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Soy products femminizing our (human) boys?

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Stormin Mormon - 18 Jan 2007 14:22 GMT
Here is a second article which says much the same thing.

http://www.mothering.com/articles/growing_child/food/soy_story.html

Summary: Eating soy foods increases estrogen in people. This
effect is most
pronounced in infant and child boys. The effects are severe.

To view the entire article, visit
  http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53327

Tuesday, December 12, 2006
----------------------------------------------------------------
--
Soy is making kids 'gay'
By Jim Rutz
----------------------------------------------------------------
--

Posted: December 12, 2006

Soy is making kids 'gay'

There's a slow poison out there that's severely damaging our
children and threatening to tear apart our culture. The ironic
part
is, it's a "health food," one of our most popular.

Now, I'm a health-food guy, a fanatic who seldom allows anything
into his kitchen unless it's organic. I state my bias here just
so
you'll know I'm not anti-health food.

The dangerous food I'm speaking of is soy. Soybean products are
feminizing, and they're all over the place. You can hardly
escape
them anymore.

I have nothing against an occasional soy snack. Soy is
nutritious
and contains lots of good things. Unfortunately, when you eat or
drink a lot of soy stuff, you're also getting substantial
quantities of estrogens.

Estrogens are female hormones. If you're a woman, you're
flooding
your system with a substance it can't handle in surplus. If
you're
a man, you're suppressing your masculinity and stimulating your
"female side," physically and mentally.

In fetal development, the default is being female. All humans
(even
in old age) tend toward femininity. The main thing that keeps
men
from diverging into the female pattern is testosterone, and
testosterone is suppressed by an excess of estrogen.

If you're a grownup, you're already developed, and you're able
to
fight off some of the damaging effects of soy. Babies aren't so
fortunate. Research is now showing that when you feed your baby
soy
formula, you're giving him or her the equivalent of five birth
control pills a day. A baby's endocrine system just can't cope
with
that kind of massive assault, so some damage is inevitable. At
the
extreme, the damage can be fatal.

Soy is feminizing, and commonly leads to a decrease in the size
of
the penis, sexual confusion and homosexuality. That's why most
of
the medical (not socio-spiritual) blame for today's rise in
homosexuality must fall upon the rise in soy formula and other
soy
products. (Most babies are bottle-fed during some part of their
infancy, and one-fourth of them are getting soy milk!)
Homosexuals
often argue that their homosexuality is inborn because "I can't
remember a time when I wasn't homosexual." No, homosexuality is
always deviant. But now many of th! em can truthfully say that
they
can't remember a time when excess estrogen wasn't influencing
them.

Doctors used to hope soy would reduce hot flashes, prevent
cancer
and heart disease, and save millions in the Third World from
starvation. That was before they knew much about long-term soy
use.
Now we know it's a classic example of a cure that's worse than
the
disease. For example, if your baby gets colic from cow's milk,
do
you switch him to soy milk? Don't even think about it. His
phytoestrogen level will jump to 20 times normal. If he is a
she,
brace yourself for watching her reach menarche as young as
seven,
robbing her of years of childhood. If he is a boy, it's far
worse:
He may not reach puberty till much later than normal.

Research in 2000 showed that a soy-based diet at any age can
lead
to a weak thyroid, which commonly produces heart problems and
excess fat. Could this explain the dramatic increase in obesity
today?

Recent research on rats shows testicular atrophy, infertility
and
uterus hypertrophy (enlargement). This helps explain the
infertility epidemic and the sudden growth in fertility clinics.
But alas, by the time a soy-damaged infant has grown to
adulthood
and wants to marry, it's too late to get fixed by a fertility
clinic.

Worse, there's now scientific evidence that estrogen ingredients
in
soy products may be boosting the rapidly rising incidence of
leukemia in children. In the latest year we have numbers for,
new
cases in the U.S. jumped 27 percent. In one year!

There's also a serious connection between soy and cancer in
adults
- especially breast cancer. That's why the governments of
Israel,
the UK, France and New Zealand are already cracking down hard on
soy.

In sad contrast, 60 percent of the refined foods in U.S.
supermarkets now contain soy. Worse, soy use may double in the
next
few years because (last I heard) the out-of-touch medicrats in
the
FDA hierarchy are considering allowing manufacturers of cereal,
energ! y bars, fake milk, fake yogurt, etc., to claim that "soy
prevents
cancer." It doesn't.

P.S.: Soy sauce is fine. Unlike soy milk, it's perfectly safe
because it's fermented, which changes its molecular structure.
Miso, natto and tempeh are also OK, but avoid tofu.

Special offer:

Read Rutz's latest book, "The Meaning of Life"

James Rutz is chairman of Megashift Ministries and
founder-chairman
of Open Church Ministries. He is the author of "MEGASHIFT:
Igniting
Spiritual Power," and, most recently, "The Meaning of Life." If
you'd rather order by phone, call WND's toll-free customer
service
line at 1-800-4WND-COM (1-800-496-3266).
CatNipped - 18 Jan 2007 18:15 GMT
<snip more homophobic drivel from our resident homophobe (taken from an
internet site trying to look like a serious article)>

From "Women's Health" Health Library (full, very interesting, article at:
http://www.womenshealth.com/library/phytoestrogens.html)

"Phytohormones (plant hormones), particularly phytoestrogens, have generated
a great deal of interest in the consumer and scientific community for a
number of years. Phytoestrogens, or plant estrogens, are very weak estrogens
that occur naturally in many foods and herbs. The chemical structure of
phytoestrogens is similar but not identical to the estrogens produced by the
body.

