Cat Forum / Cat Anecdotes / April 2006
PING: Monique
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Karen - 13 Apr 2006 15:47 GMT I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is not organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). I am also observing that the *combination* in which I eat is important (I believe). but the biggest thing is I have not eaten out at any restaurant except the organic deli and one greek restaurant where I know everything is made from fresh food. It might be worth investigating trying to stick to as unprocessed of food as possible and don't let yourself get too far from a healthy snack. Also, anything you eat that is acidic (even like an orange etc.) make sure you have a nice soluble thing with it - even a half piece of organic white bread. Just some thoughts (takes some planning but does seem to make a diff).
Monique Y. Mudama - 13 Apr 2006 15:59 GMT > I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is > not organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > of organic white bread. Just some thoughts (takes some planning but > does seem to make a diff). Thanks, Karen!
As I understand it, everyone is different. I am 100% convinced that stress is the determining factor for me. Food probably affects it, but regardless of what I eat, it seems that my stomach will be upset if I am stressed.
Hopefully I can get an appt with my doctor today and maybe we can rule out/in an ulcer ...
Unfortunately, my lifestyle is closely tied to eating out, and I'm not sure I can totally eliminate it. But it's worth trying to minimize if it does make a difference.
As for acidic, I think that may be a problem when I drink decaf coffee. I've stopped drinking the decaf at work, but maybe I need to eliminate it totally. That would be awful =/
The xylitol was a horrible idea. It didn't make my stomach *hurt*, but even one little packet in my drink caused my stomach to rumble ominously and, er, well, the results just weren't pleasant. You were right about that one. DH reported similar issues.
 Signature monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully
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Karen - 13 Apr 2006 16:43 GMT > > I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is > > not organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > sure I can totally eliminate it. But it's worth trying to minimize if > it does make a difference. Look for restaurants in your area that make things from scratch. It will help and I would think in your area (CO being the naturalist place it is) there would be some good ones. You can get take out from those places too. I would guess this is maybe the biggest difference in the last month. I used eat out practically everyday.
> As for acidic, I think that may be a problem when I drink decaf > coffee. I've stopped drinking the decaf at work, but maybe I need to > eliminate it totally. That would be awful =/ One address:
http://www.toddycafe.com/
Strips 67% of acid out of coffee. I simply refuse to give up coffee. I bought one of these two weeks ago. Now, it isn't AS good as brewed, or rather I should say it is a bit different than brewed. Really smooth. But it is very good. You only have to make every once in a while (I do it on say Saturday night). It really does make a HUGE difference. Use filtered water for best effect. Best 30 bucks you can spend.
> The xylitol was a horrible idea. It didn't make my stomach *hurt*, but > even one little packet in my drink caused my stomach to rumble > ominously and, er, well, the results just weren't pleasant. You were > right about that one. DH reported similar issues. I'm telling you, I"ve decided that for some folks, if it isn't the way God made it, your body is going to do terrible things. I knew that about me too, from when Grandma's packaged soft cookies came out. I took one bite of those (this was back in my college days mind) and I could TASTE the chemicals used. I couldn't finish (and believe me, I could eat anything back then). Same with aspartame. I will say, I've had *small* amounts of Splenda that didn't seem to cause a problem, but mostly, I'd just stick with honey or something if I need it. See if you have a local natural foods CO-OP with a deli. Mine is SOOOOO great. The food is delicious. THey make different stuff everyday. I have been just getting some of their salads and stuff and their "take home" meals. Faster than take out, and better. I also have great luck with Amy's Country Vegetable pot pies, the black bean enchildas and her Chili with cornbread. (I do take Beano before I eat anything really fiber filled - just to make sure). I still think that there is something funky with my ovary but all the other stuff as reeeeeaaally made a 180 turn.
YOu just have to figure out which things do it for you or not.
Monique Y. Mudama - 13 Apr 2006 22:06 GMT > Look for restaurants in your area that make things from scratch. It > will help and I would think in your area (CO being the naturalist > place it is) there would be some good ones. You can get take out > from those places too. I would guess this is maybe the biggest > difference in the last month. I used eat out practically everyday. It's possible, but typically expensive and time consuming. The likely choice organic foods market in Boulder has the parking lot from hell, for example, and I'm literally afraid to park there during peak hours.
