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'Monster' Cat In China Weighs 33 Pounds

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NMR - 21 Feb 2006 01:50 GMT
http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H


http://tinyurl.com/mql5m

The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but prefers to eat
six pounds of chicken and pork each day.

Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat
NanCe - 21 Feb 2006 02:33 GMT
>http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>http://tinyurl.com/mql5m
>The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but prefers to eat
>six pounds of chicken and pork each day.

I have a hard time believing it is healthy - according to who, the owner?
How would he even clean himself!  Friggin' sad.

NanCe
kilikini - 21 Feb 2006 12:56 GMT
>http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

> >http://tinyurl.com/mql5m
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> NanCe

I saw this on CNN!  The poor cat can't even jump on the bed to take a nap;
the slave has to carry him and place him there!  This cat looks more like a
hairy puffer fish than a cat.  It's terrible.

kili
Magic Mood Jeep© - 21 Feb 2006 02:50 GMT
> http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat

I saw this creature on Fox News (Fox Report with Shepherd Smith), poor kitty
has a 31.5 inch waist - can't stand up for very long, and is unable to even
climb up the steps they made/bought so that it can get onto their bed - poor
thing would get up one step and stop, and they would lift him/her the rest
of the way.  And it's not chicken and pork, it's chicken and PORT (as in the
wine)

There's a video link on www.foxnews.com - under "Today's Features", or do a
search for "Big Boned", which is the title of the clip.  It's also under
Free Video under the title of Skinnerville.
Claude V. Lucas - 21 Feb 2006 02:58 GMT
>http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>>
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>search for "Big Boned", which is the title of the clip.  It's also under
>Free Video under the title of Skinnerville.

I saw that.

I'll never again refer to Bubba as "fat".

Claude
D. - 21 Feb 2006 03:38 GMT
> There's a video link on www.foxnews.com - under "Today's Features", or do a
> search for "Big Boned", which is the title of the clip.  It's also under
> Free Video under the title of Skinnerville.

Poor thing. :(

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T - 21 Feb 2006 03:59 GMT
> http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat

I just had to euthanize a 27lb cat who had gone down to 24lbs. The
reason was that he had a multitude of problems including hepatic
lipidosis, diabetes, kidney failure, a UTI, osteoarthritis and those are
just the few I can remember.

According to the vet it's genetic.
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 21 Feb 2006 04:41 GMT
In rec.pets.cats.anecdotes T <nospam.kd1s@cox.nospam.net> wrote:

> I just had to euthanize a 27lb cat who had gone down to 24lbs. The
> reason was that he had a multitude of problems including hepatic
> lipidosis, diabetes, kidney failure, a UTI, osteoarthritis and those are
> just the few I can remember.

I'm sorry to hear this. :(

I don't know the circumstances of his weight loss, but if he was sick
and not eating, then he might have lost weight too quickly, which can
*cause* hepatic lipidosis. If a cat needs to lose weight, it should be
done very carefully, to avoid overwhelming the cat's liver with too
much fat as it's being burned for fuel. I'm not saying it's your fault,
even if you were trying to slim him down, because it's pretty tricky.
Most vets will say that if you're going to put your cat on a diet, it
should be done under the vet's supervision.

Of course, your cat had other problems, too, some of which might have
been caused or aggravated by his weight, so it wasn't all that simple.

Joyce
Gabey8 - 22 Feb 2006 09:15 GMT
[[I just had to euthanize a 27lb cat who had gone down to 24lbs. The
reason was that he had a multitude of problems including hepatic
lipidosis, diabetes, kidney failure, a UTI, osteoarthritis and those are
just the few I can remember.

According to the vet it's genetic.]]

I'm sorry to hear of your loss. :o(

I can believe that in some cats' cases, weight problems are genetic in
origin. Goodness knows that there are humans fighting the same battle.

But as long as the owner works closely with the vet to manage the cat's
health as best they can, there's not much more that the owner can do, even
if they DO have an exceptionally large or heavy cat.

If I thought that was the case with this super-sized feline in China, I
wouldn't feel so sorry for the cat. I hope that the owner ends up in touch
with some qualified vets as a result of this story going on TV.

Donna
badwilson - 21 Feb 2006 05:22 GMT
Good gawd, they are killing that poor cat :-(  It's waist is bigger than
mine and 6 lbs of meat per day?!?!  I eat that in a week and I'm a 5'6"
human.
Signature

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overflow.
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http://photos.yahoo.com/badwilson click on the Vino album

> http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat
Helen Miles - 21 Feb 2006 10:19 GMT
> The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but prefers to eat
> six pounds of chicken and pork each day./////

Good grief! Mine are lucky if they eat 250g of food a day!! I feel sorry
for the poor cat. :o(

Helen M
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 21 Feb 2006 10:21 GMT
>> The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but
>> prefers to eat six pounds of chicken and pork each day.

> Good grief! Mine are lucky if they eat 250g of food a day!! I feel sorry
> for the poor cat. :o(

Perhaps this is a hoax? That site is full of tabloid junk. Who knows
how much of it is true? Or, even if somewhat true, perhaps greatly
exaggerated?

Joyce
RobZip - 21 Feb 2006 10:58 GMT
> Perhaps this is a hoax? That site is full of tabloid junk. Who knows
> how much of it is true? Or, even if somewhat true, perhaps greatly
> exaggerated?
>
> Joyce

Not a hoax. I saw the same video of the poor thing being helped up on the
bed on CNN. The owner blames the huge size on the cat having a large
appetite. The reporter commented on just how does the cat aquire 6 pounds of
chicken every day. This cat seriously looked like a bloated, ready to  pop
tick.
armshome@aol.com - 21 Feb 2006 11:13 GMT
I saw it on the news too, but wonder if the 6 pounds is in error?
Maybe converted incorrectly?  Surely evern a 30 pound cat could not eat
6 pounds of food per day!  That is i/5 his weight.  Think of 1/5  of
your weight.  Could you eat 25 pounds per day??
RobZip - 21 Feb 2006 11:49 GMT
> I saw it on the news too, but wonder if the 6 pounds is in error?
> Maybe converted incorrectly?  Surely evern a 30 pound cat could not eat
> 6 pounds of food per day!  That is i/5 his weight.  Think of 1/5  of
> your weight.  Could you eat 25 pounds per day??

Error or not, it's wayyy too much, huh?
kilikini - 21 Feb 2006 13:00 GMT
> > Perhaps this is a hoax? That site is full of tabloid junk. Who knows
> > how much of it is true? Or, even if somewhat true, perhaps greatly
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> chicken every day. This cat seriously looked like a bloated, ready to  pop
> tick.

Didn't it?  My husband and I sat there watching the program, eyes huge and
mouth dropped open.  That cat weighs more than all three of mine combined!
6 pounds of chicken a day?  My hubby did the math and said that's about 2
whole roasters for that cat every day.  When we roast a chicken for us, 1
single chicken, it lasts for 3 meals.

kili
hamandcheese@betweentheknees.com - 21 Feb 2006 17:25 GMT
>> Perhaps this is a hoax? That site is full of tabloid junk. Who knows
>> how much of it is true? Or, even if somewhat true, perhaps greatly
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>chicken every day. This cat seriously looked like a bloated, ready to  pop
>tick.

I saw it on TV as well and noticed that even when just lying there his
breathing was labored.