The body is not able to convert phytoestrogens into estrogen, however,
anecdotal evidence indicates there may be benefits from phytoestrogens for
women during perimenopause because of weak estrogenic-like qualities. Some
women report relief from minor symptoms such as hot flashes, anxiety, and
irritability."

Now, any good recipes anyone?

Hugs,

CatNipped
Stormin Mormon - 18 Jan 2007 20:26 GMT
Baha, as the only person on this message board who has met me in
person, you may wish to comment on the charges.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> <snip more homophobic drivel from our resident homophobe
CatNipped - 18 Jan 2007 21:45 GMT
> Baha, as the only person on this message board who has met me in
> person, you may wish to comment on the charges.
>
>> <snip more homophobic drivel from our resident homophobe

Anyone here can google your past messages on this board to see some really
horrific comments about homosexuals.

CatNipped
CatNipped - 18 Jan 2007 22:02 GMT
>> Baha, as the only person on this message board who has met me in
>> person, you may wish to comment on the charges.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> CatNipped

For example, there's this thread:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.pets.cats.anecdotes/browse_frm/thread/fcbd164
6f1da2fe0/aebe1ebbef00ad72?lnk=gst&q=stormin+mormon+gay&rnum=3#aebe1ebbef00ad72


CatNipped
CatNipped - 18 Jan 2007 22:04 GMT
>>> Baha, as the only person on this message board who has met me in
>>> person, you may wish to comment on the charges.
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> CatNipped

Sorry, the thread devolved with this homophobic comment from you:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.pets.cats.anecdotes/browse_frm/thread/fcbd164
6f1da2fe0/aebe1ebbef00ad72?lnk=gst&q=stormin+mormon+gay&rnum=3#aebe1ebbef00ad72


CatNipped
CatNipped - 18 Jan 2007 22:06 GMT
>>>> Baha, as the only person on this message board who has met me in
>>>> person, you may wish to comment on the charges.
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> CatNipped

Drat, the link keeps jumping down past your ignorant comment, so I'll quote:

11 From:Stormin Mormon - view profile
Date:Wed, Jun 14 2006 6:54 am
Email: "Stormin Mormon" <cayoung61-#spambloc...@hotmail.com>
Groups: rec.pets.cats.anecdotes
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Hmm. Calling Butt-back mountain a superb film? I don't plan to see
that homo-centric bit of trash. Musta been directed by Tu Sor But.
Edited by Chinese film professional Wee Lyk Fags. Starring Henry
Fitzpatrick, and Patrick Fitzhenry.

Sorry, can't help with the other film, though.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.

David - 19 Jan 2007 00:21 GMT
> Drat, the link keeps jumping down past your ignorant comment, so I'll
> quote:
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> Hmm. Calling Butt-back mountain a superb film? I don't plan to see

(the rest has been removed)

I had forgotten about his particularly putrid posts about "Brokeback
Mountain" last year; this reminds me of why I blocked his posts long ago!

David
Baha - 19 Jan 2007 01:13 GMT
I find it best to say that matters of biology are best left to the medical
profession, and researchers trained in human physiology and endocrinology in
this particular case, and not members of the ministry. This is the kind of
man who doesn't know soy from Shinola. Clearly the minister is an obvious
homophobe; unfortunately, repeating such remarks inevitably creates a
situation of guilt by association. Remember that according to the Articles of
Faith, an ideal LDS strives after the good things; this minister is promoting
medical misinformation and intolerance to our fellow-beings, and regardless
of what religion we follow we should not strive to follow after such.

Blessed be,
Baha

>Baha, as the only person on this message board who has met me in
>person, you may wish to comment on the charges.
>
>> <snip more homophobic drivel from our resident homophobe
Christina Websell - 19 Jan 2007 19:38 GMT
>I find it best to say that matters of biology are best left to the medical
> profession, and researchers trained in human physiology and endocrinology
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> Blessed be,
> Baha

I feel entitled to reply here as a lot of my family are Latterday Saints.  I
am not.
I have shared these homophobic posts with my LDS family and they are
disgusted.  My aunt and uncle have been members for 54 years and their view
is that "God " sends us our sexuality and circumstances and it is not up to
anyone else to judge. so please,, leave it off.  Chris.you are bringing the
church into disrepute with your personal crusade. IMO.   Talk to your
bishop.

And then send us some cat posts.  You can't do the Mormon thing on me.  I
have you sussed.  LOL!

Tweed

.
Stormin Mormon - 22 Jan 2007 00:06 GMT
Excellent answer, but I guess I asked the wrong question.