> One address: > > http://www.toddycafe.com/ I've been curious about these for a while. Maybe time to check 'em out.
Anyway, I saw a doctor today. She agrees that my symptoms point to IBS, but she also took blood for a thyroid test and I'm supposed to give some icky samples to a lab to rule out parasites and whatnot.
She prescribed me an anti-spasmodic (sp?) to try; curious to see if it will help and how the side effects are. She also mentioned that anti depressants have been successfully used in treating IBS. That's a possibility, but one that makes me uneasy.
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W. Leong - 14 Apr 2006 04:46 GMT > It's possible, but typically expensive and time consuming. The likely > choice organic foods market in Boulder has the parking lot from hell, > for example, and I'm literally afraid to park there during peak hours. I am within walking distance to a health food store and it sells organic foods too. The organic foods market in town is in some obscure places. Maybe you can find a more convenient health food store to get organic food instead of going to the organic foods market. Even some supermarkets carry organic foods now as the demand for them are growing.
> Anyway, I saw a doctor today. She agrees that my symptoms point to > IBS, but she also took blood for a thyroid test and I'm supposed to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > depressants have been successfully used in treating IBS. That's a > possibility, but one that makes me uneasy. I can understand that. I was antidepressants once and stopped taking it before the prescription was finished. There can be many side effects. Did the doctor say your symptoms may be brought on by stress? If you do want to try a high fiber diet, ncrease the fiber slowly.
Winnie
W. Leong - 14 Apr 2006 06:22 GMT > I've been curious about these for a while. Maybe time to check 'em > out. > > Anyway, I saw a doctor today. She agrees that my symptoms point to > IBS, but she also took blood for a thyroid test and I'm supposed to > give some icky samples to a lab to rule out parasites and whatnot. There is a good section on IBS at http://www.drweil.com/u/HC/HCA259/#4 Worth checking it out.
Winnie
> She prescribed me an anti-spasmodic (sp?) to try; curious to see if it > will help and how the side effects are. She also mentioned that anti > depressants have been successfully used in treating IBS. That's a > possibility, but one that makes me uneasy. mlbriggs - 13 Apr 2006 18:47 GMT >> I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is >> not organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > ominously and, er, well, the results just weren't pleasant. You were > right about that one. DH reported similar issues. Perhaps you should try a good soup (no cream) and see how that works. MLB
Monique Y. Mudama - 13 Apr 2006 23:27 GMT > Perhaps you should try a good soup (no cream) and see how that > works. MLB Do you have a specific reason in mind that that would help? Maybe easier to digest?
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mlbriggs - 14 Apr 2006 01:59 GMT >> Perhaps you should try a good soup (no cream) and see how that >> works. MLB > > Do you have a specific reason in mind that that would help? Maybe > easier to digest? That is it! When I have problems, soup seems to be easier to digest. MLB
Yowie - 13 Apr 2006 23:41 GMT >> I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is >> not organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > ominously and, er, well, the results just weren't pleasant. You were > right about that one. DH reported similar issues. I feel fo ryou, Monique. When I'm stressed I get the most aweful stomach cramps then really bad diarrhea too. I have to watch what I eat, as well. Oddly, if I eat too much from the cabbage family, it sets of my cramps and diarrhea. As do all non-naturally occuring sugars (ie, I can have sucrose, fructose, glucose and galactose and lactose but thats about it). I also have to watch by coffee intake, too much or too strong and I'm racing for the loo soon afterwards. It didn't seem to be the caffeine, though, but rather, something else in the cofee, as decaf can do the same thing, and I'm worse if I have instant coffee than I am if I get a proper brew. Tea just makes me pee alot, btu doesn't cause cramps.