-mhd
cybercat - 21 Feb 2006 17:55 GMT
> >> Perhaps this is a hoax? That site is full of tabloid junk. Who knows
> >> how much of it is true? Or, even if somewhat true, perhaps greatly
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> -mhd

I wanted to slap that cheesy grin right off the guy's face. What a cruel
idiot.
hamandcheese@betweentheknees.com - 21 Feb 2006 18:10 GMT
>> I saw it on TV as well and noticed that even when just lying there his
>> breathing was labored.
>> -mhd
>
>I wanted to slap that cheesy grin right off the guy's face. What a cruel
>idiot.

My sentiments as well.
-mhd
Monique Y. Mudama - 21 Feb 2006 19:17 GMT
>> Perhaps this is a hoax? That site is full of tabloid junk. Who
>> knows how much of it is true? Or, even if somewhat true, perhaps
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> aquire 6 pounds of chicken every day. This cat seriously looked like
> a bloated, ready to  pop tick.

Yeah, it's the cat's fault for having a big appetite.  Not.  How
irresponsible can people be?

Nevermind.  I already know the answer.

Signature

monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully

pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca

jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 21 Feb 2006 20:40 GMT
In rec.pets.cats.anecdotes RobZip <whoknows@why.net> wrote:

> Not a hoax. I saw the same video of the poor thing being helped up on the
> bed on CNN. The owner blames the huge size on the cat having a large
> appetite. The reporter commented on just how does the cat aquire 6 pounds of
> chicken every day. This cat seriously looked like a bloated, ready to  pop
> tick.

I didn't mean that the cat weighing 33 lbs was a hoax, but that he ate
6 lbs of meat a day seems like an exaggeration.

Joyce
NMR - 21 Feb 2006 16:58 GMT
> >> The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but
> >> prefers to eat six pounds of chicken and pork each day.
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> Joyce

Which site Joyce  if you are talking about local 6  site it is a news
channel website not a tabloid site all that stuff you see is happening or
has happened in Florida or the world
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 21 Feb 2006 20:49 GMT
In rec.pets.cats.anecdotes NMR <haveyouplonkedatrolltoday@anti-troll.com> wrote:

> Which site Joyce  if you are talking about local 6  site it is a news
> channel website not a tabloid site all that stuff you see is happening or
> has happened in Florida or the world

But the focus is totally on sensational stories, weird events, tragic
accidents, fires, killings, kidnappings, illnesses, scare stories. Didn't
see any world news on the site, although I only looked for a few minutes,
so maybe I missed it. But just the fact that it's easy to miss tells you
something about how prominent world issues are to that station.

I'm not saying the news is not real. I'm just talking about the focus on
the site - it's definitely tabloid material.

Joyce
Helen Miles - 21 Feb 2006 10:22 GMT
> Good grief! Mine are lucky if they eat 250g of food a day!! I feel sorry
> for the poor cat. :o(
>
> Helen M

And I forgot to mention that 225g of that is gooshy canned food!

Helen M
jmcquown - 22 Feb 2006 08:24 GMT
>> The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but prefers
>> to eat six pounds of chicken and pork each day./////
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Helen M

Undoubtedly the cat doesn't know any better.  Poor thing!  Here I thought
Persia was wickedly fat at 16 lbs.!

Jill
Karen - 21 Feb 2006 15:14 GMT
It really seems to me that this type of overweightness HAS to be genetic. I
can see the dry food cats really gaining but to be eating largely protein
and gain this kind of weight is not just excess calories (I don't believe
anyway). I don't think ALL overweight problems are genetic, but I seriously
believe there is something genetically out of whack for this kind of
obesity.

http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H


> http://tinyurl.com/mql5m
>
> The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but prefers to eat
> six pounds of chicken and pork each day.
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat
Alison - 21 Feb 2006 16:29 GMT
http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H


> http://tinyurl.com/mql5m
>
> The cat's owner said it has no interest in eating fish but prefers to eat
> six pounds of chicken and pork each day.
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat >.

I saw it on the BBC news. Poor cat , I felt so sorry for it.
Alison
mlabofski@yahoo.co.uk - 21 Feb 2006 16:48 GMT
I'm sorry but what the beep is wrong with people?  As far as I am
concerned that guy is abusing his cat by not controlling what it eats,
and if it was in England and I knew him I would report him to the RSPCA
for cruelty, it makes me so mad!  It reminds me of a documentary I saw
called something like Feeders, which was about people who fed and
encouraged morbidly obese people to get even bigger, thus in effect
abusing and sometimes killing them.

Grrr

Marcia

> http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat
NMR - 21 Feb 2006 16:55 GMT
Agreed
> I'm sorry but what the beep is wrong with people?  As far as I am
> concerned that guy is abusing his cat by not controlling what it eats,
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>>
>> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat
wafflycat - 21 Feb 2006 17:09 GMT
> http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat

It's basically animal abuse. Poor cat :-(

helen s
PawsForThought - 21 Feb 2006 20:57 GMT
> http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat

I saw this on the news this morning.  Poor kitty, it was really
pathetic that anyone would let their cat get that fat :(
sriddles@aol.com - 21 Feb 2006 22:56 GMT
> > http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

> >
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> I saw this on the news this morning.  Poor kitty, it was really
> pathetic that anyone would let their cat get that fat :(

Poor thing. Cherokee was 25 lbs but he didn't look anything like that!
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 21 Feb 2006 23:17 GMT
In rec.pets.cats.anecdotes sriddles@aol.com wrote:

>> I saw this on the news this morning.  Poor kitty, it was really
>> pathetic that anyone would let their cat get that fat :(

> Poor thing. Cherokee was 25 lbs but he didn't look anything like that!

It's not about how the cat looks, though. It's about whether the cat's
weight is affecting its health.

It makes me suspicious whenever someone tells me, "I'm just concerned for
your *health*", when they suggest I lose some weight - when I know that
what they really mean is that they don't like my looks. I am pretty healthy,
after all. (And I'm not young.)

Anyway, I don't think the issues are the same for humans and felines.
Human bodies can adapt to storing a lot of fat, and it doesn't mean one
is unhealthy (contrary to popular myth). But cats really can't tolerate a
lot of fat in their system, as it can lead to fatty liver syndrome and a
host of other problems. Also, a fat person can choose to exercise more,
to build up their muscles so they can carry their weight better and not
suffer so much damage to their knees and so forth. A cat isn't going to
do that. And since a person is in control of their diet, they can choose
whether to eat healthful food or not (which doesn't necessarily determine
one's weight, but certainly can affect one's health). A domestic cat cannot.

Still, when I hear someone talking about how bad a fat cat *looks*, I
wonder if we're not just projecting our own prejudices on the cat (and
by extension, onto their human caretaker). Someone else compared the cat
in China to a bloated tick. We don't really need to go there, do we?

Joyce
sriddles@aol.com - 21 Feb 2006 23:41 GMT
> In rec.pets.cats.anecdotes sriddles@aol.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> Joyce

No, I'm not projecting anything of the sort. I just didn't elaborate or
perhaps choose my words well. By the way the cat "looks" I don't mean
the asthetic beauty, I mean that fat cats "look" miserable and unable
to be active. Cherokee didn't look that way. At 25 lbs, he was big, he
was overweight, but not to the extent I would have considered him
morbidly obese. He died at 17 and was still as active as any cat I've
had.
Come to think of it, there are *people* who are overweight, and then
there's people who likewise look miserable and unable to be active.
But if someone told me I needed to lose weight for my health, I'm
afraid I'd be pretty annoyed and suggest they MYOB.