As the only person on this message board who has met me in
person. And one posessing a very good sense of "gaydar". Do you
think I'm a homophobe? I've been accused at least twice on this
message board of being a homophobe, and here is your chance to
comment.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> I find it best to say that matters of biology are best left to the medical
> profession, and researchers trained in human physiology and endocrinology in
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> >
> >> <snip more homophobic drivel from our resident homophobe
Baha - 22 Jan 2007 02:23 GMT
I had been hoping to avoid this. Owing to our obvious religious and political
differences, I wanted to keep a respectful distance from the question and
hadn't wanted to comment, but it seems like it's not going to go away if I
ignore it.

It seems as if you think that homophobia and gaydar seem to go hand in hand,
as if by having a good sense of gaydar means I look at you in particular and
say "Look, everyone, a gay guy." I think you are afraid of being labeled gay,
as opposed to thinking you are a gay man. I know you are not. But you are of
a rigidly conservative frame of thinking that is not so much homophobic as
much as it is opposed to, and threatened by, anything that is different from
your set of beliefs and values. One may compare it to suggesting an author is
in danger of immortal condemnation, and insinuating that the writer is trying
to pervert a religion and the faith of its adherents, because a book does not
present a person's church in a matter best left to missionaries; and making
such a suggestion before the novel is in production, let alone the stores. A
person feels threatened by a different viewpoint, and reacts by building a
wall rather than trying to understand.

Yes, I feel your comments are homophobic because they are based on narrow
thinking, hatemongering and misinformation by a man who tries to pass himself
off as an expert in human biology, a minister who has no business insinuating
himself into matters in which he is not trained. Are you yourself homophobic?
I think it is broader than that; you have a fear of that which makes you
realize there are people who are different and who think differently from
yourself. It is not so much homophobia, but a fear of a world outside the
church walls, where life is not necessarily as orderly...but it is infinitely
more interesting.

Blessed be,
Baha  

>Excellent answer, but I guess I asked the wrong question.
>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>> >
>> >> <snip more homophobic drivel from our resident homophobe
Stormin Mormon - 23 Jan 2007 03:04 GMT
Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
homosexuals.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> I had been hoping to avoid this. Owing to our obvious religious and political
> differences, I wanted to keep a respectful distance from the question and
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
>
> >Excellent answer, but I guess I asked the wrong question.
Jo Firey - 23 Jan 2007 04:53 GMT
> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
> homosexuals.

Can I ask a couple of simple questions before you disappear behind my spam
filter?

Why are you even on this group?  You don't have cats, and have never shown
any fondness or affinity for them,

And why do you feel the need to use the group as a means to haunt Liz?  She
seems a particularly lovely person with no taste at all for confrontation.
But you not only come to the group and try to create controversy, but seem
determined to draw her into it.

Could you just go away already and find another venue for your diatribes?

Jo
badwilson - 23 Jan 2007 08:01 GMT
>> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
>> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
> diatribes?
> Jo

Hear, hear!  I have not been able to figure out why in the world she
puts up with him.  He has got to be one of the most nastiest people to
ever post repeatedly on this NG.  Sheesh!  And she just doesn't tell him
to get stuffed, even though he's practically stalking her!
Signature

Britta
Purring is an automatic safety valve device for dealing with happiness
overflow.
Check out pictures of Vino at:
http://picasaweb.google.com/badwilson

jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 23 Jan 2007 08:20 GMT
 [drivel we don't need to see more than once]

> Can I ask a couple of simple questions before you disappear behind
> my spam filter?

> Why are you even on this group?  You don't have cats, and have
> never shown any fondness or affinity for them...

Yay! So glad you said this, Jo! My sentiments exactly. He's been in my
killfile for months.

Joyce
Adrian A - 23 Jan 2007 12:55 GMT
>> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
>> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>
> Jo

Christopher is a really sick individual that needs treatment in a mental
institution.
Joey DoWop Dee - 23 Jan 2007 13:35 GMT
>> Christopher A. Young
>> You can't shout down a troll.
>> You have to starve them.

He's giving everyone the answer right in his signature line.
Don't try to *make* him go away. Just *let* him go away.
Christina Websell - 23 Jan 2007 22:40 GMT
>> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
>> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
> Jo
My aunt and uncle have been members of the LDS church for 54 years.  I have
never seen them show any homophobia.
Ok, it isn't encouraged by their church.  It isn't up to them to judge and
they know it.
I feel sad that Chris posts as "Stormin Mormon." whilst posting his personal
views.  He is not at all typical of Mormons as I know them.

Tweed
Jo Firey - 23 Jan 2007 23:56 GMT
>>> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
>>> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> Tweed

It says an awful lot about him that many of us have felt the need to defend
the LDS church after some of his posts.  It is really sad that he feels the
need to advertise his church affiliation along with his antisocial views.

Jo
Christina Websell - 31 Jan 2007 23:08 GMT
>>>> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
>>>> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
> feels the need to advertise his church affiliation along with his
> antisocial views.

I  wish that I could debate this, but I am at least 6 hours ahead and have
to go to bed right now
Sleep tight everyone and have lovely dreams

Tweed
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 23 Jan 2007 17:56 GMT
> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
> homosexuals.

However, most men who engage in "gay-bashing" do so because
they are insecure in their OWN sexual identity, thus feel
threatened by someone who dares to be different!  (A secure
heterosexual is willing to live and let live.)
Joey DoWop Dee - 23 Jan 2007 19:24 GMT
> Well, that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting. The
> bottom line answer is that I'm not homophobic. I have no fear of
> homosexuals.