Not coincidentally, I found really increasing my fibre intake and decreasing my high-GI foods (like white bread, white rice, chips etc etc) and high-fat foods (fries, pizza etc) and beiing careful with high protein foods (like red meat, cheese - its OK to eat them providing I'm eating them with a good amount of roughage) also helped. Having, erm, 'bulk' in the system seemed to stop it from breaking down into liquid whenever I was stressing. Oh yeah, and drink more water. It sounds counter intuitive, but bulky and well hydrated colon contents are far more resistant to the vagueries of stress induced cramps and diarrhea than hard, dry stools (coz the body has trouble moving those along so tends to 'fluch' them out, rather than letting them move along naturally).
And small meals often seems to work better than large meals with big spaces of 'nothing' in between.
Make sure you walk every day. The act of walking also helps the various muscles, tendons and other bits in our gut area push along the contents. Its also good for you and releives stress :-). One thing I found with my job and stress was that if the weather wasn't good enough to go outside and have a quick walk and see grass & trees & sky etc etc, was to ignore the PC (which is hard when one is addicted to RPCA....) and *paint*. I keep a stash of water colour pencils in a draw, and colour in/paint line drawings i've found on the 'net. I'm in no way an artist, but there is somethign about applying bright colours (everything where I work is grey or some sort of dull muted colour) and being creative about what colour to apply where that really de-stressed me.
Hope you can find somethign that helps in all that.
Yowie
Monique Y. Mudama - 13 Apr 2006 23:49 GMT > Hope you can find somethign that helps in all that. Thank you so much for all of your suggestions, Yowie! My dr. also mentioned trying a higher-fiber diet, saying that it might help or might make it worse, but at least I could try it.
I have gotten to the point where I'm not really working out at all, which is horrible for so many parts of me. Last weekend I did finally get on my mountain bike, both days. I'm hoping to do a lot of that this weekend, too.
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Karen - 14 Apr 2006 02:20 GMT >> Hope you can find somethign that helps in all that. > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > get on my mountain bike, both days. I'm hoping to do a lot of that > this weekend, too. Yeah, increasing my fiber has really helped. You know, I discovered I was eating a LOT of insoluble fiber and not much soluble fiber. So, when I was sickest, I increased the soluble fiber first and then after a week started adding the roughage of insoluble fiber back in. This seems to be working way better. It has taught me I should probably eat some of those things I was not like bread, pasts, rice. Yams are good too. Benefiber helped as it is completely soluble and has no taste (yeah!) so you can really mix it in with anything.
W. Leong - 14 Apr 2006 04:36 GMT > Yeah, increasing my fiber has really helped. You know, I discovered I was > eating a LOT of insoluble fiber and not much soluble fiber. So, when I was [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > is completely soluble and has no taste (yeah!) so you can really mix it in > with anything. Karen, can you mention a few food items that are high in soluble fiber and some that are heigh in insoluble fibre? Which type of fibre are in green vegetables and beans? Thanks!
Winnie
Karen - 14 Apr 2006 05:25 GMT >> Yeah, increasing my fiber has really helped. You know, I discovered I >> was eating a LOT of insoluble fiber and not much soluble fiber. So, [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Winnie This is the list I kept seeing everywhere for soluble fiber so, I worked off that and added all other fibers back in; seems like most everything else is insoluble to some degree. But I'm not an expert by any means. There is very little on this list that I ate before:
As a general rule, the grain and cereal foods at the top of this list make the safest, easiest, and most versatile soluble fiber foundations for your meals and snacks.
Rice Pasta and noodles Oatmeal Barley Fresh white breads such as French or sourdough (NOT whole wheat or whole grain)* Rice cereals Flour tortillas Soy Quinoa Corn meal Potatoes Carrots Yams Sweet potatoes Turnips Rutabagas Parsnips Beets Squash and pumpkins Mushrooms Chestnuts AvocadosBananas Applesauce Mangoes Papayas
*Please choose a baked-daily, high quality, preservative-free brand. White bread does not mean Wonder.
sriddles@aol.com - 13 Apr 2006 16:21 GMT > I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is not > organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). I am also [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > organic white bread. Just some thoughts (takes some planning but does seem > to make a diff). Glad you're feeling better! I bet it is next to impossible to find a restaurant that serves organic food. It's hard here, to find a restaurant that has options for a fat-free diet. You'd be surprised how many of them don't even have a bottle of fat-free salad dressing, or offer egg substitute. . Maybe it's just a southern thing. It's better than it used to be. At least now, even the fast food places have things like fat-free smoothies.