Sherry
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 21 Feb 2006 23:53 GMT
> By the way the cat "looks" I don't mean
> the asthetic beauty, I mean that fat cats "look" miserable and unable
> to be active. Cherokee didn't look that way. At 25 lbs, he was big, he
> was overweight, but not to the extent I would have considered him
> morbidly obese. He died at 17 and was still as active as any cat I've
> had.

Ah... thank you for clarifying.

> Come to think of it, there are *people* who are overweight, and then
> there's people who likewise look miserable and unable to be active.
> But if someone told me I needed to lose weight for my health, I'm
> afraid I'd be pretty annoyed and suggest they MYOB.

Yeah, altogether too many people seem to feel entitled to weigh in, excuse
the pun, with their unwanted opinion!

Joyce
sriddles@aol.com - 22 Feb 2006 04:07 GMT
>  > By the way the cat "looks" I don't mean
>  > the asthetic beauty, I mean that fat cats "look" miserable and unable
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
> Joyce

That goes both ways, too. People think it is perfectly acceptable (and
even complimentary) to say things like "If you don't gain weight you
are going to blow away" et. etc. After I had surgery I lost a lot of
weight. I got sick of the comments like that. You would *never* say
something like that to someone who needed to *lose* weight, but somehow
they thought criticism of the opposite was okay to say to someone.

Sherry
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 22 Feb 2006 07:40 GMT
> That goes both ways, too. People think it is perfectly acceptable (and
> even complimentary) to say things like "If you don't gain weight you
> are going to blow away" et. etc.

Well, I think that's pretty rude! I guess really thinness-obsessed
people would consider it a compliment, which is a sad comment on them,
isn't it?

Or how about this one: after someone's been sick, saying to them, "Hey,
you look great, have you lost weight?" Yeah, sure, it's called the
Chemotherapy Diet. Duh!

> You would *never* say
> something like that to someone who needed to *lose* weight

You'd be surprised how many people do indeed say that! You might never
say it, and I commend you for that, but there are a lot of clods in the
world. As you have unfortunately experienced!

Joyce
meee - 22 Feb 2006 10:53 GMT
> > That goes both ways, too. People think it is perfectly acceptable (and
> > even complimentary) to say things like "If you don't gain weight you
> > are going to blow away" et. etc.
>snip

yes I had to put up with this one, and many 'anorexia related' puns as a
teenager, even though I ate like a horse (which of course made everyone at
school whisper that I was bulimic) Fortunately 2 kids and 10 years have
restored me to social acceptable-ness!! (???) pity our society is still so
superficial....or that a small percentage seems to think they have the right
to set a 'standard' for 'normality'
NMR - 22 Feb 2006 15:24 GMT
>> > That goes both ways, too. People think it is perfectly acceptable (and
>> > even complimentary) to say things like "If you don't gain weight you
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> superficial....or that a small percentage seems to think they have the
> right to set a 'standard' for 'normality'

I love a woman with a little meat on the bones :-D
Got to have the handles  No I won't finish that sentence in fear of not
waking up
meee - 23 Feb 2006 02:16 GMT
>>> > That goes both ways, too. People think it is perfectly acceptable (and
>>> > even complimentary) to say things like "If you don't gain weight you
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
:) That's what my dh says! So I make sure I eat plenty of chocolate to keep
him happy....:)
Monique Y. Mudama - 21 Feb 2006 23:59 GMT
> It makes me suspicious whenever someone tells me, "I'm just
> concerned for your *health*", when they suggest I lose some weight -
> when I know that what they really mean is that they don't like my
> looks. I am pretty healthy, after all. (And I'm not young.)

Ah, yes, my mom's favorite tactic.

She's been good lately, though.  Obviously making an effort to bite
her tongue, but I really do appreciate it.

It's really frustrating because while, yes, she wears a smaller size
than I do, she is also extremely inflexible, prone to falls, and
generally out of shape -- and she smokes.  I'm much more worried about
her health than about mine.

Signature

monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully

pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca

jmcquown - 25 Feb 2006 18:49 GMT
> In rec.pets.cats.anecdotes sriddles@aol.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> know that what they really mean is that they don't like my looks. I
> am pretty healthy, after all. (And I'm not young.)

I would *never* suggest to someone they lose weight, for their health or
otherwise.  It's not my concern.  You are, however, correct in your
assumption that it's about appearance rather than someone truly caring
(unless they know you've been diagnosed with a condition your weight - in
either direction - compromises).

What bugs me is overweight people complaining about being overweight *and*
about health problems but making no attempt to do anything about it.

6 lbs. of chicken per day for a cat is ridiculous.  But then, I worked with
a man who weighed almost 400 lbs. and was about to go in for gastric bypass
surgery.  The day before he took off to go have the surgery he went out and
got TWO large orders of batter fried fish, chips, hush puppies for lunch and
sat and devoured them at his desk.  He seemed proud of himself as he
commented, "I'm going to eat as much as I can before I have this surgery."
Totally wrong attitude; I'm surprised the doctors agreed to do the surgery
since he obviously wasn't committed to weight loss or his health but rather
committed to a 'quick fix'.  This same man didn't follow the doctors orders
after the surgery (liquid diet, then soft foods, then gradually work into
solids and NO FAT, NO SUGAR).  He was scarfing down a cheeseburger and pizza
two weeks after the surgery and wound up in the hospital.  His system
couldn't handle it.

> Anyway, I don't think the issues are the same for humans and felines.
> Human bodies can adapt to storing a lot of fat, and it doesn't mean
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
>
> Joyce

What's her name, former model Tyra Banks, did a show where they padded her
up in a "fat suit" and she went out shopping in NYC so she could experience
the attitudes overweight people get.  She had a tiny camera built into the
glasses they had her wear and was wired for sound.  She (being a model) was
absolutely shocked at people refusing to look at her, ignoring her in stores
or saying things like "I don't think we have that in your size" when she
hadn't said whether something she was looking at was for her or a gift for
someone else.  She heard rude comments, laughter behind her back.

Then they set her up on three blind dates.  One guy would look anywhere in
the restaurant but *at* her.  She asked each one if they'd ever dated a
large woman before.  One guy was completely honest; said no, large women
weren't his "type".  Another guy said he tried not to judge by looks but you
could tell he was uncomfortable.  All three were floored when she announced
they were on a date with Tyra Banks and called the hidden camera crew over.

It was very telling.

Jill
CatNipped - 27 Feb 2006 21:52 GMT
Jill, I want to let you know that this is not an attack on you, it's just a
vent - it's just that when I read some of the things you wrote it pushed
every single one of my buttons.

> I would *never* suggest to someone they lose weight, for their health or
> otherwise.  It's not my concern.  You are, however, correct in your
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> What bugs me is overweight people complaining about being overweight *and*
> about health problems but making no attempt to do anything about it.

First of all, how do you know that they have made no attempt to do anything
about it?  Because they're fat they're automatically undisciplined, or are
they just blind and can't see how they look in a mirror (because, of course,
it is so easy to simply diet and lose all that ugly fat, isn't it)?

Another person in this thread wrote "people who let themselves become fat".

Let me tell everybody right now, once and for all...

*NOBODY* *CHOOSES* *TO* *BE* *FAT*!!!

Having a choice between this: http://www.possibleplaces.com/Before/ and
this: http://www.possibleplaces.com/After/ does anybody in their right mind
think I would *CHOOSE* or *ALLOW MYSELF* to look (AND FEEL!!) as I looked
for 30 years of my life????!!!!!

