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Cat Forum / Cat Anecdotes / August 2006Ping Takayuki or Cantate
Help! I have a question about Japanese, and I hope that either of you (or anyone else who knows the language) can answer this. I'm fixing a tech manual that was translated from Japanese to English. I don't speak Japanese at all, but my job is to make sure the English sounds natural. Anyway, there's some stuff in it about fetal ultrasounds. It talks about calculating the number of gestational weeks and the "expected date of confinement". Date of *confinement*? I'm not sure how the translator came up with that word. Could this mean the date of delivery? Thanks, Joyce > Help! I have a question about Japanese, and I hope that either of you > (or anyone else who knows the language) can answer this. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Thanks, > Joyce That used to be the "polite term". Back when you couldn't use words like pregnant. see http://tinyurl.com/h3lrf Jo > That used to be the "polite term". Back when you couldn't use words like > pregnant. I did a Google search on this and I discovered that "date of confinement" is very much an English-language term. I have never heard it before, but have always heard the due date called, well, the "due date". :) Or maybe the date of delivery. Confinement? What do they *do* in those maternity wards, anyway?? And apparently the old term is in use in medicine, so I guess "confinement" is going to stay. It's even referred to as "EDC" (estimated date of confinement), so I can't exactly change that. I really thought this was just a faulty translation, that perhaps there was a Japanese word that means both confinement and delivery or something, and they chose the wrong English word. Thanks! Joyce > > That used to be the "polite term". Back when you couldn't use words like > > pregnant. >I really thought this was just a faulty translation, that perhaps there >was a Japanese word that means both confinement and delivery or something, >and they chose the wrong English word. I'm glad someone knew, because I had no idea. It's true that the Japanese have what they call "wasei-eigo" terms, literally, Japanese English. For example, "one up", meaning getting an extra life in a video game... oh wait, except that those video games were exported to English speaking countries in the 80s, ironically really making it into a common English term. > >I really thought this was just a faulty translation, that perhaps there > >was a Japanese word that means both confinement and delivery or something, > >and they chose the wrong English word. > I'm glad someone knew, because I had no idea. It's true that the > Japanese have what they call "wasei-eigo" terms, literally, Japanese > English. For example, "one up", meaning getting an extra life in a > video game... oh wait, except that those video games were exported to > English speaking countries in the 80s, ironically really making it > into a common English term. I wasn't thinking it was a wasei-eigo term, though. The manual was originally written in Japanese, because the product is Japanese. But now the company is going to market it in the US, so they translated the manual to English. And I assumed, originally, that the translator picked the word "confinement" because that was the closest to whatever word in Japanese is used to mean "going into labor" or "delivery", etc. If you could see this manual, you would understand why I thought it was a mistake - there are a lot of odd phrasings in the book. The translator, although he or she clearly knows enough English to get most of it grammatically correct, nonetheless used words and phrases that most English speakers would not use. So I just figured this was a poor choice of an English word. Except that it turned out I was wrong about that. Maybe I'm too young to know this old-fashioned term, or maybe it's because I've never worked in medicine before, or because I never had kids, but that word just escaped me. I really think it's a bizarre word for labor... Joyce > If you could see this manual, you would understand why I thought it > was a mistake - there are a lot of odd phrasings in the book. The > translator, although he or she clearly knows enough English to get most > of it grammatically correct, nonetheless used words and phrases that > most English speakers would not use. So I just figured this was a poor > choice of an English word. The way Japanese people sometimes use English is one of the most hilarious things in the world. I'll never forget how much I laughed at the few signs I could read when I was over there. One of my very favorite books on Japan that is filled with stories of fractured English is Jack Seward's "Japanese in Action". And some of the packaging on the Japanese foods sold over here cracks me up. ("You can make sweet sandwich by placing natto between the breads.") Many examples may be found at: http://www.tabiwallah.com/oddwallah/index.html Here are some more hysterical (and historical) gems of English Japanese style: From an Osaka pediatrician's clinic: SPECIALIST FOR THE DECEASE OF CHILDREN From a Niigata hotel: The elevator is fixed for the next day. During that time we regret you will be unbearable. A warning sign at a Tokyo intersection: HAVE MANY ACCIDENTS HERE! A barber's sign: HEADS CUTTING Y1500. FOR BALD MEN Y900 A brand-new laundromat just outside Tokyo: NO MORE WHOREHOUSE. NOW NO. 1 LAUNDRY. YOU COME ALL THE SAME, PLEASE. A tattoo parlor near the laundromat: COME IN AND HAVE YOUR THING ENGRAVED. A ladies' sportswear store: UNTHINKABLE COLOR COMBINATIONS! And the winner of the Fractured English Olympics, a gigantic banner hung over the Hibiya intersection in downtown Tokyo, while Douglas MacArthur was being promoted for the upcoming US Presidential elections: WE PLAY FOR MACARTHUR'S ERECTION. > The way Japanese people sometimes use English is one of the most hilarious > things in the world. I'll never forget how much I laughed at the few signs I [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > packaging on the Japanese foods sold over here cracks me up. ("You can make > sweet sandwich by placing natto between the breads.") I'm reminded of the snack food that its Janglish package suggested as "good friend to beer". (Well, "friend", "companion" - same thing, right?) > The way Japanese people sometimes use English is one of the most hilarious > things in the world. I'll never forget how much I laughed at the few signs I > could read when I was over there. I agree, it's very funny. There are entire websites devoted to this topic, actually. I'm sure that all the clothing sold in this country, with Asian characters of one language or another, is equally amusing to the speakers of those languages! :) Joyce > Except that it turned out I was wrong about that. Maybe I'm too young > to know this old-fashioned term, I think I'm a little younger than you but I knew it. But then, I read a lot of old literature. Very common term in older novels.  