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I gave away my cats, I'm heartbroken

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223rem - 02 Jun 2007 01:39 GMT
I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
want and in fact they spend more time outdoors than indoors. They love
to roam, climb trees, hunt, etc. They'd probably go nuts if  confined
in an apartment.

To my surprise, my landlord, who always pets my cats when he rans into
them, offered to take my cats and 'give them a good home' in a barn on
his 50 acre farm. They'll probably become "barn cats"! This guy is a
honorable man, he's proven that many times, so he'll keep his promise.

Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
What would you have done in my place?
MaryL - 02 Jun 2007 02:27 GMT
>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
> What would you have done in my place?

Well, since you asked for opinions, I will give you mine.  Yes, I think you
were wrong.  I would *never* give up my cats.  They are family, just like
children -- and very few people would give up children.  Cats are not
disposable objects!  Moreover, I have been through a number of "moving days"
when I had to find an apartment that would accept cats.  I had to give up on
many apartments that I really would have liked simply because of adamant "no
pets" policies.  I no longer have to worry about that because I own my home,
but *my* policy during the days when I was renting was "accept my cats, or I
look elsewhere."  Incidentally, cats adjust *very* well to apartment living.
All you need to do is provide lots of toys, attention, scratching posts, and
a climbing surface (such as a cat tree).  Barn cats usually do not receive
the type of attention that you have probably been giving your cats.  They
also usually have a shorter lifespan than indoor cats -- less nutrition,
vulnerable to predators, traffic (even in a rural area), etc.  Your landlord
may have good intentions, but do you really think he will monitor their
health, take them to a vet on a regular basis, provide good quality food
(and not take the attitude that they can "catch their own food"), groom
them, give them attention, and all the other little things that you have
probably done without even thinking about it.  So, my opinion is that you
should try to retrieve these kitties, take them with you, and provide the
type of indoor space that will give them a healthy and happy environment
without needing to go outdoors.  Personally, I think it will also make *you*
happier since you said you are heartbroken over this decision.

MaryL
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 02 Jun 2007 03:24 GMT
"223rem" <223remi@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I
> wrong? What would you have done in my place?

223rem, I can't tell you whether you will regret your decision or not,
because those are *your* feelings. But I think your decision was made
with your cats' best interests at heart. They love to go outdoors and
play in trees, grass, dirt. They would never get that in the city. If
you were to let them outside in that environment, they could easily get
hurt or killed. So you'd have to keep them confined, and I agree with
you that that would be terrible for them after what they've been used to.

Cats are not humans. That doesn't mean that their lives matter less
than human lives, but it does mean that they have *different needs*.
Different species, different needs: what a concept! Cats, unlike human
children, are not traumatized for life by a change of human caretaker
(as long as the new caretaker is also loving and responsible). It's an
adjustment, sure. But they will adjust. Pretty much every cat I've ever
had came from someplace else, and they've all adjusted happily to me.

Pets are family, and should be treated as family. But that doesn't mean
that everyone in your family is treated exactly the same. Different
choices are appropriate for different individuals and different situations.
You are doing the responsible thing by making sure that your cats are
going into a good person's hands, someone who will take good care of
them. Sometimes that is the best thing you can do under the circumstances.

The "pet adoption is FOREVER" concept is a valid response to the fact
that so many people think that animals can just be abandoned anywhere at
any time, with no thought about the animal's needs or its future, due
to callousness or ignorance or just plain stupidity. And I do think a
lifetime commitment should be the *intention* when adopting a pet. One
shouldn't go into it with the attitude of, "I'll take this pet now, and
if I get sick of it, I can always give it away." If that's a person's
attitude, then they're not ready for a pet.

But - stuff happens. Things you weren't expecting can put your ability
to care for your pets on shaky ground. Sometimes the best thing you can
do is to find a more stable home for your pets. For god's sake, some
people are forced to give up their *children* because of unforseen
circumstances, and that has more far-reaching consequences than giving
your pet to a new, loving caretaker.

And if you change your mind and decide you can't part with them after
all, then I support you in that, too. It's a very tough choice, and I
don't envy you.

Purrs,
Joyce
jofirey - 02 Jun 2007 03:30 GMT
> "223rem" <223remi@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I
> > wrong? What would you have done in my place?