Sherry
Karen - 13 Apr 2006 16:54 GMT > > I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is not > > organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). I am also [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Sherry It's not too bad here in Lincoln actually. But I can imagine down south would be horrible.
Karen - 13 Apr 2006 16:57 GMT Hey, check this out:
http://www.oklahomafood.coop/pipermail/members/2005-February/000217.html
sriddles@aol.com - 13 Apr 2006 22:11 GMT > Hey, check this out: > > http://www.oklahomafood.coop/pipermail/members/2005-February/000217.html That's interesting, and very annoying. He's absolutely right about two things: You have to watch what the legislature sneaks through. That bill was passed purely for the benefit of big business, NOT for food safety for Oklahomans. Second thing is, if you have ever eaten a "yard chicken", the meat bears absolutely no resemblance to that putrid, disgusting, slimy, stinky stuff Tyson passes off at the meat counter. Healthy yard-bird meat isn't even close to the same color, or smell, or taste, as Tyson chicken. I quit buying meat-counter chicken ages ago. I also only buy free-range eggs for DH. They're way better too, and keep fresh a lot longer.
Monique Y. Mudama - 13 Apr 2006 17:12 GMT > Glad you're feeling better! I bet it is next to impossible to find a > restaurant that serves organic food. It's hard here, to find a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > thing. It's better than it used to be. At least now, even the fast > food places have things like fat-free smoothies. Why fat free as opposed to low-fat? My understanding is that fat free foods often uses sugar or other sweeteners to "make up for" the flavor loss.
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sriddles@aol.com - 13 Apr 2006 22:05 GMT > > Glad you're feeling better! I bet it is next to impossible to find a > > restaurant that serves organic food. It's hard here, to find a [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > -- > monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully I don't care anything about sugar or calories. I'm too thin already and I always try to choose high-calorie stuff. The problem is, I am on the heart-healthy diet, and if I stick to it, I can barely maintain the weight I have. It's the fat that I have to avoid, because of artery disease.
Sherry
Monique Y. Mudama - 13 Apr 2006 22:20 GMT > I don't care anything about sugar or calories. I'm too thin already > and I always try to choose high-calorie stuff. The problem is, I am > on the heart-healthy diet, and if I stick to it, I can barely > maintain the weight I have. It's the fat that I have to avoid, > because of artery disease. Interesting. I'm still surprised you would have to go with no fat, as opposed to low fat.
I tried a very low fat diet two years ago. It was great for a while, but it didn't work for me in the long run. I don't think it was wise for me to be putting in serious miles on the bicycle every day and still eating a very fat-limited diet.
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sriddles@aol.com - 13 Apr 2006 22:49 GMT > > I don't care anything about sugar or calories. I'm too thin already > > and I always try to choose high-calorie stuff. The problem is, I am [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Interesting. I'm still surprised you would have to go with no fat, as > opposed to low fat. Extremely low cholesterol has been proven to reverse CAD. (along with other lifestyle stuff of course... I didn't suffer through three surgeries so I could eat Ranch dressing. LOL. "Low fat" is relative. Look at the label for "low fat" salad dressing. Six to eight grams of fat per tablespoon...that's a lot of fat grams to blow on salad dressing. If I'm going to ingest six fat grams, it's gonna be on something I like a lot better than "no fat" vs. "low fat" salad dressing. It's a balance, really. But after going off high-fat food for nearly five years, it tastes gross to me now anyway.
Sherry
> but it didn't work for me in the long run. I don't think it was wise > for me to be putting in serious miles on the bicycle every day and > still eating a very fat-limited diet. I can see how limiting protein would be very bad for you, but I don't see the benefit of saturated fat in your diet. What is it?
Sherry
> -- > monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully > > pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca Monique Y. Mudama - 13 Apr 2006 23:12 GMT >> Interesting. I'm still surprised you would have to go with no fat, >> as opposed to low fat. > > blow on salad dressing. If I'm going to ingest six fat grams, it's > gonna be on something I like a lot better than "no fat" vs. "low > fat" salad dressing. It's a balance, really. Yeah, that makes perfect sense.