Maybe the man has "no fear of homosexuals" (the literal meaning of
"homophobia" ) but even on the off-chance that is true, he's failing to
equate his hatred with fear or to recognize that's where his hatred stems.

Please: leave him to his own fates.

Signature

Remember: It is To Laugh

EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 22 Jan 2007 20:37 GMT
> Excellent answer, but I guess I asked the wrong question.
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> message board of being a homophobe, and here is your chance to
> comment.

Unless the topic came up in conversation, how would Baha
know?  Those of us who have read your posts here may be in a
better position to judge.  (Unless the opinions you express
are simply trolling, not what you really think.)
Stormin Mormon - 23 Jan 2007 03:07 GMT
Baha has seen some sides of my personality which not many people
have. Normally, I'm a rather calm and collected person. I do have
a sense of humor, but not many people see it. We did have one
conversation over dinner, when Louie mentioned psyching out some
other folks, playing into their homophobia. I think during that
discussion I made it reasonably clear that I'm not homophobic. I
thought she'd have remembered that.

So, yes, it has come up in conversation.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> Unless the topic came up in conversation, how would Baha
> know?  Those of us who have read your posts here may be in a
> better position to judge.  (Unless the opinions you express
> are simply trolling, not what you really think.)
Baha - 23 Jan 2007 20:45 GMT
The difference is that it has never come out directly. Laughing over a story
(Louie used to freak out opponents in college hockey games by placing the
stick in strategic areas of the other guy's anatomy) is one thing, that's
just getting a few good chuckles over an anecdote. However, posting this
minister's uninformed drivel on a board which, frankly, doesn't give a damn
is going to earn a person a homophobe medal in really short order, and I
don't blame anyone for being upset. And this includes myself. The post is
offensive, and that one about Brokeback Mountain just as bad. If you want to
make the LDS (and by extension yourself) look good, then do what Jesus did
and sit to dinner with those who would be called sinners and stop giving a
rat's @$$ about what other people do in bed. When we have global warming,
disease, war and unequal rights between genders and races to worry about,
homosexuality is really a very small matter.

Blessed be,
Baha

>Baha has seen some sides of my personality which not many people
>have. Normally, I'm a rather calm and collected person. I do have
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>> better position to judge.  (Unless the opinions you express
>> are simply trolling, not what you really think.)
Christina Websell - 31 Jan 2007 22:37 GMT
> The difference is that it has never come out directly. Laughing over a
> story
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> Blessed be,
> Baha

Couldn't have put it better myself, Mrs Kaur

Tweed
sriddles@aol.com - 18 Jan 2007 18:35 GMT
> Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
>
> http://www.mothering.com/articles/growing_child/food/soy_story.html

It would be marvelous if the time, talent, and money for research to
promote this kind of hysteria was spent on, say, cancer, or AIDS
research.

Sherry
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 18 Jan 2007 18:55 GMT
> > Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
> >
> > http://www.mothering.com/articles/growing_child/food/soy_story.html

> It would be marvelous if the time, talent, and money for research to
> promote this kind of hysteria was spent on, say, cancer, or AIDS
> research.

LOL - good one, Sherry! :)

Joyce
Shiral - 18 Jan 2007 20:13 GMT
>  > Stormin Mormon wrote:
>  > > Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Joyce

I agree! =o) Alas, there seems to be an unending supply of hysteria.

Melissa
meeee - 18 Jan 2007 20:56 GMT
>>  > Stormin Mormon wrote:
>>  > > Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> Melissa

And lots of post-grad students trying to come up with New and More
Impressive research projects.
Stormin Mormon - 18 Jan 2007 20:29 GMT
I'd also like that. How about cardiac research (I'm told cardiac
problems are the #1 killer of adults in the USA). Or on programs
to help folks avoid smoking. One fellow I know had a heart attack
that nearly killed him. He got the doctors list of things to
maintain his health. He gets a bit of exercise, changed from salt
to Salt Sense, and keeps on smoking cigarettes.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> It would be marvelous if the time, talent, and money for research to
> promote this kind of hysteria was spent on, say, cancer, or AIDS
> research.
>
> Sherry
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 18 Jan 2007 20:34 GMT
> Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> effect is most
> pronounced in infant and child boys. The effects are severe.

Why don't you volunteer as a test subject?  Judging by the
hatemongering junk you post here, a few feminine traits
(like intelligence, compassion and common sense) could only
improve you!