And I'm reminded why I blocked you in the first place.  Just trying to upset
everyone.
Kreisleriana - 02 Jun 2007 11:57 GMT
>> "223rem" <223remi@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>And I'm reminded why I blocked you in the first place.  Just trying to upset
>everyone.

Isn't this the guy who posted pics of what his cats killed?  

Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh

Make Levees, Not War
MaryL - 02 Jun 2007 15:29 GMT
>>> "223rem" <223remi@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> Make Levees, Not War

Uh, oh.  I missed that (which would have led to an entirely different
reaction on my part).  Thanks.

MaryL
jmcquown - 02 Jun 2007 03:42 GMT
>> I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 39 lines]
>
> MaryL

I agree with you, Mary.

Jill
jmcquown - 02 Jun 2007 10:40 GMT
>> I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 39 lines]
>
> MaryL

This has nothing to do with a gmail block... I blocked 223 a long time ago
because he obviously doesn't give a crap about cats.  This just proves it.
He's not heartbroken.  It's all about HIM, not about the cats.  I hope 223
gets to go live in a barn.  Grrrrrr.

Jill
MaryL - 02 Jun 2007 15:38 GMT
>>> I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 46 lines]
>
> Jill

Thanks, Jill.  I had not picked up on that.  I just did a brief google
search and found a message where this person said he *left his cats alone
for four weeks* but they were "fine" when he returned.  Another message said
"Should have put the cat in the car with birdie" when someone wrote about a
sparrow getting into the car.  Grrrrr is right.  Those cats didn't have a
home, they had an occasional place to visit.

MaryL
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 02 Jun 2007 19:16 GMT
> Thanks, Jill.  I had not picked up on that.  I just did a brief google
> search and found a message where this person said he *left his cats alone
> for four weeks* but they were "fine" when he returned.  Another message said
> "Should have put the cat in the car with birdie" when someone wrote about a
> sparrow getting into the car.  Grrrrr is right.  Those cats didn't have a
> home, they had an occasional place to visit.

In which case, status as barn cats might be a step UP for them!

> MaryL
jmcquown - 02 Jun 2007 23:03 GMT
>> Thanks, Jill.  I had not picked up on that.  I just did a brief
>> google search and found a message where this person said he *left
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> In which case, status as barn cats might be a step UP for them!

At least they'll be away from him!
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 02 Jun 2007 23:28 GMT
Thanks for not excommunicating from this newsgroup (via killfiling) for
my comments about giving away cats. OK, so everyone ignored my post, but
at least I'm still included in other discussions!

On second reading, I can see why people are upset about cats being given
away to someone who will keep them as barn cats. I think that if you must
give away your cats, then you need to be responsible about it and find
them a good home where they will be loved and well cared-for. This doesn't
sound like a great situation for them, I have to agree.

I do think that giving away your pets is something you should try to
avoid if at all possible. But sometimes it can't be avoided, and I don't
think that's "wrong". I do feel quite strongly that there are situations
where it is actually better for the animals to be rehomed to stable and
loving people, if you can no longer provide that for them.

I personally am not considering re-homing any of my cats, in case
anyone was wondering! If Smudge and Licky were regularly drawing blood
from each other, and making life miserable for each other and the rest
of us - and if I'd tried everything to change the situation and nothing
worked - I might have to seek a new home for one of them. But I'm not
even close to that point, and never have been.

Which reminds me, the Feliway seems to be working nicely on the general
atmosphere around here. No, there's no cuddling and grooming going on
between the sworn enemies, but the growling and hissing is greatly
reduced, I haven't heard any actual fights at all, and I'm no longer
waking up to find tufts of Smudge fur strewn on the living room rug. So,
a definite improvement!

Joyce
mlbriggs - 03 Jun 2007 01:30 GMT
On Sat, 02 Jun 2007 22:28:43 +0000, jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt wrote:

> Thanks for not excommunicating from this newsgroup (via killfiling) for
> my comments about giving away cats. OK, so everyone ignored my post, but
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
>
> Joyce

Well, I have 844 unread posts.  This one prompted  me to look up the post
you referred to.  I cannot do anything but agree with you.  All of my cats
were either strays or re-homed cats.   Don't feel your posts are ignored.
There just seems to be so many to read recently and it is hard to keep up.
Best wishes for a peaceful household.   MLB
Marina - 03 Jun 2007 04:29 GMT
> Which reminds me, the Feliway seems to be working nicely on the general
> atmosphere around here. No, there's no cuddling and grooming going on
> between the sworn enemies, but the growling and hissing is greatly
> reduced, I haven't heard any actual fights at all, and I'm no longer
> waking up to find tufts of Smudge fur strewn on the living room rug. So,
> a definite improvement!