SignatureMarina, Miranda and Caliban. In loving memory of Frank and Nikki. Stories and pics at http://koti.welho.com/mkurten/ Pics at http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/frankiennikki/ and http://community.webshots.com/user/frankiennikki >> Except that it turned out I was wrong about that. Maybe I'm too young >> to know this old-fashioned term, > > I think I'm a little younger than you but I knew it. But then, I read a > lot of old literature. Very common term in older novels. I think it also has a longer history in English than in American - Only the Eastern states concerned themselves with that sort of ultra "niceness" of language in Victorian/Edwardian days - pioneer women didn't have the time for such nonsense. >>Help! I have a question about Japanese, and I hope that either of you >>(or anyone else who knows the language) can answer this. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > That used to be the "polite term". Back when you couldn't use words like > pregnant. Ah yes - a pregnant woman was then "in a delicate condition", she didn't have breasts but "bosoms", instead of legs she had "limbs" (like a tree?)..... (And alongside such "delicacy" of language, you had children slaving in factories twelve hours a day, and ten-year-old prostitutes selling themselves on the streets.... the "good old days" weren't all that "good" for a lot of people!) > Help! I have a question about Japanese, and I hope that either of you > (or anyone else who knows the language) can answer this. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Thanks, > Joyce EDC or expected date of confinement is, as far as I understand, the usual medical term for the date the baby is expected to be born. Maybe it's more common in UK English? I think confinement is just an old fashioned term for labour and birth stage of a pregnancy. >> Help! I have a question about Japanese, and I hope that either of you >> (or anyone else who knows the language) can answer this. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > it's more common in UK English? I think confinement is just an old > fashioned term for labour and birth stage of a pregnancy. This manual doesn't say "All your babe are belong to us", does it? > This manual doesn't say "All your babe are belong to us", does it? Sorry Helen, Mark Edwards beat you to that joke the other day! :) It does say a lot of odd things, however. Joyce, burning the 9:15PM oil >It talks about calculating the number of gestational weeks and the >"expected date of confinement". > >Date of *confinement*? I'm not sure how the translator came up with >that word. Could this mean the date of delivery? "Expected date of confinement", also "EDC", is real medical terminology for the answer to the question, "When are you due?" MDs know what it means. Bud SignatureThe night is just the shadow of the Earth. > "Expected date of confinement", also "EDC", is real medical > terminology for the answer to the question, "When are you due?" MDs > know what it means. I just want to know whose confinement they're talking about. Signaturemonique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca > > "Expected date of confinement", also "EDC", is real medical > > terminology for the answer to the question, "When are you due?" MDs > > know what it means. > I just want to know whose confinement they're talking about. Not the baby's - he or she is getting *out* of confinement! Joyce Ok, response from a Brit here! Confinement is a term used for the time of labour/delivery of a baby. I think it stems from times long ago, when well to do women would be advised by the doctor or midwife to take to their beds when birth was close. Most likely, because in those days, women had not such a close idea of when exactly the baby was due. Of course, for the rest of the not so wealthy population, they just worked until they popped! sandra > Ok, response from a Brit here! Confinement is a term used for the > time of labour/delivery of a baby. I think it stems from times long > ago, when well to do women would be advised by the doctor or midwife > to take to their beds when birth was close. Most likely, because in > those days, women had not such a close idea of when exactly the baby > was due. What a horrible term. It should be ditched. Signaturemonique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca > Help! I have a question about Japanese, and I hope that either of you > (or anyone else who knows the language) can answer this. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Date of *confinement*? I'm not sure how the translator came up with > that word. Could this mean the date of delivery? That's what it meant in Victorian days (when any word remotely connected with female parts or functions had its euphemism)! The translator must have had a very old dictionary. > Thanks, > Joyce > > Date of *confinement*? I'm not sure how the translator came up with > > that word. Could this mean the date of delivery? > That's what it meant in Victorian days (when any word > remotely connected with female parts or functions had its > euphemism)! The translator must have had a very old > dictionary. Well, as others have observed, the term has managed to stick around and be very current in medical usage. Joyce jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net wrote in news:44e68729$0$34514 $742ec2ed@news.sonic.net: > Date of *confinement*? I'm not sure how the translator came up with > that word. Could this mean the date of delivery? That's an old-fashioned way of saying the due date. It's perfectly good, if archaic, English. Chak SignatureGuilt is the tragic delusion of culpability without the comic relief of sin. --Brooke McEldowney, 9 Chickweed Lane |
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