>> but it didn't work for me in the long run. I don't think it was >> wise for me to be putting in serious miles on the bicycle every day >> and still eating a very fat-limited diet. > > I can see how limiting protein would be very bad for you, but I > don't see the benefit of saturated fat in your diet. What is it? Well, I didn't say saturated fat! Fat is fuel, and I put myself on a regimen of maybe 30g of fat a day, much less than was actually recommended for even a lean diet. And on that I was doing several hours of strenuous exercise every day.
Later I read some articles specifically talking about how endurance athletes (not sure I fit into that category, exactly, but anyway) performed better and had fewer illnesses and injuries in the long run if they consumed more fat.
I dunno. Covert Bailey says that even athletes do well on low-fat diets. I guess you can find someone to support just about anything.
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jmcquown - 14 Apr 2006 01:42 GMT > I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is not > organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). (snippage)
I saw Paul Newman on The Tonight Show last week. His daughter (Lisa?) introduced an organic line of foods as a subsidiary off of his Newman's Own food line (proceeds of which go to various charities). His daughter introduced organic dog food. Jay Leno made him a bet of $10 that Paul Newman wouldn't eat the organic dog food. Paul hesitated a moment, then grabbed the open can (chicken and brown rice, I believe it was) and took a spoonful and ate it. He actually looked like he liked it. As they were cutting to a commercial break, he took another spoonful and was eating it.
I don't know if this proves anything other than Paul Newman supports his daughters efforts to offer organic dog food, but pulleeeze... I don't want to see someone eating canned dog food on television! Reminds me of Johnny Carson begging for Alpo when Ed McMahon used to do live commercials for that product. I fed my dog Alpo until he was elderly and on prescription food but I wouldn't have eaten it. Would you (the collective you) eat Fancy Feast? That stuff is often more expensive than a can of jack mackerel or salmon when it comes to the weight of the cans. Come on, folks.
I have nothing against organic but I'm not going to avoid foodstuffs that don't use pesticides. I use pesticides in my house when those damned Palmetto bugs and Wolf crickets wander in from outside. I just make sure it doesn't affect me and my cats or their food supply.
Jill
Jo Firey - 14 Apr 2006 02:49 GMT >> I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is not >> organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > Jill Charlie came home with several different types of treats for the dog last week. He said the guy running the cash register was snacking on some of them. I must admit they smell better than what we used to give our dog when I was a kid.
And my daughter ate plenty of Purina Dog Chow when she was a baby. Didn't seem to do any harm.
Jo
EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) - 14 Apr 2006 04:18 GMT >>I tell you what, since I started avoiding almost anything that is not >>organic I have seen a major improvement (also on Librax still). [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Feast? That stuff is often more expensive than a can of jack mackerel or > salmon when it comes to the weight of the cans. Come on, folks. Depends upon what else was available! ;-) Actually, it's perfectly wholesome food (and, unlike some dog-food, does not contain ground bone, which isn't particularly designed for the human digestive system). The fish-flavored ones are a bit too fishy-tasting for human palates, and the meats are too bland (although a little salt and a few herbs would probably take care of that), but if it were served to you with crackers and a spreader, and you didn't know it was "pet food", I suspect most of us would ind it perfectly acceptable.
> I have nothing against organic but I'm not going to avoid foodstuffs that > don't use pesticides. I use pesticides in my house when those damned > Palmetto bugs and Wolf crickets wander in from outside. I just make sure it > doesn't affect me and my cats or their food supply. As I understand it, foods raised without pesticides are free of pests because of being grown with other foods that repel the pests that might attack them. Also, sometimes the pesticides incorporate themselves INTO the food (DDT and food-fish, for example - one reason DDT is no longer routinely used).
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Tish Silberbauer - 14 Apr 2006 05:24 GMT >> I have nothing against organic but I'm not going to avoid foodstuffs that >> don't use pesticides. I use pesticides in my house when those damned [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >food-fish, for example - one reason DDT is no longer >routinely used). <minor rant warning> Organic producers / growers *do* use pesticides, it's just that they use pesticides derived from natural products - e.g. pyrethrum derived from the pyrethrum plant (a kind of daisy) or garlic, rather than generated in a laboratory. It is a very common fallacy that organic means "pesticide free", but it ain't so.