That's great news! I still haven't asked my sister about her cats and
the Feliway. She's on the island now with them for a few days.

Signature

Marina, Miranda and Caliban. In loving memory of Frank and Nikki.

Pat - 02 Jun 2007 03:38 GMT
|I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
| apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
| Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
| What would you have done in my place?

I brought 7 cats from a very isolated farm where they were always free to
roam (and worry me half to death in spite of no traffic) to a house in town.
It's a small town, but it still has traffic, so they've been kept indoors
(almost 18 months now) ever since. I was really afraid they would not adapt
to being housecats, but it's not been that bad - except on my budget, since
now I have to provide all of their food and they can't use the great
outdoors for a litterbox, and cat litter is expensive.

Before I moved I considered giving one of them to the woman who was moving
in behind me, but she didn't want another cat. I also would have given him
to the owner of the farm, but she didn't want another cat either. This cat
was my biggest worry about having to stay indoors because he likes to chase
and fight with some of the younger ones. But thanks to Feliway (which I used
for the first six months or so in the house), everyone has learned to get
along pretty well.

The one troublesome cat is also the one who seems to miss being outside the
most, but he loves his meowmie and seems to understand. He gets tons more
attention from me now than he did on the farm. They all do, really, because
now they're around me constantly.

I'm trying to finish putting up a fence around the back yard with a charged
wire on the top to keep them from going over it. Then they will at least get
to be outside. It won't be like it was on the farm, but will be better than
having to stay in 100% of the time.

I would not have moved to an apartment even if I could have found one that
would accept so many cats, because I can't stand apartments, and buying a
house around here is cheaper than renting an apartment, and I've simply got
to have a garden, and the cats have to be able to go outside eventually, if
only in a small area.

Bottom line, the cats are my family, and I won't part with any of them
unless I am desperate (which I really am, money-wise) and absolutely certain
that they would have as good or better care and love from their new slave as
they get from me. Also, I would not let go of one that would be greatly
missed by any of the others. For instance, if I had to thin out the clowder,
I wouldn't give away Abelard or Beatrice because they are best friends, like
Baby Eyes and Tommy are. I could let Billy and Lily go together, because
neither of them are attached to any of the others, and they are littermates.
I would miss them terribly, but if I knew where they were and that they were
happy and their new slave was devoted to them, I could do it, but only
because I'm so strapped for money.

If I was in your position I would question the prospective new slave very
closely. I don't know how many cats are involved or what the barn situation
is like, or how strongly attached to you the cats are. Chances are if you
let them go, and it's a good situation, they'll adapt to it quicker than
you'll adapt to being without them.

I wish the best for all concerned.
Sherry - 02 Jun 2007 03:46 GMT
> I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
> What would you have done in my place?

Well, since you asked, no, I would not have done what you did. I would
have
first given the cats a chance to adjust to the new apartment, and if
they didn't (most of
them do)....then I'd have looked at homing them to another indoor-
outdoor place.
I have to tell you, Mother Nature is hard on barn cats.
Also, I hope that you clarified the definition of "giving them a good
home as a
barn cat." Some people are under the impression that barn cats are
completely
self-reliant, and that's just not true. They still ahve to be fed
daily, and have
fresh water daily. They still get sick and have to be vetted.
I don't mean to sound critical, but it just makes me sad that you
couldn't find
a way to keep them. I do hope they make out okay.

Sherry
Matthew - 02 Jun 2007 04:28 GMT
>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
> What would you have done in my place?

I would have never gave up my furballs.   I made a point years ago in my
marriage  she would go before the cats  and out she went
Rhonda - 02 Jun 2007 07:38 GMT
Go back and get them. Barn cats do not live long lives. They are on the
farm to do a job -- not be pampered or loved.

