beliefs is that that they > don't BELIEVE in blood transfusions. That's right, no blood products can be used. The department I work for occasionally has to take a child "into care" in theory if their parents are JW and refuse such treatment in life-threatening circumstances. We are alerted by the hospital, we apply for a court order immediately, become temporary guardians and agree the treatment. Once the child is well again, we revoke the order, unless of course there are other concerns. Mostly the JW parents are glad this happened. Their child is saved and their religious belief is not compromised. Tweed >>> Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on >>> my [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Tweed That was always the reason I gave for not listening to the JW lessons. I know perfectly well what I would do if I or my child needed blood. No point into getting committed to a belief system I'm not going to follow. Jo > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on my > way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give blood". As I looked > at the needle in my arm I realised what they must have thought and laughed. Wait - you were on your way to go give blood, and you *already* had the needle in your arm? <scratches head> Confused, Joyce > > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on > > my [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Confused, > Joyce I thought the same thing, but now I realize that as she looked at the needle while she was at the center donating blood, did she realize what she said and to whom! > > > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on > > > my [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Confused, > > Joyce > I thought the same thing, but now I realize that as she looked at the needle > while she was at the center donating blood, did she realize what she said > and to whom! I see, he (this was Adrian) didn't have this thought until later... got it! However, I'm still confused. How else does one interpret "give blood"? Joyce > > > > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I > > > > was on [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Joyce Where I'm from, it means to donate blood/serum for hospitals (or the Red Cross) to use during surgery, or for blood transfusions. >> However, I'm still confused. How else does one interpret "give blood"? > Where I'm from, it means to donate blood/serum for hospitals (or the Red > Cross) to use during surgery, or for blood transfusions. Same here. But I didn't know why that should be offensive, until I read in another post that JW's don't believe in blood transfusions. I didn't know that. Joyce > >> However, I'm still confused. How else does one interpret "give blood"? > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > in another post that JW's don't believe in blood transfusions. I didn't > know that. Or any sort of transplant surgery, they believe that you've got what you've got and if it breaks, then it must be God's Will so we shouldn't try and fix it. I daresay frown on boob jobs as well :-) SignatureNik Simpson > I see, he (this was Adrian) didn't have this thought until later... got it! > > However, I'm still confused. How else does one interpret "give blood"? > > Joyce I believe the significance is that the JWs believe that blood transfusions are sinful or evil or some such. >> I see, he (this was Adrian) didn't have this thought until later... >> got it! [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I believe the significance is that the JWs believe that blood > transfusions are sinful or evil or some such. They believe god should do the healing (or not) without any interference from humans. Unless they are all home-schooled, however, I find it hard to believe they can gain admittance to any public (and probably even private) schools without having the necessary immunizations against TB, polio, measles, mumps, etc. They read Acts 15:20 which says to abstain from anything strangled, or blood. It's been years since I read that chapter, but my memory is that the chapter is talking about animal sacrifices. and also talking about extracting revenge from your enemies. I couldn't see anything about medical transfusions. SignatureChristopher A. Young You can't shout down a troll. You have to starve them. . : > I see, he (this was Adrian) didn't have this thought until later... got it! : > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] : I believe the significance is that the JWs believe that blood : transfusions are sinful or evil or some such. >> I see, he (this was Adrian) didn't have this thought until later... got >> it! [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > I believe the significance is that the JWs believe that blood > transfusions are sinful or evil or some such. JW's base their beliefs on avoiding blood transfusions, and indeed, anything related to blood, on the following passages of the Bible: Acts 15:29 "That ye abstain...from blood..." Acts 21:25 "...Gentiles...keep themselves from things offered to idols and from blood..." I don't agree with their interpretation, but can see how they got their beliefs. Yowie >>> I see, he (this was Adrian) didn't have this thought until later... got >>> it! [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > I don't agree with their interpretation, but can see how they got their > beliefs. Yes, so can I. However we have moved on since two thousand years ago. As adults, they can choose, but their children can't. So what a good thing that the children can be saved if they need blood products by the local authority intervening. Tweed > > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on my > > way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give blood". As I looked [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Confused, > Joyce How does this work: "As I looked at the needle in my arm [later, while giving blood] I realised what they must have thought and laughed." But I *like* the idea of self-starting on that. Might save time at the donation site if everyone showed up already needled. :-) SignatureRemember: It is To Laugh <http://tinyurl.com/2a5u8b> >> > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I >> was on my > way out, I said "I can't stop now I'm on my way to give [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > But I *like* the idea of self-starting on that. Might save time at the > donation site if everyone showed up already needled. :-) I might suggest that next time I go, in August, but I don't think they'll take up the idea. ;-) SignatureAdrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera) Cats leave pawprints on your heart. http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk >> > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was >> on [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > But I *like* the idea of self-starting on that. Might save time at the > donation site if everyone showed up already needled. :-) LOL! I like your humour, Joey. Humor if you prefer.. Tweed > > Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I was on > > my [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Confused, > Joyce I took it that when Adrian finally had the needle in his arm to give blood, he realised what he had said to the JW's earlier. Tweed >>> Talking of JW's, a few years ago a couple knocked at my door as I >>> was on my [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Tweed Correct, just because my posts make sense to me doesn't mean they make sense to others. ;-) SignatureAdrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera) Cats leave pawprints on your heart. http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk > After years of trying to be po |
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