>  To view the entire article, visit
>    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53327
[quoted text clipped - 148 lines]
> service
>  line at 1-800-4WND-COM (1-800-496-3266).
Stormin Mormon - 22 Jan 2007 00:11 GMT
So, you don't care about potential damage to human boys? Wow,
what nasty names would you like to be called? I'm sure someone
could find a few.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> Why don't you volunteer as a test subject?  Judging by the
> hatemongering junk you post here, a few feminine traits
> (like intelligence, compassion and common sense) could only
> improve you!
Baha - 22 Jan 2007 01:52 GMT
First and foremost, this is in urban-myth category. I'm reminded of things
like spider eggs in Bubble Yum, or kangaroo meat in Mickey D's burgers.
Secondly and more importantly, you quoted from a minister's book. the author
is not an endocrinologist nor has he any position in the scientific research
community. What does this man know about the effect of soy products on the
male endocrine system? the logic is flawed on multiple levels. A mother
nurses her infant son, he is likely to get a certain amount of female
hormones through the breast milk. If we wish to continue with this logic, any
male who has been breastfed is a homosexual waiting to happen. Why, WHY would
you take the word of a homophobic minister as proven medical science? Let
this man stick to his pulpit (although his attitudes are so revolting to me
that I wouldn't go into his church for a million dollars laid out in a line.)

Blessed be,
Baha

>So, you don't care about potential damage to human boys? Wow,
>what nasty names would you like to be called? I'm sure someone
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>> (like intelligence, compassion and common sense) could only
>> improve you!
Stormin Mormon - 24 Jan 2007 14:37 GMT
After some discussion (and a fresh perspective or two), I'm
finding out that this article is both poorly written, and
offensive to many. Oops! Such was not my goal. What's going on,
is that I'm rapidly losing confidence in the establishment, on so
many levels. I've taken a couple medical problems to established
doctors, and had them make the matters worse. And a couple
friends of mine, much the same. The establishment changes
position back and forth also. Is butter killing us? How about
margarine with trans fats? Cyclamates, saccharine, or Splenda? Or
was it sugar that is killing us all?

I do have a couple friend of mine who are raising their baby on
formula. Could it be soy product? When I read the article, I
didn't see any anti-this or anti-that. Except for
anti-commercially prepared stuff. The anti bias that I totally
missed, others picked right up on it.

My goal of posting to this board, is that the folks here seem
sincere and caring. And my reaction to the article was "we're
hurting members of our families!". Yes, it's not cat related, but
it sure seemed important to families. And now, I'm finding out
that different people see a whole different content in the
article, different than what I'd seen. My mistake, and I sure am
sorry. Never intended to mean anything other than that the
commercial factories aren't putting out healthy product.

And, so, I am writing to apologize to anyone who was offended.
That sure wasn't my intent.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> First and foremost, this is in urban-myth category. I'm reminded of things
> like spider eggs in Bubble Yum, or kangaroo meat in Mickey D's burgers.
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> >So, you don't care about potential damage to human boys? Wow,
Cheryl Perkins - 24 Jan 2007 14:59 GMT
> After some discussion (and a fresh perspective or two), I'm
> finding out that this article is both poorly written, and
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> margarine with trans fats? Cyclamates, saccharine, or Splenda? Or
> was it sugar that is killing us all?

I find it really helps my peace of mind if I pay no attention whatsoever
to scare stories in the media. If I can't quite manage that, I would try
to find the original reports the stories are based on before panicking. A
reputable writer will give enough names for you to track down the original
research (although you may need access to a university library). A writer
who simply rants and doesn't give you the information you need to check
the research should be ignored. There's an awful lot of junk information
out there. There's also a lot of situations, including medical ones, which
are *not* yet fully understood in spite of all the advances of the past
century or so.  Moreover, even established and excellent doctors are human
- there are limits to their knowledge and abilities, and they sometimes
make mistakes.

*Life* kills us - no one comes out alive! And you're playing the odds when
you choose your lifestyle. If you avoid something that is statistically
associated with a shorter life, like smoking or a high-fat diet and
low-exercise life, the odds are that you will live longer than you would
if you smoked, at nothing but hamburgers, and never exercised. But there
aren't any guarantees on the individual level from statistical
generalities.

> sorry. Never intended to mean anything other than that the
> commercial factories aren't putting out healthy product.

Commercial products can be healthy and safe (ie uncontaminated), or not,
depending on the business and which products are chosen by the consumer.  
Soy is a well-known and generally safe nutrient as far as I ever heard,
although I think it's a mistake to focus on a single nutrient in your
diet. I think people should eat a variety of foods, so that their various
benefits and risks balance out, more or less.

Signature

Cheryl

Stormin Mormon - 24 Jan 2007 21:47 GMT
I can't describe how embarassed I am. After all, I'm the guy who
checks things on www.snopes.com and reminds folks not to spread
internet legends.

I'll have to try that -- avoiding scare stories. After all, what
can one person do?

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 You can't shout down a troll.
 You have to starve them.
.

> I find it really helps my peace of mind if I pay no attention whatsoever
> to scare stories in the media. If I can't quite manage that, I would try
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
> diet. I think people should eat a variety of foods, so that their various
> benefits and risks balance out, more or less.
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 24 Jan 2007 21:49 GMT
> I find it really helps my peace of mind if I pay no attention whatsoever
> to scare stories in the media. If I can't quite manage that, I would try
> to find the original reports the stories are based on before panicking.

And by the time you're as old as I am, you will have lived
through several about-faces among respectable researchers,
and learn to ignore most of them!  I try to eat a balanced
diet, avoid foods that seem to bother my own digestive
system, and don't pay much attention to the "latest
research".  However, I do tend to opt for the "natural",
unfooled-around-with, as opposed to the artificially
enhanced.  (Like "fat free half and half" - an oxymoron in
any case - but have you read the LABELS for it?)
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 24 Jan 2007 23:47 GMT
> I try to eat a balanced
> diet, avoid foods that seem to bother my own digestive
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> enhanced.  (Like "fat free half and half" - an oxymoron in
> any case - but have you read the LABELS for it?)