If the humans remember to feed them, that's a good day, but otherwise
they are considered workers who need to keep down the rodent population
(and sometimes starve trying.)

Also, the cats will have lots of itchy fleas and probably vet care only
if they have an open wound that is noticed.

Barns do not provide much comfort. They get incredibly cold.

Go get them and take care of them. They will adjust to your new life,
just as you will.

Rhonda

> I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
> What would you have done in my place?
Debbie Wilson - 02 Jun 2007 09:57 GMT
> To my surprise, my landlord, who always pets my cats when he rans into
> them, offered to take my cats and 'give them a good home' in a barn on
> his 50 acre farm. They'll probably become "barn cats"! This guy is a
> honorable man, he's proven that many times, so he'll keep his promise.

If your cats are used to getting fed by you, and having access to indoor
comforts and attention to their health, they won't do very well as barn
cats. Will he feed them daily - twice daily as they are used to?  What
happens in winter? Will he make sure they are free of fleas, wormed,
taken to the vet if they get hurt? It sounds unlikely to me, if he is
takiing them as barn cats and not pets. His intentions are well-meaning,
but I think it's going to be very tough on your guys.
Most so-called barn cats are already semi-feral, which yours aren't. As
others have said, it's a hard life, and I personally think you should
get your cats back and take them with you. Yes, they will be wanting to
go out badly at first in the new place, but you must be firm and not
give in - they will adapt in time, and if you give them lots of
attention and active play, they will be fine. You can give them climbing
space by getting big cat climbing trees for them, and stimulate the
hunting response with lots of play. Does the new apartment allow pets?

Just my 2p-worth -

Deb.
Signature

http://www.scientific-art.com

"He looked a fierce and quarrelsome cat, but claw he never would;
He only bit the ones he loved, because they tasted good." S. Greenfield

223rem - 02 Jun 2007 11:00 GMT
Thanks for the feedback everyone.

I may have use the term barn cats incorrectly; my cats may kill mice,
but they only eat cat food. My landlord knows that.  He also mentioned
that the cats will be housed together with his puppies.
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 02 Jun 2007 19:14 GMT
> Thanks for the feedback everyone.
>
> I may have use the term barn cats incorrectly; my cats may kill mice,
> but they only eat cat food. My landlord knows that.  He also mentioned
> that the cats will be housed together with his puppies.

Oh swell!  (I'm sure the cats will be overjoyed!)
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 02 Jun 2007 19:08 GMT
> I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
> What would you have done in my place?

Depends upon how many cats we're talking about!  If you have
a lot of them, that may be a better solution than just
taking two or three with you (which is rather like deciding
which of your children to give up).  However, My cats have
mostly been indoor/outdoor when they could be.  When forced
to become indoor only, they've always adapted very well.
(Except for Melisande's tendency to try to escape whenever I
open the door.)

Remember, a healthy cat sleeps eighteen to twenty hours a
day.  If they have food and water available, and plenty of
toys to keep them amused, they really don't have that much
unoccupied time to fill!  (And of course, I wouldn't even
CONSIDER an apartment that would not allow cats!)
Christina Websell - 06 Jun 2007 23:49 GMT
>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Well, I accepted his offer, and now I'm extremely sad... Was I wrong?
> What would you have done in my place?

I don't what your situation is that causes you to move from where you can
have your cats to where you can't.
I only know when I split from my ex years ago, I fought tooth and nail to
keep this place as at the time (we) had 11 dogs.
I won in the end but it cost me every penny I had in legal fees.  So my
answer is I didn't abandon my pets.

Tweed
wafflycat - 07 Jun 2007 12:53 GMT
>>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
>
> Tweed

Not everyone is able to do that, though, Tweed. I can utterly understand the
poster being sad, but has done the right thing in the circumstances *as
described* by finding suitable alternative arrangements for the cats. I'd
hate to be in the position of the OP: I'd be devastated, and there but for
the grace of ... insert name of deity of choice.
Adrian A - 07 Jun 2007 13:07 GMT
>>> I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> I'd be devastated, and there but for the grace of ... insert name of
> deity of choice.

Good to see you posting again, Helen, I was wondering how you were doing.
Signature

Adrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart.
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk

wafflycat - 07 Jun 2007 13:31 GMT
> Good to see you posting again, Helen, I was wondering how you were doing.