Sneering and making fun of fat people is the last bastion of prejudice that
is openly allowed in our society.  Nobody would ever think to make a movie
making fun of African-Americans and stereotyping them as stupid, lazy,
watermelon-eating caricatures.  But it's perfectly alright to depict fat
people as stupid, lazy, do-nut eating caricatures.  Everybody "knows" that
fat people are disgusting, undisciplined slobs with no self-control or
self-respect - and it's perfectly OK to say so right in the open, right in
front of (or, worse, behind the back of) a fat person's face.

> 6 lbs. of chicken per day for a cat is ridiculous.  But then, I worked
> with
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> sat and devoured them at his desk.  He seemed proud of himself as he
> commented, "I'm going to eat as much as I can before I have this surgery."

First, let me say that I feel sorry for this man that who, for at least the
third time, you've sneered at on the world-wide web... and that, apparently,
people think it is perfect OK to do so since nobody has ever remarked that
this is equivalent to saying, "that African-American seemed proud of himself
as he went out and ate watermelon the night before he had surgery to dye his
skin white" (to obtain acceptance in society, to be like everyone else who
has never had to experience prejudice).

Second, *OF COURSE* he wanted to eat as much as he could before surgery.  If
you were told that after a week from today you could *NEVER AGAIN* eat any
of your favorite foods, would *you* not want to go out and enjoy as much of
them as you could before that???!

Before my surgery I went to Outback Steakhouse and had a huge rib-eye,
"Shrimp on the Barbie", and "Death by Chocolate" dessert - absolutely
stuffed myself - because I knew I would never again in my life have that
again, ever!

> Totally wrong attitude; I'm surprised the doctors agreed to do the surgery
> since he obviously wasn't committed to weight loss or his health but
> rather
> committed to a 'quick fix'.

What people don't seem to "get" is that overeating is an addiction like
every other addiction *with one crucial exception* - you can't avoid food
like you can avoid the source of other addictions.  It's like telling a
heroin addict who's trying to quit that he *HAS* to have three "hits" a
day - but only weak stuff that won't give him a high - while everyone around
him is shooting up the good stuff.

Or to put it in a way you may be able to relate to... it's like telling a
smoker who's trying to quit that she *HAS* to have three puffs of tobacco
three times a day - but only of a nasty tasting off brand - while everyone
around her is chain smoking her favorite brand of cigarettes and blowing
smoke in her face.

I'll tell you something... I smoked for over 20 years and three years ago
just stopped and haven't had a cigarette since.  Easy.  No problem.  I could
do it again standing on my head.  But could I lose 100 pounds in a year
without the jump start of bariatric surgery???  No way, no how.  Never.  It
was a thousand times harder than quitting smoking.  I could choose to never
look at or smell another cigarette for as long as I live - but I have to eat
every single day of my life.

And believe me, bariatric surgery is *NOT* a "quick fix".  The surgery
doesn't take away your appetite, your hunger, your cravings for sweets, or
anything else.  It doesn't exercise for you, it doesn't force you to eat a
healthy diet, and it sure as hell doesn't take away all temptation.

It just makes it so you're very sick if you do give in and eat those things.
There are times when I want a piece of cake... I *KNOW* that if I eat that
piece of cake I'll be laying in bed in an hour feeling like I'm dying and
wishing I were dead.  But sometimes I want it so much that I'll accept the
consequences.  That's how bad it gets.

> This same man didn't follow the doctors orders
> after the surgery (liquid diet, then soft foods, then gradually work into
> solids and NO FAT, NO SUGAR).  He was scarfing down a cheeseburger and
> pizza
> two weeks after the surgery and wound up in the hospital.  His system
> couldn't handle it.

That alone should tell you how powerful an addiction overeating is.  Who
would deliberately do something that they *know* might kill them???  ...
Wait a minute, a smoker knows that she may end up with lung cancer, heart
disease, or emphysema - but she still smokes - with the *ADDED* knowledge
that, unlike an overeater, she is not only endangering her own health but
endangering the health of people and *PETS* who are around her when she
gives in to her addiction.

Just FYI, in order to be eligible for bariatric surgery, patients have to
get the approval of an internist, a nutritionist, and a psychiatrist before
they are allowed to have the surgery.

Just think about it... why would anyone undergo major surgery and have
someone go in and put metal staples around their stomach and intestines,
knowing that they may die in surgery or afterwards from complications, if
being thin was just a matter of having a little self discipline????!!!!!!!

> What's her name, former model Tyra Banks, did a show where they padded her
> up in a "fat suit" and she went out shopping in NYC so she could
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> hadn't said whether something she was looking at was for her or a gift for
> someone else.  She heard rude comments, laughter behind her back.

This should be a perfect example for thin people to make them understand
that being fat is *NOT* a choice.  Would anyone knowingly, deliberately, put
on that fat suit and wear it 24/7 in the face of this humiliation and
discrimination???!

And finally, there are people (admittedly not as many as tell themselves
this) who are just naturally large and *NOTHING* they do will change that.
Making fun of them is the same as someone who happened to be born a
straight, WASP male sneering and looking down on someone who happened to be
born a black lesbian.

> Then they set her up on three blind dates.  One guy would look anywhere in
> the restaurant but *at* her.  She asked each one if they'd ever dated a
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> It was very telling.

Yes, it was.  And it was very telling that you could, for at least the third
time, sneer at and write extremely insulting things about fat people who
went through the danger of bariatric surgery as a last resort, and not a
single person has called you on it until now.

Because, you know what (and I'll probably regret letting some people here
know of my deepest, darkest fear)... I am *SO* scared of becoming my
"before" self again that I have to run to a mirror as soon as I get up in
the morning, and then get on the scale, to reassure myself that I really did
manage to lose the weight and it wasn't all just a marvelous dream.

The bariatric surgery is only good for 5 years.  The stomach stretches and
the body compensates for the bypassed intestines by becoming better at
digesting the foods you eat.  So if I gain so much as a couple of ounces my
heart pounds, my palms sweat, and I get sick to my stomach.  I'd want to die
before going back to that (and, realistically, probably would have died
within 5 years if I had not lost the weight)!

Now, before you (probably righteously) jump down my throat, let me
apologize.  Jill, again, I didn't mean to single you out and attack you
about this, but I *really* needed to vent about this subject.  I'd like to
beg the whole world, *PLEASE* try to be a little more understanding and
compassionate when it comes to obesity.

Signature

Hugs,

CatNipped

See all my masters at:  http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/

> Jill
Monique Y. Mudama - 27 Feb 2006 22:07 GMT
> Let me tell everybody right now, once and for all...
>
> *NOBODY* *CHOOSES* *TO* *BE* *FAT*!!!

Thanks for your post, Lori.  It definitely made me think.

I've also often thought that it would be easier not to eat at all than
to eat a restricted diet.

Signature

monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully

pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca

jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 28 Feb 2006 00:19 GMT
> *NOBODY* *CHOOSES* *TO* *BE* *FAT*!!!

That's probably true, for the most part. I do know people who choose
not to diet, and by doing so, they stay fat. But I'm not convinced that
dieting would make them thin anyway, so it's not really much of a choice
after all. (I'm one of these people, by the way.)

It is a myth that we can control our weight in the long run. Most of
us cannot. We can lose weight in the short run, sure. And that's what
gives us the idea that we control our weight. But for 98% of dieters,
it comes back, often with even more weight.

The real clincher for me is that dieting and regaining, over and over,
is so unhealthy that I think it's better for me to remain at my current
size. I'm not saying there are no risks to being at my weight, but until
there is a SAFE, EFFECTIVE, and PERMANENT way to lose weight, I'm not
doing it anymore. Instead, I'm putting my energy into eating well,
exercising, and taking care of my body in the best way I can. So far,
so good.