I'm with you, Evelyn. "Fat-free half and half" sounds scary. My idea
of a healthy diet is one with as few pesticides, hormones, antibiotics,
flavor and color additives, and preservatives as possible. Some people
think "eating healthy" means low-fat or even no fat (which could kill
you!) - and they'll eat food with all sorts of weird chemicals and junk
that *do not belong in the food*, just to get the no-fat version. What's
wrong with fat? As long as you don't eat too much of it, or regularly
eat hydrogenated oils (also a result of over-processing), I think it's
fine.

And then there are the low-carb freaks, which is just a variation on
a theme, as far as I can see. One night about 3 or 4 years ago, when I
went to bed, fat was the evil food. And when I woke up the next morning,
fat was good and carbs had become evil. :) Same old thing, dressed up
as something new.

I do know that some people require a low-carb diet because their bodies
don't metabolize sugar very well. But, just as with the low-fat diets,
some people go overboard and try to eliminate the dreaded carbs from their
diet completely - which is dangerous. For most of us, a balanced diet
with a reasonable amount of carbs (whole grains are best), is good for
you, not bad!

OK, off my soapbox...

Joyce

"Red meat isn't bad for you. Now, blue-green meat - *that's* bad for
you!"   - Tommy Smothers
Adrian A - 25 Jan 2007 11:32 GMT
>  > I try to eat a balanced
>  > diet, avoid foods that seem to bother my own digestive
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
> "Red meat isn't bad for you. Now, blue-green meat - *that's* bad for
> you!"   - Tommy Smothers

The thing that worries me, some of the chemicals we're exposed to now didn't
exist 30 years ago. Who knows what the long term effects will be.
Signature

Adrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart.
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk

Sherry - 24 Jan 2007 15:04 GMT
On Jan 24, 8:37am, "Stormin Mormon"
<cayoung61-&spambloc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> After some discussion (and a fresh perspective or two), I'm
> finding out that this article is both poorly written, and
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> Christopher A. Young

I wasn't really "offended". A better description was, I just thought
the whole article was eyeball-rollingly silly. Too silly to warrant
being offended.

Sherry
Shiral - 24 Jan 2007 17:47 GMT
> > >So, you don't care about potential damage to human boys? Wow,- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -

A.  You didn't read the articles carefully  and come to the conclusion
that the issues they raised weren't medically and scientifically sound
BEFORE posting them here on a cat Newsgroup?

B. The question asked in the subject line of this thread was
specifically about "harm" being done to men and boys through eating soy
products which supposedly might turn them into 'girly-men' to
paraphrase the words of California's lamentable Governator. If it had
been a general question about "Are soy products safe for (all) human
consumption?" you would have run into a less angry response.

C. Given that the Chinese and Japanese have been eating soy products
for centuries, and both China and Japan are well populated to say the
least, I'd say there's little likelihood that soy products are either a
deterent to sexual activity, or that they have a feminizing influence
on men.

D.If  I could find a food that would make men less inclined to violence
while not altering their dispositions in other ways, I'd make a point
of feeding it to the entire Bush Administration.

Melissa
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 22 Jan 2007 20:39 GMT
> So, you don't care about potential damage to human boys?

Define "damage".
meeee - 18 Jan 2007 20:55 GMT
LMAO!! Thanks, best laugh I had all day...Soy products turning our kids
gay....next thing you'll be telling me 'It's Those Evil Nips Turning Us Gay
On Purpose By Selling Us Soy'....Sheesh!!

What was it my dad used to say? 'Make sure the brain is in gear before using
motor mouth.....;'
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 18 Jan 2007 22:33 GMT
> LMAO!! Thanks, best laugh I had all day...Soy products turning our kids
> gay....next thing you'll be telling me 'It's Those Evil Nips Turning Us Gay
> On Purpose By Selling Us Soy'....Sheesh!!

Real Men don't eat tofu... :)

> What was it my dad used to say? 'Make sure the brain is in gear before using
> motor mouth.....;'

Also: constipation of the brain, diarrhea of the mouth. More crude, but
also more visceral (heh, literally :)).

Joyce
meeee - 19 Jan 2007 11:25 GMT
> > LMAO!! Thanks, best laugh I had all day...Soy products turning our kids
> > gay....next thing you'll be telling me 'It's Those Evil Nips Turning Us
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> Joyce

LMAO absolutely!!
Yowie - 18 Jan 2007 21:04 GMT
> Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> To view the entire article, visit
>   http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53327

Yes, thats why China, the country that eats the most soy, has the smallest
population and the most gay and/or feminised men.

Yowie
Joy - 18 Jan 2007 21:34 GMT
>> Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>> To view the entire article, visit
>>   http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53327

LOL!  Very good, Yowie!

Joy
Baha - 21 Jan 2007 02:17 GMT
WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT THIS
MOMENT REALLY WHIZZED UP ON SINUS TABLETS!