Ta, Adrian.

I'm fine. Vernon is fine.

Nathan is injured - he came off his bike at a road race (Lotus circuit -
closed roads) when another rider locked handlebars with him - then went up
over the bars and barrel-rolled at about 30mph. Bruised noggin (shattered
lid), broken shoulderblade, haemotoma on hip the size of a melon and acres
of road rash. All down his right-side and he spent two days his horse
spittal. Guess who starts his A-levels on Monday and guess who can't write?
No prizes for guessing the correct answer.. I'm spending a lot of time out
on my bike, as I'm doing the Dunwich Dynamo at the end of July. It's a 200km
night ride from Hackney out to the coast at Dunwich, so I get out as much as
possible to get training miles in so I can last the distance!

Felines ruling the homestead as is their right. Waffles brings me plenty of
mousies she has been attempting to gum to death :-) They've also spent
oodles of time nursing Nathan with use of feline ultrasound (purrs) to the
broken shoulderblade and bruised hip :-)
Adrian A - 07 Jun 2007 15:29 GMT
>> Good to see you posting again, Helen, I was wondering how you were
>> doing. --
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
> also spent oodles of time nursing Nathan with use of feline
> ultrasound (purrs) to the broken shoulderblade and bruised hip :-)

Lots of purrs for Nathan's recovery and good luck purrs for his exams.
Signature

Adrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart.
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk

wafflycat - 07 Jun 2007 17:20 GMT
> Lots of purrs for Nathan's recovery and good luck purrs for his exams.

Thanks Adrian
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 07 Jun 2007 21:51 GMT
> Nathan is injured - he came off his bike at a road race (Lotus circuit -
> closed roads) when another rider locked handlebars with him - then went up
> over the bars and barrel-rolled at about 30mph. Bruised noggin (shattered
> lid), broken shoulderblade, haemotoma on hip the size of a melon and acres
> of road rash.

Yikes! That sounds serious. Hope he's recovering OK! BTW, what does
"shattered lid" mean? I'm picturing a cartoon where someone's head has
a lid that opens up to expose the brain. I'm sure that's not what you
meant. :)

> All down his right-side and he spent two days his horse spittal.

Translate? :)

> Guess who starts his A-levels on Monday and guess who can't write?

Oh, dear. Can't he make arrangements to take the tests later? I suppose
that's difficult because of the potential for cheating... not to say that
Nathan would cheat, but the school might have a policy against rescheduling
a standard test. Hope not!

> Felines ruling the homestead as is their right. Waffles brings me plenty of
> mousies she has been attempting to gum to death :-)

She's getting to be an old lady, isn't she? Or rather, a grand old dame.

> They've also spent
> oodles of time nursing Nathan with use of feline ultrasound (purrs) to the
> broken shoulderblade and bruised hip :-)

Feline ultrasound! Perfect name for it. :) I'm sure it's helping the
healing process.

Feline ultrasound to all of you,
Joyce
wafflycat - 07 Jun 2007 22:03 GMT
> > Nathan is injured - he came off his bike at a road race (Lotus circuit -
> > closed roads) when another rider locked handlebars with him - then went
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> a lid that opens up to expose the brain. I'm sure that's not what you
> meant. :)

His helmet was shattered. Rather spectacular bruising on his forehead took
the exact shape of the innards of the helmet.

> > All down his right-side and he spent two days his horse spittal.
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> rescheduling
> a standard test. Hope not!

The school has arranged for a scribe - basically Natahn will dictate his
answers. Extra time allowed too.

> > Felines ruling the homestead as is their right. Waffles brings me plenty
> > of
> > mousies she has been attempting to gum to death :-)
>
> She's getting to be an old lady, isn't she? Or rather, a grand old dame.

Indeed she is thoroughly magnificent :)

> > They've also spent
> > oodles of time nursing Nathan with use of feline ultrasound (purrs) to
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Feline ultrasound to all of you,
> Joyce

Ta muchly :)
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 07 Jun 2007 22:18 GMT
> <jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net> wrote in message

>> Yikes! That sounds serious. Hope he's recovering OK! BTW, what does
>> "shattered lid" mean? I'm picturing a cartoon where someone's head has
>> a lid that opens up to expose the brain. I'm sure that's not what you
>> meant. :)

> His helmet was shattered.