> Having a choice between this: http://www.possibleplaces.com/Before/ and
> this: http://www.possibleplaces.com/After/ does anybody in their right mind
> think I would *CHOOSE* or *ALLOW MYSELF* to look (AND FEEL!!) as I looked
> for 30 years of my life????!!!!!

Well, frankly, Lori, I don't think you look so bad in the before picture!
It's not a very flattering picture, which has nothing to do with your size.
The picture is blurry, you're not wearing an outfit that flatters your
body as well as another one might, and your haircut in the "after" picture
is much better, too. It's like those weight-loss ads that show before and
after pictures - the before picture always shows the woman in a muumuu and
a bad haircut, looking unhappy, and the picture is blurry and has bad,
unflattering lighting. The after photo always looks clean, crisp, colorful,
and the woman is wearing a great outfit, is made up, and smiling to beat
the band. Well NATURALLY she looks better in the after picture!

Of course, I can't tell you how you *felt* at your higher weight, that's
not something I could know. But I don't think fat equals ugly, so when I
see a fat person, I don't automatically dismiss them as unattractive. It
would take other attributes to turn me off of someone - fat or thin.

However, it's true that most people would not choose to be the object of
prejudice, discrimination, ridicule, rejection, and so forth. So given the
choice, most people would lose weight and keep it off, if they could. So
why can't they? Maybe because biologically, our bodies fight any and all
attempts to lose weight? Your metabolism doesn't know the difference
between chosen and unchosen starvation, after all. And we're still here
on earth because our bodies have evolved ways to keep ourselves from
starving.

What I really can't stand is the moral righteousness people have about
fat people. What is that about? To all who are reading this post: if you
are the kind of person who sneers at a fat person and who believes that
they deserve moral judgement, could you take a few minutes and ask yourself
why you feel the need to make that judgement? What's it to ya, anyway?
Why do you care if a fat person complains about her health, but doesn't
"do anything" about her weight?

My moral values are pretty simple, actually. If a person does something
to hurt another living being, that's morally wrong. If what they're doing
doesn't hurt anyone else, then I make no judgement about it. Sure, I don't
like everyone, and I don't think everyone is beautiful. But that's not a
judgement, that's just me having my own tastes, which we're all entitled
to. I still think you have a right to be whomever you are, whether I like
it or not (which is irrelevant) - as long as you are not doing harm to
another person or other living thing. What you do with your own body,
psyche, spirituality, and life, is truly your business.

> Nobody would ever think to make a movie making fun of African-
> Americans and stereotyping them as stupid, lazy, watermelon-eating
> caricatures.

No, now they're gun-toting gangstas. Don't assume racism is gone just
because polite white people don't express it openly. I do agree with
you that it's still OK to express fat-hatred openly. But as a white
person, I can't assume that racism isn't getting expressed just because
I don't see it very much. Ask any black person you meet, and you'll hear
about being followed in stores by clerks, stopped on the highway for no
reason at all ("Driving While Black"), people crossing the street when
they see them coming. It's still there, even if it's more hidden than it
used to be.

> What people don't seem to "get" is that overeating is an addiction like
> every other addiction *with one crucial exception* - you can't avoid food
> like you can avoid the source of other addictions.

And this assumes that all fat people eat too much, which is simply not
the case. That is a superficial analysis and ignores the complexity of
the human metabolism.

Which is not to deny that many people do have eating disorders, and I'm
sure that is hell to live with and recover from.

Joyce
CatNipped - 28 Feb 2006 01:05 GMT
> Of course, I can't tell you how you *felt* at your higher weight, that's
> not something I could know. But I don't think fat equals ugly, so when I
> see a fat person, I don't automatically dismiss them as unattractive. It
> would take other attributes to turn me off of someone - fat or thin.

Yeah, the statistics above the pictures were more telling than the pictures
themselves.  Had I continued like that I would probably have been dead from
stroke or a heart attack within 5 to 10 years - I most certainly would have
been diabetic (I was insulin resistant already), and probably would have
needed joint replacement surgeries.

Appearances don't really matter to me - DH is still at the same weight he
was and I'd still pick him over Brad Pitt any day.  And talk about being
overweight but still in shape!!!  We saw a work-out machine that someone was
throwing out.  It had adjustable weights for a variety of weight-resistant
exercises.  Ben managed to get it into the bed of our pick-up *BY
HIMSELF*!!!!  Then when we got it home he chivvied it into the garage with
me on it (he asked me to "hold down" one end to get it under the garage
door)!!!!!!!!  I had to do the exercises with just one weight bar even
though it had about ten on it.

> What I really can't stand is the moral righteousness people have about
> fat people. What is that about? To all who are reading this post: if you
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Why do you care if a fat person complains about her health, but doesn't
> "do anything" about her weight?

That's what bothers me the most too.  People who were born to be thin (like
my daughter and son who could both eat candy non-stop all day, every day,
and never gain an ounce), for some reason feel superior to large people
without ever having known what it's like to diet for even a day in their
lives.  They think they have some self-control that large people don't have
when in fact they've never had to test that self control because they've
never had the problem of having to diet in opposition to your natural body
type.

Signature

Hugs,

CatNipped

See all my masters at:  http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/

jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 28 Feb 2006 04:41 GMT
> People who were born to be thin (like my daughter and son who could
> both eat candy non-stop all day, every day, and never gain an ounce),
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> never had the problem of having to diet in opposition to your natural
> body type.

And the irony is, people who can "eat candy non-stop all day" aren't
exactly doing what's best for their health. A skinny, junk-food eating
couch potato isn't living an especially healthy lifestyle, but people
tend not to give them a hard time about it, because it doesn't show.
So why are they getting on a moral high horse about it? (I don't mean
your kids, I'm just talking about naturally thin people who don't gain
weight easily, but don't take very good care of themselves, either.)

Now here's a question: what is so great about "self-control"? I mean,
as a moral virtue. Sure, it's a great thing to be able to do in many
situations, such as when you want to say something horrible to somebody,
but you hold back because you know it will have bad consequences. But
why do we elevate this trait to the level of moral purity? I'll tell you
why I think we do - because those religious fanatics who got kicked out
of England in the 1600s settled this country and their values have
dominated our culture ever since. (I'm talking about the Puritans, in
case anyone wonders what I'm on about.) And now that American values
have become so prominent in the world, we've proudly exported them all
over the world. Wheeee.

No, I'm not saying we should all just do whatever we want whenever we
want. Of course we need to control many of our impulses. But why
eating? Why is that a character failing, if we don't control what we
eat?

Joyce
Cheryl Perkins - 28 Feb 2006 12:54 GMT
<snip>

> Now here's a question: what is so great about "self-control"? I mean,
> as a moral virtue.

I think it's a pretty important moral virtue. If you don't have
self-control, you will never do or think anything that doesn't interest
or benefit you. But like many virtues, it has many forms - how many of us
have think we're exerting self-control when in fact (as others have
mentioned) we aren't even being strongly tempted to do whatever it is we
think we have control over? And it's different for different things -
some people find it very hard to control a hasty or cruel tongue but very
easy to control the desire for owing things (and therefore are very
generous towards others with the money most people would spend on
themselves).

And as with any virtue, it's a lot easier to spot its real or imagined
lack in others than to practice it oneself.

--
Cheryl
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 28 Feb 2006 16:06 GMT
>> what is so great about "self-control"? I mean, as a moral
>> virtue.
>
> I think it's a pretty important moral virtue. If you don't have
> self-control, you will never do or think anything that doesn't
> interest or benefit you.