>> Here is a second article which says much the same thing.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>Yes, thats why China, the country that eats the most soy, has the smallest
>population and the most gay and/or feminised men.

Yep. Louie is half East Indian and half Chinese. Nothing but limpwristed
sissies all over Mama's side of the family, and you know what they're doing?
That's right. Breeding generations of more queers. As if centuries of pansies
in the Forbidden City before Mutha-in-law came along weren't bad enough. And
as for my father in law, he took an oath to go vegan when his firstborn fell
off a balcony at the age of two. That was my Louie. And what followed? Six
siblings, and those two younger boys are the biggest poofters in town from
all that tofu daddy's been eating for almost forty years. And now that we
mention it, I married a flaming queen and the biggest problem with it is, WE
EACH TAKE DIFFERENT DRESS SIZES!!!

Now, is anyone interested in my husband's recipe for real Buffalo-style wings?

Blessed be,
Baha
Ex-Mormon, Gay rights supporter

>Yowie
Ketzl's Dad - 21 Jan 2007 02:54 GMT
> Now, is anyone interested in my husband's recipe for real Buffalo-style wings?

Ackshly, yes; but only if the recipe includes soy sauce.

Signature

Joey DoWop Dee

Remember: It is To Laugh.

Kreisleriana - 21 Jan 2007 16:31 GMT
>WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT THIS
>MOMENT REALLY WHIZZED UP ON SINUS TABLETS!
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
>
>Now, is anyone interested in my husband's recipe for real Buffalo-style wings?

YES.

AND: <read warning above, minus ex-Mormon subdivision>

Oh please everybody.  You all know where all these limp-dishrag sissy
boys and flannel-wearing combat booted lezzos come from.  Not one of
them resulted from budding, cloning or parthenogenesis.  They all
arrived the old-fashioned way, from good old-fashioned, God-fearing
heterosexual sex.  

So obviously, the fault lies with us straight people.  Keep your legs
together and your zippers zipped, straight folks, you're flooding the
world with gays. :P

Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh

Make Levees, Not War
Baha - 22 Jan 2007 01:58 GMT
Yeah, a moratorium on breeding would be in order, folks. Help control the gay-
lesbian population, keep your parents spayed or neutered.

Blessed be,
Baha
Neutered by nature

>>WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT THIS
>>MOMENT REALLY WHIZZED UP ON SINUS TABLETS!
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
>
>Make Levees, Not War
Christina Websell - 22 Jan 2007 21:36 GMT
>>WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT
>>THIS
[quoted text clipped - 42 lines]
> together and your zippers zipped, straight folks, you're flooding the
> world with gays. :P

<smirk>
I would not like to say whether any of you will ever be in a position to
fall in love with one of your own sex.  Who knows?  And why does it matter,
anyway?  Let us all be happy with whoever we choose to spend our lives with
and live without prejudice.

Tweed

Tweed
CatNipped - 23 Jan 2007 15:23 GMT
>>>WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT
>>>THIS
[quoted text clipped - 52 lines]
>
> Tweed

Right!  When is love *EVER* a *BAD* thing no matter who is loving whom!!???

Hugs,

CatNipped
Baha - 23 Jan 2007 16:24 GMT
I am of the opinion that the quality of the relationship is more important by
far than the gender of the people involved.

Blessed be,
Baha

>>>WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT
>>>THIS
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
>Tweed
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 23 Jan 2007 17:53 GMT
> <smirk>
> I would not like to say whether any of you will ever be in a position to
> fall in love with one of your own sex.  Who knows?  And why does it matter,
> anyway?  Let us all be happy with whoever we choose to spend our lives with
> and live without prejudice.

Exactly!  How can anyone know how they'd respond to
temptation unless they are actually tempted?  (Just because
I have never been sexually attracted to someone of my own
gender doesn't mean it can't happen - there are plenty
members of the OPPOSITE sex who don't attract me, either!)
Yowie - 21 Jan 2007 20:15 GMT
> WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT
> THIS
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
> Baha
> Ex-Mormon, Gay rights supporter

Oh, my oh my.  You mistook my words. I was being sarcastic. It just stands
to reason that the Chinese - who eat the most soy prducts - are clearly not
producing an unsually high number of gay and feminised men. I mean, they
would't have the population they do if most of their men folk were feminised
to the point of infertitlity or outright gay.

Not that I'd care if they were, but I was just pointing out that if eating
soy (at least, as the Chinese eat soy products) was so terrible for the
health, the Chinese and other soy-eating populations would surely have shown
clear effects now.

Yowie, another gay rights supporter.
Baha - 22 Jan 2007 01:56 GMT
Oy! Sorry!!! I know you were being sarcastic, sorry if you thought I was
taking stuff personally. I was being flippant too. Hope you're not mad from
me.

When I told Louie about this whole ridiculous mess he went off on this, ahem,
gay speech that I paraphrased here just to be a smart@$$.

Blessed be,
a very sheepish Baha

>> WARNING: THE FOLLOWING IS FACETIOUS PROSE WRITTEN BY A WOMAN WHO IS AT
>> THIS
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
>Yowie, another gay rights supporter.
Yowie - 22 Jan 2007 02:13 GMT
Oh OK :-) No harm done.