You know, I realized this later on... I can be a bit slow interpreting
expressions I've never heard before, sorry!

>> Oh, dear. Can't he make arrangements to take the tests later?

> The school has arranged for a scribe - basically Natahn will dictate his
> answers. Extra time allowed too.

Oh, that's great! Good luck to him on the tests.

Joyce
Marina - 08 Jun 2007 04:46 GMT
> Felines ruling the homestead as is their right. Waffles brings me plenty
> of mousies she has been attempting to gum to death :-) They've also
> spent oodles of time nursing Nathan with use of feline ultrasound
> (purrs) to the broken shoulderblade and bruised hip :-)

So glad to hear the cats are on the job. Nathan should get better in no
time with their help. Feline ultrasound for his A-levels. ;)

Signature

Marina, Miranda and Caliban. In loving memory of Frank and Nikki.

jofirey - 07 Jun 2007 20:22 GMT
>>>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> I'd hate to be in the position of the OP: I'd be devastated, and there but
> for the grace of ... insert name of deity of choice.

I seriously doubt the poster did any such thing.  He has posted upsetting
nonsense before just to get a reaction.  Or if prior posts are true the cats
are better off without him anyway.

Jo
Christina Websell - 08 Jun 2007 02:34 GMT
>>>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
>
> Not everyone is able to do that, though, Tweed.

Actually they can.  If they are brave enough to fight.

>I can utterly understand the poster being sad, but has done the right thing
>in the circumstances *as described* by finding suitable alternative
>arrangements for the cats. I'd hate to be in the position of the OP: I'd be
>devastated, and there but for the grace of ... insert name of deity of
>choice.

Oh, for goodness sake, he never cared about his cats before why should he
now?

Tweed
wafflycat - 08 Jun 2007 12:14 GMT
>>>>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>>>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> Actually they can.  If they are brave enough to fight.

We'll have to agree to disgaree on that one, Tweed. I take the view none of
us can know entirely the circumstances of another and make that judgement
for everyone else. Example: elderly person needs to be put into a
residential care home. There may well not be any residential care home
available where he or she can also take their pet with them. Should that
elderly person be castigated for not being able to take their pets with
them?

>>I can utterly understand the poster being sad, but has done the right
>>thing in the circumstances *as described* by finding suitable alternative
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Oh, for goodness sake, he never cared about his cats before why should he
> now?

It still applies as a general thing - not everyone can be in the position to
be able to take their pets with them, irrepsective of whether the OP is an
utter twerp or not.

> Tweed
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 08 Jun 2007 19:45 GMT
>>> Not everyone is able to do that, though, Tweed.

>> Actually they can.  If they are brave enough to fight.

> We'll have to agree to disgaree on that one, Tweed. I take the view
> none of us can know entirely the circumstances of another and make
> that judgement for everyone else.

Thank you, Helen! I totally agree with you. It's all too easy for many
of us to become self-righteous and judgemental about other people's
decisions, without understanding how it feels to live in their skin
and their circumstances.

"If I can do X, then anyone can," is an often-heard pronouncement.
Essentially, that comes from a belief that everyone else is exactly
like oneself, which is pretty egotistical, if you ask me.

> Example: elderly person needs to be put into a
> residential care home. There may well not be any residential care home
> available where he or she can also take their pet with them. Should that
> elderly person be castigated for not being able to take their pets with
> them?

Good example.

I certainly hope I will always be able to keep my kitties with me!

Joyce
Christina Websell - 09 Jun 2007 16:40 GMT
>>>>>I will be moving from a house in a suburban/semi-rural area to an
>>>>> apartment in a  big metropolis. Now my cats can go out whenever they
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
> elderly person be castigated for not being able to take their pets with
> them?

This is not such a case at all, and well you know it.  It is unfair of you
to bring up this type of circumstance in comparison.

We may have to agree to disagree on this.
I will still like you if you don't agree with me on this ;-)

I don't mind a debate about my views.  It is OK to argue.  What I do not
like is when someone on the group questions my mental health because I do
not agree with not neutering a tom cat.

Tweed
 
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