Well, you didn't quote the part where I also said it's important to
control oneself in many circumstances, because otherwise you end up
hurting people. From your post alone, some people might infer that I
think we should all go around doing and saying whatever we pleased.

I was questioning the idea that "self-control" is such a virtue unto
itself, that people will judge your lack (or *perceived* lack) of it
in reference to behaviors that have no victims. In other words, self-
control becomes an end in itself, rather than simply a means to deal
with social relationships in a decent and civilized way.

I will admire someone who exerts self-control, when not to do so would
cause harm. I will usually judge someone who doesn't. But I don't have
any particular admiration for people who maintain self-control over
their private behaviors, or who do it just for the sake of doing it.
I mean, self-control for its own sake is what anorexia is all about,
isn't it? I find that pathological.

And anyway, I think it's a depressing view of human nature to say that
if nobody had self-control, we'd never do anything nice for each other.
Don't we also have kind impulses? A lack of self-control wouldn't stop
us from acting on those. We'd do a lot of nasty things, too, but I like
to think our basic natures are also good.

Joyce
Cheryl Perkins - 28 Feb 2006 16:39 GMT
>  >> what is so great about "self-control"? I mean, as a moral
>  >> virtue.
>  >
>  > I think it's a pretty important moral virtue. If you don't have
>  > self-control, you will never do or think anything that doesn't
>  > interest or benefit you.

> Well, you didn't quote the part where I also said it's important to
> control oneself in many circumstances, because otherwise you end up
> hurting people. From your post alone, some people might infer that I
> think we should all go around doing and saying whatever we pleased.

I didn't quote that because I wasn't responding to it; I was responding to
the sentence I quoted. And I indicated that I had snipped other material,
so no one should think what I quoted was all you said.

> I was questioning the idea that "self-control" is such a virtue unto
> itself, that people will judge your lack (or *perceived* lack) of it
> in reference to behaviors that have no victims. In other words, self-
> control becomes an end in itself, rather than simply a means to deal
> with social relationships in a decent and civilized way.

There's a lot of interesting ideas in there. If self-control is a virtue,
it should be an end in itself. But it's perfectly obvious that humans have
a tendency to misunderstand what it means to have a particular virtue, and
go way off base trying to achieve it. Love and freedom are virtues, but
you aren't really achieving it if you express your love for your toddler
by giving her freedom to play on the highway.

People also often have a strong tendency to try to figure out where others
fall short in virtue, and to announce their 'findings' loud and clear.
It's *so* much easier than looking at oneself.

I don't support the idea that whether or not there are victims affects
whether or not a particular behaviour is the right thing to do. I don't
agree with judging behaviour by the ends - or by whatever ends are
apparent.

> I will admire someone who exerts self-control, when not to do so would
> cause harm. I will usually judge someone who doesn't. But I don't have
> any particular admiration for people who maintain self-control over
> their private behaviors, or who do it just for the sake of doing it.
> I mean, self-control for its own sake is what anorexia is all about,
> isn't it? I find that pathological.

I don't usually think about it much at all with reference to other people,
because I've noticed when I have done so in the past that I've often
gotten it wrong. There are an astonishing number of people who don't seem
to struggle much at all who are really exerting enormous self control just
to keep going.

I don't know much about anorexia, but although control is important in
many such problems, I wouldn't call it the same thing as the more general
'self control'. There's sometimes an element of struggle for control
between the person and others, particularly family members.

> And anyway, I think it's a depressing view of human nature to say that
> if nobody had self-control, we'd never do anything nice for each other.
> Don't we also have kind impulses? A lack of self-control wouldn't stop
> us from acting on those. We'd do a lot of nasty things, too, but I like
> to think our basic natures are also good.

I tend to think basic human nature is fairly neutral with a bias towards
keeping ourselves alive and reproducing ourselves - which can be
expressed through competition or cooperation. I don't think I'd go as
far as some do in saying that all kind and generous gestures are, deep
down, selfish, though.

Signature

Cheryl

-L. - 28 Feb 2006 01:34 GMT
>  > *NOBODY* *CHOOSES* *TO* *BE* *FAT*!!!
>
> That's probably true, for the most part. I do know people who choose
> not to diet, and by doing so, they stay fat.

It's not a matter of "dieting".  It's a matter of changing your
lifestyle and for many fighting against your "natural" state which is
"overweight" based on "societal"** standards.  A low metabolism is a
survival mechanism in most animals, including humans.  And as Lori said
- it is also a battle against an addiction for many.

**Some societies/cultures value those who are overweight or obese -
it's merely a matter or perspective.

> But I'm not convinced that
> dieting would make them thin anyway, so it's not really much of a choice
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
> and the woman is wearing a great outfit, is made up, and smiling to beat
> the band. Well NATURALLY she looks better in the after picture!

Lori probably doesn't have any good pictures of herself at her highest
weight because she felt so bad about herself either she didn't let
people take photos or her low self-esteem showed in the photos that
were taken.  (Excuse me Lori, if this isn't true.)  I have weighed
everything from 98 to 198 as an adult.  You will never find a pic of me
at 198 - none were taken.  You will only find one of me at 98 - for the
same exact reasons.

> Of course, I can't tell you how you *felt* at your higher weight, that's
> not something I could know. But I don't think fat equals ugly, so when I
> see a fat person, I don't automatically dismiss them as unattractive. It
> would take other attributes to turn me off of someone - fat or thin.

American society does not value people who are even moderately
overweight.  So you are the exception.

> However, it's true that most people would not choose to be the object of
> prejudice, discrimination, ridicule, rejection, and so forth. So given the
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> on earth because our bodies have evolved ways to keep ourselves from
> starving.

Bingo.

> What I really can't stand is the moral righteousness people have about
> fat people. What is that about? To all who are reading this post: if you
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Why do you care if a fat person complains about her health, but doesn't
> "do anything" about her weight?

It seems so petty and sophomoric.

<snip>

> No, now they're gun-toting gangstas. Don't assume racism is gone just
> because polite white people don't express it openly. I do agree with
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> they see them coming. It's still there, even if it's more hidden than it
> used to be.

It's just become more covert and subtle.  Racism is still alive and
well in America.

>  > What people don't seem to "get" is that overeating is an addiction like
>  > every other addiction *with one crucial exception* - you can't avoid food
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> the case. That is a superficial analysis and ignores the complexity of
> the human metabolism.

Bingo.  Plus the addiction,  and the psychological ramifications of
being overweight.

> Which is not to deny that many people do have eating disorders, and I'm
> sure that is hell to live with and recover from.

Many people go from one eating disorder to another.  I have suffered
obesity and anorexia nervosa, both.  And I can tell you that 100% of my
eating disorders stemmed from societal pressure and low self-esteem.
It took me 30-some-odd years to learn not to hate my body - a lesson I
learned from society at a very young age.  We are doing a number on our
little girls in this country.  And it is the bigots and the media who
sneer at overweight girls/women who are guilty.

-L.
sriddles@aol.com - 28 Feb 2006 05:09 GMT
> >  > *NOBODY* *CHOOSES* *TO* *BE* *FAT*!!!
> >
[quoted text clipped - 118 lines]
>
> -L.
CatNipped - 28 Feb 2006 14:29 GMT
>>  > *NOBODY* *CHOOSES* *TO* *BE* *FAT*!!!
>>
[quoted text clipped - 57 lines]
> at 198 - none were taken.  You will only find one of me at 98 - for the
> same exact reasons.