Yowie, looking sheepish (not that there's anything wrong with that)

> Oy! Sorry!!! I know you were being sarcastic, sorry if you thought I was
> taking stuff personally. I was being flippant too. Hope you're not mad from
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> >
> >Yowie, another gay rights supporter.
Baha - 22 Jan 2007 02:58 GMT
>Oh OK :-) No harm done.
>
>Yowie, looking sheepish (not that there's anything wrong with that)

As a matter of fact, some of us find sheep to be pretty darned cute. if you
find them anything more than cute though, you need help. Badly!

Blessed be,
Baha
Yowie - 22 Jan 2007 04:40 GMT
> >Oh OK :-) No harm done.
> >
> >Yowie, looking sheepish (not that there's anything wrong with that)
>
> As a matter of fact, some of us find sheep to be pretty darned cute. if you
> find them anything more than cute though, you need help. Badly!

Shouldn't that be 'baaadly'?. LOL

Yowie (g,d,r)
Kreisleriana - 22 Jan 2007 15:15 GMT
>>Oh OK :-) No harm done.
>>
>>Yowie, looking sheepish (not that there's anything wrong with that)
>
>As a matter of fact, some of us find sheep to be pretty darned cute. if you
>find them anything more than cute though, you need help. Badly!

B-a-a-a-a-dly!

Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh

Make Levees, Not War
Baha - 22 Jan 2007 16:48 GMT
Considering my previous responses on this thread, I believe I'd be considered
a bleating heart liberal!

Blessed be,
BAAAAAAA-ha

>>>Oh OK :-) No harm done.
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
>Make Levees, Not War
Shiral - 22 Jan 2007 19:33 GMT
> Considering my previous responses on this thread, I believe I'd be considered
> a bleating heart liberal!
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
> --
> Message posted via http://www.catkb.com

LOL!!  I'd say its much better  to wool-gather than spread ignorant,
overly-credulous homophobic theories. =o)

Melissa
Baha - 23 Jan 2007 16:25 GMT
Speaking as a compulsive knitter, I approve of wool-gathering!

Blessed be,
Baha

>> Considering my previous responses on this thread, I believe I'd be considered
>> a bleating heart liberal!
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
>Melissa
Dewi - 19 Jan 2007 00:13 GMT
Why the hell are you posting this on RPCA! It is clearly propaganda and
likely an article put out by the so called "God fearing" members of the
beef industry. Posting something like this really makes you look the
fool.

Dewi.
Dewi - 19 Jan 2007 00:30 GMT
Actually it's probably put out by the beef industry to appeal to the
"god fearing" members of the community. Propaganda all the same.

Dewi
Enfilade - 19 Jan 2007 02:34 GMT
> Actually it's probably put out by the beef industry to appeal to the
> "god fearing" members of the community. Propaganda all the same.

What I want to know is why this thread is being dignified with any
responses at all.

Don't feed the trolls, folks.

*strokes Nocturne*

--Fil
Ketzl's Dad - 19 Jan 2007 03:44 GMT
>> Actually it's probably put out by the beef industry to appeal to the
>> "god fearing" members of the community. Propaganda all the same.
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> --Fil

Amen to that.

Signature

Joey DoWop Dee

Remember: It is To Laugh.

Adrian A - 19 Jan 2007 11:17 GMT
> Why the hell are you posting this on RPCA! It is clearly propaganda
> and likely an article put out by the so called "God fearing" members
> of the beef industry. Posting something like this really makes you
> look the fool.
>
> Dewi.

I'm surprised the fool hasn't been killfiled by everyone. The least people
could do is ignore his mindless posts.
Signature

Adrian (Owned by Snoopy and Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart.
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk

Kreisleriana - 19 Jan 2007 15:46 GMT
>> Why the hell are you posting this on RPCA! It is clearly propaganda
>> and likely an article put out by the so called "God fearing" members
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>I'm surprised the fool hasn't been killfiled by everyone. The least people
>could do is ignore his mindless posts.

I dunno.  This one did give me a good loud laugh. ;)

Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh

Make Levees, Not War
sriddles@aol.com - 19 Jan 2007 16:09 GMT
> >> Why the hell are you posting this on RPCA! It is clearly propaganda
> >> and likely an article put out by the so called "God fearing" members
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> I dunno.  This one did give me a good loud laugh. ;)

Heh. Yeah, sometimes you just gotta shake your head and laugh.
Sometimes before you even open the post to read it. My old editor would
be rolling over in his grave simply from the title. "Femminizing?"

Sherry

> Theresa
> Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
>
> Make Levees, Not War
Ketzl's Dad - 19 Jan 2007 13:04 GMT
> Here is a second article which says much the same thing.

<serious snip of serious garbage>

Gees, I've only been here a week and already a ridiculous cyberschmuck
surfaces.
Where is that kill button...

Signature

Joey DoWop Dee

Remember: It is To Laugh.

Cantate - 24 Jan 2007 03:37 GMT
Jumping back in after a long silence,,,

So, what about the entire population of Japan, not to mention China and
Korea, where the main source of protein has been soy products for
centuries?

And what does this have to do with cats?

Cantate in Japan

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