I do, however, strongly agree that the reduction in use (or banning) of long-term, persistent pesticides and herbicides (like DDT) is a good thing and we were stupid to have ever used these things. People will be paying for the use of these poisons for generations to come - just look at the poor folks in Vietnam who are still suffering the after-effects of the abuse of the defoliant (i.e. a herbicide) Agent Orange during the Vietnam war.
Oddly enough, some of these natural pesticides (pyrethrum being a good example) *can* be more damaging to the local insect ecology than the nasty laboratory ones that have a more specific action. Pyrethrum is extremely good at killing insects (unless they develop resistance - another story), but its problem is that it is very broad in its action and will kill beneficial as well as pest insects. If you're an organic or biodynamic farmer and want / need to maintain healthy population of beneficial insects, which includes pollinators like bees and predators like ladybirds, frequent spraying the totally natural, organic and earth-friendly pyrethrum will do more harm than good. Other pest control methods, like companion planting that Evelyn mentioned, are more complex to use and require much more time monitoring both pest and beneficial insect populations, but in a small-scale operation that doesn't use large-scale monocultures, can be better in the long run.
<rant finished>
I suppose that I'd better go out to my veggie patch now and pick off the cabbage white butterfly eggs that have been laid on my broccoli seedlings. I only have 8 seedlings, so it's not too much of a chore! Keeping the kangaroo out of my veggie patch is much more of a challenge! (they've eaten *all* the leaves off my okra, stripped the parsley, nibbled most of my chillis, and are having a serious attempt at my basil - grrrr!).
Gosh, I didn't expect I'd write that much! Tish
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 14 Apr 2006 06:33 GMT > but in a small-scale operation that doesn't use large-scale > monocultures, can be better in the long run. Tish, just wondering what the word "monocultures" means in this context. Does it mean planting a large area with a single crop, rather than mixing different ones together?
Joyce
Tish Silberbauer - 14 Apr 2006 08:25 GMT > > but in a small-scale operation that doesn't use large-scale > > monocultures, can be better in the long run. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >Joyce I guess I was trying to make the distinction between a market garden or home veggie patch and the broadacre crops like wheat, cotton and canola. There is a fair bit of evidence that mixing different crops or vegetation types (doesn't always have to be crops - can be native or decorative plants) in small patches means you have fewer pest problems than having a lot of a single type of vegetation. Caveat: this is not my area of speciality, it is just something I'm interested in.
Cheers, Tish
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 14 Apr 2006 09:04 GMT > >Tish, just wondering what the word "monocultures" means in this context.
> I guess I was trying to make the distinction between a market garden > or home veggie patch and the broadacre crops like wheat, cotton and > canola. I've heard the term before and haven't been quite sure what it means. Sounds like I guessed pretty much correctly.
Joyce
sriddles@aol.com - 14 Apr 2006 15:11 GMT > > > but in a small-scale operation that doesn't use large-scale > > > monocultures, can be better in the long run. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > Cheers, > Tish Yes, that's right, to my understanding too. Monoculture is like acres and acres of the same thing--that's a paradise to aphids, and other pests. Organic gardening relies a lot on "companion" crops. Like planting marigolds with your squash because it repels squash bugs. And planting lavender and things that attract ladybugs and preying mantises, so that you'll have them to eat the aphids and bad bugs. Roses like to have garlic as a "companion". Companion crops aren't a new fad at all. The Native Americans used that concept. Isn't it funny how after all the chemical research to develop the chemical sprays, all the developing of the technology to have a way to spray them, some of us like to go back to the way the Native Americans did it hundreds of years ago. Sherry
Yowie - 15 Apr 2006 13:06 GMT >>> I have nothing against organic but I'm not going to avoid foodstuffs >>> that [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > parsley, nibbled most of my chillis, and are having a serious attempt > at my basil - grrrr!). Soundl sike the 'roos have a penchant for Thai food, although the image of a 'roo suffering from 'chilli burn' (in either of the orifices that are susceptable) is quite amusing.
Yowie
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