Very true!  Those pictures were taken on a trip to New York City and I *HAD*
to have at least a couple of pictures of me there - but I hated them.  My
clothes were sloppy (except for work), my hair was a mess - because, besides
feeling bad and tired all the time, I had no self-esteem at that point.  I'm
normally a very out-going, happy-go-lucky type person, but when I was that
weight very few people would even bother to talk to me!

I once , while looking for a prom dress for my daughter, walked into a 5-7-9
store and had a skinny little sales girl run up to me before I got two steps
inside the door.  She looked me up and down and said, with sneer on her
face, "Oh we don't sell your sizes in this store."  I said, "Well thank you
for telling me that before I spent hundreds of dollars on my daughter's prom
dress, we wouldn't want a snotty little git like you to have *that*
commission, now would we?"  I stuck my nose up and walked out the store, but
when I got to the parking lot I sat in my car and cried - then I went out
and had a Big Mac (my comfort food - the more people rag on you about your
weight, the worse you feel, and the more comfort food you need).

You see, for me (and I suspect for a lot of other people) overeating wasn't
about being greedy about food.  What I was trying to do was somehow fill up
that huge void inside of me that *should* have been filled with my mother's
love and approval.  By the time I finally realized that was my problem (and
able to give to myself what my mother withheld from me) I was so overweight
(and had been for so long) that simple dieting would never have worked.
Even knowing this about myself, I still have times when I want comfort food,
though - it's insidious.

Signature

Hugs,

CatNipped

See all my masters at:  http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/

>> Of course, I can't tell you how you *felt* at your higher weight, that's
>> not something I could know. But I don't think fat equals ugly, so when I
[quoted text clipped - 67 lines]
>
> -L.
idontmind@gmail.com - 01 Mar 2006 03:04 GMT
> Very true!  Those pictures were taken on a trip to New York City and I *HAD*
> to have at least a couple of pictures of me there - but I hated them.  My
> clothes were sloppy (except for work), my hair was a mess - because, besides
> feeling bad and tired all the time, I had no self-esteem at that point.  I'm
> normally a very out-going, happy-go-lucky type person, but when I was that
> weight very few people would even bother to talk to me!

Actually I just looked at them and they aren't *that* bad.  I was
surprised at the difference though - wowie!

> I once , while looking for a prom dress for my daughter, walked into a 5-7-9
> store and had a skinny little sales girl run up to me before I got two steps
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> and had a Big Mac (my comfort food - the more people rag on you about your
> weight, the worse you feel, and the more comfort food you need).

Good for you telling that *bitch* off.

> You see, for me (and I suspect for a lot of other people) overeating wasn't
> about being greedy about food.  What I was trying to do was somehow fill up
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Even knowing this about myself, I still have times when I want comfort food,
> though - it's insidious.

I struggle with a few comfort foods from time to time. Mac 'N' Cheese -
homemade, baked with onions and a nice creamy sauce.  Damn, that's
good. ;)  That's the one dish passed down from my paternal Grandmother
that I still make.

-L.
jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 01 Mar 2006 05:00 GMT
> I struggle with a few comfort foods from time to time. Mac 'N'
> Cheese - homemade, baked with onions and a nice creamy sauce.
> Damn, that's good. ;)

The ultimate comfort food!! Hmm... maybe that's what I'll have for
dinner... :)

Joyce
CatNipped - 01 Mar 2006 14:01 GMT
>> Very true!  Those pictures were taken on a trip to New York City and I
>> *HAD*
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Actually I just looked at them and they aren't *that* bad.  I was
> surprised at the difference though - wowie!

Well, DH loved the way I looked (he loves big women and I was really worried
about losing a lot of weight - but he still loves me!*  ;>), and I didn't
care about anyone else.  So it wasn't so much the way I looked as it was the
way I felt that prompted me to have the surgery.  I can't tell you how much
it meant to me, when my granddaughters were here, to be able to *RUN* and
play with them - sliding down water slides (well, more like careening down,
LOL), swinging on swings.  The difference in the way I feel, and my future
health outlook (I've probably added at least 20 years to my life, since
we're a long-lived family) - *that's* what amazes me.

*He's also very glad that I'm so much healthier than I was.

>> I once , while looking for a prom dress for my daughter, walked into a
>> 5-7-9
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
> Good for you telling that *bitch* off.

It made me really sad for every woman who was overweight and might have
walked into that store just trying to get some incentive to diet, or just
looking and dreaming.  One of the reasons this thread "set me off" was
knowing that there are people out there who feel smug, and justified in
being mean to and making fun of overweight people.  And the media buys into
it also - with all our obsession with super-model skinniness, the opposite
is considered to be bad - not different, but *BAD*!  It's so ironic that we
are the richest nation on the planet, with most of our population
*considered* "overweight", and we have children who are deliberately
starving themselves to death!

>> You see, for me (and I suspect for a lot of other people) overeating
>> wasn't
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> -L.

Ooooooo - YUM!  Yeah, I still have to be vigilant and not give in to those
comfort foods - if I do I know I'll eat too much of them and hurt myself!
;>

Signature

Hugs,

CatNipped

See all my masters at:  http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/

-L. - 28 Feb 2006 01:51 GMT
> Jill, I want to let you know that this is not an attack on you, it's just a
> vent - it's just that when I read some of the things you wrote it pushed
[quoted text clipped - 182 lines]
> beg the whole world, *PLEASE* try to be a little more understanding and
> compassionate when it comes to obesity.

Can't snip a word (Bravo!) but will add a comment.  It's not just the
obese who get discriminated against in this manner - it's the
moderately overweight as well.  But I do think the fatter you are, the
worse you get treated.  And let's not forget the double standard when
it somes to sex - fat men are treated a whole lot better in society
than fat women are.

-L.
CatNipped - 28 Feb 2006 15:46 GMT
> Can't snip a word (Bravo!) but will add a comment.  It's not just the
> obese who get discriminated against in this manner - it's the
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> -L.

Right!  Just look at sitcoms like "The King of Queens" - and there are
dozens more like this - where a fat guy has a hot wife, and nobody blinks an
eye at this.  How many TV shows have you seen where a fat woman has a hot
husband?

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CatNipped

See all my masters at:  http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/

Christina Websell - 25 Feb 2006 19:52 GMT
> In rec.pets.cats.anecdotes sriddles@aol.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> It's not about how the cat looks, though. It's about whether the cat's
> weight is affecting its health.

I agree.  However, there is an "ideal weight for size" for humans, cats,
dogs etc.  If this is exceeded too much it will certainly affect health.

> It makes me suspicious whenever someone tells me, "I'm just concerned for
> your *health*", when they suggest I lose some weight - when I know that
> what they really mean is that they don't like my looks. I am pretty
> healthy,
> after all. (And I'm not young.)

You are an adult, it's up to you to control your weight, or not.  You know
the score.
I got very thin when I was ill.  Now it would not hurt me to lose 7lbs.

> Anyway, I don't think the issues are the same for humans and felines.
> Human bodies can adapt to storing a lot of fat, and it doesn't mean one
> is unhealthy (contrary to popular myth).

I never heard this.  Where did you get this from?

>But cats really can't tolerate a
> lot of fat in their system, as it can lead to fatty liver syndrome and a
> host of other problems. Also, a fat person can choose to exercise more,
> to build up their muscles so they can carry their weight better and not
> suffer so much damage to their knees and so forth.

But how often does this happen?  Very fat people find it very difficult to
exercise.  I have a friend who weighs probably 28 stones (14lbs = 1 stone.)
It's a Catch 22 situation.  She needs to exercise to get her weight down but
she is already too heavy to exercise.

> A cat isn't going to
> do that. And since a person is in control of their diet, they can choose
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> wonder if we're not just projecting our own prejudices on the cat (and
> by extension, onto their human caretaker).

I don't see any prejudice, it's a bad idea to allow your cat to get fat.  I
think you are saying this because you let yourself get fat and want us to
say it's OK.
You will now hate me.  Kitty says even if so, can she still be Licky's
girlfriend? and she says she didn't get a Valentine.

Tweed

We are in charge of our cats.  We can control their diet.

Someone else compared the cat
> in China to a bloated tick. We don't really need to go there, do we?
Monique Y. Mudama - 27 Feb 2006 21:25 GMT
>>But cats really can't tolerate a lot of fat in their system, as it
>>can lead to fatty liver syndrome and a host of other problems. Also,
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> exercise to get her weight down but she is already too heavy to
> exercise.

There's a book by Covert Bailey that addresses, among other things,
exercise for overweight people.  He recommends walking at a moderate
pace.  It's absolutely true that a very overweight person is going to
find it difficult to join an aerobics class or similar.  But there are
other exercises.  He even claims that moderate exercise is better for
weight loss than intense exercise.

I'm not sure about fat people building up their muscles to protect
their knees.  I would be surprised by this.  It's extremely hard for
even a fit person with knee problems to improve them via physical
therapy exercises.

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monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully

pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca

jXwXeXrXmXoXnXt@sonic.net - 28 Feb 2006 00:37 GMT
> There's a book by Covert Bailey that addresses, among other things,
> exercise for overweight people.  He recommends walking at a moderate
> pace.  It's absolutely true that a very overweight person is going to
> find it difficult to join an aerobics class or similar.  But there are
> other exercises.  He even claims that moderate exercise is better for
> weight loss than intense exercise.

And remember, if someone's very heavy, then moderate exercise will
get their heart going more than it will for someone who's lightweight.
A heavy person has work harder to move their bodies around.

When I was in my early 30s, I took some medication that caused me to
gain 80 lbs in one year. It was physically traumatic - I ached in every
joint. I suspect that some of the aching was due to something other
than the weight gain, since I also ached in non-weight bearing joints
such as my elbows - but some of it was definitely caused by the sudden
increase of stress on muscles that weren't accustomed to carrying that
much weight.

At first, I didn't exercise much. In fact, I started to feel like I
was disabled - I couldn't even walk one block without the muscles in
my shins burning in pain. I was miserable.

Finally, I started an exercise program. It was extremely gentle at
first - 5 minutes a day of very low-impact dancing. I endured the pain
for the 5 minutes, but didn't push myself any harder than that. But soon,
I was able to do it for 5 minutes without feeling so much pain, so I
increased it to 10 minutes. And so on, until I could work out for 30
minutes (plus 10 minutes on either side for warm-up and cool-down) each
day.

Ever since then, I've been pretty mobile. I think that what I was doing
with the early exercising was building up my weight-bearing muscles so
they could carry me without pain. Now I can walk for miles, I regularly
exercise for 30 minutes at a time (not as often as I would like to be
doing, but not because it hurts or I can't do it - just business and
laziness), and in general can get around pretty well.

> I'm not sure about fat people building up their muscles to protect
> their knees.  I would be surprised by this.

You might be right - knees are tricky. You can get bad knees even if
you take care of yourself, and even if you don't weigh that much. But
I think that if your leg and back muscles are weak, your knees are more
likely to take a beating. So it's not a guarantee, but keeping in
shape can improve your odds (as long as you don't overdo it and blow
out your knees!).

Joyce
William Hamblen - 22 Feb 2006 00:39 GMT
>http://www.local6.com/news/7267453/detail.html?treets=orlpn&tid=2653055048813&tm
l=orlpn_8pm&tmi=orlpn_8pm_1_07000202202006&ts=H

>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
>Gee I wonder why he is a fat cat

Perhaps it is being fattened for market.
Gabey8 - 22 Feb 2006 09:07 GMT
Wow. I saw this kitty's pic yesterday for the first time. That owner needs
to consult a vet to help him safely bring that cat to a more appropriate
size and weight.

I realize I'm the one who started the "LOL! My cat-in-law is on
fatfelines.com" thread a few days ago, but if Saturn looked like THIS
kitty, I wouldn't be laughing. Saturn's got some extra girth, but that's
combined with being a physically large cat in all other dimensions, as
well: nose-to-tail, shoulder-to-paws, etc. He's got the biggest head and
paws I've ever seen on a cat, and they're proportionately sized to the
rest of his frame.

This poor kitty looks like he's got a decent-sized frame, too (judging
from the apparent length of his frame from his head down to his haunches,
looking at the picture). But his frame's nowhere near big enough to carry
33 lbs worth of weight, and the fact that he needs help getting up on the
bed is a major red flag that something's amiss. I realize that at 9 years
old, the kitty is starting to get on in years, but he should still be able
to manage going from floor to bed at this stage of his life.

He's such a pretty cat. What a lovely face! I hope his owner gets some
help managing the cat's weight and overall health, so he'll have nine good
long lives to look forward to.

Donna
Enfilade - 22 Feb 2006 13:53 GMT
> Wow. I saw this kitty's pic yesterday for the first time. That owner needs
> to consult a vet to help him safely bring that cat to a more appropriate
> size and weight.

I am not showing Tyche this image.  She /already/ wants to be obese...

I think it's sad when owners want to win "fat cat" contests or
whatever, and let their pets' health get so endangered.

We want Tyche to be slimmer for health reasons, but we certainly don't
find her ugly or unattractive just because her body type is 4--she gets
all the loving that the others get (Who are all 3's) (in fact, she gets
brushed more because there's more of her to brush....)

We need to keep food down because Kumani needs to be encouraged to eat
(she's thin, she's still a 3 but barely) and Smokey screams loud enough
to disturb the neighbours if there isn't food on hand.

--Fil

ps. body types according to our vet:
1. emaciated
2. underweight
3. healthy
4. overweight
5. obese

Tyche, at 12 pounds is a 4 because she is a smaller cat than Nox and
Smokey who are 12 lbs and 3's.
Lesley - 22 Feb 2006 15:19 GMT
> I am not showing Tyche this image.  She /already/ wants to be obese...
>
>Like we used to say about Isis(RB) "There's a cat that WANTS to die of obesity!"

She never managed it, she had an apetite like a small pony and yet she
remained petite to the extent that we were forced to conclude she was
probably hollow...then again maybe 2 things worked in her favour one
being that she ate good quality wet food with occasional dry and the
main one that she refused anything (with the exception of occasional
ham, prawns and cod) that didn't come from a box or a tin with a
picture of a cat on it...

Sarrasine also manages the hollow effect having an even bigger appetite
for cat food and apart from ham (for which she will commit murder) no
appetite at all for hoomin food (apart from the fried chicken incident
and for all we know Redunzel could have done it- she eats anything
because her sister is such a pig she can't afford to be fussy!)...

Perhaps there is some sort of genetics going on here. Perhaps some cats
inherit a fondness for hoomin food and that when combined with a doting
and unwise slave helps to cause obesity

As for the "Monster cat" (Poor thing!) eating 6lbs of chicken a day...I
agree....That;s 2 smallish birds and when we roast a chicken it lasts
one day for dinner with enough left for sandwiches the next and the
occasional offering of a treat to the Furballs, which Sarrasine mostly
ignores (see above)

Lesley

Slave of the Fabulous Furballs

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